/ New rock shoes :(

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Chay - on 27 Mar 2013
OK..

My beloved Scarpa Visions are about to die and they don't make them anymore :(. Hence I'm looking for a new rock shoe; I'll be keeping the Visions for lower grade climbs as they're exquisitely comfy and technical enough even in their rounded state.

New shoes will be used leading around VS 4c and hopefully into low E territory, seconding and leading when I feel up to it. Generally climb mountain routes so they have to be comfortable enough for multi-pitch days but technical enough to cope well into the low Es; so a general technical shoe required, I don't climb ludicrously steep/overhanging sport routes or boulder very hard so shoe doesn't need to be up to that. I have a fairly wide foot.

Recommend me some and I'll short list a few to try on and buy in a shop.

Thanks,
C
Chay - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay: Obviously we the usual suspects, Sportivas, sazi's; anything else worth looking at?
mrchewy - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay: I've watched lads boulder V8 roofs in Evolv Bandits and I've had multipitch days out in them on territory from Vdiff to E2. They tend to smell a lot tho, way worse than most shoes. The laceups have a tighter fit than the velcro, so I tend to keep the laceups for harder and shorter stuff..
Lasted me a lot longer than the La Sportivas I had before and I'm just about to get the velcros resoled for the first time. Worth seeing if they fit.
Chay - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to mrchewy: Funny you should say that; I bought a pair of the original bandits when they first came out- maybe 4 years ago?

I really liked them; I used them a lot when I was climbing well- up to E2. Worth considering, nice to know the new model is as good!

C
ripper - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay: I use Anasazi velcros for most things but also have a pair of 5.10 Spires for long mountain days, which I find pretty supportive and comfy - I size them half a size up from the 'Sazis and wear with thin socks. Couple of mates have used Sportiva Cliff laces which seem to be to be a similar proposition. 5.10 Galileo are similar to the Anasazi Velcro but supposedly slightly wider and stiffer, but I've never climbed in them. Scarpa Vapour also worth a look?
Chay - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to ripper: Definitely trying the Scarpa Vapour; very tempting if they're anywhere near as good as the visions.

5.10 spires/Sportiva Cliffs; I've always thought of these as long lower grade multi pitch- are they up to VS/HVS/E1+?

Thanks, I used to have some Anasazi Pinks so could well go back to sazis.

C
ripper - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay:
> (In reply to ripper) Definitely trying the Scarpa Vapour; very tempting if they're anywhere near as good as the visions.
>
> 5.10 spires/Sportiva Cliffs; I've always thought of these as long lower grade multi pitch- are they up to VS/HVS/E1+?
>
> Thanks, I used to have some Anasazi Pinks so could well go back to sazis.
>
> C

Long multi-pitch is exactly what I got my Spires for - in fact they've seen more action on two trips to the Dolomites than they have in the UK. I've done pitches of UIAA V+/VI in them though, that's probably around HVS, and if they were slightly tighter they'd be good for a notch or two harder again - the rubber's good and they edge fairly well. Anasazi Velcros are pretty comfy for shorter multi-pitch once they're well broken in though, at least on my feet, and you can always slip your heels out the back between climbs as I do.
jenniwat001 on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay:

red chilli habaneo lace ups- my other half loves them and he has wide feet that eat through shoes like chocolate. He leads HS too.
Skyfall - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay:

Have you looked at Katanas? I have used them for v long days out and they are a nicely technical shoe without being downturned etc. Being velcros they are quick on/off if you want. I'm not sure they are wide fitting as such but they certainly aren't narrow.
neuromancer - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay:

Katanas are narrow.

If you have wide feet, scarpa. If not, sportiva / 510.

Just decide if you want velcro or lace, and how stiff you want them to be.
Chay - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay: I have tried La Sportivas before; not the Katanas but the Muiras(?) and they pinched my wide feet a bit.

I liked Sazi's when I had the pinks and I like Scarpa; may well be sticking with these if the other options aren't right.

I don't mind Velcro shoes if the velcro system is good; some you just can't get tight enough- handy being able to slip the heel out at belays though!

C
Chay - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay: Bandits are the other option atm.
Skyfall - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay:

Miuras are considerably narrower than Katanas. They're not a lace up version of the Katanas, though there is one of those too.

Velcros tend to be wider fitting generally.
neuromancer - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay:

Miuras narrower than katanas? What planet are you living on!

Wide feet = scarpa. Vapours or instincts.

Bandits fall apart easily and feel like climbing in b3's.
Steve nevers on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay:

I've been on a similar shoe finding struggle and the two best fits i've had was 5.10 Dragons and Evolv Geshidos, although the Dragons are baggy heeled.

Might be worth having a look at the geshidos? Seems to fit a chisel-tipped flipper foot pretty well and they have a triple velcro fasting which aids the fitting pretty well.
Si dH - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay:
If yo liked pinks in the past then there is no reason to do anythign other than try on and buy a pair of Verdes, or Velcros if you prefer. Alternatively I'd suggest, if you can find them, its worth trying on a pair of Tenayas - the yellow and whit ones with red/bacl laces (cant remember the name). They are very simialr to Verdes but cheaper and a lot of people say theyre great.
Steve nevers on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Si dH:
> (In reply to Chay)
Tenayas - the yellow and whit ones with red/bacl laces (cant remember the name). They are very simialr to Verdes but cheaper and a lot of people say theyre great.


Having tried them this week and on the advice of two good shoefitters and some people that use them the Tenaya Masai is a direct clone of the 'sazis but without the added heel rubber on the new 5.10 models.
ripper - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay: I like Sazi VCS - of the limited number of shoes i've climbed in, they seem to give me (marginally) more performance advantage than anything else. However, they don't quite fit my feet - if they were squarer across the toes, with more length for the third and fourth toe, I could probably get away with a half-size smaller as they're not that tight over my big toe (which is, after all, where most of the power comes from). Maybe I should be looking at Scarpas...
neuromancer - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to ripper:

Last time I'll say it, but chisel feet with a wide toebox = scarpa.

Vapours or instincts (the downturn on either is only pretty gentle, instincts only just a little toe down and toe rubber).
biscuit - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay:

what about having them re-soled ?

Even if you only keep them as a second pair. Not sure how much it costs in UK now but for keeping hold of your shoes that are ever so comfy it's often worth it.

I know a few people out here who use the tenaya masais and they all rate them.
Fraser on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to neuromancer:
> (In reply to Chay)
>
> Miuras narrower than katanas? What planet are you living on!

I'm afraid Skyfall is right. Katanas use a different, wider last to the Miuras, (both the lace-ups and the VS) There used to be a section on the La Sportiva website which gave you all the relevant info, but basically the Miura uses the PD75 fit last, and the Katanas a PD55; the Katanas being a 'technical' fit and the Miuras a 'performance' fit.


To the OP.

My suggestion for a suitable all-day, slightly technical shoe was going to be the Miura.
danm - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to neuromancer:

Manufacturers don't use a single last for all their boots, so saying that you should base your shoe choice on a manufacturer is wrong. Personally I've found boots from 5.10, Scarpa and La Sportiva which have been a perfect fit for me, but also each manufacturer makes shoes which don't fit me at all. Just try a heap of different shoes on and see which fits best - at VS-E1 comfort is more important than performance anyway.

One thing you can do is wear them indoors (watch tv or something) for an hour or 2 and see how they feel then, gives a beter idea about hotspots and you can still return them unused if they don't pass muster.
The Fox - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay: my shoe of choice use to be Visions and i was equally gutted when they disappeared.
now use Vapours and very happy with them.
Chris Aston - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay: Think they still sell them in Go outdoors , have a look on the website
Madden - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay: Don't know if somebody else has already suggested them, but I recently bought a pair of 5.10 Stonelands (their new lace-up shoe), for £70 (which is pretty cheap these days). So far, they're the comfiest shoe I've ever put on in a shop, and have done well for several day-long sessions at walls. I've climbed up to font 6c+ in them indoors (not had a chance to get on a rope or outdoors with them yet, due to weather and travel constraints)... I really would recommend them though! Flexible, but good at edging, and with a different cut to the heel than a 5.10 anasazi, they seem to excel at heel hooks. Oh, and I have wide feet too, and these shoes seem made for me.
johncook - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to jenniwat001: The spirits are better than the habneros. I have short wide feet so I tend to stick to chilis as they seem to be the widest. Lead up to E2 and 6c, but not much bouldering. I prefer jam cracks, but do climb slabs and walls and find the spirits good all round shoes. I like long routes, and have often kept the spirits on all day. Also they don't make your feet reek like some of the other manufacturers.
Fluvial - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Chay:
I've heard good things about the Tenaya's as well the Ra and Intl I've climbed E2s in Evolv Defys which are comfy but not technical
AlanLittle - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to neuromancer:
> (In reply to Chay)
>
> Miuras narrower than katanas? What planet are you living on!
>

One where he can feel what he's putting his feet in? Or, even, one where measuring devices have been invented

... gets ruler and shoes ...

Katana Laces size 42: width of forefoot: 90mm
Miura Laces size 42: width of forefoot: 85mm

Happy to help.

AlanLittle - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to Fluvial:

I read good reviews of the Tenaya Ra too, on which basis I bought a pair slightly larger than my Miuras as comfy multipitch shoes. My impression so far based on a couple of breaking-in sessions at the wall: comfy indeed, but insensitive. I hope that will improve with a bit of wear.
neuromancer - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to AlanLittle:

I was thinking miura laces vs katana velcros (i.e. classics), but ho hum.
AlanLittle - on 29 Mar 2013
In reply to neuromancer:

As somebody pointed out above, Miura Laces & Velcro are the same last and both Katanas are the same last, although I find the two generations feel quite different.
kingofthering on 31 Mar 2013
In reply to Fraser:
> (In reply to neuromancer)
> [...]
>
> I'm afraid Skyfall is right. Katanas use a different, wider last to the Miuras, (both the lace-ups and the VS) There used to be a section on the La Sportiva website which gave you all the relevant info, but basically the Miura uses the PD75 fit last, and the Katanas a PD55; the Katanas being a 'technical' fit and the Miuras a 'performance' fit.
>
>
> To the OP.
>
> My suggestion for a suitable all-day, slightly technical shoe was going to be the Miura.


The 55 and 75 in the Last only stands for the amount of offset of the shape telling you how asymetric the shoe is. PD standing for pointed tip.
It says nothing about the width of the shoe.
Also the Katana Lace-up and the Katana Velcro are nothing alike. The Lace Up is a lot wider than the velcro. And it“s the same with Miuras and the Miura VS.

Anyway it shouldn“t matter for the grade he was asking for. Every shoe will be great for VS 4c.
Styx - on 31 Mar 2013
In reply to Madden:
> (In reply to Chay) Don't know if somebody else has already suggested them, but I recently bought a pair of 5.10 Stonelands (their new lace-up shoe), for £70 (which is pretty cheap these days). So far, they're the comfiest shoe I've ever put on in a shop, and have done well for several day-long sessions at walls. I've climbed up to font 6c+ in them indoors (not had a chance to get on a rope or outdoors with them yet, due to weather and travel constraints)... I really would recommend them though! Flexible, but good at edging, and with a different cut to the heel than a 5.10 anasazi, they seem to excel at heel hooks. Oh, and I have wide feet too, and these shoes seem made for me.


I've been wearing a pair of the velcro Stonelands for the last week or so and so far I have been very impressed with them. I usually wear Miura laces or velcro but picked these up as a more comfortable option for long routes. I've mainly been climbing indoors up to 7a in them but I took them bouldering on Friday intending to just use them for warm ups before breaking out the tight fitting "big guns", I ended up wearing them all day long I was so impressed. I pulled out my Miura's once but put them back in my bag again after one attempt.

The Stonelands last is designed to with a flat forefoot in mind, rather than curling your toes in to a crimp position as the Miura's/Anasazi's do your toes should lie flat, this makes for a much more comfortable experience. Typically this leads to poorer performance but somehow the unorthodox toe box really pulls it off in the Stonelands, edging performance is excellent without compromising the confidence inspiring smearing.

For anything less than hard and very steep sport climbing these are likely to become my new go to shoe. There, I said it, I'm sorry Sportiva, I loved you long time but there's a new gunslinging hottie in town.

There are three models in the Stonelands range, the lace up is the softest, slipper the stiffest and velcro somewhere in the middle which I find to be a great balance for most types of climbing.

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