/ NEWS: FRI NIGHT VID: Dawes and Redhead - E9 6c

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UKC News - on 18 Jan 2013
John Redhead E9 6c, 3 kbTwo awesome videos for tonight's Friday Night Vid slot.

E9 6c is a film by Dominic Clemence and is of course titled in reference to The Indian Face on Cloggy with Redhead and Dawes.

Read more at http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=67747
NJBrown - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News: there's no great characters in climbing anymore.
daveyw - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News:
gotta drive home carefully in the snow as i cant wait to see second film. first one was chuffin great.
Boogs on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to NJBrown:
> (In reply to UKC News) there's no great characters in climbing anymore.

I think there are still great characters in climbing , just maybe they are slightly tempered & manipulated by marketing & sales teams to a more managable commercial state . ( possibly talking out of my lower back )

I consider the likes of Dave Birkett & Leo Holding great characters & extremely strong climbers too , but modern climbing standards have been thus , that to garner significant press coverage that one has to do something truly exceptional or incredibly stupid nowadays .

Is Alex Honnold a great character for example ? An amazing climber without doubt but character maybe that is more debateable ? I would argue that it takes great character to achieve some of the things that he has done .

Inspiring films in many ways I think .
spidermonkey09 - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to NJBrown:
Of course there are characters in climbing, things just evolve. Honnold is a huge character, very similar to Redhead in a way, in that he climbs things because he wants to and for no other reason.
Not everything was better back in the day...
oldcheese - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News: I agree that redhead is a character but Jesus, is he self absorbed and pretentious or what!

Just the little sideways glance to check the camera is on his is enough amid the constant stream of b......x convinces me he is not in it for the joy of climbing but self promotion.

Not taking anything away from his climbing achievements which were superb and far greater than mine could ever hope to be.

And how can he ever justify that giving small children an erect phallus as ok?
Stuart (aka brt) - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to NJBrown:

I think for character you could replace with provocative. There seemed to be loads of mud slinging and slagging matches in the 80's/90's.

Maybe it was just the lack of blood to the brain because of the Lycra that skewed my impression of it all...
Jackwd - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News: Redhead talks some bollocks!
muppetfilter - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to boogie man: I disagree, Dave Birkett is of this generation of go out there and do it for yourself climbers. Leo Houlding last showed true character when he got pissed and threw up as Andy Cave drove on the series "the edge" ....

Climbings role models are dictated to the masses and are all about big ticks, flash photos and sanitised politics. Gone are the days of the "one of us" characters in the climbing media with brawling drinking and general enjoyment of doing it for the sake of it.
Boogs on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to muppetfilter:

Would have to agree with above re ; Mr Redheads pretence , self promotion & talking bollocks don't think there is much denying that . I do believe Leo Houlding , Jason Pickles & friends showed character & strength in Posing Productions Autana film I think that was hell of a feat achieving that .

I probably didn't provide the best examples in the 1st post further up , they popped into my head as I was rush typing on my way out of the door .

I did think the no great characters in climbing any more was worthy of further discussion hence my albeit shoddy post . All fair comments above .

I also consider people like Mike Robertson and Ulei Steck as memorable characters but for very different reasons .
The Pylon King on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to muppetfilter:

It's our sanatised 'cool' commercial society. Music has gone the same way.

Any Adam Ants or Princes out there now? No.
Enty - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to Jackwd:
> (In reply to UKC News) Redhead talks some bollocks!

Yup - I know it was a long time ago but he made me cringe in that.

E
Toccata on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News:

Utter utter brilliance.

Film from the era where myth was being dispelled but mystique lived in fireside conversations, magazine snippets and infrequent 'real' contact that could as much be a chance meeting at the crag as BBC 1 on Saturday night.

Today's climbers live in a nonsense-free world where every success, failure or throwaway comment is dissected in hours by people on every continent. Who'd dare stick their neck out?

Speaking of which, how many climbers (or cavers or mountain bikers or wingsuit flyers) use the adrenaline of their sport to shy away from the real adrenaline situations of life such as workplace confrontation or standing up to aggressors in the street? In the Clown film I see someone who recognises that climbing is a personal, often introverted sport, and wants to show that that introversion is not (in his case) fear but self confidence.
Helnorris - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News: Some quite cool fri night vids :)
John redhead is classic :) funny guy
sbc_10 - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News:

.....must be an interesting experience sharing a tent with Mr Redhead...!
muppetfilter - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to boogie man:

You would certainly remember Mr Robertson for his Naked Climbing/Hitching ;0) .

I guess in our world where climbing has been pushed into the world of "Athletes" where instructors are coaches then the freedom to go and enjoy, explore and learn your own way like Dawes did could be lost.
jimjimjim on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News: Dawes i'd like to meet, Redhead...i avoid people like him. Great films though.
Arms Cliff - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to NJBrown: Professional climbers seem to have less flamboyant channelling of their self absorption these days!
shantaram - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News: Great films. Can't believe that I've never seen these classics before. Dawes is a loveable ecentric, but I struggled with Redhead in both of those films. He's incredibly talented, but so far up his own arse he'd need a headtorch.
patrick_b - on 18 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News:

Brilliant video. John's like something from The Fast Show!
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Jim Brooke - on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News:

I have a strong recollection of talking to someone involved in the making of this, about how Redhead felt compelled to have a wank at the top of Norwich cathedral spire. Whether or not it's true, the memory has unfortunately stayed with me ever since.
Fraser on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to shantaram:
> Dawes is a loveable ecentric, but I struggled with Redhead in both of those films. He's incredibly talented, but so far up his own arse he'd need a headtorch.

Interesting comment as I feel the same, but with the characters flipped!

I remember seeing 'E9 6C' on tv just after I started climbing and being totally absorbed so thanks to UKC for showing this.

Daniel Heath - on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News:

I've just made the connection with the similar artwork in the Balcony of the new Beacon Centre - is that one of Redheads?
Jackwd - on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to patrick_b: Or Brass Eye, especially when he's thrusting his way through the market with that phallus attached to him spitting his hippy-arty spiel...
stellafan - on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News: redhead. what a nob
jon on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to Fraser:
> (In reply to shantaram)
> [...]
>
> Interesting comment as I feel the same, but with the characters flipped!

To be honest, I think they both are.
Goucho on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to jon: I wonder regarding the two Johnny's, how much of their persona is genuine, and how much is a PR exercise to create and maintain an enigmatic, controversial (certainly in Redheads case) and mystical aura.

I think they are both in fact playing to the gallery, and they are possibly completely different in private?

It's amazing sometimes the difference between public, and private persona's.

I remember playing doubles at darts in the Padarn, against Brown and one of his mates (hangers on??), and getting more than a grunt from him was nigh on impossible.

On the other hand, I spent 2 hours in the Pineapple on Water Street in Manchester with Whillans - just him and me, and I'd never met him before - and he was warm, open, generous - in both buying the beer and conversation, and an absolute delight.

jon on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to Goucho:

I think that if you assume a wildly exaggerated persona for long enough, it can take over and you eventually become that person.
Goucho on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to jon: True, but if you watch the Redhead video closely, you can see a couple of moments when the mask slips, and you get a glimpse of a different person.

And maybe the fact we only got a grunt from Brown, was because we thrashed him 3 games on the trot :-)
ERH - on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News:

"If one person takes me seriously...." wandering around in a mask and giant paper-mache penis
Chris63 on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News: We all like different stuff. That's the thing about climbing, its personal. Were they playing to the camera? Maybe, maybe not. At the end of the day someone had to edit these films. So I guesss what we see here is what the film maker was trying to capture.
lishylad - on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to stellafan: Totally agree, both him and Dawes may well have been talented climbers (HARD) but they both seemed very desperate and craved for recogition....nobs!
bonzka - on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News: I think Dominic Clemence is a brilliant comedy director, ahead of his time.
Frank the Husky - on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to oldcheese:

> And how can he ever justify that giving small children an erect phallus as ok?

Like the child in question wisely said: "There's nothing wrong with the human body."...and they were right! You must be Catholic, or repressed in some other - equally deviant - way, and good luck with that.

XX


ourkid - on 19 Jan 2013
In reply to Frank the Husky:
The key difference between these characters and those that have come after is that they where more than simply climbers.
Redhead: Totally nuts but as he say's "an image maker who climbs"
Doors: trying to redefine physical movement...

what we have today are professional climbers who climb.... that's it...

But thats because whether we like it or not, climbing harder is about pulling on smaller bits of rock, and if you think thats really whats its all about then.. you are a bit f***ed up!
I like climbing - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to stellafan:
> (In reply to UKC News) redhead. what a nob

Why ?
Franco Cookson on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to I like climbing: my thoughts exactly. People really are so lost today.
jon on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to I like climbing:
> (In reply to stellafan)
> [...]
>
> Why ?

I guess because of his aggressively confrontational manner, especially during his street show. But I think 'nob' is maybe unkind and doesn't really describe him very well. Pretentious? Well not really, this is pretentious - wait for the second part with the yellow speedos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vrac4j7C79Y
Enty - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to jon:

Truly awful!!

E
progrupicola - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to jon: I've seen this freaky vid already,anyway if one think Redhead and Dawes have big egos, you've done very well reminding what it's like, in terms of how far an ego can got swell, 10 over 10 I rather prefer Readhead & Dawes even if that means, madness or playing a roll.
ads.ukclimbing.com
I like climbing - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to jon:
> (In reply to I like climbing)
> [...]
>
> I guess because of his aggressively confrontational manner, especially during his street show. But I think 'nob' is maybe unkind and doesn't really describe him very well. Pretentious? Well not really, this is pretentious - wait for the second part with the yellow speedos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vrac4j7C79Y

I never saw his street show - was that an art thing ? In the context of the Indian Face and his climbing achievements I think he has earned the right to express himself any way he wants.
I find him truly inspiring.
As for the video you posted, while I am in awe of the climbing I found the music a chilling reminder that death is never very far away when you push the boundaries. And of course Janis died too.
I like climbing - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to Franco Cookson:
> (In reply to I like climbing) my thoughts exactly. People really are so lost today.

Wise words.
jon on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to I like climbing:
> (In reply to jon)
> [...]
>
> I never saw his street show - was that an art thing ?

It's in the vid - where he's prancing around with a two foot papier maché dildo...
I like climbing - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to jon:
> (In reply to I like climbing)
> [...]
>
> It's in the vid - where he's prancing around with a two foot papier maché dildo...

Didn't see the second video until just now ! Really enjoyed the film and I'd love to own one of his works. I guess I empathised with it and you didn't.
jon on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to I like climbing:

Some of his paintings are fabulous. I remember Paul Williams used to have the Tormented Ejaculation on his wall!
jon on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to jon:

Er... I just googled 'tormented ejaculation redhead', without really thinking - don't do it!
I like climbing - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to jon:
> (In reply to I like climbing)
>
> Some of his paintings are fabulous. I remember Paul Williams used to have the Tormented Ejaculation on his wall!

That's great !
Enty - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to jon:
> (In reply to jon)
>
> Er... I just googled 'tormented ejaculation redhead', without really thinking - don't do it!

I thought the one where the red headed lass, tied up and forced to......

I'll get me coat.

E
gd303uk - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to I like climbing: John redhead is a nice fella, not the nob aggressive anti welsh nutter that some people who have never met him think. Redhead is an artist , who happens to be a brilliant climber, A great character in the history of British climbing.
I have a few Redhead art works , I like his art, I am sure he would be happy to sell you an artwork or two.
davo - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to Franco Cookson:
> (In reply to I like climbing) my thoughts exactly. People really are so lost today.

Probably just you that is a bit lost! Sometimes it is hard to see things from that far up your own ass!
I like climbing - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to gd303uk:
> (In reply to I like climbing) John redhead is a nice fella, not the nob aggressive anti welsh nutter that some people who have never met him think. Redhead is an artist , who happens to be a brilliant climber, A great character in the history of British climbing.
> I have a few Redhead art works , I like his art, I am sure he would be happy to sell you an artwork or two.

Thanks for this. I've met him a couple of times and discussed buying some art. The only problem was the size of those particular works - they were huge ! He was really nice as you said.
Frank the Husky - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to ourkid:
> (In reply to Frank the Husky)

> But thats because whether we like it or not, climbing harder is about pulling on smaller bits of rock, and if you think thats really whats its all about then.. you are a bit f***ed up!

To seriously suggest that climbing harder is just about pulling harder on smaller holds shows what a loveable numpty you are. What about the mental aspect, what about the desire? Even Neil Gresham might disagree with your simplistic view of climbing. I've seen you climb, and that's what's holding you back from climbing better, harder routes. If you don't have the authentic desire, you might as well not bother, because otherwise it's all just numbers - and your numbers up!


simon cox - on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to NJBrown: No great characters? perhaps you get less "character", more olympic performance in the press but why would there be fewer great characters? As the number of people "into climbing" gets ever larger alas it is inevitable that much of the climbing media will be more mainstream...

But there are many people out there who are truly inspirational:
Mick fowler, what a demon mountaineer and lovable, but a really crap fell runner - thank God!
Adam Ondra - what passion!
Sharma what a dude!
And the Wide Boyz - how can Tom and Pete after spending so much time hanging upside down in the cellar, be so apparently normal?

There is no question Dawes was special - the dynamism of his climbing is for me the real poetry of the film; perhaps for climbers Redheads route legacy is more impressive than his art of philosophy, which is also a little dark/ obscure for me - but I admire his DIFFERENCE!

If I fail on Right Eliminate one more time, I will be out with my acrylic paints!

Cheers,
Franco Cookson on 20 Jan 2013
In reply to davo:

Depends whether you think climbing is a sport or an appreciation of art I suppose. But if it's only a sport, what do all these people climbing E11 do for getting a meaning from life? Or are they all just headless hedonists?
Timmd on 21 Jan 2013
In reply to oldcheese:
> (In reply to UKC News) I agree that redhead is a character but Jesus, is he self absorbed and pretentious or what!
>
> Just the little sideways glance to check the camera is on his is enough amid the constant stream of b......x convinces me he is not in it for the joy of climbing but self promotion.
>
> Not taking anything away from his climbing achievements which were superb and far greater than mine could ever hope to be.

I think I agree, he does seem a tad self absorbed and waffling.

Like in the first video where he says how two climbers have seen his picture on Indian Face, and that one is dead and they other has gone mad, and asks what more he can say.

It's meaninglessly enigmatic and suggestive of something sinister and otherworldly connected with the climb (or his painting).

Watch out the evil mystical spirits are about...?

A very good climber with an interesting take on things in society it seems, but why does he need to suggest things vaguely as if it's something mystical?

It'd be boring if we weren't all different I guess.
JJL - on 21 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News:

I was really trying to go along with it, but then Redhead talked about "moving people on".
Arrogant, patronising and blind to the irony.
davo - on 21 Jan 2013
In reply to Franco Cookson:
> (In reply to davo)
>
> Depends whether you think climbing is a sport or an appreciation of art I suppose. But if it's only a sport, what do all these people climbing E11 do for getting a meaning from life? Or are they all just headless hedonists?


Truly priceless!
Rock Badger on 21 Jan 2013
In reply to UKC News: Too much ACID,,,, man
andyb211 - on 21 Jan 2013
In reply to sbc_10:
> (In reply to UKC News)
>
> .....must be an interesting experience sharing a tent with Mr Redhead...!

as long as he don't bring the pink strap on!!!

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