This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
The background:
A mining permission granted in 1952 which allows for "the winning and working of flurospar and other minerals" is being used as a pretext for a massive limestone quarrying operation right in the heart of the Peak District. The entire hillside to the north west of Calver is under threat. The PDNPA has tried to put a stop to this wanton vandalism and after many delays a public inquiry was finally held. The planning inspector, after much deliberation and several site visits, came to the obvious conclusion that the quarry was not being worked in accordance with the original permission. His conclusion was that no more than 2 tons of limestone should be removed for every ton of flurospar.
The high court ruling:
The quarry owners appealed to the high court and won. The judgement effectively gives them carte blanche to do whatever they want for all the land the permission covers - an area much bigger than they are currently working on.
The judge did not consider the context in which the permission was granted, namely an era in which extraction was done by pick and shovel, not modern machinery. An era in which flurospar was a vital mineral for steel production.
He did not consider the fact that the flurospar extraction is merely a sham, the small quantities being extracted are not being processed.
He rejected the 2:1 ratio as being harsh on the quarry owners, but did not offer any suggested ratio. In fact he seems to feel that anything short of a million to one is OK.
Most all of though, the judge did not seem to believe that being in a National Park should make any difference, and that removal of an entire hill would be entirely justifiable! Needless to say, the judge did not make a site visit.
It may have been the judge's intent that the planning inquiry will be reconvened under the guidelines he put forward, but this is simply not going to happen - the PDNPA know it would be futile with such a lop-sided interpretation.
If this judgement is left to stand the precedent it sets is truely horrific. The owners of Backdale have already restarted quarrying and seem hell-bent on covering as much ground as the can. In the last month the road than runs past Froggatt has seen a big increase in lorry traffic - the bridge near Calver has been damaged on three occasions. But the implication go much further than Calver and the Peak District - it gives the green light for quarrying in any national park on the flimsiest of permissions. National Park authorities are rendered powerless to prevent the wholesale destruction of the countryside. Already the owners of another quarry near Bradwell are going to the high court in the light of this ruling.
More information:
http://www.longstone-edge.org.uk/
What you can do:
The decision as to whether to appeal lies solely with the Secretary of State for Defra - Hilary Benn. The local mp, Partrick McLoughlin, is meeting with him in the next week to urge him to act. The appeal must be lodged soon, both for legal reasons but also to limit the environmental damage. Apparently there is not much point in writing to the minister (civil servants deal with their in-tray), but it is worth writing or emailing Partrick McLoughlin (mcloughlinp@parliament.uk) and expressing your support to him. A big bundle of letters from all over the country will give him some useful ammuntion. The Longstone Edge website contains some sample letters
There is already good cross-party support amongst local mps, but the more mp's on board the better. Email you MP and get over the message that this is not a NIMBY campaign - it affects everyone who ever visits a national park.
Find out who your MP is here:
http://www.theyworkforyou.com/
It is imperative we act now. If this judgement is left to stand we may as well say goodbye to any notion that National Parks are special
A mining permission granted in 1952 which allows for "the winning and working of flurospar and other minerals" is being used as a pretext for a massive limestone quarrying operation right in the heart of the Peak District. The entire hillside to the north west of Calver is under threat. The PDNPA has tried to put a stop to this wanton vandalism and after many delays a public inquiry was finally held. The planning inspector, after much deliberation and several site visits, came to the obvious conclusion that the quarry was not being worked in accordance with the original permission. His conclusion was that no more than 2 tons of limestone should be removed for every ton of flurospar.
The high court ruling:
The quarry owners appealed to the high court and won. The judgement effectively gives them carte blanche to do whatever they want for all the land the permission covers - an area much bigger than they are currently working on.
The judge did not consider the context in which the permission was granted, namely an era in which extraction was done by pick and shovel, not modern machinery. An era in which flurospar was a vital mineral for steel production.
He did not consider the fact that the flurospar extraction is merely a sham, the small quantities being extracted are not being processed.
He rejected the 2:1 ratio as being harsh on the quarry owners, but did not offer any suggested ratio. In fact he seems to feel that anything short of a million to one is OK.
Most all of though, the judge did not seem to believe that being in a National Park should make any difference, and that removal of an entire hill would be entirely justifiable! Needless to say, the judge did not make a site visit.
It may have been the judge's intent that the planning inquiry will be reconvened under the guidelines he put forward, but this is simply not going to happen - the PDNPA know it would be futile with such a lop-sided interpretation.
If this judgement is left to stand the precedent it sets is truely horrific. The owners of Backdale have already restarted quarrying and seem hell-bent on covering as much ground as the can. In the last month the road than runs past Froggatt has seen a big increase in lorry traffic - the bridge near Calver has been damaged on three occasions. But the implication go much further than Calver and the Peak District - it gives the green light for quarrying in any national park on the flimsiest of permissions. National Park authorities are rendered powerless to prevent the wholesale destruction of the countryside. Already the owners of another quarry near Bradwell are going to the high court in the light of this ruling.
More information:
http://www.longstone-edge.org.uk/
What you can do:
The decision as to whether to appeal lies solely with the Secretary of State for Defra - Hilary Benn. The local mp, Partrick McLoughlin, is meeting with him in the next week to urge him to act. The appeal must be lodged soon, both for legal reasons but also to limit the environmental damage. Apparently there is not much point in writing to the minister (civil servants deal with their in-tray), but it is worth writing or emailing Partrick McLoughlin (mcloughlinp@parliament.uk) and expressing your support to him. A big bundle of letters from all over the country will give him some useful ammuntion. The Longstone Edge website contains some sample letters
There is already good cross-party support amongst local mps, but the more mp's on board the better. Email you MP and get over the message that this is not a NIMBY campaign - it affects everyone who ever visits a national park.
Find out who your MP is here:
http://www.theyworkforyou.com/
It is imperative we act now. If this judgement is left to stand we may as well say goodbye to any notion that National Parks are special
In reply to Chris the Tall:
http://hilarybenn.org/contact/
fill his inbox.
alternatively, phone the given number and ask for the name and contact details of his PA and agent. They are readily given and you can get your message to the minister in this way. I managed to persuade the minister for disability to agree to come to an event i organised last year through a polite but persistent campaign with her PA.
http://hilarybenn.org/contact/
fill his inbox.
alternatively, phone the given number and ask for the name and contact details of his PA and agent. They are readily given and you can get your message to the minister in this way. I managed to persuade the minister for disability to agree to come to an event i organised last year through a polite but persistent campaign with her PA.
In reply to Chris the Tall: Have written to my local MP.
In reply to Chris the Tall: I've written to my my MP via the theworkforyou.com web link. He's Nick Clegg, leader of the LibDems, and as MP for Sheffield Hallam he represents a constituency that has a city level of population but is very close to the Peak Park boundary. So, to all those large numbers of climbers on the west side of Sheffield, if that's your MP, please write to him.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Can we get this thread as a premier post, or an article, or on the latest news of the home page so more people have a chance of seeing it?
In the process of emailing Ann Cryer, my local MP.
Can we get this thread as a premier post, or an article, or on the latest news of the home page so more people have a chance of seeing it?
In the process of emailing Ann Cryer, my local MP.
In reply to HC~F: Is it not possible to set up a simple click on petition like has been done for other things, I have had replies from Downing street to those and even if its automatic it must piss them off having to think about it?
In reply to Al Evans: They've already done one. The response wasn't very helpful.
In reply to HC~F: Link please, I might have responded to it in that case, I know I did the Portland ones, and have sent e-mail too.
In reply to Al Evans:
it is in the first link;
http://www.longstone-edge.org.uk/
Also probably in the news pages on here.
it is in the first link;
http://www.longstone-edge.org.uk/
Also probably in the news pages on here.
In reply to sutty: Thanks Sutty but the click petition is closed, I'll look what else I can do.
In reply to Al Evans:
Addresses to write to at bottom of this article;
http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/older.html?month=03&year=2008#n43313
Addresses to write to at bottom of this article;
http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/older.html?month=03&year=2008#n43313
In reply to Al Evans:
There was a on-line petition, got a lot of support, but the response was - "it is in the hands of a planning inspector" ,which at the time, it was. Things have moved on significantly.
Personaly I think the e-petition thing is a joke - home to calls to make Spandau Ballet's Gold the national anthem or make Jeremy Clarkson PM.
The thing is, the more effort you make to register your opinion, the more weight it carries. Clicking a button takes a second, but writing an email or letter shows you care about the issue a bit more strongly.
Having said that, a couple of sample emails might be useful....
There was a on-line petition, got a lot of support, but the response was - "it is in the hands of a planning inspector" ,which at the time, it was. Things have moved on significantly.
Personaly I think the e-petition thing is a joke - home to calls to make Spandau Ballet's Gold the national anthem or make Jeremy Clarkson PM.
The thing is, the more effort you make to register your opinion, the more weight it carries. Clicking a button takes a second, but writing an email or letter shows you care about the issue a bit more strongly.
Having said that, a couple of sample emails might be useful....
In reply to Chris the Tall:
email will be going to Mr Benn with a copy to Tom Levitt my and kind of local to Longstone MP (High Peak)
email will be going to Mr Benn with a copy to Tom Levitt my and kind of local to Longstone MP (High Peak)
In reply to Chris the Tall: i've posterd letters to my useless mp's.
Thanks for the sample letters or i would not have had an idea of how to start.
Thanks for the sample letters or i would not have had an idea of how to start.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Hillary Benn is MP for Leeds central - if your in leeds drop him an email, or write to him: http://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/hilary_benn/leeds_central
Im going to now. If this doesnt come to anything an on-sight mass protest could do.
Hillary Benn is MP for Leeds central - if your in leeds drop him an email, or write to him: http://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/hilary_benn/leeds_central
Im going to now. If this doesnt come to anything an on-sight mass protest could do.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
<bump>
Written to MP, also spreading this around by email and on other fora.
<bump>
Written to MP, also spreading this around by email and on other fora.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Tuesday bump
Email Partrick McLoughlin (mcloughlinp@parliament.uk) to express your support for his efforts to persuade the minister to appeal. Tell him you think the destruction of the national park is a scandal and that the judge's decision is flawed for not considering the context in which the permission was originally granted. And tell him where you are from (particularly useful if you are in a marginal constituency) - helps to get over the message that this is not a NIMBY campaign.
Tuesday bump
Email Partrick McLoughlin (mcloughlinp@parliament.uk) to express your support for his efforts to persuade the minister to appeal. Tell him you think the destruction of the national park is a scandal and that the judge's decision is flawed for not considering the context in which the permission was originally granted. And tell him where you are from (particularly useful if you are in a marginal constituency) - helps to get over the message that this is not a NIMBY campaign.
In reply to Chris the Tall: A very well written thread. Will send an email.
To those who are also sending an email, you MUST sign it with your full name and also include your address. I used to work for a company that did planning applications and we rejected letters of complaint that were not signed or did not have an address on the basis that we were unable to reply directly to our critics.
To those who are also sending an email, you MUST sign it with your full name and also include your address. I used to work for a company that did planning applications and we rejected letters of complaint that were not signed or did not have an address on the basis that we were unable to reply directly to our critics.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Just a reminder to people that this issue is on the agenda for tonight's Peak Area Meeting - Grouse Inn, Froggatt Edge, 7:30 - where Henry might be able to shed more light on what's going on behind the scenes.
Also on the agenda, venue and content of future meetings, feedback on the newsletter, progress on the guidebooks, chips and Lucinda Hughes....
Just a reminder to people that this issue is on the agenda for tonight's Peak Area Meeting - Grouse Inn, Froggatt Edge, 7:30 - where Henry might be able to shed more light on what's going on behind the scenes.
Also on the agenda, venue and content of future meetings, feedback on the newsletter, progress on the guidebooks, chips and Lucinda Hughes....
Email to Meg Munn - Labour MP for Heeley, Sheffield - gonna do McLoughlin now.
Dear Meg
Thank you so much for your written response to my previous email. I went to the meeting on Tuesday 8 April at Calver. I understand that parliamentary protocol prevented you from attending the meeting, which was attended by Patrick McLoughlin. For Heeley residents, the Peak District can be a refuge from the City, accessible by public transport, and fully deserving of its National Park status (and the protection such status should entail). Two public footpaths have already been lost and a green road diverted by quarry operators at Backdale. I would like to ask you to represent me in parliament by bringing up this issue with Hilary Benn: as the Secretary of state for DEFRA the decision rests with him as to whether an appeal against the high court ruling is permitted. I am given to understand that Hazel Blears may also be able to influence this issue.
Below is a summary of some of the discussions. I am particularly concerned over what Justice Sullivan's high court ruling will mean for the rest of the Peak District and other National Parks.
Yours sincerely
Joanne Wood
The background:
A mining permission granted in 1952 which allows for "the winning and working of flurospar and other minerals" is being used as a pretext for a massive limestone quarrying operation right in the heart of the Peak District. The entire hillside to the north west of Calver is under threat. The PDNPA has tried to put a stop to this wanton vandalism and after many delays a public inquiry was finally held. The planning inspector, after much deliberation and several site visits, came to the obvious conclusion that the quarry was not being worked in accordance with the original permission. His conclusion was that no more than 2 tons of limestone should be removed for every ton of flurospar.
The high court ruling:
The quarry owners appealed to the high court and won. The judgement effectively gives them carte blanche to do whatever they want for all the land the permission covers - an area much bigger than they are currently working on.
The judge did not consider the context in which the permission was granted, namely an era in which extraction was done by pick and shovel, not modern machinery. An era in which flurospar was a vital mineral for steel production.
He did not consider the fact that the flurospar extraction is merely a sham, the small quantities being extracted are not being processed.
He rejected the 2:1 ratio as being harsh on the quarry owners, but did not offer any suggested ratio. In fact he seems to feel that anything short of a million to one is OK.
Most all of though, the judge did not seem to believe that being in a National Park should make any difference, and that removal of an entire hill would be entirely justifiable! Needless to say, the judge did not make a site visit.
It may have been the judge's intent that the planning inquiry will be reconvened under the guidelines he put forward, but this is simply not going to happen - the PDNPA know it would be futile with such a lop-sided interpretation.
If this judgement is left to stand the precedent it sets is truely horrific. The owners of Backdale have already restarted quarrying and seem hell-bent on covering as much ground as the can. In the last month the road than runs past Froggatt has seen a big increase in lorry traffic - the bridge near Calver has been damaged on three occasions. But the implications go much further than Calver and the Peak District - it gives the green light for quarrying in any national park on the flimsiest of permissions. National Park authorities are rendered powerless to prevent the wholesale destruction of the countryside. Already the owners of another quarry near Bradwell are going to the high court in the light of this ruling.
Dear Meg
Thank you so much for your written response to my previous email. I went to the meeting on Tuesday 8 April at Calver. I understand that parliamentary protocol prevented you from attending the meeting, which was attended by Patrick McLoughlin. For Heeley residents, the Peak District can be a refuge from the City, accessible by public transport, and fully deserving of its National Park status (and the protection such status should entail). Two public footpaths have already been lost and a green road diverted by quarry operators at Backdale. I would like to ask you to represent me in parliament by bringing up this issue with Hilary Benn: as the Secretary of state for DEFRA the decision rests with him as to whether an appeal against the high court ruling is permitted. I am given to understand that Hazel Blears may also be able to influence this issue.
Below is a summary of some of the discussions. I am particularly concerned over what Justice Sullivan's high court ruling will mean for the rest of the Peak District and other National Parks.
Yours sincerely
Joanne Wood
The background:
A mining permission granted in 1952 which allows for "the winning and working of flurospar and other minerals" is being used as a pretext for a massive limestone quarrying operation right in the heart of the Peak District. The entire hillside to the north west of Calver is under threat. The PDNPA has tried to put a stop to this wanton vandalism and after many delays a public inquiry was finally held. The planning inspector, after much deliberation and several site visits, came to the obvious conclusion that the quarry was not being worked in accordance with the original permission. His conclusion was that no more than 2 tons of limestone should be removed for every ton of flurospar.
The high court ruling:
The quarry owners appealed to the high court and won. The judgement effectively gives them carte blanche to do whatever they want for all the land the permission covers - an area much bigger than they are currently working on.
The judge did not consider the context in which the permission was granted, namely an era in which extraction was done by pick and shovel, not modern machinery. An era in which flurospar was a vital mineral for steel production.
He did not consider the fact that the flurospar extraction is merely a sham, the small quantities being extracted are not being processed.
He rejected the 2:1 ratio as being harsh on the quarry owners, but did not offer any suggested ratio. In fact he seems to feel that anything short of a million to one is OK.
Most all of though, the judge did not seem to believe that being in a National Park should make any difference, and that removal of an entire hill would be entirely justifiable! Needless to say, the judge did not make a site visit.
It may have been the judge's intent that the planning inquiry will be reconvened under the guidelines he put forward, but this is simply not going to happen - the PDNPA know it would be futile with such a lop-sided interpretation.
If this judgement is left to stand the precedent it sets is truely horrific. The owners of Backdale have already restarted quarrying and seem hell-bent on covering as much ground as the can. In the last month the road than runs past Froggatt has seen a big increase in lorry traffic - the bridge near Calver has been damaged on three occasions. But the implications go much further than Calver and the Peak District - it gives the green light for quarrying in any national park on the flimsiest of permissions. National Park authorities are rendered powerless to prevent the wholesale destruction of the countryside. Already the owners of another quarry near Bradwell are going to the high court in the light of this ruling.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
The PDNP is going to challenge the ruling:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/derbyshire/7356478.stm
The PDNP is going to challenge the ruling:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/derbyshire/7356478.stm
In reply to winhill: There is still hope then!, Keep writing those letters people!
In reply to Chris the Tall:
I emailed my local MP in Weston-super-Mare to add my small voice to the weight of the campaign. Admittedly I pretty much ripped off your post because I'm lazy like that. But I was more than a little surprised when I got a letter back from the House of Commons yesterday! For a minute I thought that I was in trouble until I opened it.
Ok it didn't say "Good point, we'll change our minds in view of your letter" but it was forwarded to the relevant minister and hopefully the interest of another MP from the other end of the country will help a little.
I emailed my local MP in Weston-super-Mare to add my small voice to the weight of the campaign. Admittedly I pretty much ripped off your post because I'm lazy like that. But I was more than a little surprised when I got a letter back from the House of Commons yesterday! For a minute I thought that I was in trouble until I opened it.
Ok it didn't say "Good point, we'll change our minds in view of your letter" but it was forwarded to the relevant minister and hopefully the interest of another MP from the other end of the country will help a little.
In reply to Chris the Tall:
Hi there,
Wrote to my MP, Beverley Hughes about a month ago. After an acknoledgement letter I now received a reply. Bev has talked to the Secretary of State in the Department for Communities and Local Government re the Longstione Edge issue and she replied this.
"Thank you for your letter enclosing one from your constituent[...] who has written about the recent High Court decision in respect of quarrying on Longstone edge. [...]
I have now decided to seek permission to appeal against the High Court's decision in the Court of Appeal.[...]
Should this be denied, Communities and Local Government will explore with other Government departments alternative ways of addressing the issues by quarrying on Longstone Edge"
Dunno if that means much but it's encouraging. So if you haven't done so, an email to your MP through www.writetothem.com may add momentum to the movement.
Cheers
A.-
Hi there,
Wrote to my MP, Beverley Hughes about a month ago. After an acknoledgement letter I now received a reply. Bev has talked to the Secretary of State in the Department for Communities and Local Government re the Longstione Edge issue and she replied this.
"Thank you for your letter enclosing one from your constituent[...] who has written about the recent High Court decision in respect of quarrying on Longstone edge. [...]
I have now decided to seek permission to appeal against the High Court's decision in the Court of Appeal.[...]
Should this be denied, Communities and Local Government will explore with other Government departments alternative ways of addressing the issues by quarrying on Longstone Edge"
Dunno if that means much but it's encouraging. So if you haven't done so, an email to your MP through www.writetothem.com may add momentum to the movement.
Cheers
A.-
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