/ NEWS: VIDEO: Silbergeier with Nina & Cedric
Jack Geldard made an interview with Nina at the time, but in short she says about the ascent that:
The first 8b pitch felt like a 7a warm-up...
Read more at http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=67700
I did notice one error: at the end that's a Burger King that Lachat abandons Caprez on the descent to go and visit, not a McDonalds. Also that Swiss Burger King serves Red Bull, which is maybe not an error but wow.
Hmmm, there's another error - but not as serious as the MacDo/Burger King catastrophe. The subtitles seem to credit Pietro dal Pra with the first ascent. As far as I know he made the fourth ascent.
Hmm - personally I don't really get the look-at-me-I'm-a-dick style, but some people like it, I suppose. Luckily the climbing made up for it.
Nice vid and great looking route, a nice change from the usual Euro-cave escapades.
I could barely watch. The movie would have been vastly improved if id didnt have cedric in it!
Climbing looks absolutely amazing and for sport some ridiculous run-outs. If there are easier routes of that kind of rock quality it would look to be an awesome place to go.
>for sport some ridiculous run-outs.
How is this a sport route?
Sparsely bolted, ground up, on the lead. Afaik that would make it a perfectly valid trad climb in e.g. the US of A.
> Sparsely bolted, ground up, on the lead. Afaik that would make it a perfectly valid trad climb in e.g. the US of A.
No, it makes it a sparsely bolted sports climb. (And the style in which they climbed it has no bearing on it - obviously)
What a really enjoyable film that was. I even think plenty of non-climbers would get something from it.
> No, it makes it a sparsely bolted sports climb.
The point I am making, which you appear to be wilfully ignoring, is that the parochial British definition of the "trad" / "sport" divide is not the only one.
British definition something like: no bolts = "trad", all bolt protected = "sport" unless it's on slate then it might be "trad" depending on how far apart the bolts are. How the bolts got there is immaterial.
US definition as I understand it (I have only climbed in the US once so there may be nuances I'm missing): bolts placed on the rope from above = "sport", no bolts = "trad", bolts placed on the lead without hanging on gear = also definitely "trad", bolts placed on the lead whilst hanging on gear as I assume Kammerlander did = dunno, "gray" area?
Swiss definition - the one that actually applies here = ???
> What a really enjoyable film that was.
Yes. Despite myself, I even found myself warming to Mr Lachat.
> The point I am making, which you appear to be wilfully ignoring, is that the parochial British definition of the "trad" / "sport" divide is not the only one.
But it is the only sensible one.
Defining whether a finished "product" is a sport or trad route depending on how it is "produced" is pretty silly when you think about it; two identical routes, one sport, the other trad. But then that's the USA for you!
An arbitrary distance between bolts when a route mysteriously morphs from sport to trad is also pretty daft.
Bolts seem so unquestioned in Switzerland, I suspect they may not have a definition.
> Defining whether a finished "product" is a sport or trad route depending on how it is "produced" is pretty silly when you think about it; two identical routes, one sport, the other trad.
But the routes done in the different styles tend to be rather non-identical. I don't think you'd find many people calling the Bachar-Yerian a "sport" route.
Is it? Are Poetry Pink or Massambula "sport" routes? I don't think you'd get many takers. Goose Creature, Colossus, or Heading The Shot? Firmly in the grey area. Geordie War Cry? Definitely sport.
Silbergeier certainly isn't "plaisir".
> But the routes done in the different styles tend to be rather non-identical.
True, but what if they are not?
I was really thinking of sytematically bolted routes (however spaced), not routes with just the odd bolts at critical points (these are neither one thing nor the other). Not a fan myself.
Now that is a term I really dislike!
> Now that is a term I really dislike!
I sympathise, but I actually think it's quite useful if you assume - as the Swiss do - that there will be bolts. "Plaisir" tells us that for some hypothetical average, solid at the grade leader fear is unlikely to be a major factor in success or failure on the route. Whereas on non-plaisir, whether the gear is bolts or something else (or both) head games play a significant role.
I find this quite a useful distinction. If I'm climbing near my limit five metres out from my gear I don't mind if the gear is a bolt or a good friend placement or a solid #8 rock. I know it's going to hold but I still don't want to fall.
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