/ NEWS: FRI NIGHT VID: Dawes and Redhead - E9 6c
Read more at http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=67747
gotta drive home carefully in the snow as i cant wait to see second film. first one was chuffin great.
I think there are still great characters in climbing , just maybe they are slightly tempered & manipulated by marketing & sales teams to a more managable commercial state . ( possibly talking out of my lower back )
I consider the likes of Dave Birkett & Leo Holding great characters & extremely strong climbers too , but modern climbing standards have been thus , that to garner significant press coverage that one has to do something truly exceptional or incredibly stupid nowadays .
Is Alex Honnold a great character for example ? An amazing climber without doubt but character maybe that is more debateable ? I would argue that it takes great character to achieve some of the things that he has done .
Inspiring films in many ways I think .
Of course there are characters in climbing, things just evolve. Honnold is a huge character, very similar to Redhead in a way, in that he climbs things because he wants to and for no other reason.
Not everything was better back in the day...
Just the little sideways glance to check the camera is on his is enough amid the constant stream of b......x convinces me he is not in it for the joy of climbing but self promotion.
Not taking anything away from his climbing achievements which were superb and far greater than mine could ever hope to be.
And how can he ever justify that giving small children an erect phallus as ok?
I think for character you could replace with provocative. There seemed to be loads of mud slinging and slagging matches in the 80's/90's.
Maybe it was just the lack of blood to the brain because of the Lycra that skewed my impression of it all...
Climbings role models are dictated to the masses and are all about big ticks, flash photos and sanitised politics. Gone are the days of the "one of us" characters in the climbing media with brawling drinking and general enjoyment of doing it for the sake of it.
Would have to agree with above re ; Mr Redheads pretence , self promotion & talking bollocks don't think there is much denying that . I do believe Leo Houlding , Jason Pickles & friends showed character & strength in Posing Productions Autana film I think that was hell of a feat achieving that .
I probably didn't provide the best examples in the 1st post further up , they popped into my head as I was rush typing on my way out of the door .
I did think the no great characters in climbing any more was worthy of further discussion hence my albeit shoddy post . All fair comments above .
I also consider people like Mike Robertson and Ulei Steck as memorable characters but for very different reasons .
It's our sanatised 'cool' commercial society. Music has gone the same way.
Any Adam Ants or Princes out there now? No.
Yup - I know it was a long time ago but he made me cringe in that.
Utter utter brilliance.
Film from the era where myth was being dispelled but mystique lived in fireside conversations, magazine snippets and infrequent 'real' contact that could as much be a chance meeting at the crag as BBC 1 on Saturday night.
Today's climbers live in a nonsense-free world where every success, failure or throwaway comment is dissected in hours by people on every continent. Who'd dare stick their neck out?
Speaking of which, how many climbers (or cavers or mountain bikers or wingsuit flyers) use the adrenaline of their sport to shy away from the real adrenaline situations of life such as workplace confrontation or standing up to aggressors in the street? In the Clown film I see someone who recognises that climbing is a personal, often introverted sport, and wants to show that that introversion is not (in his case) fear but self confidence.
John redhead is classic :) funny guy
.....must be an interesting experience sharing a tent with Mr Redhead...!
You would certainly remember Mr Robertson for his Naked Climbing/Hitching ;0) .
I guess in our world where climbing has been pushed into the world of "Athletes" where instructors are coaches then the freedom to go and enjoy, explore and learn your own way like Dawes did could be lost.
Brilliant video. John's like something from The Fast Show!
I have a strong recollection of talking to someone involved in the making of this, about how Redhead felt compelled to have a wank at the top of Norwich cathedral spire. Whether or not it's true, the memory has unfortunately stayed with me ever since.
Interesting comment as I feel the same, but with the characters flipped!
I remember seeing 'E9 6C' on tv just after I started climbing and being totally absorbed so thanks to UKC for showing this.
I've just made the connection with the similar artwork in the Balcony of the new Beacon Centre - is that one of Redheads?
> Interesting comment as I feel the same, but with the characters flipped!
To be honest, I think they both are.
I think they are both in fact playing to the gallery, and they are possibly completely different in private?
It's amazing sometimes the difference between public, and private persona's.
I remember playing doubles at darts in the Padarn, against Brown and one of his mates (hangers on??), and getting more than a grunt from him was nigh on impossible.
On the other hand, I spent 2 hours in the Pineapple on Water Street in Manchester with Whillans - just him and me, and I'd never met him before - and he was warm, open, generous - in both buying the beer and conversation, and an absolute delight.
I think that if you assume a wildly exaggerated persona for long enough, it can take over and you eventually become that person.
And maybe the fact we only got a grunt from Brown, was because we thrashed him 3 games on the trot :-)
"If one person takes me seriously...." wandering around in a mask and giant paper-mache penis
Like the child in question wisely said: "There's nothing wrong with the human body."...and they were right! You must be Catholic, or repressed in some other - equally deviant - way, and good luck with that.
The key difference between these characters and those that have come after is that they where more than simply climbers.
Redhead: Totally nuts but as he say's "an image maker who climbs"
Doors: trying to redefine physical movement...
what we have today are professional climbers who climb.... that's it...
But thats because whether we like it or not, climbing harder is about pulling on smaller bits of rock, and if you think thats really whats its all about then.. you are a bit f***ed up!
> Why ?
I guess because of his aggressively confrontational manner, especially during his street show. But I think 'nob' is maybe unkind and doesn't really describe him very well. Pretentious? Well not really, this is pretentious - wait for the second part with the yellow speedos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vrac4j7C79Y
> I guess because of his aggressively confrontational manner, especially during his street show. But I think 'nob' is maybe unkind and doesn't really describe him very well. Pretentious? Well not really, this is pretentious - wait for the second part with the yellow speedos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vrac4j7C79Y
I never saw his street show - was that an art thing ? In the context of the Indian Face and his climbing achievements I think he has earned the right to express himself any way he wants.
I find him truly inspiring.
As for the video you posted, while I am in awe of the climbing I found the music a chilling reminder that death is never very far away when you push the boundaries. And of course Janis died too.
> I never saw his street show - was that an art thing ?
It's in the vid - where he's prancing around with a two foot papier maché dildo...
> It's in the vid - where he's prancing around with a two foot papier maché dildo...
Didn't see the second video until just now ! Really enjoyed the film and I'd love to own one of his works. I guess I empathised with it and you didn't.
Some of his paintings are fabulous. I remember Paul Williams used to have the Tormented Ejaculation on his wall!
Er... I just googled 'tormented ejaculation redhead', without really thinking - don't do it!
> Some of his paintings are fabulous. I remember Paul Williams used to have the Tormented Ejaculation on his wall!
That's great !
> Er... I just googled 'tormented ejaculation redhead', without really thinking - don't do it!
I thought the one where the red headed lass, tied up and forced to......
I'll get me coat.
I have a few Redhead art works , I like his art, I am sure he would be happy to sell you an artwork or two.
Probably just you that is a bit lost! Sometimes it is hard to see things from that far up your own ass!
> I have a few Redhead art works , I like his art, I am sure he would be happy to sell you an artwork or two.
Thanks for this. I've met him a couple of times and discussed buying some art. The only problem was the size of those particular works - they were huge ! He was really nice as you said.
To seriously suggest that climbing harder is just about pulling harder on smaller holds shows what a loveable numpty you are. What about the mental aspect, what about the desire? Even Neil Gresham might disagree with your simplistic view of climbing. I've seen you climb, and that's what's holding you back from climbing better, harder routes. If you don't have the authentic desire, you might as well not bother, because otherwise it's all just numbers - and your numbers up!
But there are many people out there who are truly inspirational:
Mick fowler, what a demon mountaineer and lovable, but a really crap fell runner - thank God!
Adam Ondra - what passion!
Sharma what a dude!
And the Wide Boyz - how can Tom and Pete after spending so much time hanging upside down in the cellar, be so apparently normal?
There is no question Dawes was special - the dynamism of his climbing is for me the real poetry of the film; perhaps for climbers Redheads route legacy is more impressive than his art of philosophy, which is also a little dark/ obscure for me - but I admire his DIFFERENCE!
If I fail on Right Eliminate one more time, I will be out with my acrylic paints!
Depends whether you think climbing is a sport or an appreciation of art I suppose. But if it's only a sport, what do all these people climbing E11 do for getting a meaning from life? Or are they all just headless hedonists?
> Just the little sideways glance to check the camera is on his is enough amid the constant stream of b......x convinces me he is not in it for the joy of climbing but self promotion.
> Not taking anything away from his climbing achievements which were superb and far greater than mine could ever hope to be.
I think I agree, he does seem a tad self absorbed and waffling.
Like in the first video where he says how two climbers have seen his picture on Indian Face, and that one is dead and they other has gone mad, and asks what more he can say.
It's meaninglessly enigmatic and suggestive of something sinister and otherworldly connected with the climb (or his painting).
Watch out the evil mystical spirits are about...?
A very good climber with an interesting take on things in society it seems, but why does he need to suggest things vaguely as if it's something mystical?
It'd be boring if we weren't all different I guess.
I was really trying to go along with it, but then Redhead talked about "moving people on".
Arrogant, patronising and blind to the irony.
> Depends whether you think climbing is a sport or an appreciation of art I suppose. But if it's only a sport, what do all these people climbing E11 do for getting a meaning from life? Or are they all just headless hedonists?
> .....must be an interesting experience sharing a tent with Mr Redhead...!
as long as he don't bring the pink strap on!!!
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