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Does anyone know out there what the world record dyno is at the moment?? Whats you're personal best (if you measured??) How far is Hubble??
In reply to JR: thats a bit like asking what it the record for teh smallest crimp held or the slopiest sloper, or the smeariest smear.
In reply to Al Evans:
Yeah i think so
In reply to DaveP:
No, its not because it is a measurable distance.
Yeah i think so
In reply to DaveP:
No, its not because it is a measurable distance.
In reply to JR: Wasn't there something in OTE (boo, hiss) about a dyno comp recently. Seem to remember 2 metres was mentioned.
In reply to Jonathan:
Yeah i think so, thats where i remember 9ft from?!? , but im sure its got to be more than 2 metres cos, two of us managed 8ft 1 this week.
Yeah i think so, thats where i remember 9ft from?!? , but im sure its got to be more than 2 metres cos, two of us managed 8ft 1 this week.
In reply to JR: Off how many footholds/handholds and how big?Have you tried dynoing to a jam?
To anyone that knows cliffs barn its on the warmup wall to the right of the ledge, the blue squared jug to the bar at the top off surface features for feet.
And I did it and i'm only 5'7" so its not that hard.
And I did it and i'm only 5'7" so its not that hard.
Climbing walls? Boring! Not the same! Blah! Blah! Blah!
What about a real dno, on real rock, on a route, not 2" above a thick mat.
Whats the furthest or the hardest thats been done?
What about a real dno, on real rock, on a route, not 2" above a thick mat.
Whats the furthest or the hardest thats been done?
In reply to JR: yeah but are you going off jugs, sidepulls crimps etc....whats the finishing hold like??? whats the angle of the rock??, how big are the foot holds?? etc etc etc.is it straight up or off to the side? with the right setup a 6 footer can easily jump 8 foot, but often the most impressive dynos are from/to shit holds, or at an odd angle.
The difficulty of dynos is strongly related to the height of the climber, so in finding the "biggest dyno" it might be wise to give the length as a factor of the climbers height.
The difficulty of dynos is strongly related to the height of the climber, so in finding the "biggest dyno" it might be wise to give the length as a factor of the climbers height.
In reply to JR:
I've thought about this one b4.
I have two pill up bars at home. One is about 2 1/2 ft above the other and about 2 inches back (to stop me hitting my chest off the first one).
So, the usual exercise is to pull up on no. 1, drop back down & launch for no2. It's not very far (when I'm fit I can do reps)and not a dyno (one hand does not leave no.1).
The question is , is a standardised test , how far can you move no.2 up until even messrs Graham, McClure, Loskot, Nicole etc (forget Moon) are struggling. How far can a human propel itself upwards, feet off. Definitely a standard test as much (and more interesting) than a high jump.
By the way, I saw afilm with some chimps jumping round a room with bars whilst agitated and , frankly, they would kick our asses so hard at this particular challenge.
Foz
I've thought about this one b4.
I have two pill up bars at home. One is about 2 1/2 ft above the other and about 2 inches back (to stop me hitting my chest off the first one).
So, the usual exercise is to pull up on no. 1, drop back down & launch for no2. It's not very far (when I'm fit I can do reps)and not a dyno (one hand does not leave no.1).
The question is , is a standardised test , how far can you move no.2 up until even messrs Graham, McClure, Loskot, Nicole etc (forget Moon) are struggling. How far can a human propel itself upwards, feet off. Definitely a standard test as much (and more interesting) than a high jump.
By the way, I saw afilm with some chimps jumping round a room with bars whilst agitated and , frankly, they would kick our asses so hard at this particular challenge.
Foz
In reply to Gfoz:
Chimps, gorillaz, etc, are just so sick strong compared to humans, you wouldn't believe it. An enraged female chimp was once recorded as pulling on a strain guage handle and registering over 600lb (I think this is mentioned in the Guiness Book of Records, or something). I used to be pretty good at deadlifting (OK, I'm sorry) and once managed 440lb. That was, like, eyeballs popping out AND with two hands STRAPPED to the bar, and done pretty slowly. It's not fair. We're so genetically close to them, as well. Makes you wonder what tweaking a few genes will do. Perhaps, one day, chimps and humans will be able to communicate. Imagine being able to say to a chimp 'do you fancy coming down the plantation and working on that new problem?' Then, later, 'yeah, if you rock over on your right before you hit the smear with your left foot and release the right toe hook, I think you've got it.' I bet they could positively scamper up something like Careless Torque, which would end up being renamed 'Staight Banana'. There would be a separate grading scale for each species, as I bet gibbons and smaller monkeys would just be bloody brilliant, whereas your silverback, on the other hand, may be a bit closer to your average Joe (Young). Oh, yeah, and of course, they can use their feet like we use our hands.
Chimps, gorillaz, etc, are just so sick strong compared to humans, you wouldn't believe it. An enraged female chimp was once recorded as pulling on a strain guage handle and registering over 600lb (I think this is mentioned in the Guiness Book of Records, or something). I used to be pretty good at deadlifting (OK, I'm sorry) and once managed 440lb. That was, like, eyeballs popping out AND with two hands STRAPPED to the bar, and done pretty slowly. It's not fair. We're so genetically close to them, as well. Makes you wonder what tweaking a few genes will do. Perhaps, one day, chimps and humans will be able to communicate. Imagine being able to say to a chimp 'do you fancy coming down the plantation and working on that new problem?' Then, later, 'yeah, if you rock over on your right before you hit the smear with your left foot and release the right toe hook, I think you've got it.' I bet they could positively scamper up something like Careless Torque, which would end up being renamed 'Staight Banana'. There would be a separate grading scale for each species, as I bet gibbons and smaller monkeys would just be bloody brilliant, whereas your silverback, on the other hand, may be a bit closer to your average Joe (Young). Oh, yeah, and of course, they can use their feet like we use our hands.
In reply to Canadian Dom: Nah. Your silverback, right? Your silverback..he's a big bloke, make no mistake, carries a bit of weight you could say, but he'd a top climber. Slow and methodical, but well strong, and I bet you wouldn't call him "average" to his face!
Gibbons? Do me a favour! Their hands are permanently hooked; designed for brachiations on tree branches, swinging and all that stuff. If you could find a roof with incut holds they might be ok but on your regular roch, they'd be lost mate.
Now baboons, they're your proper cragrats. Remember my mate Craig telling me about climbing this (hard) route at Hell's Gate in Kenya and along comes this troop of babs and pisses up it like it was a ladder, tiddlers as well!
And what about the insects? If we could have a natter to a spider (yes I know it's an Arachnid, before some anorak gets on my case) it'd have some handy hints I'm sure. Not good at baths though.
Gibbons? Do me a favour! Their hands are permanently hooked; designed for brachiations on tree branches, swinging and all that stuff. If you could find a roof with incut holds they might be ok but on your regular roch, they'd be lost mate.
Now baboons, they're your proper cragrats. Remember my mate Craig telling me about climbing this (hard) route at Hell's Gate in Kenya and along comes this troop of babs and pisses up it like it was a ladder, tiddlers as well!
And what about the insects? If we could have a natter to a spider (yes I know it's an Arachnid, before some anorak gets on my case) it'd have some handy hints I'm sure. Not good at baths though.
In reply to JR:
I seem to remember there being guidelines for bouldering comps in and around Europe.
Things I remember include it must be on a 20 degree overhanging wall and you can start from the most whooping great jug you can find.
I would assume that the distance measured is from the jug to the finish hold / top and the figure 2.41metres springs to mind.
To be honest it's all about the feet though aint it? Smears or great big nobbles will make all the difference...
Myself and someone else who I climb with can regularly get 2.3 metres or so starting from not too bad feet but I reckon we could get much more with strategically placed feet nobbles!
Discuss....
J
I seem to remember there being guidelines for bouldering comps in and around Europe.
Things I remember include it must be on a 20 degree overhanging wall and you can start from the most whooping great jug you can find.
I would assume that the distance measured is from the jug to the finish hold / top and the figure 2.41metres springs to mind.
To be honest it's all about the feet though aint it? Smears or great big nobbles will make all the difference...
Myself and someone else who I climb with can regularly get 2.3 metres or so starting from not too bad feet but I reckon we could get much more with strategically placed feet nobbles!
Discuss....
J
In reply to everyone:
The distance is measured from highest hand to finishing hold. The hold was one largeish jug. The feet are two small surface features which are not level with eachother. its vertical.
I meant how far is Hale bopp not how far is hubble?!?
And for whoever said its 2" off the ground, the starting hold is actually at about 8 or 9foot. With the finishing hold being at about 17foot.
Thinking about it 2.41m rings a bell but i dont buy OTE so i cant check.
The distance is measured from highest hand to finishing hold. The hold was one largeish jug. The feet are two small surface features which are not level with eachother. its vertical.
I meant how far is Hale bopp not how far is hubble?!?
And for whoever said its 2" off the ground, the starting hold is actually at about 8 or 9foot. With the finishing hold being at about 17foot.
Thinking about it 2.41m rings a bell but i dont buy OTE so i cant check.
In reply to JR: try the big dyno on the lower tier at the roaches. from under cuts to the b5 mantel over 7ft
In reply to mark: which dyno is that? is it the one on the big block directly below inertia reel?? on the side facing towards the rockhall cottage etc..???
ho ho ho, hee hee. i must be going mad or something, because i am just wetting myself after reading that post about chimps. i mean, who gives a toss!!! its like having penis envy towards a horse ....
In reply to andy r: Thats the fella - right hand side of the undercut traverse to sloper, bigger, better and harder than both Deliverance and the Buckstone!!!
In reply to JR:
The reference to OTE that a few people have mentioned was Britains first dyno competition at the Loat Arrow Bouldering Masters at The Edge in Sheffield a few months ago.
Basically the board is 20 degrees overhanging. The starting jug is BIG, and fixed in one place. Below the starting jug are two parallel lines of identical, reasonably positive (1/1.5cm edges?) foot holds. The finish hold is up (obviously) and left of the start hold - 45 degrees left actually. There is a line of bolt holes along this 45 degree line to move the finish jug along as people are eliminated, much like high jump. The winning jump, I think, was 2.41m. Previously the European (World?) record had been around 2.32m.
The reference to OTE that a few people have mentioned was Britains first dyno competition at the Loat Arrow Bouldering Masters at The Edge in Sheffield a few months ago.
Basically the board is 20 degrees overhanging. The starting jug is BIG, and fixed in one place. Below the starting jug are two parallel lines of identical, reasonably positive (1/1.5cm edges?) foot holds. The finish hold is up (obviously) and left of the start hold - 45 degrees left actually. There is a line of bolt holes along this 45 degree line to move the finish jug along as people are eliminated, much like high jump. The winning jump, I think, was 2.41m. Previously the European (World?) record had been around 2.32m.
In reply to felix:
Too right who gives a toss.....about chimp's or world record dyno's. How many people have actually used a proper dyno, not a slap, in anger on a route?
Too right who gives a toss.....about chimp's or world record dyno's. How many people have actually used a proper dyno, not a slap, in anger on a route?
In reply to Willyb:
I held Graeme Livingstone's ropes when he did Double Dyno or Die on the Aberdeen sea cliffs. The roof consist of a steep slab with a 45 degree roof above it. The roof was crossed by two moves, both dynos with gear just before the first target hold. Graeme's first attempt failed during the setup for the second dyno and left him upside down with his head about six inches above the slab.
The name thus becomes rather apt.
Bob
I held Graeme Livingstone's ropes when he did Double Dyno or Die on the Aberdeen sea cliffs. The roof consist of a steep slab with a 45 degree roof above it. The roof was crossed by two moves, both dynos with gear just before the first target hold. Graeme's first attempt failed during the setup for the second dyno and left him upside down with his head about six inches above the slab.
The name thus becomes rather apt.
Bob
In reply to BoulderPete:
Point being though it's the new rock & roll of the new rock & roll. How many Boulder-dudes do you know or see relentlessly going on about & practising dyno's, yet on rock never use them. Or when they claim to have done they are simply slaps, which they could probably do statically anyway!
Point being though it's the new rock & roll of the new rock & roll. How many Boulder-dudes do you know or see relentlessly going on about & practising dyno's, yet on rock never use them. Or when they claim to have done they are simply slaps, which they could probably do statically anyway!
In reply to Willyb:
almost everyone whos done wings of unreason. so there.
almost everyone whos done wings of unreason. so there.
In reply to midgets of the world unite: to be fair stu, you can't really compare the dyno on wings to something like the buckstone
In reply to JR:
Simply attach large kite to back. Place industrial sized fan below move, dyno to hearts content.
Simply attach large kite to back. Place industrial sized fan below move, dyno to hearts content.
In reply to daveP:
Why do you think that dave? It's a different type of move, but it's just as comitting! I have a great mental image of someone trying to reverse the dyno on "wings" now.
Why do you think that dave? It's a different type of move, but it's just as comitting! I have a great mental image of someone trying to reverse the dyno on "wings" now.
In reply to midgets of the world unite:
oh, btw - Hubble isn't very far at all, only 370 miles. Hale Bopp however is currently 1200 million miles and getting further every day. You'd have to be tall to latch that one.
oh, btw - Hubble isn't very far at all, only 370 miles. Hale Bopp however is currently 1200 million miles and getting further every day. You'd have to be tall to latch that one.
In reply to Willyb:
I agree with you there but i dont think that you could static an eight foot gap!!!
I agree with you there but i dont think that you could static an eight foot gap!!!
In reply to MattH: As you know Matt there will be an International Dyno competition at the Festival of Climbing (thats Birmingham or Climb'01) in accordance with the dimensions that you have laid out, in fact you are organising it I seem to remember. If anyone else thinks they are up to it make sure you're at the NIA on 9th December.
Graeme Alderson
Graeme Alderson
In reply to MattH:
Is that 2.41 vertical metres or 2.41 from one hold to the other??
Is that 2.41 vertical metres or 2.41 from one hold to the other??
In reply to JR:
I guess thinking about it its 2.41m between the holds, 'cos if it was vertical height then it would be 3.41m between the holds. (cos45/2.41 = 3.41, for anyone interested). 3.41m is a bit far.
I guess thinking about it its 2.41m between the holds, 'cos if it was vertical height then it would be 3.41m between the holds. (cos45/2.41 = 3.41, for anyone interested). 3.41m is a bit far.
In reply to JR: i like to dyno and i thought deliverance and buckstone easyish dyno's like quintins dyno i thought easy. hale bopp is much harder and not just the distance which is further but the holds which are smaller(apart from top hold.) i haven't done it but have touched the top several times.
intresting fact ;; on fred rouhlings 9a hugh in france there is one move which is a big dyno with about 2 meters imbetween the holds. and thats in the midle of a 9a.
intresting fact ;; on fred rouhlings 9a hugh in france there is one move which is a big dyno with about 2 meters imbetween the holds. and thats in the midle of a 9a.
In reply to midgets of the world unite: i got a mate who's pretty small and he's done hale bopp bieng small is not always an excuse
In reply to dan evans:
Ahh well i shal try hale bopp this summer
Ahh well i shal try hale bopp this summer
i can dyno about 6 feet! does this count?
On a good day i can do 1-4-8 on a campus board as well!
On a good day i can do 1-4-8 on a campus board as well!
In reply to midgets of the world unite: yes I would like to see somone reverse the wings dyno on the lead, but equally I'd like to see someone reverse the buckstone dyno!!!! surely a downward slither/smearing would see you back on the footholds (but don't step on the gear). I know you're a short arse, but this move can be done statically on smears (as per the first ascent) so its not that impossible.
Reversing the buckstone would involve catching youreself from a 6 foot drop, without hitting the floor, would surely be a lot harder.
Reversing the buckstone would involve catching youreself from a 6 foot drop, without hitting the floor, would surely be a lot harder.
In reply to daveP: Re wings of unreason - but isn't climbing the last moves solid 6c, probably giving a route grade of e5 6c rather than e3 6a (IMO) if you dyno it. Therefore the dyno is the easier and more sensible(?) way to climb the route which I think was the whole point of the discussion (i.e. an example of a real dyno on a route).
In reply to Ian:
No, the smear finish if you use your head and are cunning, is about E3 6a (at least for me at 5'5", if you're wondering). I find the dyno harder! And why would anyone want to dyno with both hands other than to show off ...?!
No, the smear finish if you use your head and are cunning, is about E3 6a (at least for me at 5'5", if you're wondering). I find the dyno harder! And why would anyone want to dyno with both hands other than to show off ...?!
In reply to Jon Read:
Does it count if you did both the smear finish and the dyno at the same time? i.e stand on the smear, realise it's going to blow and jump off it to the top. does that smear really stick? woo.
Does it count if you did both the smear finish and the dyno at the same time? i.e stand on the smear, realise it's going to blow and jump off it to the top. does that smear really stick? woo.
In reply to midgets of the world unite:
Now that's more like 6c, or I'd like to think so, having failed by that method quite spectacularly on the onsight. My mate had given me "a lot" of slack for a dyno. I ended up beneath the first overlap (ie. 3ft. from the floor). Readza comes unstuck via bogus-beta from someone else, which makes a change ...
Now that's more like 6c, or I'd like to think so, having failed by that method quite spectacularly on the onsight. My mate had given me "a lot" of slack for a dyno. I ended up beneath the first overlap (ie. 3ft. from the floor). Readza comes unstuck via bogus-beta from someone else, which makes a change ...
In reply to Jon Read:
Thats what you get for trying to beta flash things!
Thats what you get for trying to beta flash things!
In reply to Jon Read:
<No, the smear finish if you use your head and are cunning, is about E3 6a (at least for me at 5'5", if you're wondering). I find the dyno harder! And why would anyone want to dyno with both hands other than to show off ...?!>
6a? I'm impressed - it doesn't look like there's any holds. I'm 6' and dynoed with both hands because I couldn't find anything else useful to do with either hand - just crouch down on the footholds and jump. For my height it's ungradeable but actually fairly easy after you've built up the nerve, the crux is lower down.
<No, the smear finish if you use your head and are cunning, is about E3 6a (at least for me at 5'5", if you're wondering). I find the dyno harder! And why would anyone want to dyno with both hands other than to show off ...?!>
6a? I'm impressed - it doesn't look like there's any holds. I'm 6' and dynoed with both hands because I couldn't find anything else useful to do with either hand - just crouch down on the footholds and jump. For my height it's ungradeable but actually fairly easy after you've built up the nerve, the crux is lower down.
In reply to Ian:
That's where the cunning comes in (!), the best smears are not directly up from the pocket but a slight step right, and there's a wee edge to go for too. See the easy way.
> 6a? I'm impressed - it doesn't look like there's any
> holds.
> holds.
That's where the cunning comes in (!), the best smears are not directly up from the pocket but a slight step right, and there's a wee edge to go for too. See the easy way.
In reply to Jon Read: personally i would put wings at E3 6a for a climber of reasonable height (i.e. taller than both jon read and midgets...) like me, where the dyno is a lovely 5-7 inch spring of you toes, one handed.
see:-
http://www.kleyland.co.uk/rob_wings4.jpg
But recently witnessed a mate of mine (who's only about an inch taller than me at 6'2) pull some obscene reach out of his back pocket and static it at about E2 5c.
see:-
http://www.kleyland.co.uk/tom_wings2.jpg
I couldn't comment as for the shorter gent, but the first ascentionists put it at HXS/E6 6c and "the hardest route in the world".
More to the point, when's this buttress gonna be accessable again???
see:-
http://www.kleyland.co.uk/rob_wings4.jpg
But recently witnessed a mate of mine (who's only about an inch taller than me at 6'2) pull some obscene reach out of his back pocket and static it at about E2 5c.
see:-
http://www.kleyland.co.uk/tom_wings2.jpg
I couldn't comment as for the shorter gent, but the first ascentionists put it at HXS/E6 6c and "the hardest route in the world".
More to the point, when's this buttress gonna be accessable again???
In reply to Canadian Dom:
Canadian Dom eh? You gone native already? You've only been there three weeks.
Canadian Dom eh? You gone native already? You've only been there three weeks.
To see someone doing a dyno on a route, check out the photos of that Ron Fawcett lookalike type bloke (Malcolm Somebody)on Mirage in the Rockclimbing in Australia book. Now thats a dyno!
In reply to everyone:
So what??, the actual guidebook grade of wings of unreason is E4 6b and people have thought its as "easy" as E2 5c and as hard as E5 6c. Hmmmm. Im 6'1" Does that mean its ....E3 6a then?? Surely its just because different people find some routes easier than others??
So what??, the actual guidebook grade of wings of unreason is E4 6b and people have thought its as "easy" as E2 5c and as hard as E5 6c. Hmmmm. Im 6'1" Does that mean its ....E3 6a then?? Surely its just because different people find some routes easier than others??
In reply to JR:
Of course. Try headpointing it in EBs with an old style rigid #2 Friend (or maybe it was just a Hex?), as the Woodward brothers did. I think their grade of HXS (E6) 6c would be totally spot on. Hmm, perhaps that was the first E6 ... ?
Of course. Try headpointing it in EBs with an old style rigid #2 Friend (or maybe it was just a Hex?), as the Woodward brothers did. I think their grade of HXS (E6) 6c would be totally spot on. Hmm, perhaps that was the first E6 ... ?
In reply to Jon Read: just to change the subject a bit, has anyone got any beta for track of the cat?? like, how can I climb it without incuring a £5000 fine.......
In reply to daveP:
I think it's in now, actually. The yellow tape's been down for a month or so.
In reply to Jon: no Friends in 1977: must have been a hex if anything at all. Track of the Cat also presumably virtually unprotected then. Just shows how silly all this 'first E6' business is [however amusing]. Anyone for Nectar in non-sticky boots without micro-wires?
E3 6a without the jump my arse
I think it's in now, actually. The yellow tape's been down for a month or so.
In reply to Jon: no Friends in 1977: must have been a hex if anything at all. Track of the Cat also presumably virtually unprotected then. Just shows how silly all this 'first E6' business is [however amusing]. Anyone for Nectar in non-sticky boots without micro-wires?
E3 6a without the jump my arse
In reply to m@: I've dynoed past the sloper of georges wall to the juggy break which is easier, although further than grabing the sloper. Most dynos of this type are all in footwork and timing. I've managed dynos of 9' and even 8' with one hand (that's 8 or 9 feet between hand holds before you ask!). Once you have the knack they are quite straight forward, however Hale Bop, now there is a real challenge. Buckstone Dyno, Deliverence, all the dyno's at Stoney are no where in the same league!!
Easy dynos: Deliverence (stanage), Buckstone Dyno (stanage), Lift Off(speckle hen butress)
Hard dynos: Hale Bop(cuisiniere, Hurricane (curbar)
Easy dynos: Deliverence (stanage), Buckstone Dyno (stanage), Lift Off(speckle hen butress)
Hard dynos: Hale Bop(cuisiniere, Hurricane (curbar)
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