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...i wish someone had told me that.....
In reply to nightmonkeyuk: ...the ellipsis is overused in internet chat rooms
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
...you don't have to spend a thousand pounds on expensive equipment.
...you don't have to spend a thousand pounds on expensive equipment.
In reply to Only a hill:
...or make life difficult for yourself by using gear that everyone realised wasn't very good 50 years ago. (see Alex's blog if you don't understand this).
...camping before climbing makes life much harder.
...Grade II gullies are quite often much less safe than grade II ridges.
...some climbers consider a large German sitting in a hole constitutes a 'belay'.
> ...you don't have to spend a thousand pounds on expensive equipment.
...or make life difficult for yourself by using gear that everyone realised wasn't very good 50 years ago. (see Alex's blog if you don't understand this).
...camping before climbing makes life much harder.
...Grade II gullies are quite often much less safe than grade II ridges.
...some climbers consider a large German sitting in a hole constitutes a 'belay'.
In reply to TobyA:
>...or make life difficult for yourself by using gear that everyone realised >wasn't very good 50 years ago. (see Alex's blog if you don't understand >this).
Link please?
>...or make life difficult for yourself by using gear that everyone realised >wasn't very good 50 years ago. (see Alex's blog if you don't understand >this).
Link please?
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
...under no circumstances should I allow my headtorch out of my sight. 9/10 benightments are caused by the head torch pixies, they will use voodoo on you if you don't continually praise them by carrying your head torch. The voodoo causes you to get lost and realise that your map of the Nevis Range is no use in the Lake District.
...get your boot/sock/lacing system sorted before spending a day in the hills in winter. I've been told that you could hear the swearing from the adjacent gondola as I came of Aonoch Mor and the blood got back to my toes.
...under no circumstances should I allow my headtorch out of my sight. 9/10 benightments are caused by the head torch pixies, they will use voodoo on you if you don't continually praise them by carrying your head torch. The voodoo causes you to get lost and realise that your map of the Nevis Range is no use in the Lake District.
...get your boot/sock/lacing system sorted before spending a day in the hills in winter. I've been told that you could hear the swearing from the adjacent gondola as I came of Aonoch Mor and the blood got back to my toes.
In reply to TobyA:
I do note the smiley, but of the climbers I've spoken to about this subject, people either 'get' it or they don't. It's not about making life difficult for yourself, it's about seeing the mountains in the same way the pioneers did, putting challenge and interest back into easy routes, and considering alternatives to the expensive mass-market specialist equipment that is ubiquitous nowadays.
> (In reply to Only a hill)
>
> [...]
>
> ...or make life difficult for yourself by using gear that everyone realised wasn't very good 50 years ago. (see Alex's blog if you don't understand this).
>
> [...]
>
> ...or make life difficult for yourself by using gear that everyone realised wasn't very good 50 years ago. (see Alex's blog if you don't understand this).
I do note the smiley, but of the climbers I've spoken to about this subject, people either 'get' it or they don't. It's not about making life difficult for yourself, it's about seeing the mountains in the same way the pioneers did, putting challenge and interest back into easy routes, and considering alternatives to the expensive mass-market specialist equipment that is ubiquitous nowadays.
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
sometimes there's not enough snow during Scottish winters!
sometimes there's not enough snow during Scottish winters!
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
1) drinking you own bodyweight in Fromblers Old Bastard at the Clachaig the night before can impair judgement and getty outty beddy
2) Being photographed on the Ben wearing day glow Koflachs 3 sizes too big, a women's pink and lilac Goretex and a pony tail will come back to haunt you. My girlfriend looking at said photo last week said I looked like a really ugly woman (which makes a change as she says I normally look like a really ugly bloke)
3) Russian ice screws might be cheap but they bend like Clegg in a cabinet meeting
4) Full bumflap salopettes are de rigeur when you need a poo halfway up the Orion
5) The holes in the seating at Chevy's were useful for holding pint glasses
6) Before boarding down the head wall on the Gorm, ensure there are no Uni climbers on the way up it....
7) No matter how much it has been snowing for the previous 9 days, followed by perfect freeze thaw, it will be frikkin pishing it down as soon as you head across Rannoch Moor and you WILL spend 3 days living off a traditional Scottish diet of tatties and thus retreat back to the home counties with an empty wallet and scurvy
8) Save money on the Funicular by being blown UP the White Lady (it will of course, be raining atthe time)
10) Scottish climbers may come across as weather beaten, grumbly, parochial and prone to being curt with mincing Saasenachs, but in reality, they are weatherbeaten, parochial and prone to being curt with mincing Sassenachs
11) When sleeping in the boot of your car outside the Clach, ensure you also bring your doss bag. A tartan dog blanket is no substitute, nor is spooning Anne Goudie.
12) Camp Hypercouloirs have a securing grub crew in the axe head to stop the picks wobbling. It is useful to discover this sooner rather than 15 years later, as you put them above the fireplace as display items.
13) People on UKC love repeated posts asking "is Elliot's in yet"?
14) Never, ever everer engage the owner of the Dead Squirrel campsite in a conversation about organic phosphates and sheep dip
1) drinking you own bodyweight in Fromblers Old Bastard at the Clachaig the night before can impair judgement and getty outty beddy
2) Being photographed on the Ben wearing day glow Koflachs 3 sizes too big, a women's pink and lilac Goretex and a pony tail will come back to haunt you. My girlfriend looking at said photo last week said I looked like a really ugly woman (which makes a change as she says I normally look like a really ugly bloke)
3) Russian ice screws might be cheap but they bend like Clegg in a cabinet meeting
4) Full bumflap salopettes are de rigeur when you need a poo halfway up the Orion
5) The holes in the seating at Chevy's were useful for holding pint glasses
6) Before boarding down the head wall on the Gorm, ensure there are no Uni climbers on the way up it....
7) No matter how much it has been snowing for the previous 9 days, followed by perfect freeze thaw, it will be frikkin pishing it down as soon as you head across Rannoch Moor and you WILL spend 3 days living off a traditional Scottish diet of tatties and thus retreat back to the home counties with an empty wallet and scurvy
8) Save money on the Funicular by being blown UP the White Lady (it will of course, be raining atthe time)
10) Scottish climbers may come across as weather beaten, grumbly, parochial and prone to being curt with mincing Saasenachs, but in reality, they are weatherbeaten, parochial and prone to being curt with mincing Sassenachs
11) When sleeping in the boot of your car outside the Clach, ensure you also bring your doss bag. A tartan dog blanket is no substitute, nor is spooning Anne Goudie.
12) Camp Hypercouloirs have a securing grub crew in the axe head to stop the picks wobbling. It is useful to discover this sooner rather than 15 years later, as you put them above the fireplace as display items.
13) People on UKC love repeated posts asking "is Elliot's in yet"?
14) Never, ever everer engage the owner of the Dead Squirrel campsite in a conversation about organic phosphates and sheep dip
In reply to nightmonkeyuk: you shouldn't listen to what anyone tells you on the Internet.
In reply to nightmonkeyuk: guidebook descriptions are vague for a good reason.
In reply to Only a hill:
Chalk me up in the 'don't really get it' column although I have absolutely no problem with others doing what they want.
Quite similar to how they look now just a bit colder and more miserable? Again -
Alternatively you could just try harder ones?
Ok, I've considered it. And on consideration I rather like my Vipers, Goretex pro-shell and DAS Parka.
Have fun!
Chalk me up in the 'don't really get it' column although I have absolutely no problem with others doing what they want.
> it's about seeing the mountains in the same way the pioneers did,
Quite similar to how they look now just a bit colder and more miserable? Again -
> putting challenge and interest back into easy routes,
Alternatively you could just try harder ones?
> and considering alternatives to the expensive mass-market specialist equipment that is ubiquitous nowadays.
Ok, I've considered it. And on consideration I rather like my Vipers, Goretex pro-shell and DAS Parka.
Have fun!
In reply to John Rushby:
1) drinking you own bodyweight in Fromblers Old Bastard at the Clachaig the night before can impair judgement and getty outty beddy
11) When sleeping in the boot of your car outside the Clach, ensure you also bring your doss bag. A tartan dog blanket is no substitute, nor is spooning Anne Goudie.
Some awful advice here, you should be ashamed of yourself.
1) Us 'high performance climbers' know the importance of 'Carb loading' when training for peak performance. There is no finer preparation for a day in the hills than having N+1 beers the night before. Where N is defined as the point where your climbing partner looks attractive and walking becomes a problem.
11) When bivvying you need to remember the maxim "Build a man a fire and he is warm for a night, set a man on fire and he is warm for the rest of his life" this is one of the great advantage of climbing as a 3. Burn the first person to shiver.
1) drinking you own bodyweight in Fromblers Old Bastard at the Clachaig the night before can impair judgement and getty outty beddy
11) When sleeping in the boot of your car outside the Clach, ensure you also bring your doss bag. A tartan dog blanket is no substitute, nor is spooning Anne Goudie.
Some awful advice here, you should be ashamed of yourself.
1) Us 'high performance climbers' know the importance of 'Carb loading' when training for peak performance. There is no finer preparation for a day in the hills than having N+1 beers the night before. Where N is defined as the point where your climbing partner looks attractive and walking becomes a problem.
11) When bivvying you need to remember the maxim "Build a man a fire and he is warm for a night, set a man on fire and he is warm for the rest of his life" this is one of the great advantage of climbing as a 3. Burn the first person to shiver.
In reply to Reach>Talent:
Someone should have told you that the term "Nevis Range" is an abomination, invented by the parasitic commercial interests of the ski industry to help extract more money from the ignorant masses by linking their now vandalised mountain with another one which the ignorant masses have actually heard of.
> ......that your map of the Nevis Range is no use.....
Someone should have told you that the term "Nevis Range" is an abomination, invented by the parasitic commercial interests of the ski industry to help extract more money from the ignorant masses by linking their now vandalised mountain with another one which the ignorant masses have actually heard of.
In reply to Robert Durran:
Woohoo hooked one
Woohoo hooked one
In reply to Reach>Talent:
Intentionally? (be honest!)
> (In reply to Robert Durran)
> Woohoo hooked one
> Woohoo hooked one
Intentionally? (be honest!)
In reply to Robert Durran:
No, I'd love to claim it was intentional. I'm not a fan of the term 'Nevis Range' and picked it for the 'bumbly outdoor punter' factor but I wasn't actively trolling
No, I'd love to claim it was intentional. I'm not a fan of the term 'Nevis Range' and picked it for the 'bumbly outdoor punter' factor but I wasn't actively trolling
In reply to TobyA
BTW do you want to go winter climbing over xmas sometime?
>
> Ok, I've considered it. And on consideration I rather like my Vipers, Goretex pro-shell and DAS Parka.
>
isn't that because you're a self confessed gear freak?> Ok, I've considered it. And on consideration I rather like my Vipers, Goretex pro-shell and DAS Parka.
>
BTW do you want to go winter climbing over xmas sometime?
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
No matter how short the pitch, your second/leader will NOT be able to hear you, no matter how loud you shout.
To combat this, develop an intricate system of "morse code" style rope tugs! (Stick it in the belay device and take in till they are winched up the pitch and begin to realise that they maybe should be climbing).
Pete
No matter how short the pitch, your second/leader will NOT be able to hear you, no matter how loud you shout.
To combat this, develop an intricate system of "morse code" style rope tugs! (Stick it in the belay device and take in till they are winched up the pitch and begin to realise that they maybe should be climbing).
Pete
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
Try to 'let the dog out' before your get into the coire.
If the brown dog is barking on the drive up the road, stop at the swingers' bogs in Tyndrum and release the chocolate hostages in relative comfort.
Try to 'let the dog out' before your get into the coire.
If the brown dog is barking on the drive up the road, stop at the swingers' bogs in Tyndrum and release the chocolate hostages in relative comfort.
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
If you're aware of crosswinds on the drive up the A9, you will not be able to stand up on the walk into the Northern Corries.
If you're aware of crosswinds on the drive up the A9, you will not be able to stand up on the walk into the Northern Corries.
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
One for absolute beginners like me:
You should always get right up to the bottom of your route before deciding you're too scared.
Then think to yourself how much less steep it looks up close and you've not come all this way just to turn around.
Then think how the first section looks quite do-able and you now can't really see the crux section, but it must be more of the same.
Then get to the crux section thinking how hard and scary it looks and that's what crux must mean, but the do-able first part now doesn't look so do-able in reverse.
Check-mate.
Only Yazz and the Plastic Population can help you now...
Later on, in the pub of course, think to yourself how you conquered the mountain so bravely, forgetting, in fact, that the mountain tricked you into it.
One for absolute beginners like me:
You should always get right up to the bottom of your route before deciding you're too scared.
Then think to yourself how much less steep it looks up close and you've not come all this way just to turn around.
Then think how the first section looks quite do-able and you now can't really see the crux section, but it must be more of the same.
Then get to the crux section thinking how hard and scary it looks and that's what crux must mean, but the do-able first part now doesn't look so do-able in reverse.
Check-mate.
Only Yazz and the Plastic Population can help you now...
Later on, in the pub of course, think to yourself how you conquered the mountain so bravely, forgetting, in fact, that the mountain tricked you into it.
In reply to Reach>Talent:
I'm not sure I understand your point about the map though. All maps have North at the top, so as long as the writing is the right way up you're facing North. You must then consider which way you want to go. Walking to the left like an Egyptian will get you off the top of Ben Nevis, though possibly by an unnecessarily quick route.
> (In reply to nightmonkeyuk)
> ...under no circumstances should I allow my headtorch out of my sight. 9/10 benightments are caused by the head torch pixies, they will use voodoo on you if you don't continually praise them by carrying your head torch. The voodoo causes you to get lost and realise that your map of the Nevis Range is no use in the Lake District.
>
The headtorch thing is easily solved. Modern LED torches have a long enough battery life that you can put it on switched on when you leave the house on Friday, and leave it there till you get into work on Monday.> ...under no circumstances should I allow my headtorch out of my sight. 9/10 benightments are caused by the head torch pixies, they will use voodoo on you if you don't continually praise them by carrying your head torch. The voodoo causes you to get lost and realise that your map of the Nevis Range is no use in the Lake District.
>
I'm not sure I understand your point about the map though. All maps have North at the top, so as long as the writing is the right way up you're facing North. You must then consider which way you want to go. Walking to the left like an Egyptian will get you off the top of Ben Nevis, though possibly by an unnecessarily quick route.
Is anyone else getting dejavu??
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
The day before I arrive in Scotland, it will have started raining. All the ice will have been washed away, making a mockery of the 10-hour drive and use of precious annual leave. The locals will all rave about the fantastic conditions the previous week. A week in Scotland, in the rain, is sh*t. Go to Rjukan or the Alps...
The day before I arrive in Scotland, it will have started raining. All the ice will have been washed away, making a mockery of the 10-hour drive and use of precious annual leave. The locals will all rave about the fantastic conditions the previous week. A week in Scotland, in the rain, is sh*t. Go to Rjukan or the Alps...
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
Pain is my freind,Pain is my freind ,Pain is my freind ,Pain is my freind
repeat after me
,Pain is my freind ,Pain is my freind ,Pain is my freind ,Pain is my freind
repeat after me
brixton climber
> ...i wish someone had told me that.....
dear nightPain is my freind,Pain is my freind ,Pain is my freind ,Pain is my freind
repeat after me
,Pain is my freind ,Pain is my freind ,Pain is my freind ,Pain is my freind
repeat after me
brixton climber
In reply to John Rushby:
Quality!
I would add:
14) There are no women in the clachaig.
15)There are no women in any of the pubs in Lochaber.
16) You will never give up the false hope that there will be some 'up for it' women in the clachaig.
17) When in the clachaig with your woman you will wish you were there with your mates.
18) fancy bent/curved/sharp/shiny axes are crap....get some mountain tech mountaineering axes for 90% of all routes.
19) Ice axe self arrest doesn't work.
20) Your best mate will be a complete pain to you after a week of aborted climbs and nightly skin-fulls of 'old shagger bitter'. (refer to 17...you will wish you were there with your woman).
21) The north face car park is a cess-pit everywhere there is grass.
22) 'When i did my first scottish winter season' will be addictive and after one decent day you will be going back forever and will be dragging your kids there one day boring them with tales of your exploits.
> (In reply to nightmonkeyuk)
>
> 1) drinking you own bodyweight in Fromblers Old Bastard at the Clachaig the night before can impair judgement and getty outty beddy
>
> 2) Being photographed on the Ben wearing day glow Koflachs 3 sizes too big, a women's pink and lilac Goretex and a pony tail will come back to haunt you. My girlfriend looking at said photo last week said I looked like a really ugly woman (which makes a change as she says I normally look like a really ugly bloke)
>
> 3) Russian ice screws might be cheap but they bend like Clegg in a cabinet meeting.
>
> 7) No matter how much it has been snowing for the previous 9 days, followed by perfect freeze thaw, it will be frikkin pishing it down as soon as you head across Rannoch Moor and you WILL spend 3 days living off a traditional Scottish diet of tatties and thus retreat back to the home counties with an empty wallet and scurvy
>
> 10) Scottish climbers may come across as weather beaten, grumbly, parochial and prone to being curt with mincing Saasenachs, but in reality, they are weatherbeaten, parochial and prone to being curt with mincing Sassenachs
>
> 13) People on UKC love repeated posts asking "is Elliot's in yet"?
>
>
>
> 1) drinking you own bodyweight in Fromblers Old Bastard at the Clachaig the night before can impair judgement and getty outty beddy
>
> 2) Being photographed on the Ben wearing day glow Koflachs 3 sizes too big, a women's pink and lilac Goretex and a pony tail will come back to haunt you. My girlfriend looking at said photo last week said I looked like a really ugly woman (which makes a change as she says I normally look like a really ugly bloke)
>
> 3) Russian ice screws might be cheap but they bend like Clegg in a cabinet meeting.
>
> 7) No matter how much it has been snowing for the previous 9 days, followed by perfect freeze thaw, it will be frikkin pishing it down as soon as you head across Rannoch Moor and you WILL spend 3 days living off a traditional Scottish diet of tatties and thus retreat back to the home counties with an empty wallet and scurvy
>
> 10) Scottish climbers may come across as weather beaten, grumbly, parochial and prone to being curt with mincing Saasenachs, but in reality, they are weatherbeaten, parochial and prone to being curt with mincing Sassenachs
>
> 13) People on UKC love repeated posts asking "is Elliot's in yet"?
>
>
Quality!
I would add:
14) There are no women in the clachaig.
15)There are no women in any of the pubs in Lochaber.
16) You will never give up the false hope that there will be some 'up for it' women in the clachaig.
17) When in the clachaig with your woman you will wish you were there with your mates.
18) fancy bent/curved/sharp/shiny axes are crap....get some mountain tech mountaineering axes for 90% of all routes.
19) Ice axe self arrest doesn't work.
20) Your best mate will be a complete pain to you after a week of aborted climbs and nightly skin-fulls of 'old shagger bitter'. (refer to 17...you will wish you were there with your woman).
21) The north face car park is a cess-pit everywhere there is grass.
22) 'When i did my first scottish winter season' will be addictive and after one decent day you will be going back forever and will be dragging your kids there one day boring them with tales of your exploits.
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
Fitness can help towards safety, with regards to having enough in reserve for keeping it together mentally.
I've not had a winter Scottish season yet, but it seemed true in the snow in the Lakes last year.
Cheers
Tim
Fitness can help towards safety, with regards to having enough in reserve for keeping it together mentally.
I've not had a winter Scottish season yet, but it seemed true in the snow in the Lakes last year.
Cheers
Tim
In reply to Timmd:
From feeling a bit like I didn't have much in reserve.
Tim
> (In reply to nightmonkeyuk)
>
> Fitness can help towards safety, with regards to having enough in reserve for keeping it together mentally.
>
> I've not had a winter Scottish season yet, but it seemed true in the snow in the Lakes last year.
>
> Cheers
> Tim
>
> Fitness can help towards safety, with regards to having enough in reserve for keeping it together mentally.
>
> I've not had a winter Scottish season yet, but it seemed true in the snow in the Lakes last year.
>
> Cheers
> Tim
From feeling a bit like I didn't have much in reserve.
Tim
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
It is infinitely better and easier to put on your harness, crampons, gear up and have the rope accessible on the level flat ground at the bottom of the coire rather than the steep, dodgy, loose, trip-while-trying-to-get-a-cramponed boot-through-a-harness-leg-loop-and-you-may-die, tiny ledge at the bottom of (if not some way up..) your chosen route, however no-where near as much fun
It is infinitely better and easier to put on your harness, crampons, gear up and have the rope accessible on the level flat ground at the bottom of the coire rather than the steep, dodgy, loose, trip-while-trying-to-get-a-cramponed boot-through-a-harness-leg-loop-and-you-may-die, tiny ledge at the bottom of (if not some way up..) your chosen route, however no-where near as much fun
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
winter sacks are twice as heavy
winter climbing takes twice as long
you are not fit enough for this S***T
clipper leashes dont work with frozen gloves(gloves that are frozen are also rather crap)
you will suffer and you might not like it.... but you will love it
at some point!
PS you will not go blind, your eyes are just freezing shut
winter sacks are twice as heavy
winter climbing takes twice as long
you are not fit enough for this S***T
clipper leashes dont work with frozen gloves(gloves that are frozen are also rather crap)
you will suffer and you might not like it.... but you will love it
at some point!
PS you will not go blind, your eyes are just freezing shut
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
The experience goes something like this:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=276395&v=1#x4093194
The experience goes something like this:
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=276395&v=1#x4093194
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
Anything up to Grade IV really isn't that hard and there's no need to be intimidated.
Anything up to Grade IV really isn't that hard and there's no need to be intimidated.
In reply to Wee Davie: and IVs are usually safer that IIs and IIIs
It gets dark really early in November!
It gets dark really early in November!
In reply to nightmonkeyuk: It's always worth carrying a doob in a waterproof container as it might be nice when you top out.
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
the internet would lead to brainless sheeplike hordes arriveing at the bottom of any route rumoured to be "in condition" rather than using a weather forecast and thinking for themselves
> ...i wish someone had told me that.....
the internet would lead to brainless sheeplike hordes arriveing at the bottom of any route rumoured to be "in condition" rather than using a weather forecast and thinking for themselves
In reply to TobyA:
Au contraire! Camping beside or in the car means at least two more hours in bed!
> ...camping before climbing makes life much harder.
Au contraire! Camping beside or in the car means at least two more hours in bed!
In reply to Horse: Avoid flogging up steep snow slopes behind someone nearly 2 feet taller than you, kicking 3 additional steps to their 1 means you might aswell break trail in the first place!
Beware the brick hard "food" in the bottom of your sack/pocket. A moments negligence can mean a lifetime of broken teeth.
Beware the brick hard "food" in the bottom of your sack/pocket. A moments negligence can mean a lifetime of broken teeth.
In reply to nightmonkeyuk:
doing a few winter climbs in Scotland is not the same as mountaineering in the Alps.
> ...i wish someone had told me that.....
doing a few winter climbs in Scotland is not the same as mountaineering in the Alps.
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Winter Conditions
This Winter Conditions page gives a summary of what is being climbed at the moment, what is 'in' nick and what the prospects are...
25 Apr
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