UKC

I've had my current mountaineering layering system for 10 years and it's time for a change...

I'm currently using a hard shell (lowe alpine triplepoint ceramic) but wondered whether to change to paramo (maybe the aspira smock?).

Does anyone have any views on which is best, and the most versatile? And is a paramo truely waterproof or will I get wet when the heavens open?

Cheers.

In reply to Adam Booth:

I've used all kinds of kit over the last 15 - 20 years but only in the last year started using Paramo (Velez smock, expedition shirt, Fuera smock). I swapped so late because of cost mainly, but now wish I'd done so sooner.

Drawbacks with Paramo: hotter than other systems until you learn how to guage what you need to wear; heavy compared to some other systems. I've been told that pressure, e.g. from rucksack straps, can force water through the garment but have not experienced this. Need to keep it clean (wash it frequently with Nikwax).

Upside: Less condensation than other systems; easy to repair (although is tough anyway); good customer service; warm, so less layers needed. Works with other systems or as part of it's own system (Rab VR Trail smock and Velez is a cracking winter combination.)

Personally if starting from scratch and if money was not an issue I'd go for Paramo.

DJ

In reply to Adam Booth: paramo wins for me no contest

In reply to Adam Booth: i would stick with using your hard shell system, you will get wet in paramo if u lean against/sit on anything wet. Having just brought a valez smock i went back to my hard shell because of this. Maby try the RAB eVENT Jacket and pants as the breath better than any other hard shell on the market and are well made so will last a while. Good Luck.

In reply to Adam Booth:
Paramo for me. I have an Aspira smock and i`ll climb grit with no worries of wrecking it.
Cheers Beds

In reply to Adam Booth: I bought my first Paramo smock (aspira) last year. I can honestly say it is the first jacket I have ever worn and stayed completely dry in, even when worn all day in constant driving rain. It is warm but reassuringly warm. I like the way the material feels and the fact it is quiet as well. There are always cheap deals on paramo gear if you do some searches.

In reply to pwhiteside:

I have a velez smock that I've been using for about 4 years - it is fantastic and just as good as when I bought it. I love it. Muz recently bought me some cascada trousers and so far they seem equally good. I tend to overheat quite easily so I was a bit wary but they were just right for a stomp up snowdon in the snow...

In reply to Adam Booth:

It's paramo all the way for me. Been wearing the same Velez jacket and Cascada Trouser for 5 years. Both items are still working as well as the day I bought them.

Keep hoping the Velez will wear out so I've got an excuse to buy the Aspira - no such luck though.

I've had days where all my mates have been p*ss wet through and I'm still toasty and dry. Also sometimes when it's been a while since I proofed it the outside gets a bit damp (as with hard shells), but with the way it works my body heat repels the wet and it never comes through. Furthermore, it even dries on the outside by the time I get to the car - no more wringing wet kit at the end of the day.

In reply to Adam Booth:
Softshell all the way. Now, when it's pissing it down so hard the ground is shaking, theres nothing to do but reach for that crisp hardshell, but when you climbing nothing beats the softshell. It's flexible, tough, water resistant but not proof (which is what makes it so good, because there isn't a huge overkill barrier, your sweat evaporates mega fast) offers more warmth, and just generally kicks ass.
Hardshells have there place, but with all waterproofs the general idea is to have the water not getting out to be less then the water thats not getting in, and Goretex/eVent etc. are all mega overkills when it comes to spindrift, light showers, etc.

Paramo is a bit of a mix between them, as it is hardshellish (good water proofness)but with many of the benifits of a softshell (not overkill/good monourverability) and everyone who uses their kit tells me it is ace. the phrase many people use is "when you move, you push the water out through it" I don't really get what they mean but I assume the are speaking about it's good breathibility.
I am bored and this post is too long so I am stopping now.

-Magnus

In reply to Adam Booth: Definitely the paramo. Or a company called cioch who are based in skye. use the same nikwax anology system as paramo, with a bit more personal touch. Used there jacket in scotland last week, absolutely awesome, the jackets are warm but all you need to do is get your layering system rigt, the nikwax stuff offers so much more than hard shell, and plus if you rip the material all you have to do is stitch it back together and carry on.

In reply to Adam Booth:

Awesome advice everyone, thanks - seems from this thread that paramo wins hands down.

In reply to the few of you who have advocated eVent, I have a pair of rab latok trousers (made from eVent, supposed to be fully waterproof); I got soaked through to the skin in a 2hr downpour on Snowdon the other week. Admittedly, I haven't proofed them for a while but it shouldn't make that much of a difference on hard shells. Think I'll just go with paramo from now on!