/ NEWS: VIDEO: Women's Climbing Symposium 2012

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UKC News - on 06 Dec 2012
Women's Climbing Symposium, 4 kbHere we have a video from Outcrop Films of the Women's Climbing Symposium that was held at the Climbing Hanger, Liverpool in Nov 2012.

Read more at http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=67655
Wiley Coyote - on 06 Dec 2012
In reply to UKC News:

At the risk of re-opening a whole can of worms, I love the pic. A nice light-hearted response to all that angst.
balmybaldwin - on 06 Dec 2012
In reply to UKC News:

Am I the only one who is having problems with the sound on this video? seems like whenever someone is talking there is no sound (e.g. shauna comments in the opening sequence, Jon giving his talk?
balmybaldwin - on 06 Dec 2012
In reply to balmybaldwin:

Oddly seems to work fine on my Tablet, but not on my PC (I have sound e.g. music, but no speech)
Purple - on 06 Dec 2012
In reply to Wiley Coyote: Perhaps, but it does emphasise the blatant and unapologetic sexist nature of this event, and brings into sharp focus the paucity of Men's Climbing Symposia & related events.

Wise-up, BMC.
Christheclimber - on 06 Dec 2012
In reply to UKC News:

Is it just me bit but doesn't Shauna sound American????
balmybaldwin - on 06 Dec 2012
In reply to Purple:
> (In reply to Wiley Coyote) Perhaps, but it does emphasise the blatant and unapologetic sexist nature of this event, and brings into sharp focus the paucity of Men's Climbing Symposia & related events.
>
> Wise-up, BMC.

I used to have the same view, especially of a ladies night run by the local wall, which included light touch free basic tuition.

I now think differently, women are enourmously outnumbered in climbing, and the more that can be done to help them overcome their reservations the better.

Men and women are different, and have different needs. as climbing is male dominated (wall owners, designers etc) it has lead to male orientated training facilities. An example of this is the lack of hard slabby climbing/bouldering walls, instead they all have big overhangs that favour male stregth over female agility
Wiley Coyote - on 06 Dec 2012
In reply to balmybaldwin:
> (In reply to Purple)
> [...]
>
it has lead to male orientated training facilities. An example of this is the lack of hard slabby climbing/bouldering walls, instead they all have big overhangs that favour male stregth over female agility

I think I must be in touch with my feminine side. Well that is I know I don't have the male stength, I'm not sure about agility of any gender or orientation.

In reply to balmybaldwin: yep slabs are for girls!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jN6YtqVbC1k
JuneBob on 06 Dec 2012
In reply to balmybaldwin:
If you think that strength not agility and skill gets you up overhangs you've got it all wrong :-)
balmybaldwin - on 06 Dec 2012
In reply to JuneBob:
> (In reply to balmybaldwin)
> If you think that strength not agility and skill gets you up overhangs you've got it all wrong :-)

I'm well aware that it doesn't, as I'm certainly not the strongest, however as for getting people in to climbing big overhanging walls that are perceived to require a lot of upper body strength can be rather intimidating. Certainly until you learn the appropriate techniques upperbody strength can make the difference between getting up an easy overhang and not.

It was probably a poor example, maybe a better one is simply that most route setters are male, and as a result most routes set tend to be reachier for the smaller among us, and as your average woman is smaller than your average man... I remember a particular bouldering set at Craggy where Marc set half the routes and Danni (Centre manager and his Girlfriend) set the other half, the difference was Danni's included contortionist, cramped moves for me, where as Marc's were relatively comfortable at similar grades. Most of the girls I knew at the wall loved Danni's routes, as reach suddenly wasn't an issue.

I remain convinced however that women have an advantage on slabby/balancey routes due in part to the shape and flexibility of their bodies (this doesn't mean men can't be good at them or women can't be good at burly overhanging routes)
Jonny2vests - on 07 Dec 2012
In reply to balmybaldwin:
> (In reply to JuneBob)
> [...]
>

> It was probably a poor example

Don't apologise, I thought you were spot on.

And to JuneBob: Skill and agility alone wont get you up an overhang either. Strength is important too.
dead_passive - on 07 Dec 2012
In reply to jonny2vests: I don't think the problem is whether strength or agility is important on an overhang vs a slab. The problem is the assumption that women can't do one or are more suited to the other.

The problem extends way beyond climbing. Many people (men and women included) seem to think that women are poor at certain things - driving, plumbing, pick your stereotype. Even worse, it seems to me that many people think that women SHOULDN'T be able to do these things. I think it's a great shame that climbers also buy into this crap.

I am a very slim male and when I started climbing I avoided overhangs like the plague due to my poor strength. My girlfriend on the other hand has always loved overhangs even though she struggles on them.

I think climbing would be very gender neutral if people would let it.
paul walters - on 07 Dec 2012
In reply to UKC News: Any girl who can climb in high heels is OK with me!
Jonny2vests - on 07 Dec 2012
In reply to dead_passive:
> (In reply to jonny2vests) I don't think the problem is whether strength or agility is important on an overhang vs a slab. The problem is the assumption that women can't do one or are more suited to the other.
...
> I am a very slim male and when I started climbing I avoided overhangs like the plague due to my poor strength. My girlfriend on the other hand has always loved overhangs even though she struggles on them.

Yes I see your point, but in reality, its not gender neutral. On average, women ARE less powerful. And they find it harder to build muscle mass + develop strength than men. This makes men, on average, better suited to climbing in steep terrain and anecdotal evidence of individuals won't change that.

Pebble will probably be along soon to call me a sexist, when its really just genetics. Men and women aren't the same, why are we so obsessed with denying that?
The Pylon King on 07 Dec 2012
In reply to jonny2vests:

> Men and women aren't the same, why are we so obsessed with denying that?

I know its weird isnt it? Its like the whole driving thing.
Jonny2vests - on 07 Dec 2012
In reply to Mr Mark Stephen Davies:
> (In reply to jonny2vests)
>
> [...]
>
> I know its weird isnt it? Its like the whole driving thing.

As usual, sarcasm, humour and suggestions of fact subtly intertwined.
winhill - on 08 Dec 2012
In reply to jonny2vests:
> (In reply to dead_passive)
>
> Yes I see your point, but in reality, its not gender neutral. On average, women ARE less powerful. And they find it harder to build muscle mass + develop strength than men. This makes men, on average, better suited to climbing in steep terrain and anecdotal evidence of individuals won't change that.

Talking of averages is just an over simplification and no help at all.

It's a shame the guy giving the biomechanics talk was cut short in the video - it would be interesting what he had to say.

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