UKC

Hi!

So, I'm luckilly getting to move from Scotland to New Zealand for a year or so, and was trying to do some kit buying in advance. Only thing is I'm struggling to find much info on the ranges of weather you'd get in the southern alps to plan kit. I'm guessing that they'd be pretty similar to the European alps-being a little bit less tall, but possibly a bit less protected from the pacific winds?

Anyone got any experience or suggestions of useful resources about it?

Thanks!

In reply to ged3000: Ask Kiwi Princess, she's based in Q'town; I'm based in Wanaka, which is pretty similar with a few local variations depending on wind direction.

For weather info try http://metservice.com/mountain/index

Best description, probably, is Scottish weather on alpine mountains with Himalayan approaches. Weather is changeable and bad weather can come in really quickly - however, the forecast service is good.

In reply to ged3000:

I'd say you get the full range to be honest, can be very hot in South Island NZ in the summer to very cold during the winter. If you're used to planning for Scotland, you should be OK. It's a maritime climate, so you can get good and bad weather any time of the year; you want a big high sat over the Tasman Sea and you should be in for some decent weather.

Cheers,
Tom

In reply to ged3000:

I lived in New Zealand for a couple of years. Wonderful experience, you are very lucky! Climbed several times in Southern Alps and elsewhere. Agree with previous reply. Scottish weather in Alpine setting and often Himalayan scale. Much more serious, in my opinion, than European Alps. Very strong and extensive storms can come in and the peaks, though smaller than European Alps, feel more remote. They do sell kit out there, some of which is excellent. 'Peaks of New Zealand' ( I think it is called ) is a great information source.
Mt Aspiring is an awesome peak!

In reply to ged3000:

Having visited New Zealand and also climbed Mt Aspiring I can confirm it is a wonderful mountain. I'd also agree with the other posts about the weather, I found it to be broadly similar to what we have in Scotland...i.e. changeable maritime weather.

The only thing I'd say about kit is I found it to be very expensive in New Zealand!! The NZ dollar doesn't go very far with the likes of Scarpa etc Even the icebreaker stuff wasn't cheap...Don't go expecting the sort of bargains you get here - or at least that was my experience. I'd buy as much as you can before you head out.

In reply to davidrjack1: I'd draw a distinction here - BD kit is not too dissimilar to the same RRP as in the UK, price up a BD Viper at $369 or £185 compared to £169 (RRP Joe Brown); however, anything from Europe - Grivel, for example - is far pricier. Check out the online site for Mainly Tramping http://mainlytramping.com/ or R & R Sports http://www.rrsport.co.nz/ or Outside Sports http://www.outsidesports.co.nz/Gear.htm for UK:NZ comparisons.

What has made a huge difference is the poor exchange rate of the £:NZ$. Anyone expecting the sort of spending power of a few years ago at £1:NZ$3 will be disappointed at £1:NZ$2.

If you're looking for cheap Icebreaker, look at:-

Icebreaker Outlet Stores
Icebreaker Outlet Otaki

203 Main Highway

Otaki City: Wellington
Country: New Zealand
Phone: 06-364-0290

Website: http://www.icebreaker.com

Store hours: Open 7 days: Mon - Sat 9am-5pm; Sun 10am-5pm

Final Tip - make sure that whatever outdoor kit you bring into NZ is really clean (spotless!) as you'll have to declare it for inspection and they employ some very effective chemical cleaning agents to sanitise equipment.

In reply to Mark / Alps:

They do sell kit out there but I wouldn't recommend buying it out there on your hard earned GBP!

Extremely expensive.

In reply to ged3000:

Just don't think you can go out when the weather is bad like you do in the UK

Apart from the extreme winds it can rain a lot - a transect of the Alps by scientists found over 11m of rain in one area

Often the best information about tracks and bush/alpine conditions can be found at the local Department of Conservation (DOC) office - this should be one of your first points of call when you visit an area in NZ.
http://doc.govt.nz/

The Mountain Safety Council are another good source of information about the NZ Backcountry
http://www.mountainsafety.org.nz/

Later in the season as snow (hopefully) starts to impact again,
http://www.avalanche.net.nz/

In reply to ged3000: not done any 'proper' mountaineeering there but have walked extensively in the Southern Alps and up the North Island volcanoes (like the slag heaps I played on as a kid but bigger). Brush up on your river-crossing skills and get a midge net - the sandflies can be a real nuisance in the bush at times even in the winter. The worst place is possibly Fiordland where mossies seem to take up in the evening when the sandflies go to bed (or was it the other way round?). There is definitely a rain shadow effect just like in the UK - much wetter on the West Coast and drier if you head east over the watershed. The walking (tramping) is fantastic but get above the bushline whenever possible as down in the trees it can be a bit samey unless you're in one of those big open braided river valleys.

In reply to ged3000: UK like...possibly more extremes..went to around 3000m and was fine in my usual Uk stuff but the weather was hugely variable. In the middle of winter we had some stunning days when we were just in thing fleeces at 3000m, yet in the autumn I'd been as cold as I probably ever have been at 1500 when we were hit by a southerly...

The southerlies are the main difference, there's little protection from the Antarctic winds when they roll in off the southern ocean.

In reply to ged3000:
If you don't know it, the epic tale of Mark Inglis and Phil Doole on Mt Cook in 1982 highlights the possible hazards of extreme weather in the Southern Alps -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Inglis

Serious mountains, with some seriously bad weather. But fantastic mountain country. Lucky you ...

Ive just got back from a year there. All the kiwis were going on about how harsh the weather is etc etc, if your used to full on mountain weather it aint too bad. Generally very stable but dependign on where the weather system coems from and which side of the country your on.

Again, if yor used to climbing in the Alps without cable cars - eg the Ecrin, then the approaches are coparable, so definitely not Himalayan!
I would say if you want to make the most of the weather and want to do peaks like Cook or dont want an epic walk in in winter, then be prepared to pay for a helicopter to drop you off.

If you join the NZAC you get cheaper use of their huts and discounted guidebooks, well worth it. Met-service is a good weather forecast but remember, West v East of the main divide the weather can be totally different, so dont get dispondant if it seems its always raining on Fox or Franz, you have options!

You really dont want to buy gear out there, its horrifically expensive despite what another post says. It may even be worth taking things like anasazis and cams out to sell, would be easy around QT and would make you a packet! Look at Mainly Tramping and Small Planet websites to get an idea of cost of stuff there.

With gear, Scottish for sure, definitely not plastics, approach shoes for long walk-ins, poles pretty handy too for big descents. It gets mega hot in the summer, so camelback very handy. I would take regular rack, bear in mind with the exception of the Darrans NZ mountain rock is total crap (with a few exceptions here and there). Some places you will come across carrot bolts so be familiar with how to use those (just thread a wire over them). If you plan on doing lots of bouldering it would be well worth taking a matt as they are obscenely expensive out there...

For some reason the kiwis have a fascination with snow steaks, it would be worth having one or 2 or deadman if your heading out in winter, and you will genreally relying on your partners to look after you, so if heading out in winter, transciever, probe, shovel etc, but they can all be hired out there. Snow-shoes or a touring set up is ideal for winter travel there, even getting out to the Remarkables ice, which isnt really worth it if your used to Euro mega venues!

Have a wicked time!

In reply to ged3000:

Mark Ingil's experience on Mount Cook were just featured on "Ray Mear's Extreme Survival", on the Dave TV Channel. If anyone is interested and sees this soon enough, it'll be repeated on the "Dave Ja Vu" channel from 8pm. I didn't notice exactly when the Mark Ingils segment started, but it was a fair way into the programme, maybe after half way through. So therefore after 8:30pm.

Thanks very much for all the advice guys - I can't wait! It sounds like amazing country out there!

One of the specific bits I wasn't sure about was that I'm thinking of replacing my current insulating layer with an end-of-season belay jacket, and had been umming and ahhing about how thick a jacket I'd need. I'm currently climbing pretty easy Scottish stuff (II), and haven't yet managed to persuade anyone to let me lead anything. But, I've been loving the winter climbing and mountaineering, and am definitely keen to get out into the bigger hills in the Southern Alps while I'm out in NZ.

From what's been said, I'd guess that something like a haglofs barrier zone with a hood, or a RAB photon jacket-kinda type thickness would do fine for beginner-intermediate winter climbing/mountaineering belay jacket in NZ? (As opposed to something as thick as the RAB photon belay, for example) I tend to run pretty warm, and reckon I'd probably be okay in something about that thick in Scotland. I know it's pretty specific, but any advice greatly appreciated!

In reply to ged3000:
+30 to -10
A synthetic Rab thing or equivalent would be nice. You can get a bit damp and be Fine for a few more days. I usually only use it for belaying or huts lunch break, it's not so cold you wear it walking.
Most places you fly into can be reached in a full days walk or 2.The reason people fly is the weather windows are seldom longer than 4 days.

In reply to KiwiPrincess: Good to see a dusting of snow on the Remarks today...