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was watching "cliffhanger" yet again tonight with the legendary climber/boxer sly stallone ,cant understand why the "rockjock" didnt take both hands off the tyrylian traverse and he would probably have saved sarah from certain death.not to worry,the fluffy toy survived. can anyone tell me the location of the "tower" in the opening sequence .it looks a cracking adventure climb .regards colin.
In reply to colina:
Pretty much all the climbing was filmed around Cortina in the Dolomities.
Stunt for Sly was the legendary Wolfgang Güllich.
Pretty much all the climbing was filmed around Cortina in the Dolomities.
Stunt for Sly was the legendary Wolfgang Güllich.
In reply to colina:
Can anyone tell me what make of harness she was wearing? Just so that I can avoid ever buying one from them.
Can anyone tell me what make of harness she was wearing? Just so that I can avoid ever buying one from them.
In reply to Trangia:
Argos own make
> (In reply to colina)
>
> Can anyone tell me what make of harness she was wearing? Just so that I can avoid ever buying one from them.
>
> Can anyone tell me what make of harness she was wearing? Just so that I can avoid ever buying one from them.
Argos own make
In reply to colina:
It's been a long time since i've been there but I think it's Cinque Torri in the Dolomites.
It's been a long time since i've been there but I think it's Cinque Torri in the Dolomites.
In reply to Trangia: Black Diamond - apparetly the credits state that the harness was specially modified to fail. At the time Black Diamond (set up by Chouinard I think) were none too happy with the 'harness buckle breaking death fall' scene, as someone had died in real life as a result of not threading the harness belt back through the buckle.
In reply to Marc C:
I agree. If I had been an equipment manufacturer I would have been very unhappy if my product was shown to fail even in a fictional film. Terrible publicity even if the credits stated otherwise (because no-one ever reads those).
I agree. If I had been an equipment manufacturer I would have been very unhappy if my product was shown to fail even in a fictional film. Terrible publicity even if the credits stated otherwise (because no-one ever reads those).
In reply to colina:
I'm sure i heard that black diamond filed a lawsuit originally. maybe the outcome was the smallprint in the credits.
not a failing of the harness anyways.
I'm sure i heard that black diamond filed a lawsuit originally. maybe the outcome was the smallprint in the credits.
not a failing of the harness anyways.
In reply to Marc C:
'Chouinard' became 'Black Diamond' as a result of a buy-out resulting from a law suit that could have closed the company completely based upon that incident I seem to recall. It was argued in court that the company should have ensured that no-one could incorrectly buckle their harness so they devised the two part buckle as a reponse. Must have been galling to watch a film showing their 'new', safer buckle deforming like tin foil!
'Chouinard' became 'Black Diamond' as a result of a buy-out resulting from a law suit that could have closed the company completely based upon that incident I seem to recall. It was argued in court that the company should have ensured that no-one could incorrectly buckle their harness so they devised the two part buckle as a reponse. Must have been galling to watch a film showing their 'new', safer buckle deforming like tin foil!
Does anyone think that anyone watched Cliffhanger and decided to avoid Black Diamond products as a result? I'd have thought that the kind of people who even noticed the brand of the harness at the beginning (and REMEMBERED it at the end of the film, after all the hijacks and hijinks in between) would be geeky climbers who would know that buckles don't deform like that.
When someone's gun jams in a movie shootout, do people think "hmm I'll avoid that brand of weapon"? When a car fails to start in a tense car action scene, and our hero has to, I dunno, nick a skateboard, do people think "I'll avoid that type of car"?
When someone's gun jams in a movie shootout, do people think "hmm I'll avoid that brand of weapon"? When a car fails to start in a tense car action scene, and our hero has to, I dunno, nick a skateboard, do people think "I'll avoid that type of car"?
In reply to Blue Straggler: I'm loathe to buy a Millenium Falcon type spaceship due to the faulty warp drive.
Although I will grant that Han Solo may have invalidated manufacturer's warrant by not getting it serviced at regualr 100000 light year intervals and not using manufacturer's parts.
Although I will grant that Han Solo may have invalidated manufacturer's warrant by not getting it serviced at regualr 100000 light year intervals and not using manufacturer's parts.
In reply to Blue Straggler:
I've stopped buying Hilti after the wanton bolting that went on.
> Does anyone think that anyone watched Cliffhanger and decided to avoid Black Diamond products as a result? I'd have thought that the kind of people who even noticed the brand of the harness at the beginning (and REMEMBERED it at the end of the film, after all the hijacks and hijinks in between) would be geeky climbers who would know that buckles don't deform like that.
>
> When someone's gun jams in a movie shootout, do people think "hmm I'll avoid that brand of weapon"? When a car fails to start in a tense car action scene, and our hero has to, I dunno, nick a skateboard, do people think "I'll avoid that type of car"?
>
> When someone's gun jams in a movie shootout, do people think "hmm I'll avoid that brand of weapon"? When a car fails to start in a tense car action scene, and our hero has to, I dunno, nick a skateboard, do people think "I'll avoid that type of car"?
I've stopped buying Hilti after the wanton bolting that went on.
In reply to Marc C:
Unless I'm very mistaken the harness was a Bod; presumably the modification would have been either replacing or doctoring the buckle so that it lived up to its description - ie buckle! I'm pretty certain, though, that additional sleight-of-hand would have been required to obtain the end result.
For any sort of dangling activity like abseiling or, as in this case, a tyrolean, the standard means of attachment to a Bod - as used, if I recall, in the scene - would be via a locking karabiner clipped through both the buckled belt and the crutch strap/legloop; the latter is a closed loop so, no matter what happens to the buckle, and barring failure of the karabiner or the webbing, it would be impossible for the harness to become detached from the tyrolean rope. In the film, however, I think I'm right in saying that that is exactly what happens. In the final scene before the plummet of doom our short-lived heroine, having fallen out of the harness through buckle failure, is left hanging from it (inevitably!) by one hand, while the harness itself is now only connected to the tyrolean by the slipping buckle on the tail of the belt which is caught in the locking karabiner; the webbing pulls through, and down she goes. But what happened to the crutch strap? It would still have been through the karabiner. Presumably the effect relies for credibility on the assumption that most of the audience are non-climbers unfamiliar with the detail and usage of a particular harness.
> (In reply to Trangia) Black Diamond - apparetly the credits state that the harness was specially modified to fail. At the time Black Diamond (set up by Chouinard I think) were none too happy with the 'harness buckle breaking death fall' scene,
Unless I'm very mistaken the harness was a Bod; presumably the modification would have been either replacing or doctoring the buckle so that it lived up to its description - ie buckle! I'm pretty certain, though, that additional sleight-of-hand would have been required to obtain the end result.
For any sort of dangling activity like abseiling or, as in this case, a tyrolean, the standard means of attachment to a Bod - as used, if I recall, in the scene - would be via a locking karabiner clipped through both the buckled belt and the crutch strap/legloop; the latter is a closed loop so, no matter what happens to the buckle, and barring failure of the karabiner or the webbing, it would be impossible for the harness to become detached from the tyrolean rope. In the film, however, I think I'm right in saying that that is exactly what happens. In the final scene before the plummet of doom our short-lived heroine, having fallen out of the harness through buckle failure, is left hanging from it (inevitably!) by one hand, while the harness itself is now only connected to the tyrolean by the slipping buckle on the tail of the belt which is caught in the locking karabiner; the webbing pulls through, and down she goes. But what happened to the crutch strap? It would still have been through the karabiner. Presumably the effect relies for credibility on the assumption that most of the audience are non-climbers unfamiliar with the detail and usage of a particular harness.
In reply to HeMa:
I heard that Wolfgang was allegedly asked to take steroids to beef himself up to look moore like Sly
> (In reply to colina)
>
> Pretty much all the climbing was filmed around Cortina in the Dolomities.
>
> Stunt for Sly was the legendary Wolfgang Güllich.
>
> Pretty much all the climbing was filmed around Cortina in the Dolomities.
>
> Stunt for Sly was the legendary Wolfgang Güllich.
I heard that Wolfgang was allegedly asked to take steroids to beef himself up to look moore like Sly
In reply to Hat Dude:
That's a true story. He came under a lot of pressure from the Director and stunt coordinator but refused point blank. To give Stallone some credit he backed Wolfgang all the way.
That's a true story. He came under a lot of pressure from the Director and stunt coordinator but refused point blank. To give Stallone some credit he backed Wolfgang all the way.
In reply to pabbage:
Filmed on Monte Cristalo above Cortina.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.php?id=35736
Filmed on Monte Cristalo above Cortina.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.php?id=35736
In reply to colina:
You should read 'High Exposure' by David Breashears. He is a climber and film maker and worked on Cliffhanger. There's a bit about working on the film in his book and also description of how dangerous the stunts were.
Very interesting stuff. The film is (loosly) based on the story of a plane which crashed in Yosemite in the 70s which was full of marijuana which a load of local climbers 'salvaged' and sold on.
You should read 'High Exposure' by David Breashears. He is a climber and film maker and worked on Cliffhanger. There's a bit about working on the film in his book and also description of how dangerous the stunts were.
Very interesting stuff. The film is (loosly) based on the story of a plane which crashed in Yosemite in the 70s which was full of marijuana which a load of local climbers 'salvaged' and sold on.
In reply to HeMa:
Two stunt doubles - Gullich and Mark De Alessandro.
> (In reply to colina)
>
> Pretty much all the climbing was filmed around Cortina in the Dolomities.
>
> Stunt for Sly was the legendary Wolfgang Güllich.
>
> Pretty much all the climbing was filmed around Cortina in the Dolomities.
>
> Stunt for Sly was the legendary Wolfgang Güllich.
Two stunt doubles - Gullich and Mark De Alessandro.
In reply to MelH:
Right. "Rock Jocks, Wall Rats and Hang Dogs" by John Long has a very funny account of the original story, along with some other great tall tales:
"Gene found a little black book with Italian names throughout. He burned it on the spot . . . The [aircraft's] fuel cells had burst on impact, and some of the weed was drenched in aviation gas. If you couldn't smell it, you'd find out the second you stoked a pipeful, when a flame like a blowtorch would leap off the hooch."
>
> Very interesting stuff. The film is (loosly) based on the story of a plane which crashed in Yosemite in the 70s which was full of marijuana which a load of local climbers 'salvaged' and sold on.
> Very interesting stuff. The film is (loosly) based on the story of a plane which crashed in Yosemite in the 70s which was full of marijuana which a load of local climbers 'salvaged' and sold on.
Right. "Rock Jocks, Wall Rats and Hang Dogs" by John Long has a very funny account of the original story, along with some other great tall tales:
"Gene found a little black book with Italian names throughout. He burned it on the spot . . . The [aircraft's] fuel cells had burst on impact, and some of the weed was drenched in aviation gas. If you couldn't smell it, you'd find out the second you stoked a pipeful, when a flame like a blowtorch would leap off the hooch."
In reply to colina: There are sections all over the dolomites - even from one shot to the next. Some is on the Marmolada, some on the Sella, some round cortina...
In reply to colina:
With regards to that film, though I'm not doubting that it's very entertaining, but what was the need to solo up the tower? What did Sly do, that was so technically brilliant, the other mountain rescuer (with the dodgey knee) couldn't have done without Sly having to risk his life to get there. He only hammered a peg into the ground and clipped the cable to it for crying out loud.
With regards to that film, though I'm not doubting that it's very entertaining, but what was the need to solo up the tower? What did Sly do, that was so technically brilliant, the other mountain rescuer (with the dodgey knee) couldn't have done without Sly having to risk his life to get there. He only hammered a peg into the ground and clipped the cable to it for crying out loud.
In reply to Ian Parsons:
TOO much time to think about that one!!
> For any sort of dangling activity like abseiling or, as in this case, a tyrolean, the standard means of attachment to a Bod - as used, if I recall, in the scene - would be via a locking karabiner clipped through both the buckled belt and the crutch strap/legloop; the latter is a closed loop so, no matter what happens to the buckle, and barring failure of the karabiner or the webbing, it would be impossible for the harness to become detached from the tyrolean rope. In the film, however, I think I'm right in saying that that is exactly what happens. In the final scene before the plummet of doom our short-lived heroine, having fallen out of the harness through buckle failure, is left hanging from it (inevitably!) by one hand, while the harness itself is now only connected to the tyrolean by the slipping buckle on the tail of the belt which is caught in the locking karabiner; the webbing pulls through, and down she goes. But what happened to the crutch strap? It would still have been through the karabiner. Presumably the effect relies for credibility on the assumption that most of the audience are non-climbers unfamiliar with the detail and usage of a particular harness.
TOO much time to think about that one!!
In reply to Ian Parsons:
the harness was a black diamond bod as others have stated. it doesn't have full strength closed leg loops. The straps closing the leg loops go through non load bearing plastic buckles so if the belt buckle failed you would part company with the harness.
the belt buckle on a bod is about the largest out there and rumour I was told at the time was that even the doctored buckle wouldn't fail so a fake soft buckle had to be made.
the harness was a black diamond bod as others have stated. it doesn't have full strength closed leg loops. The straps closing the leg loops go through non load bearing plastic buckles so if the belt buckle failed you would part company with the harness.
the belt buckle on a bod is about the largest out there and rumour I was told at the time was that even the doctored buckle wouldn't fail so a fake soft buckle had to be made.
In reply to L.J. Fallows:
That's the best bit of the film, he actually attached the helicopter, via a steel cable, to the mountain!!!!!
> (In reply to colina)
>
> He only hammered a peg into the ground and clipped the cable to it for crying out loud.
>
> He only hammered a peg into the ground and clipped the cable to it for crying out loud.
That's the best bit of the film, he actually attached the helicopter, via a steel cable, to the mountain!!!!!
In reply to colina: yes it was a good days filming that, he wanted me to let him have a go but his agent wasnt up for it hehe ....................
In reply to colina: some great replies there,the dolomites seems to be favourite.Im off to Blacks this weekend to buy one of those hilti bolt guns that Sly uses,Ideal for the Llanberrs pass.Cenotaph Corner here i come.
In reply to erikb56:
Yes - the last bit is what I wrote: "having fallen out of the harness through buckle failure..."; I would include dangling from it by one hand as having "parted company"! My point was that the harness itself, while no longer attached to the climber, would still be attached to the tyrolean rope - regardless of buckle condition - via the karabiner clipped through the legloop strap which, contrary to your view, is most definitely a closed loop; ie no matter what happens to the two lightweight positioning straps or the ladderlock buckles through which they pass, a karabiner clipped through the legloop strap can only be removed by unclipping it. I assume when saying it lacks full strength closed legloops that you're referring to the basic difference in design between the "diaper"-type Bod and the more conventional twin-legloop-plus-belt harness. The (heavy duty) ladderlock buckles, although normally only required to perform a positioning function, are actually remarkably strong - quite possibly strong enough to hold the legloops together on their own - and certainly wouldn't slip apart as easily as they did in the film.
> (In reply to Ian Parsons)
> the harness was a black diamond bod as others have stated. it doesn't have full strength closed leg loops. The straps closing the leg loops go through non load bearing plastic buckles so if the belt buckle failed you would part company with the harness.
> the harness was a black diamond bod as others have stated. it doesn't have full strength closed leg loops. The straps closing the leg loops go through non load bearing plastic buckles so if the belt buckle failed you would part company with the harness.
Yes - the last bit is what I wrote: "having fallen out of the harness through buckle failure..."; I would include dangling from it by one hand as having "parted company"! My point was that the harness itself, while no longer attached to the climber, would still be attached to the tyrolean rope - regardless of buckle condition - via the karabiner clipped through the legloop strap which, contrary to your view, is most definitely a closed loop; ie no matter what happens to the two lightweight positioning straps or the ladderlock buckles through which they pass, a karabiner clipped through the legloop strap can only be removed by unclipping it. I assume when saying it lacks full strength closed legloops that you're referring to the basic difference in design between the "diaper"-type Bod and the more conventional twin-legloop-plus-belt harness. The (heavy duty) ladderlock buckles, although normally only required to perform a positioning function, are actually remarkably strong - quite possibly strong enough to hold the legloops together on their own - and certainly wouldn't slip apart as easily as they did in the film.
it's not real you know, just hollywood make believe
In reply to stevev: hey it was real enough for me lol wearing that black wig whilst climbing was a nightmare hehe
In reply to L.J. Fallows:
ive got it on good authority that Hal didnt have a peg with him,he'd left it in his rucksack,so Gabe had no choice but to climb up single handed to rescue his buddy.Cant understand why everyone blamed Gabe for her demise though.i reckon Hal was to blame ,he only took her up there to impress her in the hope of getting sex back at the lodge.mind you when Gabe uttered the words "youre not gonna die" he got that one wrong.
> (In reply to colina)
>
> With regards to that film, though I'm not doubting that it's very entertaining, but what was the need to solo up the tower? What did Sly do, that was so technically brilliant, the other mountain rescuer (with the dodgey knee) couldn't have done without Sly having to risk his life to get there. He only hammered a peg into the ground and clipped the cable to it for crying out loud.
>
> With regards to that film, though I'm not doubting that it's very entertaining, but what was the need to solo up the tower? What did Sly do, that was so technically brilliant, the other mountain rescuer (with the dodgey knee) couldn't have done without Sly having to risk his life to get there. He only hammered a peg into the ground and clipped the cable to it for crying out loud.
ive got it on good authority that Hal didnt have a peg with him,he'd left it in his rucksack,so Gabe had no choice but to climb up single handed to rescue his buddy.Cant understand why everyone blamed Gabe for her demise though.i reckon Hal was to blame ,he only took her up there to impress her in the hope of getting sex back at the lodge.mind you when Gabe uttered the words "youre not gonna die" he got that one wrong.
In reply to colina: In the credits it actually says the Black Diamond specially modified the Harness, so that it would actually fail.
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