/ How to correctly use Creatine

This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
Goofyfoot - on 12 Nov 2012
I've been using creatine for trainnig fot the past 4 weeks, I had a one week loading period after which I just take one teaspoon every day.

The difference it has made has been impressive - both in the gym (weight training), climbing specific training deadhangs/pullups(I comfrotably managed 60 long arm pullups , sets of 10 the other night, along with variations of Frenchies...never been able to do that before!)and also middle distance running, so I'm happy that the stuff works.

I just need to know:
1)How long to take it for, before giving it a layoff?
2)The duration of the layoff period before I start taking it again?

Any advice would be much appretiated.
djxs - on 12 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot:

I take Creatine for weight lifting only, but tempted to use it for Climbing.

The general feeling is take it for 6-8 weeks, then have a week off.

Hope that helps.

PS: Creatine Mono is the best, don't take any of this fancy stuff, its the same thing!
biscuit - on 12 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot:

I used to get really irritaed by people saying what i am about to say - sorry !

Save your money and spend it on going climbing.

I'm not saying creatine doesn't work ( it does ) but if your log book is up to date you are topping out at 6b but can do deadhangs and did 60 pull ups and frenchies in one night.

Your strength is not what is holding you back.

Having said that you didn't ask for this advice and you may enjoy the training more than the end result - which a lot of people do i'm not knocking that - so i'll shuffle off now having not given you the answer to your question.

PS loading phase is now thought un necessary and also allegedly stops the alleged water retention/bloating which is not great for climbing - there you go a bit of help for you :0)
Trevor Langhorne on 12 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot:
Drug assisted climbing?
biscuit - on 12 Nov 2012
In reply to Trevor Langhorne:
> (In reply to Goofyfoot)
> Drug assisted climbing?

Yes, as is any time you've climbed after a coffee - technically.

It's legal and widespread in many sports, professionally and otherwise. Whether you use it or not is up to you i guess.
UrbanSteve - on 12 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot:

Just be aware that creatine strengthens muscles and not tendons. Your tendons are always playing catch up to muscle strength anyhow, so using creatine could increase the potential of injury.

This happened to me and I have never used creatine since. I got better and stronger by climbing on rock twice a week with indoor sessions thrown in.
Camm on 12 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot:
I felt stronger after taking creatine, but I don't think it's worth taking for climbing because of the added water weight vs the strength isn't worth it but it would be interesting to see the facts/figures behind it.
Camm on 12 Nov 2012
In reply to danrock101:
oh and I just took 2 tea spoons of mono in a drink here there and everywhere, the correct amount to take will depend on your muscle mass.
I like climbing - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to smithers25:
Totally agree !
Your point is essential for anyone using Creatine to know about. One of my climbing mates and I were going to use it. I had second thoughts and decided against it. He went for it big time and got really injured frequently. There were great strength improvements but they came at too big a cost and he recently had surgery.
When someone comes up with a proper plan to manage tendons in conjunction with Creatine use that will be interesting.
biscuit - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to I like climbing:

Out of interest can you say a bit more about what happened ?
Goofyfoot - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot: In reply to the "just go climbing, you'll get stronger" comments, unfortunatly I'm only able to climb once - perhaps twice a week if I'm lucky, so I suppliment this with various forms of training.

Regarding the weight issue, I'm managing my weight pretty comfortably through a mix of good diet and regular cardio work (betweeen 6-9 mile runs).

The cretaine itslef is good value - 7 for 500 grams from my protien.com - still got loads left.

I completey agree, that while muscle strength imrpoves quickly, this is not in relation to tendon streangth - again, this is why I'm being careful about pushing to hard at the wall, so far no problems.

As for the "climbing through the use of drugs" comment, I find this quite rediculous, creatine is a natural substance already found within the body - by taking it you are mearly suppliment what you already have, and as sombody has already pointed out, it is perfectly legal, and widely used throughout many different sports and events - was used commonly, and openly by athletes within many olympic events!
I like climbing - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to biscuit:
I think the problem was that he worked on muscular strength and simply didn't look into what was happening to his tendons. He gave up routes as soon as he started using Creatine and concentrated on bouldering. That alone would have made an impact especially as he was doing around 4 sessions a week. The gains from Creatine were fairly spectacular and injuries followed. He had probably been climbing about 3 years before he started Creatine and his progress in the first year was amazing. And I think he continued to climb through injury too which a lot of us do. If he had worked more on rest, approached injury differently and added Pilates (which I do) and generally looked into session recovery things might have been different. That said, the initial return on Creatine and the mindset it produced probably stopped him looking at these things.
I like climbing - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot:
Sounds like you're approaching this the right way. I also agree with your comment against labelling Creatine as a drug. Wenger introduced Creatine at Arsenal more than 10 years ago.
There is no doubt in my mind that used correctly it can be really effective.
3 Names - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to I like climbing:
> (In reply to Goofyfoot)
>

Wenger introduced Creatine at Arsenal more than 10 years ago.

So it doesn't work then?
I like climbing - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to Vince McNally:

Nice one ! :)
biscuit - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to I like climbing

Doesnt sound like it's to do with the creatine really. More over training and under resting combined with bad injury management. No offence to your mate obviously.

I agree with what you say about the mindset though, important point.
dj rivum - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot:
Use it for 6 weeks then take a few weeks off.
Take it at roughly the same time of day. You will find conflicting views on taking it before or after training. Personally I have a cycle of 6 weeks on, 6 weeks off and take it just before hitting the gym.
HTH
nw - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot:
People I know dont cycle it,just take a tsp a day after a loading week. They also say that the water weight comes on quickly and is limited, the strength gain should catch up with and then surpass the water weight.
Trevor Langhorne on 13 Nov 2012
You said

"As for the "climbing through the use of drugs" comment, I find this quite rediculous, creatine is a natural substance already found within the body - by taking it you are mearly suppliment what you already have",

As far as I recall blood is a natural substance already found in your body and following your argument merely to supplement what you already have by adding some more is fine; but is most definitely frowned upon in "organised" sport. You may wish to ask Lance Armstrong about that one as having transfusions of his own blood is one of the accusations made against him. Whether or not a "supplement" or other substance is legal or not in sports is irrelevant to climbing, each individual makes their own decisions about what they do or do not put into their own bodies (and accept the consequences of their actions - in this case weight gain, water retention or increased risk of injury judging by the other posts - all of which could be viewed as counter productive from the climber's perspective).

In my view what matters in climbing is exploring my own personal limits, both physical and mental and I believe strongly that those limits should not be artificially "improved" by overdosing on compounds regardless of whether or not they are natural. If you want to get stronger train harder, if no more gains come then you have reached your potential - just accept your limitations.
biscuit - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to Trevor Langhorne:

But creatine does not make you stronger. It makes you able to train more often and harder. You still have to put the effort in, it's not a way of avoiding hard work.

The consequences you mention can be avoided by no loading phase and a sensible training regime. There is no need to become bloated or injured.

I agree with what you say about it being a personal issue though, some will and some won't. In general climbing it is still an individual sport.

In competition climbing ? It'd be interesting to know who does and who doesn't.
nw - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to biscuit:
> (In reply to Trevor Langhorne)
>
> But creatine does not make you stronger. It makes you able to train more often and harder. You still have to put the effort in, it's not a way of avoiding hard work.
>
>Also true of steroids. Just sayin.
as646 on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot: On a cold Friday afternoon, I had come home from school. I had been thinking of the gym all day. I was hungry, didn't have any lunch. In fact, I didn't eat because I spent the money. For the past month I was saving up for something. Something special which I bought at GNC. I was surprised they didn't ask for ID; I was pretty sure the cashier noticed how nervous I was. Anyways, my mom asked my how my day was when I got home, but I ignored her. I have more important things to do. I run to the bathroom and unpack my bag. In my school bag is a white plastic bag from GNC. I open the bag, first removing the receipt and flushing it down the toilet to get rid of the evidence. My heart was racing now. I unpack the creatine monster from the bag.

I wonder what people will be asking me when they see that I will be 50lbs heavier. Should I say I was just eating a lot? I remove the label from the tub and tear it into a thousand small pieces. I flush that down the toilet, too. It is time now. I run up to my room when my mom ask me what I am holding. I panic, sweat drips down my forehead and my teeth chatter. "Mom, it's just for a school project". "What project?" "I don't know mom I just started it!". A tear runs down my cheek. I run upstairs and open the creatine, scooping upservings into a clear water bottle. What have I gotten myself into? I fill it with water and drink it. There is no turning back now. The creatine monster is inside me now, it will control me. What should I do if I die? I cant let my family know about this.

I open the creatine tub and throw it all out the window; a white cloud of mysterious dust sparkles into the wind so graciously. I feel the substance taking control of me; I am now the monster. I walk downstairs, its time to work out; time to get big. Now I worry, I don't want to get too big; people will think I use steroids. I do use steroids. No I don't. Creatine. All I see is the weights now, I am almost downstairs when I hear "Do you want a cookie I just baked". I know I do not have time for this **** now. "No mom I do not want a cookie" I walk in the basement and drop to my knees before the weights, tears running down my cheeks. I turn to the right and look at myself in the mirror. Oh god, what have I done?
biscuit - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to as646:

What have you done ?

You've cut and pasted some shite from somewhere on the internet and posted it on here.

Just so you know.
nw - on 13 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot:
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^This^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
mikekeswick - on 14 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot: Put it on your toast.......
Goofyfoot - on 15 Nov 2012
In reply to as646: What the hell are you talking about you fool?
unknownclimber6 - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to Goofyfoot:

creatine damages the liver over prolonged usage, i think it max 4 weeks on 2 weeks off minimum but i am just going on what my mates say as i dont touch it myself! but they are gym-heads!!
nw - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to unknownclimber6:
Any support for this statement at all?
saul - on 21 Nov 2012
In reply to Trevor Langhorne:

Sums it up for me too, haha

This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.