/ NEWS: Dave Pickford Responds to Dave Birkett

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Michael Ryan - on 14 Jun 2007
"Great to hear that Dave Birkett has recently repeated ‘The Brothers Karamazov’ – another swift and stylish ascent by the unstoppable Mr Birkett! This is one of the best new routes I have ever done in terms of the quality of the climbing, and from what Dave said shortly afterwards it sounds like he enjoyed it too.

A lot of nonsense gets thrown around the climbing community about grades these days, in which the grade seems to take on more importance than the climb itself........."
says Dave Pickford.


Read Dave Pickfords full response to Dave Birkett's repeat of The Brothers Karamazov E9 6c at UKClimbing.com's news page

http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/
Paz - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:

And I thought I went on a bit.
A Longleat Boulderer - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Paz:

Lol!
Niall Grimes - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Paz:

Pickford goes to the trouble of responding to an issue raised on these forums, a response that runs to no less than five paragraphs. And for his trouble...
>
> And I thought I went on a bit.

Fair enough response I thought, honestly saying, as far as I can tell, maybe it's right, but that's what I thought.



A Longleat Boulderer - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Niall Grimes:

I think Paz was joking Niall, Paz and Dave Pickford are often found climbing together...
Paz - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to A Longleat Boulderer:

well we were once at the same place.
A Longleat Boulderer - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Paz:

Eh? I thought you and Ally and Dave were always cheddar sessioning it...
Niall Grimes - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to A Longleat Boulderer: Got me there. And I suppose that if you do know Dave, then you are perfectly placed to know that he does indeed go on a bit :-)
shark - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:

Officially a soft touch then
shark - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Paz:
> And I thought I went on a bit.


You do. Thats official as well
Wee Davie - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:

Any chance these 'so and so responds to so and so' threads could be spiced up a bit? I'm bored out my nut.
You've got a bit of a tabloid style Mick. Surely you could stir it a bit? Pap somebody top roping, or bricking it? A 'Mick's Choss' gossip column?

Davie
Michael Ryan - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Paz:
> (In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com)
>
> And I thought I went on a bit. Paz,

You do Paz, and usually you have nothing much to say and on the whole it is negative, as this example shows.

Give us a shout when have something constructive, informative and interesting to contribute....like Dave Pickford's words.

I'm sure we will be all ears.

Mick


Paz - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to A Longleat Boulderer:

They are.

In reply to all:

Wow I'm Mr Popular today.
A Longleat Boulderer - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Paz:
> (In reply to A Longleat Boulderer)
>
> They are.
>
> In reply to all:
>
> Wow I'm Mr Popular today.

LOL Paz, you are a legend! And don't you forget it!
A Longleat Boulderer - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Niall Grimes:
> (In reply to A Longleat Boulderer) Got me there. And I suppose that if you do know Dave, then you are perfectly placed to know that he does indeed go on a bit :-)

I've only climbed with him once, and that was because of Ally Smith and Paz. Just came across as a nice guy who was uber psyched about his climbing and just got on with it without drama ... wouldn't like to say anything else :-D
Skyfall - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:

To take this debate on a little....

Is Dave Pickford trying to say something rather important here by referring several times to the fact that he on-sights hard routes if at all possible. And his grades reflect that.

Whereas many of the top climbers are more into headpointing, even if in relatively good style (and that includes Dave Birkett)? Which will influence how they perceive grades.

And yes I do understand how the grading system is supposed to work... And I think he may have a point in some respects.
A Longleat Boulderer - on 14 Jun 2007
In reply to JonC:

Interesting point ...
mickyconnor - on 15 Jun 2007
In reply to JonC: Now that is fascinating, I didn't realise that. Surely that means that endlessly worked projects are almost impossible to grade for the first ascensionist? How do they calculate out all their practice from the psycological and practical benefit of knowing it has been done for those that may follow? Also, on those routes which are fiendish, will anybody ever onsight them?
Paz - on 15 Jun 2007
In reply to mickyconnor + JonC:

I think you guys have a good point but are
using a bad example. Dave Birkett's the only one who's onsighted E8.

In his original article you can see how he arrived at E9, climbing to 25m with last gear at 13m, serious Desmond from a 6b/c move (for Dave) and a hard 6c move for anyone short.
http://www.planetfear.com/news_detail.asp?n_id=6243
Death from 6c is de rigeur on other E9s (and on EotA but that's climbing's 7b+ where as BK has 7c+ climbing)

Can someone summarize what Birkett said at the end of the video for me? I just presumed he said maybe it wasn't E9 in which case t'other Dave could've said `OK nails E8 or E8/9 it is then'.

Back in mortal realms, does anyone know how much of Zodiac you can still do since the rockfall? I had this idea that I could ab in to the right hand side of the rock fall, then do it in reverse.
mickyconnor - on 15 Jun 2007
In reply to Paz:
> Dave Birkett's the only one who's onsighted E8.

The only one ever?
ads.ukclimbing.com
abarro81 - on 15 Jun 2007
In reply to Paz: he says that routes tend to be easier at pembroke and he;s not done enough hard pembroke sutff to know how it compares to the other stuff down there.

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