UKC

Hard Sport Onsights for Katy Whittaker

On Monday 6th July Katy Whittaker onsighted two classic F7c sport routes at Kilnsey Crag, Yorkshire; Dominatrix and Biological Need.

Read more at http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=48284

In reply to UKC News:

great effort....i wonder how many UK 7c's get onsighted regularly by the blokes.

i can usually pick up 1-2 onsight grades on the continent vs the UK, so i hope Katy has the chance to get some more friendly ticks in Spain and France etc.

In reply to UKC News:

Onsighting 7c in the UK is nails.

Nice one katy!

Tommy

In reply to UKC News:

amazing stuff - very inspirational.

In reply to UKC News: Effort! Very impressive work.

Andy F

In reply to UKC News: My first thought was 'doesn't the leather catsuit make climbing difficult?', but then I read the article!

Congrats to Katy, she's climbing at a standard I couldn't even aspire to achive!

In reply to UKC News: Nice one Katy

So who's on the list for female 7c onsights in the UK?

I can think of a few abroad but in the UK and on sight they ain't many.

Lucy C? Fliss?

In reply to Morgan Woods: i was on Biological Need a few weeks back and its no stroll or marathon, hands-off rest affair - way harder than many continental 7cs. if Katy can onsight this id bet a small fortune (if i had one) that an 8a onsight in warmer climes will be forthcoming. superb stuff by Katy!

correction, Bad Bad Boy is 7c (but secretly everyone knows this is 7c+).

In reply to UKC News: awesome, well done, bad boys is defo 7c+ in my book

In reply to ksjs:

Don't know about that, don't think stamina is her strong suit. Whatever, nice one Katy..

In reply to martin heywood: hi Martin, you honestly reckon that if you can onsight these two youd struggle on euro stamina fests at the same or harder grades? if you can onsight these then youve surely got enough in the tank to manage any stamina 7cs. i note however she didnt onsight Bad Bad Boy which is maybe closer to a european style than the 2 Kilnsey routes though i understand Dominatrix is pretty sustained / physical so who knows...

In reply to ksjs: Dominatrix is probably the easiest of the 3, the Biological, then IBaBBB.

Andy F

The news article and several postings imply that 7c in the UK is harder (perhaps by a grade?) than 7c outside the UK. Why is this? Genuinely curious!

In reply to Blue Straggler: cos either we under-grade or the europeans over-grade. my view is the former as there seems to be more consistency in grades across non-UK sport venues regardless of country. with the exception maybe of Siurana which feels more on a par with the UK.

it is though difficult to say however as the styles (UK typically vertical, technical and not that obvious and non-UK typically steep, physical and more obvious) are so different. i would reckon that most sport climbers (ie people who actually sport climb rather than do trad on bolts) will add 1-2 grades to their onsight level when abroad with the daddy of all soft touch spots being Kalymnos.

In reply to ksjs:

>i would reckon that most sport climbers (ie people who actually sport climb rather than do trad on bolts) will add 1-2 grades to their onsight level

Buoux and Ceuse ??

In reply to ksjs:

Thanks. Is there quite a wide consensus that we undergrade then, and if so, are there any plans to address this? Or is a deliberate ploy designed to spank our offshore friends when they come and play on our sport routes?

Anyway, too much digression (sorry all)

Stupendous effort Ms. W.

In reply to andy farnell: i found the moves on Biological Need generally ok but not sure that they lend themselves to onsighting especially if clips arent in / extended. the move at the top of the groove where you go back-handed with right hand was however the exception: hard to read and technical / tricky (for me at least) even when you do know what youre supposed to be doing.

In reply to ksjs:

Yes I think it is very easy to write off places like Rodellar as piss, but my experience of watching many people (particularly Brits, including Katy and Ryan) doesn't bear this out. You could say that short hard routes are easy coz they they only have a few moves and you can train by bouldering...

In reply to Derbyshire Ben: havent been to either but yes, they do have an old-school (read hard) reputation as i guess does the Verdon. but for all these there are many more that conform to my suggestion. i need to get Ceuse, i fear my life may not be complete until ive been....

In reply to Blue Straggler: i get the impression that UK climbers think weve got it right and the Euros are wrong. i guess theres some sort of kudos in knowing that your UK x tick has greater currency than your Spanish x tick. perhaps theres also an element of history in it ie sport climbing developed later in the UK and maybe UK climbers were adjusting to how to apply sport grades to climbs that maybe had trad grades previously and so you get the incorrect benchmark for certain grades. just a thought...

Re: Supposed undergrading in the UK

The style of our routes tend to be more bouldery. Also, quite often the routes are hard to read and don't always have chalk on them. In France/Spain/Greece etc etc, the routes are longer, not as cruxy and therefore may seem easier if your 'fit'

In reply to martin heywood: im not writing anywhere off as piss - i love euro stamina routes and some of the venues are the most beautiful places to be. i just dont see how anyone would struggle on these stamina affairs if theyre onsighting well in the UK. youre right about short routes but typically i think short routes are much less forgiving: you might only get one shot at a move whilst on longer onsights you can often reverse to a rest and check things out of your initial plan doesnt work.

In reply to Adam Lincoln:
Add in an increasing tendency to upgrade routes whose grades had previously remained unchallenged for 15yrs and Yorkshire may soon end up the new Kalymnos.
Katy however is still a wadette, and mad as a fish to boot.
Nice one Katy!

In reply to ksjs:

It all depends on where and how you climb. Many Brits and Scandinavians are great at crimping, many Brits are great at Grit style routes. Many competition climbers are great at stamina routes coz they have amazing stamina.
There are also soft touches and sandbags in most places..

In reply to Serpico:


Fingers crossed, eh?

Just so I can add them to my list whihc routes have recently been upgraded when prehaps they should not have been?

In reply to Serpico: i wasnt aware of this trend, any particularly unworthy upgrades? FWIW Kilnsey probably has some way to go before it can rival Kalymnos (by the way, i dont have a downer on Kalymnos, its truly amazing and there are some routes at their grade but too many are just wrong).

In reply to Tyler:

Andy F's entire logbook

In reply to martin heywood: as a rule id say its easier to have or acquire good stamina than it is to acquire good technique, finger strength or power. does this not slightly devalue euro sport grades? obviously not if you disagree with my suggestion about whats easier.

In reply to Serpico: i'll have a look

In reply to Serpico:

Don't be so mean. The right hand variant he did to Dead Calm isn't far off 8a...

In reply to ksjs:

I think people dismiss these stamina routes as many of the world's strongest climbers onsight them but can't get anywhere near the same onsight level when they go to say Siurana, but this is often because there incredible training regimes are geared to these stamina type of routes. They still had to go through these punishing training schedules to get there...

In reply to martin heywood: im not really talking about the elite. im talking about competent sport climbers most of whom acknowledge that, for whatever reason, euro grades feel easier. you cant argue with the fact that people will typically add a grade or two to their onsight level when abroad, subject to venue. this is more than coincidence surely?

In reply to ksjs:
UK rock is hard to onsight and easy to redpoint which is what makes Katy's ascents impressive.

In reply to ksjs:


Probably because they train a lot before they go (usually at the wall) and OK this style of climbing is suited to onsighting...

In reply to Adam Lincoln:

And nor is the left hand version, which I notice you you the tick for on your log book

Andy F

In reply to Serpico: I've not upgraded anything, I've just taken the grade given. Which may or may not be the true grade, but if it's in the book it's taken.

Andy F

In reply to andy farnell:

That would make the right hand variant 7c then

In reply to andy farnell:
Is it not true that your guidebook is actually a sellotaped together composite of all the best bits of The YMC and Rockfax guides?

In reply to martin heywood: we'll just have to disagree on this one

In reply to Serpico: not sure about the easy to redpoint bit but yes, a very strong effort from Katy.

In reply to Serpico:
...all of which is (in true UKC style) wildly off-topic.
Well done Katy, I was going to suggest The Ashes as a potential onsight, New Dawn is another you should cruise.

In reply to Serpico:

I don't own the YMC guide, it the best bit's of Rockfax 01 and the Northern Limestone guide, if you want to be pedantic

Andy F

In reply to Serpico:

As are Mescalito and Tremelo.

Andy F

In reply to ksjs:

Fair enough :0)

In reply to UKC News: Great effort on the routes Katy! Nice one. Onsighting those two in a day is not easy. Onsighting them both any time is not easy!

Jack

In reply to Jack Geldard - Editor - UKC: Great Effort! Two classic ticks in great style....

In reply to UKC News:

Well done to Katy, was at LPT when she cruised BBB and she made it look pish !

I`m not easily impressed but, this girl is class, keep it up Katey.

mills.

In reply to Jack Geldard - Editor - UKC:

Credit where credits due - top headline Jack ! You should have organised a photo shoot to go with it !!

My personal experience is that both routes are nails - Dominatrix took days and Biological is still unfinished business. A superb day and achievement for Miss Whittaker and a harbinger of much bigger numbers.