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Hi,
The AMI (Association of Mountaineering Instructors)are considering a change in the names of the MIA (Mountain Instructor Award) and the MIC (Mountain Instructor Certificate).
The idea is the change in names will make for the remit of these professional qualifications to be more obvious.
I just wondered what your thoughts were on this??
Richard Hogan. MIA
www.rockandice.net
The AMI (Association of Mountaineering Instructors)are considering a change in the names of the MIA (Mountain Instructor Award) and the MIC (Mountain Instructor Certificate).
The idea is the change in names will make for the remit of these professional qualifications to be more obvious.
I just wondered what your thoughts were on this??
Richard Hogan. MIA
www.rockandice.net
In reply to Rich:
I think new names could make things a lot clearer. Even when I'd worked out what the 2 awards covered, it took me ages to get which was which into my head (i.e. which was the 'summer' award, and which was the 'winter'). And that was starting from a reasonable understanding of the whole MLTB award structure.... The 'Mountain Instructor' bit is fairly self-explanatory, but the difference between 'Award' and 'Certificate' ain't exactly obvious. 'Mountain Instructor (summer)' and 'Mountain Instructor (winter)' might be a touch easier to understand! Or are you thinking of a more radical name change?
It's a fairly common question on these messageboards - someone mentions 'MIA', and it instantly gets a flurry of confused 'what's that' replies. Which is generally followed by some explanations of varying accuracy....
I think new names could make things a lot clearer. Even when I'd worked out what the 2 awards covered, it took me ages to get which was which into my head (i.e. which was the 'summer' award, and which was the 'winter'). And that was starting from a reasonable understanding of the whole MLTB award structure.... The 'Mountain Instructor' bit is fairly self-explanatory, but the difference between 'Award' and 'Certificate' ain't exactly obvious. 'Mountain Instructor (summer)' and 'Mountain Instructor (winter)' might be a touch easier to understand! Or are you thinking of a more radical name change?
It's a fairly common question on these messageboards - someone mentions 'MIA', and it instantly gets a flurry of confused 'what's that' replies. Which is generally followed by some explanations of varying accuracy....
In reply to Rich:
what about MIB?
what about MIB?
In reply to Carolyn:
Slight problem with your description is that the Mountain Instructor (Winter) could be taken to imply that the holder was only qualified to instruct in winter when they can infact do the lot.
Slight problem with your description is that the Mountain Instructor (Winter) could be taken to imply that the holder was only qualified to instruct in winter when they can infact do the lot.
In reply to Rich: Noble intentions, but I guess it depends on what the new titles will be, have any suggestions been tabled yet?
In reply to Rich: May be then it should be 'Mountain Instructor (summer)' and 'Mountain Instructor (all year round)'. Just a suggestion.
In reply to Horse:
Yes, I know, and it does sometimes cause confusion with summer/winter ML. And of course, to add to the confusion, going scrambling in December is quite likely to be a 'summer' activity.
But 'Mountain Instructor (multipitch rock climbing and scrambling)' is a bit of a mouthful, don't you think? And it doesn't make it clear that they'll also have a summer ML, should you just want to go for a walk!
Hmmm. Not that the difference between a 'Mountain Leader' and a 'Mountain Instructor' is particularly clear if you don't know the system. And they don't do what they say. I mean, I've never managed to lead a mountain anywhere, summer or winter, and I've yet to meet a MIA who's taught a mountain anything useful......
Yes, I know, and it does sometimes cause confusion with summer/winter ML. And of course, to add to the confusion, going scrambling in December is quite likely to be a 'summer' activity.
But 'Mountain Instructor (multipitch rock climbing and scrambling)' is a bit of a mouthful, don't you think? And it doesn't make it clear that they'll also have a summer ML, should you just want to go for a walk!
Hmmm. Not that the difference between a 'Mountain Leader' and a 'Mountain Instructor' is particularly clear if you don't know the system. And they don't do what they say. I mean, I've never managed to lead a mountain anywhere, summer or winter, and I've yet to meet a MIA who's taught a mountain anything useful......
In reply to Carolyn: few people have been around long enough to realise this so i'll tell ou now. I once instructed a mountain n the fine art of sword swallowing
In reply to Hutch:
Wow! I was wrong, obviously.....
But then again, maybe mountains are just naturals for this? It is, after all, closely related to swallowing gear. And they do that all the time.....
Wow! I was wrong, obviously.....
But then again, maybe mountains are just naturals for this? It is, after all, closely related to swallowing gear. And they do that all the time.....
In reply to Jem:
Mountain Instructor Summer and Mountain Instructor Winter have been suggested by the AMI in a recent newsletter.
Rich.
http://www.rockandice.net
Mountain Instructor Summer and Mountain Instructor Winter have been suggested by the AMI in a recent newsletter.
Rich.
http://www.rockandice.net
In reply to Rich:
Weren't some of your threads zapped last week for being blatant spam for you own services as a professional instructor?
I assume you are trying to be a little more subtle this week.
F*ck off, nonetheless.
G
Weren't some of your threads zapped last week for being blatant spam for you own services as a professional instructor?
I assume you are trying to be a little more subtle this week.
F*ck off, nonetheless.
G
In reply to Graham: Ask him about the almost court case he had brought against him for passing off. It was before he became rock & ice, he was using a name which was remarkably similar to that of another peak district based outdoor activities provider.
In reply to Rich: Why not do it like Canoeing or Caving bits of paper and have Climbing Instructor Level One, Level 2 etc.? Then theres no confusion about which season it is.
In reply to Rich:
As I understand it, MIA is a prerequisite for MIC, so why not have Mountaineering Instructor (Summer) and Mountaineering Instructor (Summer and Winter).
As I understand it, MIA is a prerequisite for MIC, so why not have Mountaineering Instructor (Summer) and Mountaineering Instructor (Summer and Winter).
In reply to Rich: I've only heard it second-hand, perhaps you could enlighten us some more, straight from the horses mouth so to speak!
In reply to Anonymous:
I asked you to tell us more on the subject.
I started this thread with a view to gleaning some useful information for the AMI.
Please add your name next time you post.
Rich.
> (In reply to Rich) I've only heard it second-hand, perhaps you could enlighten us some more, straight from the horses mouth so to speak!
I asked you to tell us more on the subject.
I started this thread with a view to gleaning some useful information for the AMI.
Please add your name next time you post.
Rich.
In reply to Rich: Like I said "I've only heard it second-hand, perhaps you could enlighten us some more, straight from the horses mouth so to speak!"
In reply to Anonymous:
Why the gutless anonyminity you AOL user?
> (In reply to Rich) Like I said "I've only heard it second-hand, perhaps you could enlighten us some more, straight from the horses mouth so to speak!"
Why the gutless anonyminity you AOL user?
In reply to Hillman:
Sounds like a reasonable idea, though still no description to make it clear to joe public.
Rich
> (In reply to Rich) Why not do it like Canoeing or Caving bits of paper and have Climbing Instructor Level One, Level 2 etc.? Then theres no confusion about which season it is.
Sounds like a reasonable idea, though still no description to make it clear to joe public.
Rich
In reply to Rich:
But you cant make it clear to anybody without going into some kind of essay about exactly what it entails - whatever it is has to be concise and to the point - theres all manner of different sorts of Doctor for example and you find the one you want by asking relevant questions.
Level One = Rock Climbing, Scrambling, Mountain Navigation Hillwalking(no snow)
Level Two = Winter(snowy)Hillwalking, Winter(snowy)Climbing
Not too difficult really......and surely better than a series of meaningless abbreviations.
But you cant make it clear to anybody without going into some kind of essay about exactly what it entails - whatever it is has to be concise and to the point - theres all manner of different sorts of Doctor for example and you find the one you want by asking relevant questions.
Level One = Rock Climbing, Scrambling, Mountain Navigation Hillwalking(no snow)
Level Two = Winter(snowy)Hillwalking, Winter(snowy)Climbing
Not too difficult really......and surely better than a series of meaningless abbreviations.
In reply to Rich: Who or what is AMI, first I've heard of that one.
In reply to Rich: Should I be trying to find out what or who AMI is? Or should they be singing their presence from the roof tops? Perhaps even promoting and publising the Awards their memebrs hold? Or is it just a group that likes more meetings?
In reply to Mike from Frome:
The AMI are the 'Association Of Mountain Instructors' which was set up to promote the interests of it's members. See above link.
Kind of like the BMC but for MIA's and MIC's.
> (In reply to Rich) Should I be trying to find out what or who AMI is?
The AMI are the 'Association Of Mountain Instructors' which was set up to promote the interests of it's members. See above link.
Kind of like the BMC but for MIA's and MIC's.
In reply to Rich: So is in in the interests of its members to publicise that it exsits, and what and who it represents? Rather like the BMG does by have regular magazine articles on guided trips and taking out adverts in the outdoor press?
If so it's failed.
I was actually a founder member until 2 (or is it 3 now?) years ago. And do you know what I've heard or seen nothing about AMI since then except for one car sticker on one of my mates cars. I believe there is even a part time officer now. What does he do? What is the point of AMI if no one knows it exsists and we are all confuesed about the awards it's members hold?
If so it's failed.
I was actually a founder member until 2 (or is it 3 now?) years ago. And do you know what I've heard or seen nothing about AMI since then except for one car sticker on one of my mates cars. I believe there is even a part time officer now. What does he do? What is the point of AMI if no one knows it exsists and we are all confuesed about the awards it's members hold?
In reply to Mike from Frome:
Don't really know where you are coming from, but I was just enquiring as to how the AMI might make some valid changes to the award names.
As for the AMI offering support for its membership it does this by sending out a quarterly newsletter and organising sponsorship gear deals collective insurance etc.. etc..
Should we just leave these names alone or what?
Will a change in the MIA or MIC names make a difference?
Don't really know where you are coming from, but I was just enquiring as to how the AMI might make some valid changes to the award names.
As for the AMI offering support for its membership it does this by sending out a quarterly newsletter and organising sponsorship gear deals collective insurance etc.. etc..
Should we just leave these names alone or what?
Will a change in the MIA or MIC names make a difference?
In reply to Rich: That would seem to be the point! You are all busy playing at being instructors. Witness the response to this thread how many AMI memebers are rock talk users? How many are climbers? Why oh why is there no promotion of the awards by AMI. It's no wonder no-one understands the names of the awards 'cos no-ones heard of the awards. Do you want to promote the awards or not? Changing the names makes no difference whatsoever. I'm more fed up with AMI now than when I left it!
In reply to Mike from Frome:
Not many AMI members play on the forums when they get in from work (thats what teaching climbing becomes when you do it for a living)
I agree though that AMI should look at promotion of the original names and not confuse matters further by changing them further.
I posted this thread here because I wanted feedback from non-instructional parties.
BTW Were you a full member of the AMI?
Not many AMI members play on the forums when they get in from work (thats what teaching climbing becomes when you do it for a living)
I agree though that AMI should look at promotion of the original names and not confuse matters further by changing them further.
I posted this thread here because I wanted feedback from non-instructional parties.
BTW Were you a full member of the AMI?
In reply to Rich: I tend to think that AMI should keep the titles as they are and as others have suggested, do more to promote the association and what they stand for... Changing them to something new will probably only confuse many even more... As someone intending to work towards my MIA over the next couple yrs, I would like to think that my (prospective) representative association would not resort to simple knee-jerk changes in the hope of greater recognition, and hope instead that they could perhaps aim at better recognition through promotion of what MIAs/MICs etc have to offer through the climbing press etc like the BMG,MLTB & BMC do. As for acronyms, there are so many that we hear of... BMC,ML,SPA,WGL,MLTB,BMG,CC,UIAGM,IFMGA, yet many of us understand what they represent because of the efforts of their owners in promoting them, so I think the AMI should try the same route.
The AMI are not in a position to decide what the awards should be called this change can only be made by the MLTB.
It's the MLTB who run / administer the awards and it's them who are considering wether a name change would be appropriate. The AMI as an 'Assocation' will obviously have a vested interest in the mame of the awards but can't actually change them themselves.
It would be a bit like me deciding I am going to change the name of my O levels to ABC levels - i just don't have the authority to do that but I could certainly present my veiws on what I thought they should be called if a name change was in the offing.
Same situation re the AMI and the MLTB.
Richard B
It's the MLTB who run / administer the awards and it's them who are considering wether a name change would be appropriate. The AMI as an 'Assocation' will obviously have a vested interest in the mame of the awards but can't actually change them themselves.
It would be a bit like me deciding I am going to change the name of my O levels to ABC levels - i just don't have the authority to do that but I could certainly present my veiws on what I thought they should be called if a name change was in the offing.
Same situation re the AMI and the MLTB.
Richard B
In reply to RichardB: do you not mean the UKMTB? (I was under the impression that the MLTB had responsibility only for ML,SPA & WGL...
...come to think of it we have the MLTB,SMLTB,WMLTB,NIMTB,UKMTB
the whole system can appear a bit unwieldy... should we not have one body that coordinates all qualifications from the top UIAGM to the bottom SPA etc?...
...come to think of it we have the MLTB,SMLTB,WMLTB,NIMTB,UKMTB
the whole system can appear a bit unwieldy... should we not have one body that coordinates all qualifications from the top UIAGM to the bottom SPA etc?...
In reply to Jem:
You could be right Jem, I get quite confused with the governing bodies ...
The point I'm trying to make is that the AMI can't change the name of awards just because it's members hold that award. It's only the issueing body that can do that - which isn't the AMI, it's the governing body .... whatever they're called !!
Richard B
You could be right Jem, I get quite confused with the governing bodies ...
The point I'm trying to make is that the AMI can't change the name of awards just because it's members hold that award. It's only the issueing body that can do that - which isn't the AMI, it's the governing body .... whatever they're called !!
Richard B
In reply to Rich:
By analogy with the notion of 3 or 4 season boots/sleeping bags etc, why not try Mountain Instructor (3 Season)and Mountain Instructor (4 Season); this could be shortened to MI-3/4 and MI-4/4.
By analogy with the notion of 3 or 4 season boots/sleeping bags etc, why not try Mountain Instructor (3 Season)and Mountain Instructor (4 Season); this could be shortened to MI-3/4 and MI-4/4.
In reply to Ann: But that wud be awfie' confusin' when the new Tom Cruise Movie MI-3 comes out!
In reply to Ann: Diminuitive American Actor! Pretends to climb!!!
In reply to RichardB:
The AMI have a strong case to put over if they have the backing of a majority the AMI members, many of the award holders are members of AMI and this could easily influence the UKMTB.
Does anyone remember the SPSA? and the MLC?
The AMI have a strong case to put over if they have the backing of a majority the AMI members, many of the award holders are members of AMI and this could easily influence the UKMTB.
Does anyone remember the SPSA? and the MLC?
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