This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
In reply to Chris Doyle: Couldn't make it . Good crack ?
In reply to Chris Doyle: I thought the crowd backed up John really well. Some cracking one liners from the BIG Man - "I can't believe I'm being started on by a couple of blokes under 5'5" (Dawes and ?). Who was the other chap with the mouth?
In reply to phil winskill:
it was richie patterson.mr dawes was talking to me afterwards and he was pissed off because he said that the audience were"ignorant of the history" i guess most people are up to a point!
the partion shot argument did get a bit annoying but i guess it was expected. john dunne was great though.
it was richie patterson.mr dawes was talking to me afterwards and he was pissed off because he said that the audience were"ignorant of the history" i guess most people are up to a point!
the partion shot argument did get a bit annoying but i guess it was expected. john dunne was great though.
In reply to mark davies: Thanks for that Mark. I thought John was pushing it a little further than necessary with the constant jibes about his ascents - funny though. I felt he wanted to provoke a reaction from a few of the 'names' present. I guess though he has had a fair few years of abuse to get off his chest. Did I hear a comment on Ron Fawcett and some of his ascents?
In reply to phil winskill: Details! we want Details
In reply to Chris Doyle: chris, whilst you were starting this thread i was simultaneously posting about last night on grimers thread, so i'll repost it here:
well last night will go down in climbing history (and not for the fact that there was a mini rocktalk meet-up there....chris fryer, sim, irish si, neil k, ian jones, mark tolver - great to see everyone! in fact chris is still here, watching climbing vids with his mate. i digress....)
john dunne was quite simply brilliant last night. but he was a lone man on stage in alien country and one or two people took advantage of this and the old hyena thing kicked into action with baiting, taunting and outright hostility. and i dont mean from johnny. johnny was actually very entertaining and funny from his various perches in the audience, challenging john and arguing with him. but dunney stood his ground and managed time and again to get the show back on track with his cutting witticisms which won him rounds of applause time after time.
in fact considering this was alien territory the audience were 99% behind john, with lots of people telling the hecklers to shut up. yup richie patterson, you were bang out of order mate. and when john finally lost his patience and threatened to take you outside i almost wish he had done. nothing personal, everyone can be a tw*t sometimes. but as he quipped "yeah, im feeling really frightened by two 5 foot 5 blokes threatening me"..........which made the house erupt with cheers and applause
shame we didnt get it on video though because despite the odd moment when things got nasty it was sheer entertainment from start to finish and dunney came out of it on top.
hope you appreciated my turn on the mike at the end john. grimer.....the look on your face when i went up to the stage to take the mike was PRICELESS
anyway thanks for organising a great night grimer and a big thankyou to dunney for BOTHERING to come and talk to all of us
well last night will go down in climbing history (and not for the fact that there was a mini rocktalk meet-up there....chris fryer, sim, irish si, neil k, ian jones, mark tolver - great to see everyone! in fact chris is still here, watching climbing vids with his mate. i digress....)
john dunne was quite simply brilliant last night. but he was a lone man on stage in alien country and one or two people took advantage of this and the old hyena thing kicked into action with baiting, taunting and outright hostility. and i dont mean from johnny. johnny was actually very entertaining and funny from his various perches in the audience, challenging john and arguing with him. but dunney stood his ground and managed time and again to get the show back on track with his cutting witticisms which won him rounds of applause time after time.
in fact considering this was alien territory the audience were 99% behind john, with lots of people telling the hecklers to shut up. yup richie patterson, you were bang out of order mate. and when john finally lost his patience and threatened to take you outside i almost wish he had done. nothing personal, everyone can be a tw*t sometimes. but as he quipped "yeah, im feeling really frightened by two 5 foot 5 blokes threatening me"..........which made the house erupt with cheers and applause
shame we didnt get it on video though because despite the odd moment when things got nasty it was sheer entertainment from start to finish and dunney came out of it on top.
hope you appreciated my turn on the mike at the end john. grimer.....the look on your face when i went up to the stage to take the mike was PRICELESS
anyway thanks for organising a great night grimer and a big thankyou to dunney for BOTHERING to come and talk to all of us
1
In reply to phil winskill:
‘The audience has no sense of history’ this remark (by Dawes) was aimed at whether or not Ron did Knocking on heavens door. Also Dawes made the comment that Vickers couldn’t climb on grit???????? How many E7’s has Dawes flashed in the last ten years??? and has he ever climbed Font 8a. I thought it was sad to see him make such a fool of himself.
‘The audience has no sense of history’ this remark (by Dawes) was aimed at whether or not Ron did Knocking on heavens door. Also Dawes made the comment that Vickers couldn’t climb on grit???????? How many E7’s has Dawes flashed in the last ten years??? and has he ever climbed Font 8a. I thought it was sad to see him make such a fool of himself.
In reply to phil winskill:
I felt he wanted to provoke a reaction from a few of the 'names' present.
fair point phil. at one point john paid homage to one of johnnys routes, but then in the next sentence was bragging about how hed repeated one of johnnys new routes only a week after johnny had done it i thought it was hilarious
I felt he wanted to provoke a reaction from a few of the 'names' present.
fair point phil. at one point john paid homage to one of johnnys routes, but then in the next sentence was bragging about how hed repeated one of johnnys new routes only a week after johnny had done it i thought it was hilarious
In reply to Removed User: Jude. Completely unrelated to the evenings entertainment (maybe not). My girlfriend commented when we left that you made a slight hiccup with the stand you made at the end. The slide you stood in front of had the climber appear on your chest. Looked like he was dynoing for your nose....! Sorry to be so sad.
In reply to Removed User: Hi Jude, good to see you back on RT! Haven't made any of the ape index talks yet though, netheredge is a fair way on my bike.
Damn I was going to post exactly the same thread an hour earlier but went to bed instead heh.
In reply to jude calvert-toulmin:
"johnny was actually very entertaining and funny from his various perches in the audience"
Hahahaha for some reason I find that "various perches" bit very funny =).
"yup richie patterson, you were bang out of order mate"
I think a lot of people will agree with that. Droning on and on about "let's see the other photos" is hardly entertaining - knocks about 20 years off his age, and I don't mean in a good way.
"he quipped "yeah, im feeling really frightened by two 5 foot 5 blokes threatening me"....."
I thought Dawes "Yeah but that's a total of 11 feet" was pretty damn funny =).
What to say? John was good, apparently he can climb a bit too. Some of his putdowns were very good and compensated for a few bits of the lecture that dragged on a little.
The whole JD vs JD issue bemuses me (another thing that bemuses me is that the Dawes hasn't repeated Parthian yet - why?). Both are very talented and bold climbers with some of Britain's best trad routes under their belts. Wouldn't it be better to be partners in crime / climb and push British climbing together?? Does anyone else think it would be nice (once the monsoon season stops) to see JD and JD having some days out in the Peak, with JD belaying JD on Wizard Ridge and JD belaying JD on the Elder Crack Arete??
In reply to jude calvert-toulmin:
"johnny was actually very entertaining and funny from his various perches in the audience"
Hahahaha for some reason I find that "various perches" bit very funny =).
"yup richie patterson, you were bang out of order mate"
I think a lot of people will agree with that. Droning on and on about "let's see the other photos" is hardly entertaining - knocks about 20 years off his age, and I don't mean in a good way.
"he quipped "yeah, im feeling really frightened by two 5 foot 5 blokes threatening me"....."
I thought Dawes "Yeah but that's a total of 11 feet" was pretty damn funny =).
What to say? John was good, apparently he can climb a bit too. Some of his putdowns were very good and compensated for a few bits of the lecture that dragged on a little.
The whole JD vs JD issue bemuses me (another thing that bemuses me is that the Dawes hasn't repeated Parthian yet - why?). Both are very talented and bold climbers with some of Britain's best trad routes under their belts. Wouldn't it be better to be partners in crime / climb and push British climbing together?? Does anyone else think it would be nice (once the monsoon season stops) to see JD and JD having some days out in the Peak, with JD belaying JD on Wizard Ridge and JD belaying JD on the Elder Crack Arete??
In reply to Chris Doyle:
Dawes is mad as a hatter and patterson is a mouthy tit!
Dawes is mad as a hatter and patterson is a mouthy tit!
In reply to Removed User:
My favourite line of the night:
"Richie, do you want me to put you through the f*cking window!" - nothing like a good honest brutal threat to keep the crowd entertained.
My favourite line of the night:
"Richie, do you want me to put you through the f*cking window!" - nothing like a good honest brutal threat to keep the crowd entertained.
In reply to phil winskill:
>The slide you stood in front of had the climber appear on your chest. Looked like he was dynoing for your nose....!
LOL Brilliant! i did it on purpose of course
thank you fiend. i missed johnnys wise-cracking return about 11 feet, pretty good
igneous - hmmm. im just here to talk about this one thing. my life has become full since i stopped wasting it farting around on here.
now i waste it farting around on parsleywood instead
but that only takes up 5 minutes of my day and not 5 hours
i agree mark, best remark of the night
>The slide you stood in front of had the climber appear on your chest. Looked like he was dynoing for your nose....!
LOL Brilliant! i did it on purpose of course
thank you fiend. i missed johnnys wise-cracking return about 11 feet, pretty good
igneous - hmmm. im just here to talk about this one thing. my life has become full since i stopped wasting it farting around on here.
now i waste it farting around on parsleywood instead
but that only takes up 5 minutes of my day and not 5 hours
i agree mark, best remark of the night
In reply to Mark Tolver:
Anyone else want to see a re-match? I reckon a panel style head to head would be a civilised way of doing it... Ah, f*ck it, I just want to see a JD Vs JD Deathmatch!
Anyone else want to see a re-match? I reckon a panel style head to head would be a civilised way of doing it... Ah, f*ck it, I just want to see a JD Vs JD Deathmatch!
In reply to Fiend: "The whole JD vs JD issue bemuses me"
I've often thought that. In another life, they could have been the Brown and Whillans of the current era. And those two didn't especially like each other either.
I've often thought that. In another life, they could have been the Brown and Whillans of the current era. And those two didn't especially like each other either.
In reply to Mark Tolver: I thought Mr Dunne's comment regarding how all the questioning of his routes makes all his belayers and car drivers'efforts useless.Assuming he has actually made all these ascents(which I personally do not doubt),his mates must be pretty riled after spending X number of hours holding imaginary ropes for a fatlad who won't ever get up anything.
Not a bad evening all in,aside from the theiving toerag who stole my baccy while I went to the bogs.And perhaps a couple more barstaff next time please?
Not a bad evening all in,aside from the theiving toerag who stole my baccy while I went to the bogs.And perhaps a couple more barstaff next time please?
In reply to Andrew Murray: AJ, I can feel a cartoon coming on! Like in the old guide books and OTE.
Stu
Stu
In reply to Removed User:
Jude, you weren't wandering around Cromford on Sunday morning were you? If not, someone has a better/bigger hat than you.
Jude, you weren't wandering around Cromford on Sunday morning were you? If not, someone has a better/bigger hat than you.
In reply to Kipper: but probably not better/bigger tits kipper
In reply to Removed User:
I feel unqualified to judge, but I will pay close attention to the competition next time.
I feel unqualified to judge, but I will pay close attention to the competition next time.
In reply to Chris Doyle:
just putting in my piece, big jd was amazing, as were his brilliant one-liners. perhaps since little jd has so much to say, he ought to do a slide show there too, as it would probably be just as interesting. or would he not want to perform in front of such an ignorant audience?
just putting in my piece, big jd was amazing, as were his brilliant one-liners. perhaps since little jd has so much to say, he ought to do a slide show there too, as it would probably be just as interesting. or would he not want to perform in front of such an ignorant audience?
In reply to cw: I have never heard John Dunne say a word against any of the other climbers, I can understand Johnny not liking John D doing his route first, but one of the others would have, Seb/Neil etc anyway.
This is what you expect if you advertise a new route on a video/TV. In the old days, you would only have to turn your back.......
Stu
This is what you expect if you advertise a new route on a video/TV. In the old days, you would only have to turn your back.......
Stu
In reply to cw:
He did, he was pissed, and it was crap.
> (In reply to Chris Doyle)
>
perhaps since little jd has so much to say, he ought to do a slide show there too, as it would probably be just as interesting.
>
He did, he was pissed, and it was crap.
Now that I think about it,the highlight of the evening was the narration on that Old Man of Hoy video.There's not enough people speaking like that anymore.
I think we saw a little piece of climbing history last night. Years of back biting came to a head, Dunne went into the jackals lair and stood up to all of them. I have always respected both JDs as climbers, but Dunne has now gone up in my estimation and Dawes down. I felt a bit pissed off that Dunne spent a lot of the slide show trying hard to justify himself, when I think he shouldnt need to. All good entertainment though.
At the end of the day, John dunne is still out there climbing, pushing the limits etc... whereas dawes has done f'all for the last ten years because "he doesn't feel part of it any more".
In reply to Chris Doyle:
Yeah but that doesn't negate what Dawes has done in the past. What has Fawcett done in the last ten years eh??
And for the record: Avoiding The Traitors E7 6c, Salmon variations E6-7 6b-c, Smoked Salmon E8 7b, Warm Love E6 7a, Jumping on a Beetle E7 6c, Angel's Share E8 7a, Downhill Racer one handed E8 6c. And maybe some other stuff.
Yeah but that doesn't negate what Dawes has done in the past. What has Fawcett done in the last ten years eh??
And for the record: Avoiding The Traitors E7 6c, Salmon variations E6-7 6b-c, Smoked Salmon E8 7b, Warm Love E6 7a, Jumping on a Beetle E7 6c, Angel's Share E8 7a, Downhill Racer one handed E8 6c. And maybe some other stuff.
In reply to Fiend:
You can't grade downhill racer E8 6C just for a one handed ascent. It's E4 6a end of story.
You can't grade downhill racer E8 6C just for a one handed ascent. It's E4 6a end of story.
In reply to Fiend:
"Downhill Racer one handed E8 6c" - was Dawes in a one-arm straight jacket to stop him using both hands if he got the jitters? otherwise this doesn't really help you with your point...
I regret not getting my ass along to the show. But I would be keen to see Dawes pitch; due to Dawes questioning of Dunne's ascents I assume Johnny has lots of very interesting uneditted video footage of Smoked Salmon etc.
"Downhill Racer one handed E8 6c" - was Dawes in a one-arm straight jacket to stop him using both hands if he got the jitters? otherwise this doesn't really help you with your point...
I regret not getting my ass along to the show. But I would be keen to see Dawes pitch; due to Dawes questioning of Dunne's ascents I assume Johnny has lots of very interesting uneditted video footage of Smoked Salmon etc.
In reply to Fiend:
What has Fawcett done in the last ten years eh??
Crescent Arete about 3650 times!
What has Fawcett done in the last ten years eh??
Crescent Arete about 3650 times!
In reply to Anonymous: "Crescent Arete about 3650 times!"
If this is the case, tell him to stop wearing the bloody thing out
If this is the case, tell him to stop wearing the bloody thing out
In reply to Simon Cox:
But Dawes isn't widely doubted. Dunne is, and that changes the burden of proof somewhat. Because John knows his ascents will be doubted he's a fool not to document them, unless he actually benefits from the controversy....
> (In reply to Fiend)
>
> I regret not getting my ass along to the show. But I would be keen to see Dawes pitch; due to Dawes questioning of Dunne's ascents I assume Johnny has lots of very interesting uneditted video footage of Smoked Salmon etc.
>
> I regret not getting my ass along to the show. But I would be keen to see Dawes pitch; due to Dawes questioning of Dunne's ascents I assume Johnny has lots of very interesting uneditted video footage of Smoked Salmon etc.
But Dawes isn't widely doubted. Dunne is, and that changes the burden of proof somewhat. Because John knows his ascents will be doubted he's a fool not to document them, unless he actually benefits from the controversy....
In reply to midgets of the world unite: If John Dunne were pyhsically incapable of climbing the routes he has claimed the doubters would be in a stronger position. The fact he can climb >7a does a lot to swing the balance in his favour.
In reply to Sloper:
....and almost lap previous doubted ascents...and drink guiness in sessions and eat pies...imagine the potential...
...the controversy and subsequent publicity does his sponsorship no harm though. My mum would say its a shame the two of them can't bang there heads together and get on with climbing.
....and almost lap previous doubted ascents...and drink guiness in sessions and eat pies...imagine the potential...
...the controversy and subsequent publicity does his sponsorship no harm though. My mum would say its a shame the two of them can't bang there heads together and get on with climbing.
In reply to Chris Doyle:
I have just wathed 'The Big Issue' again IN this Big JD blames it on Jealousy, He does a boulder problem in this with out knowing the grade of it. the guy that took him there said the Little JD did a few weeks earlier and graded it 7a. Big JD said this cant be possible as "I cant climb 7a and I have just done it in a short session"
Also something i noticed in this, Big JD using a very corse looking wire brush on a route he was trying in Gorple.
I have just wathed 'The Big Issue' again IN this Big JD blames it on Jealousy, He does a boulder problem in this with out knowing the grade of it. the guy that took him there said the Little JD did a few weeks earlier and graded it 7a. Big JD said this cant be possible as "I cant climb 7a and I have just done it in a short session"
Also something i noticed in this, Big JD using a very corse looking wire brush on a route he was trying in Gorple.
In reply to Del: Did he not mention using a wire brush on Widdop wall during his show? I half expected a few shouts of derision at this,but no.
In reply to Andrew Murray:
I didnt go to the show so i have no idea!! Just watching a video this lunch time, Caught the end of hard grit and the big issue.
I didnt go to the show so i have no idea!! Just watching a video this lunch time, Caught the end of hard grit and the big issue.
In reply to Andrew Murray: I though this was one of Dawes' weakest arguments - the fact that he found the top very granular when he went there; Parry and Vickers, who were both trying the route beforehand and they never raised this point.
In reply to midgets of the world unite:
I remember Dawes on this forum saying his "gut reaction" was that Dunne hadn't done PS. I believe the facts are:
that Dunne has climbed 7a
has climbed very bold routes
has m8s that support his claims
i.e. the only thing missing is uneditted video footage.
If you are going to discount others ascents for lack of this evidence you should be able to produce this for your ground breaking ascents - Smoked Salmon seemed to fit that bill... I genuinely would like to see Johnny climbing 7b... watching Marc Le Menestral crank Alchimiste on "Bleau" is impressive to say the least.
BTW, I don't doubt either climbers have done the routes they claim. I think that Indian Face was an insirational ascent, I guess in some way because Dawes was such a talent, it makes his cheap comments about Dunne's efforts the more disappointing.
I remember Dawes on this forum saying his "gut reaction" was that Dunne hadn't done PS. I believe the facts are:
that Dunne has climbed 7a
has climbed very bold routes
has m8s that support his claims
i.e. the only thing missing is uneditted video footage.
If you are going to discount others ascents for lack of this evidence you should be able to produce this for your ground breaking ascents - Smoked Salmon seemed to fit that bill... I genuinely would like to see Johnny climbing 7b... watching Marc Le Menestral crank Alchimiste on "Bleau" is impressive to say the least.
BTW, I don't doubt either climbers have done the routes they claim. I think that Indian Face was an insirational ascent, I guess in some way because Dawes was such a talent, it makes his cheap comments about Dunne's efforts the more disappointing.
In reply to Billy the Kid & Simon Cox: Shut up you pair of time-wasting pedantic nit-picking tosspots. You can go ahead and scratch that off the list, whatever, Dawes has still done stuff in the last 10 years.
In reply to Andrew Murray: Yes he did. But given how the Artificial Route slab has been shredded by wire brushes I guess Widdop Wall is not so much of a big issue...
In reply to Andrew Murray: Yes he did. But given how the Artificial Route slab has been shredded by wire brushes I guess Widdop Wall is not so much of a big issue...
In reply to Fiend:
"Shut up you pair of time-wasting pedantic nit-picking tosspots"
My initial reaction to this comment was to check out your user-profile, and what do I find..
"Ex-bitter & twisted young man now mellow & funky young man"
Really?
It seems to me that you over-react when people point out you are talking bollox.
Be mellow .
"Shut up you pair of time-wasting pedantic nit-picking tosspots"
My initial reaction to this comment was to check out your user-profile, and what do I find..
"Ex-bitter & twisted young man now mellow & funky young man"
Really?
It seems to me that you over-react when people point out you are talking bollox.
Be mellow .
In reply to Fiend:
Lets look at my post again:
'You can't grade downhill racer E8 6C just for a one handed ascent. It's E4 6a end of story'.
Now how that illicited the response you gave me god only knows.
Chill Fiend I was only giving a reasoned point.
Lets look at my post again:
'You can't grade downhill racer E8 6C just for a one handed ascent. It's E4 6a end of story'.
Now how that illicited the response you gave me god only knows.
Chill Fiend I was only giving a reasoned point.
Another good quote:
Dunne to Dawes- "I think your a tw*t Johnny, but your climbings great"
Dunne to Dawes- "I think your a tw*t Johnny, but your climbings great"
In reply to Chris Doyle: was it better than moffat-choose your words carefully boy.
In reply to Chris Doyle: Sick of being dragged in to this bullshit but must ! Facts are John paths Partheon and Newstatesman on his video clearly having enjoyed all things edible in the years since his first ascents . The John I climbed with in that earlier era would have lapped these routes for fun !! As for the fall factors these were small fry . Time the peak boys stopped making c**ts of themselves and had the maturity to accept the world doesn't end in their allotment .
In reply to Mick Johnston:
John Dunne; one of the greatest climbers ever, Johnny Dawes; one of the most innovative climbers ever. Of course Dunney did the routes otherwise he wouldn't have said so. Leave the honest Yorkshireman alone.
John Dunne; one of the greatest climbers ever, Johnny Dawes; one of the most innovative climbers ever. Of course Dunney did the routes otherwise he wouldn't have said so. Leave the honest Yorkshireman alone.
In reply to Mick Johnston:
Micky J
Yeah but what's the fat get done in Bishop apart from hang off the aqueduct pipe for rad' photo ops?
When you coming over anyway - oh objective one? Russ has the pad set up for you and the Peel, and Mad Radster.
Fook me this Arrogant Bastard Ale is good (7.2%) and it Bigfoot season (9.6%), one of the latter dude and you're all mine.
Micky R
Micky J
Yeah but what's the fat get done in Bishop apart from hang off the aqueduct pipe for rad' photo ops?
When you coming over anyway - oh objective one? Russ has the pad set up for you and the Peel, and Mad Radster.
Fook me this Arrogant Bastard Ale is good (7.2%) and it Bigfoot season (9.6%), one of the latter dude and you're all mine.
Micky R
In reply to Mick - Rockfax USA:
and some say that Dunney is just a wannabe, I wannabe that has achieved a lot, a great climber, a showman, a master of one liners, streetwise, an opportunist, maybe the big one wants to be Dawes and Dawes wants to be Dunne..........
Dawes is often spoke of like this.............
"...deemed by many to be one of the most technically creative climbers of all time."
Neil Gresham's training tips part 1: an introduction to climbing technique
http://www.dmm.wales.com/dmm/pages/trtips5a.htm
Most climbers focus on building up arm strength and power, trying to keep their weight down and getting as many routes under their belts as possible in a bid to improve. But Johnny Dawes climbs on a whole different level. Johnny's most important climbing tool isn't a bulging bicep or a vice like grip, it's his brain.
Alex Wellings, Stratford Journal.
In a sport that never takes itself too seriously, Johnny was to excel at difficult climbs while always maintaining a healthy dose of irreverance. Despite his extraordinary ability, his gymnastic style and his ability to discover and develop audacious new climbs he has remained one of climbing's true free spirits. Never one to bow to convention, he maintained an enthusiasm for the unusual, the spectacular and sometimes the dangerous and (to many of his contemporaries) the unjustifiable. In a sport where "control", planned movements and delicate technique are lauded characteristics, Johnny surprises everyone with leaps, springs, lunges and a fluid style that enables him to complete some of the most difficult and rarely ascended climbs in Britain.
Johnny is one of climbing's true "lateral" thinkers. A refreshing change to the oh-so-serious rock jocks, this talented and entertaining character still enjoys his climbing and is one of the UK's real live wires
Australian website www.escalade.com.au
There is a dynamic energy about Dawes and a lot of fun. He climbs for the fun of it and seems to bounce up a crag like an energetic rubber ball, with a series of 'dynos', almost leaping for holds.
Chris Bonnington
Johnny is een beetje 'bonkers' maar hij is wel een klim-genie.
Posted by D J Aplat on a Dutch internet message board
Hiya Johnny! I'm 15 and i've been climbing for two years now, and it was thanks to you I got into it. I went round to my friend's house and he had just bought "Stone Monkey", and we watched it, and the first thing that i said afterwards was "that's cool." Anyway, i go climbing weekly at my local club, i have also been on a number of climbing trips, and i have taken rock climbing for G.C.S.E P.E. and i got an 'A'. So cheers again for helping me get into the sport.
Richard Pearce
Romantic genius who brought his great charisma and personality to a raging series of first ascents.....made his bouncing, boyish presence felt with ballsy on-sights of others routes.
Climbing Magazine, June 2001
Johnny has more respect for the rock than anyone i've ever met. he talks about it with utter, utter respect, with a purity that melts your heart, with an honesty and sincerity that is painfully beautiful. that's why he is such a great climber......it is his love for rock that is the force which has powered his achievements.
Jude Calvert-Toulmin on Rocktalk
and some say that Dunney is just a wannabe, I wannabe that has achieved a lot, a great climber, a showman, a master of one liners, streetwise, an opportunist, maybe the big one wants to be Dawes and Dawes wants to be Dunne..........
Dawes is often spoke of like this.............
"...deemed by many to be one of the most technically creative climbers of all time."
Neil Gresham's training tips part 1: an introduction to climbing technique
http://www.dmm.wales.com/dmm/pages/trtips5a.htm
Most climbers focus on building up arm strength and power, trying to keep their weight down and getting as many routes under their belts as possible in a bid to improve. But Johnny Dawes climbs on a whole different level. Johnny's most important climbing tool isn't a bulging bicep or a vice like grip, it's his brain.
Alex Wellings, Stratford Journal.
In a sport that never takes itself too seriously, Johnny was to excel at difficult climbs while always maintaining a healthy dose of irreverance. Despite his extraordinary ability, his gymnastic style and his ability to discover and develop audacious new climbs he has remained one of climbing's true free spirits. Never one to bow to convention, he maintained an enthusiasm for the unusual, the spectacular and sometimes the dangerous and (to many of his contemporaries) the unjustifiable. In a sport where "control", planned movements and delicate technique are lauded characteristics, Johnny surprises everyone with leaps, springs, lunges and a fluid style that enables him to complete some of the most difficult and rarely ascended climbs in Britain.
Johnny is one of climbing's true "lateral" thinkers. A refreshing change to the oh-so-serious rock jocks, this talented and entertaining character still enjoys his climbing and is one of the UK's real live wires
Australian website www.escalade.com.au
There is a dynamic energy about Dawes and a lot of fun. He climbs for the fun of it and seems to bounce up a crag like an energetic rubber ball, with a series of 'dynos', almost leaping for holds.
Chris Bonnington
Johnny is een beetje 'bonkers' maar hij is wel een klim-genie.
Posted by D J Aplat on a Dutch internet message board
Hiya Johnny! I'm 15 and i've been climbing for two years now, and it was thanks to you I got into it. I went round to my friend's house and he had just bought "Stone Monkey", and we watched it, and the first thing that i said afterwards was "that's cool." Anyway, i go climbing weekly at my local club, i have also been on a number of climbing trips, and i have taken rock climbing for G.C.S.E P.E. and i got an 'A'. So cheers again for helping me get into the sport.
Richard Pearce
Romantic genius who brought his great charisma and personality to a raging series of first ascents.....made his bouncing, boyish presence felt with ballsy on-sights of others routes.
Climbing Magazine, June 2001
Johnny has more respect for the rock than anyone i've ever met. he talks about it with utter, utter respect, with a purity that melts your heart, with an honesty and sincerity that is painfully beautiful. that's why he is such a great climber......it is his love for rock that is the force which has powered his achievements.
Jude Calvert-Toulmin on Rocktalk
In reply to Mick - Rockfax USA:
Where as Dunney says:
"John Dunne is one of the strongest and most notorious climbers on the current climbing scene. He is infamous for pushing climbing grades into new realms of difficulty, including classic routes which are seldom repeated because of their potentially fatal nature. His sometimes controversial climbing career has seen him dominating the headlines on many occaisions making him one of the most outstanding and committed all round climbers in the world."
M
Where as Dunney says:
"John Dunne is one of the strongest and most notorious climbers on the current climbing scene. He is infamous for pushing climbing grades into new realms of difficulty, including classic routes which are seldom repeated because of their potentially fatal nature. His sometimes controversial climbing career has seen him dominating the headlines on many occaisions making him one of the most outstanding and committed all round climbers in the world."
M
In reply to Mick - Rockfax USA:
I think if you want to find out the truth you've got to talk in abstract terms and people like Dunne and Dawes are incapable of that of course, as are people like me and Micky J, and especially the Sheffield mafia, including Ed Douglas who went to school with Dawes....and forget the belayers and photographers.
Funny game climbing.
There's only one person who knows the truth.
Do you trust him?
or even...do you care?
M
I think if you want to find out the truth you've got to talk in abstract terms and people like Dunne and Dawes are incapable of that of course, as are people like me and Micky J, and especially the Sheffield mafia, including Ed Douglas who went to school with Dawes....and forget the belayers and photographers.
Funny game climbing.
There's only one person who knows the truth.
Do you trust him?
or even...do you care?
M
In reply to Mick - Rockfax USA:
"John Dunne is infamous for pushing climbing grades into new realms of difficulty"
Can someone give me some evidence to back this claim up.
M
"John Dunne is infamous for pushing climbing grades into new realms of difficulty"
Can someone give me some evidence to back this claim up.
M
In reply to Mick - Rockfax USA: 1st E9..1st E10 both doubted (hence infamous???)
In reply to Simon Cox:
First things first.. I believe John climbed Partheon Shot, New Statesman, etc. *But* there are people who don't believe him. I have heard rumours (which I can't verify, so I wont repeat them) about almost every one of his climbs which suggest he didn't/couldn't have done them. Wether or not I believe these rumours is not the point.
The point is that John is aware of their existence. He knows that every ground breaking route he does will be disbelieved or discredited in some way. If he really wan't uncritical acclaim for his ascents, he would provide video evidence of the ascents. He may feel he shouldn't have to. In an ideal world he shouldn't have to, but I think it's the only way he'll get credit for an ascent without the rumours.
Now ask if he wants that. When he climbed Total Eclipse it would have dropped out of the news very quickly, but the subsequent spat with Jerry kept it in the mags for months to come. It's all publicity. I don't accuse John of intentionally courting infamy, but I think he's done damn well out of it.
> (In reply to midgets of the world unite)
>
> I remember Dawes on this forum saying his "gut reaction" was that Dunne hadn't done PS. I believe the facts are:
> that Dunne has climbed 7a
> has climbed very bold routes
> has m8s that support his claims
>
> i.e. the only thing missing is uneditted video footage.
>
>
> I remember Dawes on this forum saying his "gut reaction" was that Dunne hadn't done PS. I believe the facts are:
> that Dunne has climbed 7a
> has climbed very bold routes
> has m8s that support his claims
>
> i.e. the only thing missing is uneditted video footage.
>
First things first.. I believe John climbed Partheon Shot, New Statesman, etc. *But* there are people who don't believe him. I have heard rumours (which I can't verify, so I wont repeat them) about almost every one of his climbs which suggest he didn't/couldn't have done them. Wether or not I believe these rumours is not the point.
The point is that John is aware of their existence. He knows that every ground breaking route he does will be disbelieved or discredited in some way. If he really wan't uncritical acclaim for his ascents, he would provide video evidence of the ascents. He may feel he shouldn't have to. In an ideal world he shouldn't have to, but I think it's the only way he'll get credit for an ascent without the rumours.
Now ask if he wants that. When he climbed Total Eclipse it would have dropped out of the news very quickly, but the subsequent spat with Jerry kept it in the mags for months to come. It's all publicity. I don't accuse John of intentionally courting infamy, but I think he's done damn well out of it.
In reply to midgets of the world unite: We all keep saying that john's ascents are "widely doubted", so i think it would be interesting to see how many of you actually belive he hasn't done the routes he's claimed???? and if so which routes and why???
To get the ball rolling, I belive him 100%.
To get the ball rolling, I belive him 100%.
In reply to Dave: Yes, 100%
In reply to Adam Lincoln: I too believe him 100%, but unlike all of you I don't think he's that big, but then again my brother used be about 16 stone, so its all relative.
And also the Moffat thing on Total Eclipse should be a lesson to us all to make sure you're on the right route.
Didn't some of the doubt come from the first ascent of the MAximum at Malham which was graded 8b until Mick Johnston (I think) found an easier sequence and downgraded it to 7c+.
And also the Moffat thing on Total Eclipse should be a lesson to us all to make sure you're on the right route.
Didn't some of the doubt come from the first ascent of the MAximum at Malham which was graded 8b until Mick Johnston (I think) found an easier sequence and downgraded it to 7c+.
In reply to Chris Doyle:
How much fun was that the a few years back watching Malc Smith do to Jerry what he (Jerry) did to Ron and follow him round the country, or should that be the peak and Yorkshire and down grade everything he'd just done.
> (In reply to Graeme)
>
> Yeh and jerry's never had anything downgraded has he!
>
> Yeh and jerry's never had anything downgraded has he!
How much fun was that the a few years back watching Malc Smith do to Jerry what he (Jerry) did to Ron and follow him round the country, or should that be the peak and Yorkshire and down grade everything he'd just done.
In reply to Graeme:
What has Malc ever downgraded of Jerrys?
What has Malc ever downgraded of Jerrys?
In reply to Adam Lincoln: Progress at KIlnsey 8c+ to 8c, Seans Roof Malc felt 8b+ rather than 8c, also Evolution 8c+ to 8c, welll he said it was soft for 8c+, so reading between the lines its 8c. Nic Sellars 3rd Ascent of Evolution confirmed the grade as 8c. God I'm sad.
In reply to Adam Lincoln:
Probably Progress at Kilnsey, from 8c+ to 8c. I don't know whether he's done Evolution aswell, he may have helped downgrade that from 8c+ to 8c again. Mind you, Nic Sellars has defo done both, and he also downgraded Jerry's Renegade Master to V9 from E9!
Bloody nitpicking.
Probably Progress at Kilnsey, from 8c+ to 8c. I don't know whether he's done Evolution aswell, he may have helped downgrade that from 8c+ to 8c again. Mind you, Nic Sellars has defo done both, and he also downgraded Jerry's Renegade Master to V9 from E9!
Bloody nitpicking.
In reply to NigelH:
Yes, but Jerry did RM a different way to everyone else! Has anyone who has repeated it even tried going up via the crack? Much harder...
No disrespect to subsequent ascentionists meant
Yes, but Jerry did RM a different way to everyone else! Has anyone who has repeated it even tried going up via the crack? Much harder...
No disrespect to subsequent ascentionists meant
In reply to Coxy and the other geezer:
"Over-reacting" eh? Mmmm maybe you have point =).
I wasn't being entirely serious tho...
BTW...(off-topic-ish)
"My initial reaction to this comment was to check out your user-profile, and what do I find.. "
Interesting that, isn't it?? I sometimes do it when someone has made some outrageous comment like "Top-roping is perfectly acceptable", and I want to know what sort of deranged loony would say such a thing. I wonder why it matters...
"Over-reacting" eh? Mmmm maybe you have point =).
I wasn't being entirely serious tho...
BTW...(off-topic-ish)
"My initial reaction to this comment was to check out your user-profile, and what do I find.. "
Interesting that, isn't it?? I sometimes do it when someone has made some outrageous comment like "Top-roping is perfectly acceptable", and I want to know what sort of deranged loony would say such a thing. I wonder why it matters...
In reply to midgets of the world unite:
I must confess to enjoying watching video footage of myself "sending" the hardest problems I have done set to some thumping clubbing sounds... I therefore am suprised that Dunne hasn't got more "video footage" but he probably isn't as sad as me...
Perhaps there is some truth in the view that he gets more press as a result of the "Dunne versus Sheffield maffia " media warfare and putting an end to this would be a great dissapointment to the climbing mags.
The other week if you had looked closer to managing the Full Green Traverse (in the rain and in your hiking boots) I would have whipped out my DV Camcorder and offered the footage to the highest paying climbing web site set to "Singing in the rain" dubbed to sound like "sWinging in the rain". Of course I would share the profits with you, but you have to remember the costs of a climbing video business are substantial... consider just the transportation costs of repeatedly driving out to the Peak to find dry rock and the countless coffees required to warm up frozen fingers...
But seriously, fancy going to Font next Friday evenening through to Monday night? you would have a very capable spotting/ video support team...
I must confess to enjoying watching video footage of myself "sending" the hardest problems I have done set to some thumping clubbing sounds... I therefore am suprised that Dunne hasn't got more "video footage" but he probably isn't as sad as me...
Perhaps there is some truth in the view that he gets more press as a result of the "Dunne versus Sheffield maffia " media warfare and putting an end to this would be a great dissapointment to the climbing mags.
The other week if you had looked closer to managing the Full Green Traverse (in the rain and in your hiking boots) I would have whipped out my DV Camcorder and offered the footage to the highest paying climbing web site set to "Singing in the rain" dubbed to sound like "sWinging in the rain". Of course I would share the profits with you, but you have to remember the costs of a climbing video business are substantial... consider just the transportation costs of repeatedly driving out to the Peak to find dry rock and the countless coffees required to warm up frozen fingers...
But seriously, fancy going to Font next Friday evenening through to Monday night? you would have a very capable spotting/ video support team...
In reply to Simon Cox:
Alas, alas. I'm going to Font today thru Monday! Sadly I shall have to remember my acheivements (and all those pastries) without your digital skills.
I'll clean all the slopers for you....
Alas, alas. I'm going to Font today thru Monday! Sadly I shall have to remember my acheivements (and all those pastries) without your digital skills.
I'll clean all the slopers for you....
In reply to Fiend:
That geezer would be Billy by the way!
That geezer would be Billy by the way!
In reply to Fiend:
That geezer would be Billy by the way!
That geezer would be Billy by the way!
In reply to midgets of the world unite: I'll clean all the slopers for you.... Carefull he might be listening?
Stu
Stu
In reply to Fiend:
That geezer would be Billy!
That geezer would be Billy!
In reply to midgets of the world unite: I'll clean all the slopers for you.... Careful he might be listening?
Stu
Sloper that is
Stu
Sloper that is
In reply to midgets of the world unite:
Looking at the weather forecast you may not have to spend the weekend in cafes... the forecast is mega...
If you find yourself at Elephant you could always research a "ways of the weak" for 32Bl - I am not strong enough for your campus board approach...
Enjoy,
Looking at the weather forecast you may not have to spend the weekend in cafes... the forecast is mega...
If you find yourself at Elephant you could always research a "ways of the weak" for 32Bl - I am not strong enough for your campus board approach...
Enjoy,
In reply to StuT: Haha! sloper now aka eavesdropper, btw would it be a good thing if I were plural?
And who says I wash anyway?
SCRUBBER!
And who says I wash anyway?
SCRUBBER!
In reply to Adam Lincoln:
Pls call me on my mobile (number on my e-mail closing info) to touch base.
Pls call me on my mobile (number on my e-mail closing info) to touch base.
In reply to midgets of the world unite:
I think since the pot of money for top climbers has grown over the last decade it's about time that they became more professional and that they *all* should provide evidence for their groundbreaking ascents. (this isn't an issue in mainstream sports of course as there are usually 1,000 of spectators, judges, and film crews)
Money is a great corrupter and it's just too easy to say you did this or that when you may get a sponsorship bounty (be it money direct or indirect through media exposure) because of your groundbreaking ascent.
I think the burden of proof should weigh on the climber not the media as well.
That is of course going against the grain of the tradition of honesty in the sport (ha!) but .............it's just too easy to make fuzzy claims when there is a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.
Until that happens....I'm skeptical.
M
I think since the pot of money for top climbers has grown over the last decade it's about time that they became more professional and that they *all* should provide evidence for their groundbreaking ascents. (this isn't an issue in mainstream sports of course as there are usually 1,000 of spectators, judges, and film crews)
Money is a great corrupter and it's just too easy to say you did this or that when you may get a sponsorship bounty (be it money direct or indirect through media exposure) because of your groundbreaking ascent.
I think the burden of proof should weigh on the climber not the media as well.
That is of course going against the grain of the tradition of honesty in the sport (ha!) but .............it's just too easy to make fuzzy claims when there is a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.
Until that happens....I'm skeptical.
M
In reply to Mick - Rockfax USA:
The burden of proof should be on the first ascenionist ? That has to be far too simplistic as not all climbers are in it for the money. Surely we don't want the situation where only paid climbers who have inspected the route well enough to have established where and when to put the film crew get the right to claim new routes ? There are plenty of grounbreaking ascents which are just that because they were done on sight.
The burden of proof should be on the first ascenionist ? That has to be far too simplistic as not all climbers are in it for the money. Surely we don't want the situation where only paid climbers who have inspected the route well enough to have established where and when to put the film crew get the right to claim new routes ? There are plenty of grounbreaking ascents which are just that because they were done on sight.
In reply to GrahamD:
"That has to be far too simplistic as not all climbers are in it for the money"
What you mean like those top climbers who are independently wealthy?
And there lies the genesis of the Dunne, Dawes, Moffat professional rivalary. Two of them are independently wealthy, one isn't.
M
"That has to be far too simplistic as not all climbers are in it for the money"
What you mean like those top climbers who are independently wealthy?
And there lies the genesis of the Dunne, Dawes, Moffat professional rivalary. Two of them are independently wealthy, one isn't.
M
In reply to Mick - Rockfax USA: All I know is that it would be very boring without the climbers you are talking about, makes life a little intresting, specialy at the moment with all this crap weather(soon to change).
Mutual respect would be nice though.
Stu
Mutual respect would be nice though.
Stu
In reply to StuT:
I agree. Without controversy or differences of opinion life would be very Parsleywood.
I'm sure that they all respect each other to various degrees - all three at one time have wanted to be top dog. And they have in the narrow disciplines of short bolted or bold pitches and bouldering. But in the broadest sense, none of them have even come close.
Chris Bonnington rules - and always has.
M
I agree. Without controversy or differences of opinion life would be very Parsleywood.
I'm sure that they all respect each other to various degrees - all three at one time have wanted to be top dog. And they have in the narrow disciplines of short bolted or bold pitches and bouldering. But in the broadest sense, none of them have even come close.
Chris Bonnington rules - and always has.
M
In reply to StuT: Mine too!!!
In reply to Fiend:
has anyone got an old tremadog guide? The pink one? in there is the best climbing photo ever. Joe Brown in flat cap, shirt sleeeves rolled up, jean type things and big boots. Laybacking. Smoking a roll up.
If anyone has a link to it or can scan it in, *please please please* can I have that photo?!
Its the best!
Thanks!
has anyone got an old tremadog guide? The pink one? in there is the best climbing photo ever. Joe Brown in flat cap, shirt sleeeves rolled up, jean type things and big boots. Laybacking. Smoking a roll up.
If anyone has a link to it or can scan it in, *please please please* can I have that photo?!
Its the best!
Thanks!
In reply to Chris Doyle:
Just to throw one in if Mick R or mick J are still there.
Having known Vickers since he was a kid. Do you think was right that he can't climb on grit.
Just to throw one in if Mick R or mick J are still there.
Having known Vickers since he was a kid. Do you think was right that he can't climb on grit.
This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
Loading Notifications...