/ Training equipment - safety rated?

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Ed F - on 03 Jan 2013
I'm just wondering if fingerboards etc. are safety rated in the same way as gear is?

The consequences of pulling down a fingerboard whilst doing a front lever could be just as bad as gear breaking on a route, but I don't know what testing is done on it.

I've got a piece of training kit that I made myself that's designed to take bodyweight, and was wondering if I need to do anything safety wise if I wanted to start selling them...

Cheers
Neil Henson - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Ed Feldman: I doubt the fingerboard itself would be likely to break. More likely the screws will pull out of the wall if not suitably installed. The installation is of course not within the manufacturer's control.
Ed F - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Neil Henson:

I know none of this is likely...

But, just as an example, how do fingerboard manufacturers decide how many screws are needed to make it safe?
spearing05 - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Ed Feldman: Given that the sheer strength of your average screw is going to be considerably more than the weight of the average climber the number of screwsis more to do with them either pulling through the material of the board or out of the wall.

In reality you are coming back to the security of the fastening which would be ouside your control. Best bet would be to not supply screws as it could be argued that you are implying that they aree safe to use when in some instances they are not. Personaly I'd supply with 4 well spaced holes and the instructions to mount to a suitable surface using appropriate fastenings then the onus is on the person fitting rather than you.

Please note I'm not a lawyer or product tester. Advice taken at you own risk I will not accept resposibility for any loss or . . . . . etc etc etc
Neil Henson - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Ed Feldman:
> (In reply to Neil Henson)
>
> how do fingerboard manufacturers decide how many screws are needed to make it safe?

They employ someone from an engineering background who can perform this type of calculation. The process would likely be as follows:
1) Assume maximum weight of climber (say 20 stone for example).
2) Add appropriate safety margin (say 50% i.e 30 stone)
3) Calculate maximum static load (i.e. climber hanging)and dynamic load (i.e. climber doing pull ups).
4) Select suitably rated screw for these maximum loadings.
5) Split the load between several of these screws (four minimum I would suggest for a fingerboard.)

As the previous poster mentioned, the screws are unlikely to fail, even a relatively small one will hold a significant amount of weight. Poor installation will be the most likely source of failure e.g trying to install on plasterboard.

A more practical approach for you would be to look at various pieces of similar climbing equipment from reputable manufacturers and note the number of holes and hole diameter that has been used. You would also need to ensure that screw holes are not positioned too close to the edges.
shark - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Neil Henson:

Maybe you should consider taking up a less risky sport
Neil Henson - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to shark:
> (In reply to Neil Henson)
>
> Maybe you should consider taking up a less risky sport

Pardon? Have you read my post?

I was merely stating to the OP what process a fingerboard manufacturer is likely to undertake in order to design a fingerboard.
colina - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Ed Feldman:
don't bother with screws .at the very least use large coach bolts (if going into wood) and make sure that the wood is attached properly (your door frame wood is not a good idea),preferably large nuts and bolts going through the wall is better than expandable bolts.over the top ?. A contributor to this site recently and sadly had the misfortune to pull a board off the wall and been left with life changing consequences .
you can use the biggest fixings ever made, the main thing is make sure its going into something solid or your wasting your time and injury is not far away.
don't rush it (i know yer dying to do those one finger pullups!) ,do it properly ok.
common sense prevails .gd luck.
shark - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Neil Henson:

Sorry that was intended for Feldman.

Slipping off is a bigger risk than the board coming off. I put a mat out if I do anything ambitious on slopers.
Ed F - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Neil Henson:

Thanks Neil, useful stuff to think about...
Ed F - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to shark:

> Maybe you should consider taking up a less risky sport

Maybe you should consider reading to the end of my post!

I've made a bit of training kit that I'm thinking about producing for sale - if I do, I want to make sure I follow standard procedure for testing training equipment (if there is any) to make sure I don't get sued if someone hurts themselves whilst using it.
Scott_vzr on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Ed Feldman:There will be a BS (kitemark) or CE standard no doubt.
biscuit - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Scott_vzr:

Can't find one on my fingerboard or pull up bar, or my weights or my gym ball.

This tells me 2 things.

1) i need to climb more
2) you probably won't need a CE or kitemark
shark - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Ed Feldman:
> (In reply to shark)
>
> [...]
>
> Maybe you should consider reading to the end of my post!
>


Sorry. I'm a dick
vark - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Ed Feldman:
I have no experience of these things but I would guess in part the testing/specification required would be determined by your insurers or at least the testing /calcs you have down would influence the premium.
Ed F - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to shark:

Don't worry!
Ed F - on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to all:

Looks like it should be ok then. It's a simple enough design and the one I've made is pretty sturdy...
nasher47 on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to Scott_vzr:

There is no British or European standard covering this, it's too niche.
ads.ukclimbing.com
nasher47 on 03 Jan 2013
In reply to colina:

Surely a troll!?

Screws are widely used throughout the climbing world to secure massive volumes to walls perfectly safely. The strength of a 5mm screw is unbelievable, you could happily hang on a single screw so long as it is in a solid material.

Coach bolts is overkill.

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