UKC

Hi folks!

I'm looking for some info on the Ice Factor in Kinlochleven from anyone who has been there. I quite fancy giving it a shot to see if I would enjoy ice climbing and was wondering if anyone could tell me what its all about and if learners etc are able to go for a climb on the wall, also is there anyone experienced out there who would like to come with me to show me the ropes, so to speak? Thanks.

Kirstin

In reply to tattoo2005: The Ice Factor is superb IMO and well worth a visit. Iwould guess you'd need either a partner who has some experience or book a session with an instructor. I think they hire gear i.e tools/boots/crampons.

Although its in Kinlochleven that is probably its only connection to Scottish winter climbing ;O) But as I said before, good fun and definitely worth a visit.

http://www.ice-factor.co.uk/

Iain

In reply to tattoo2005:

Kirstin,

You have spoken to one of the instructors at the Ice Factor on this site many times before. Jamie B of Sonja's snow hole fame. I am sure he will give you all the info you need.

Ands

In reply to scawf vu: Hiya Ian, thanks for the info. I'm hoping to find someone experienced to go with, male o female, I don't mind. I don't have a lot of rock climbing experience, so not sure what sort of skill you have to have as far as climbing goes, I'm mainly a hillwalker. It looks like omething I'd like to try!

Kirstin

In reply to Ands: I didn't really chat to Jamie much at all, so didn't like to ask!

In reply to tattoo2005:

Dear tatoo

I never took you for the shy type.

Norrie

In reply to tattoo2005: Well the actual business of using axes/crampons is very simple although, as you get onto more technical mixed ground on the harder routes, the repertoire of skills/techniques increases. Placing rock pro is the same although placements can be more difficult to find(buried under snow/rime), screws and the more "exotic protection don't take much to master. And belaying etc is essentially the same.

The additional things for winter are navigation, especially in sh*t conditions, efficiency with kit and a tolerance to a bit of discomfort is useful!

IMO winter climbing is the most rewarding/addictive and bloody frustrating time you can spend in the hills!
You've just got to give it a go.

Iain

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Dear Norrie

I'm not shy but you get unhelpful people in this world and also helpful ones so I would rather just put in a topic and see if anyone can help!

Tattoo

In reply to scawf vu: Hi Iain, it does seem quite hard to find people who have time to help out, I think taking learners out must be a bit of a nightmare but we all gotta start somewhere! Maybe someone will be kind enough to offer some help, we'll wait and see

Kirstin

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Dear Norrie

I also meant to say that I didn't think that Jamie would be unhelpful but he seemed to be having so much fun with Sonj that I didn't like to interupt lol!

Tattoo

In reply to tattoo2005:
Dear Tattoo

The Ice factor is a good place to go to, however, it does not give a real indication of what Scottish winter climbing is all about. Jamie B is looking to take people like yourself out, to show you the basics.

Some winter climbing is little more than winter walking. Just make sure the person you go with to learn knowns a great deal more than you.

You will either enjoy or hate winter climbing once you start.

Norrie

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Dear Norrie

I think that is the hardest thing to find, someone who does actually have good experience. My ex is in mountain rescue so I always felt safe when I was out on the hill with him.

Tattoo

In reply to tattoo2005:
I also meant to say that I didn't think that Jamie would be unhelpful but he seemed to be having so much fun with Sonj that I didn't like to interupt lol!
Dear Tattoo

Jamie B is a professional, so I think he could take you out climbing and still have fun with Sonj.

Norrie

In reply to tattoo2005:

I remeber Jamie posted on here about a month ago that he would be happy to take some novices out so that he can log time for his winter instruction qualification. I can only imagine that offer would still stand. I would reccomed getting in touch with him. If you had some suitable crampons an axe and boots along with decent clothes for those conditions then you shouldn't be more of a hassle to teach than anyone else. I can highly reccomend Jamie's instruction. He is very professional and when/if you go out with him you will feel he is trying to teach you rather than being out for his own jollys.

I am about to score a pair of decent B3 rated boots and have the clothes needed for such conditions so if I get a pair of crampons and an axe I would be well be up for tagging along if Jamie is up for it.

Cheers,

Ands

In reply to tattoo2005: Quite like going out with"novices" and that was the way I learned, as Norrie said just make sure anyone you go with knows their stuff.

Why not post on the "lifts and partners" forum for the Ice Factor.

Iain

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Dear Norrie

I'm sure he is but he just seemed to be having so much fun that I didn't want to get in the way lol!

Tattoo

In reply to scawf vu:


At this time of year if there is an offer of some outdoor instruction as I am assuming there still is from Jamie then I would reccomend snapping it up. I am sure we could also have a session at the Ice Factor to thank him as he likes to promote the place for obvious reasons. That and a good few drinks for his bother of course.

Ands

In reply to scawf vu: Does the Ice Factor have a section like that on its website?

In reply to tattoo2005:


Have you been drinking? I think he means on this site...

Ands

In reply to Ands: It was just the way it was worded!

In reply to tattoo2005:


Lush!

Ands

In reply to Ands: I havent been drinking, I'm still in the middle of dying from this bloody cold I've got!

In reply to Ands:
Jamie B of Sonja's snow hole fame.........

Is there something we should know about here?

In reply to tattoo2005: Aye, meant Lifts and P's on UKC!

Iain

In reply to Donald M:

Dear Donald

You must be the only person who does not know what is going on with that pair of randy gits.

Norrie

In reply to scawf vu: Sorry Iain, I was obviously having a senior moment there! If you hear of anyone who would be willing to help me out would you let me know?

Kirstin

In reply to tattoo2005:

I have e-mailed Jamie the link for this thread. I am sure he will get back to one of us at some point. Am nae backwards at being forwards.

Ands

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Really? Is it of high gossip value?

In reply to Ands: Thanks Ands!

In reply to Donald M:


Pair of bloody perverts the two of them...

Ands

In reply to tattoo2005:


No probs. It is good for Jamie. When I become the greatest all round climber in the world, which I think we all know I will, he will have the honour of saying he taught me rock and winter climbing.

Ands

In reply to Ands: Erm, okay then!

In reply to tattoo2005:


Will do! Not very likely mind............won't be back in the homeland until March for the Glencoe do!

Iain

In reply to scawf vu: I'll see you in Glencoe then if I don't speak to you before!

In reply to Donald M:

Dear Donald

No gossip value as it was all out in the open and above board.

Norrie

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Ok, I don't think I want to know anymore anyway.

In reply to tattoo2005:


Seriously. You should have seen me pulling on the plastic at the wall today. World class me mate. I am hoping to go and climb in the rain tomorrow. Ah there's nothing like being a Scottish rock climber in December.

Ands

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Dear Norrie

What type of experience/qualifications should I be looking for in a partner?

Tattoo

In reply to Ands:

Do you "do" winter climbing?

In reply to Donald M:


Not as yet no hence looking for a bit of instruction from Mr B. But I assure that once I get a good try and it I will be world class. In my own head.

Ands

P.S. As it is Saturday night I will mostly be posting 'humour'.

In reply to tattoo2005:
Dear Tattoo

Someone half my age and with a quarter of my experience would do fine.

Norrie

In reply to Norrie Muir:


Aye but what about for a CLIMBING partner?

Ands

In reply to Ands:
Dear Ands

Then my recommendation to tattoo would rule you out.

Norrie

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Dear Norrie

That seems like a tall order, going by your experience, respectfully so.

Tattoo

In reply to Norrie Muir:



Good. With my navigation skills and Kirstins climbing experience we would make a god awful team!

Ands

In reply to Ands: I can navigate

n reply to tattoo2005:


So can I under normal conditions but I have had a few situations in white outs i.e. winter navigation.

Ands

In reply to tattoo2005:

Dear tatoo

Well you can show Ands when the pair of you go walking.

Norrie

In reply to Ands: Gotcha now, havent faced those conditions yet, but maybe in the future

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Dear Norrie

I would be happy to as long as the weather aint too bad, not got experience in winter weather yet!

Tattoo

In reply to Ands:
Dear Ands

Even blind people can navigate in normal conditions.

Norrie

In reply to tattoo2005:
Dear Tattoo

I navigate summer and winter the same way - normally without a map and compass, so far I've not been lost.

Norrie

In reply to tattoo2005:


I am no expert at clear weather navigation but certainly when you canny see more than about 3ft in front of you and your on a plateau things get pretty interesting. Have only experienced it about five times but on every occasion it was still pretty concering which suggests I am not confident enough of my ability to navigate out of such situations. Joe Simpson claims he cannot navigate and always climbs with someone who can.

Ands

In reply to Norrie Muir:


A trail of rolly butts from the car/CIC hut to the route your climbing?


Ands

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Dear Norrie

I wanted to learn how to navigate as when I was out with my ex I very much relied on him to get me off the hill safely but if anything had happened to him I would have been in trouble. More experience on the hill is what I need, its just trying to find fowk to go out with.

Tattoo

In reply to Ands: I would still much prefer to be able to look after myself and other, you never know when you may need the skill if something goes wrong.

In reply to tattoo2005:


I try and cut down on the likely hood of having to call out the MRT by taking a GPS and lots of batteries out with me in the winter. I only use it in an emergency so am learning 'manual' winter nav skills all the time. Experience is key.

Ands

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Dear Norrie

I think it is a skill which is very much overlooked on the hills by a lot of people. The guys from Buckie who were rescued on Ben Macdhui a couple of weeks ago in the blizzard had no navigation skills what so ever

Tattoo

In reply to Ands:

Dear Ands

That is go good to me, I have been on other hills that Ben Nevis and I don't normally fail on winter routes, so I have to find another way down from the top.

Norrie

In reply to tattoo2005:

Dear tatoo

All members of a party on the hill should be able to navigate. The only problem comes when there is a disagreement on what is the "right" way to go. My mate who has instructed at Glenmore Lodge, always defers to my decisions on navigation.

Norrie

In reply to Norrie Muir:


Aye I was just being a sarcastic bollox as you know. I seem to remember you saying you navigate with an altemeter which I have never understood as I can see how it will tell you how high you are but not where you are and where you should go.

Ands

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Aye, that sounds familiar.

>My mate who has instructed at Glenmore Lodge, always defers to my decisions on navigation.

Ya bugger! I had a cracking "witty" reply to your "nagigation" post and you've gone and corrected the spellings.

Iain

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Dear Norrie

I never realised how important navigation really was until I started learning it. I think it is a skill that is greatly overlooked by a lot of people out on the hills these days. The group that was rescued from Ben Macdhui a week or two ago in the blizzard had no navigation skills what so ever, extremely poor show

Tattoo

In reply to scawf vu:
Dear scawf

Sorry, go for it anyway.

Norrie

In reply to Ands:
Dear Ands

I thought you could navigate? With an altimeter and compass, one can tell where you are on the map, mind you, don't do it yourself. Now you know where you are, then the easy bit is getting to where you want to go to.

Norrie

In reply to Norrie Muir:


Aye with a compass and map that makes more sense. I thought you were navigating with an altemeter only...

Ands

In reply to Ands: And you had the cheek to ask me earlier if I had been drinking!!!

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Norrie, can you now divulge your Nevis plateau navigation secret? I have been intrigued for about 9 months waiting for it. Having been down the scenic 5 finger gully descent once (4 hours and £8 quid in a taxi)I am very keen to hear your tip.

Davie

awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww!
i want to go to the ice factor havent been in ages. cant wait till the summer so i can go without feeling guilty!

In reply to Richard Carter: So do I!!!

Hi guys, just want to fill you in a wee bit on the Ice Factor.

Obviously I'm biased, but I'd argue that it is the best place possible to get a feel for ice-climbing without all the expense, legwork and lengthy apprenticeship traditionaly associated with Scottish winter mountaineering. You can hire equipment and will probably find the climbing medium very helpful; first-time placements and easier-angled slopes. We have plenty of ice-climbing novices who do extremely well on their first session.

How you book in is up to you. If you've never done it before you can get a more experienced partner to sign you in as their guest, or if you want some dare I say it more directed instruction you can hire one of us. This will definately take you further faster; we see a lot of people trying to muddle through with minimal experience, and it is quite apparent that this doesn't really work. Ice-climbing can be very strenuous if you don't have good technique, but this can be instilled fairly swiftly if you are receptive.

It goes without saying that it is essentially just indoor training, and that the complexities of learning ice-climbing ropework and judgement of mountain conditions need to be learnt elsewhere. We are keen to promote our outdoor courses as complimentary to indoor ice sessions; do some work with us indoors and out and we can definately build a lifelong enthusiasm.

I did advertise for Winter ML training partners; I'm for the most part looking for people at a similar stage on the WML syllabus to myself and definately don't want to take my employers' business! That having been said I have spoken to s friend who posts on here as Almost Sane and we have discussed the idea of running a bespoke basic winter skills group around the Clachaig meet at the beginning of March. This is not a profit-making venture, but we would require payment in beer. Any takers?

In reply to Jamie B.:

If I make it down in March which I very much so hope to do then consider my beer tokens banked.

Ands

In reply to Jamie B.: Hi Jamie, thanks for the info above. I have very little experience in climbing, mainly doing hillwalking but I would be glad to join in anything that you are organising at the Glencoe meet if I am suitable for it? Paymaent in beer is not a problem!

Kirstin