UKC

Peak Area Meeting Tonight at the Anchor in Tideswell

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The agenda includes Windgather belay stakes and Peak Area guidebooks.

7:30 pm at the Anchor pub.

http://www.streetmap.co.uk/newmap.srf?x=415895&y=376385&z=3&sv=...

Alan
 Grover 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX:

Damn. Promised myself that I would get to this meet. Unfortunately, I'm off to see Grimer's stand up routine tonight.
grimer 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Grover: If I was you I'd go to Tideswell. Stakes at Windgather sounds far mor interesting than some sordid story about me getting shoved into a toilet by two terrorists.
 Grover 03 Oct 2002
In reply to grimer:

They found you then.
 Offwidth 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX:

Thursday again!?

Anonymous 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Offwidth: Has anyone else seen the draft report on Ring Ouzels?

I predict a substantial amount of feathers being spat!!!
 Offwidth 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX: Any chance of someone to post the key issues up here (as has happene before) so we can comment if we cant make it.
Kipper 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Offwidth:

The agenda is here :- http://www.thebmc.co.uk/thebmc/areacom/agendas/Pkag0902.pdf

It's a pity that the BMC Guidebook Co-ordinator won't be there.
 Offwidth 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Kipper:

Thats a pdf file which a lot of people cant read and is part of the reason I asked for it to be pasted here. The other is to get some debate going pre-meeting.
In reply to Offwidth:


The discussion will be on points 6 and 8.



Peak District Area Committee
Meeting to be held at The Anchor, Tideswell Crossroads
Thursday 3rd October, 2002, 7.15pm

AGENDA

1. Apologies for absence

2. Minutes of the previous meeting held on Thursday 20th June, 2002

3. Matters arising

4. Management Committee report

5. Access:
5.1 Western Grit and Moorland
5.2 Eastern Grit
5.3 Limestone

6. Peak Guidebooks
6.1 Update on BMC guidebook production
6.2 “Privately produced guides”

7. Date and venues for meetings in 2003

8. Windgather Rocks belay stakes

9. Use of email for correspondence to cut down on postage and printing costs.
 Michael Ryan 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX:

> 2 “Privately produced guides”

What's a a privately produced guidebook?


> 9. Use of email for correspondence to cut down on postage and printing costs.

Revolutionary.

Mick

In reply to Mick - Rockfax USA:
> (In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX)
>
> [...]
>
> What's a a privately produced guidebook?

Ones produced by privates.
 Michael Ryan 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX:

I suppose then that a "generally produced guidebook" is one produced by Generals!

M
 Offwidth 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX:

Thanks

6 Why discuss this? (I hope as a member more money is not going to be wasted on ill advised legal action)

8 I though this was discussed and voted on before with a majority against the use of stakes. If not the key points of my previous arguments were:

I still think the belays at Windgather are very good compared to some crags (like Woodhouse Scar in Halifax). The problem is only really noticable on a few places on the crag when you need quite a few closely spaced multi-point belays for group use. On nearly all of these positions, stakes will encourage overuse of excellent little routes and worse still encourage abseils. I'm sorry to go on about this but the characteristic layered flakey incuts at Wingather are particularly susceptable to abseil damage and also encourage poor abseil technique (as you end up dropping your feet onto the many good holds). IMHO the outdoor groups should use one of the quarry sections further along for abseils (where stakes would be fine).

I must admit I'm also still a bit miffed that the outdoor centre concerned, in their plans for the stake locations, tried to claim the footprint area was hardly used when it has some of the more popular low grade routes on the crag.
 Michael Ryan 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Offwidth:
> (In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX)
>
> Thanks
>
> 6 Why discuss this? (I hope as a member more money is not going to be wasted on ill advised legal action)

I hope the person who decided to use thousands of pounds of BMC members money on frivalous lawsuitse got a severe bollocking and was made accountable for such a waste.

Or perhaps they got transfered to a bigger climbing beaurocracy where they can waste more money, talk more bollox and smooze with other well-connected expedition types and conspire to fleece more money from the climbing industry and get awarded more grant money for their holidays.

M
 Chris Craggs Global Crag Moderator 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Mick - Rockfax USA:
What are you suggesting Mick, maybe the UIAA are going to try and sue us next!

I would have gone to the meeting but:
a) I don't want to get into a slanging match,
b) I too busy writing guides to sit in a room full of stuffed shirts telling me what I should and should not be doing!
All the best - roll on the revolution,

Chris

Enty 03 Oct 2002
In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX:
The Peak is a climbing area of National importance, therefore the meeting should only be at a weekend and should be publicised better.

Enty

 Ropeboy 04 Oct 2002
In reply to Enty:

Quite, someone's told me it's not even on the BMC website that there is a meeting tonight!
 CragHead 04 Oct 2002
In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX:

Well - What happened last night?
Kipper 04 Oct 2002
In reply to Offwidth:

>.. I though this was discussed and voted on before with a majority against the use of stakes. If not the key points of my previous arguments were:

Wrong - the initial vote went the other way.
Kipper 04 Oct 2002
In reply to Ropeboy:
> (In reply to Enty)
>
> Quite, someone's told me it's not even on the BMC website that there is a meeting tonight!

Rubbish - http://www.thebmc.co.uk/thebmc/areacom/area_meetings.asp?area_drop=6
Kipper 04 Oct 2002
In reply to CragHead:
> (In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX)
>
> Well - What happened last night?

Everone loves Alan.

 Grover 04 Oct 2002
In reply to grimer:
> (In reply to Grover) If I was you I'd go to Tideswell. Stakes at Windgather sounds far mor interesting than some sordid story about me getting shoved into a toilet by two terrorists.

There was me waiting for the terrorists toilet incident and it turns out to have been a man made offwidth. Oh the disappointment!

Still, can't imagine that the Tideswell meet was as entertaining as Grimer last night.

In reply to Kipper:

It was a very peaceful meeting. The guidebook issue didn't really get discussed in any great depth because Grimer wasn't able to attend the meeting.

The Windgather issue was discussed again but it was decided, and voted, that the original course of action was correct - namely that Clare Bond from the BMC investigates the placement of stakes. The stakes, if used, will be removalble poles dropped into tubes sunk in the ground and will only be place on the prime areas used by the outdoor groups.

...er...I think that was about it.


Alan

 gingerkate 04 Oct 2002
In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX:
Would it be a good idea if maybe someone involved posted a thread about meetings, a week or two before?
And kept bumping it up occasionally, so people got a chance to see it?
I know they're all on the BMC website, but people come here, and they don't go there right much.
 Offwidth 04 Oct 2002
In reply to Alan James, ROCKFAX:

Which bit of "Windgather is a terrible place to set up abseils" didnt they understand then. Democracy eh.

The rock has many lips which are too delicate to take much traffic and which gives people a tendancy to drop their feet and hence teaching poor abseil technique.
Ian Hill 04 Oct 2002
In reply to Offwidth: surely everyone has Acrobat reader don't they?
 sutty 04 Oct 2002
In reply to Ian Hill:
If they do not have it they can go to any government website and download it. sorted.
Enty 04 Oct 2002
In reply to Ropeboy:
I was being sarcastic.
We had this accusation levelled at us regarding the Yorkshire bolt meeting earlier this year. However, us Yorkshire mafia are quite happy to let Peak climbers sort out Peak area problems and the same goes to South West climbers, North Wales, Dorset etc etc

Enty
 Offwidth 07 Oct 2002
In reply to Ian Hill:

Not only do a signifiacant minority not have Acrobat, some dont even know what it is (I dont have it as a deliberate ploy as it stops my lazy office mate using my PC as a download tool for his laptop and screwing up all sorts of things in the process).

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