/ Self Rescue

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paulascd on 28 Feb 2011 - students.shef.vic.ask4.co.uk
Just watched this video:

http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=3472

How does it work if your using doubles. Do you just tie off the one rope or both?

Cheers for any advice

Paul
PaulHarris - on 28 Feb 2011
In reply to paulascd:
treat both ropes as one, so tie both off put prussuk onto both and escape the system.
paulascd on 28 Feb 2011 - students.shef.vic.ask4.co.uk
In reply to PaulHarris:
Thanks for the reply. One more question (haven't used double ropes before :)):

When you clove hitch the rope to the anchor at a belay, how does this work with doubles? Do you only put a clove hitch on one rope and leave the other? Or on both?

Thanks again,

Paul
idiotproof (Buxton MC) - on 28 Feb 2011
In reply to paulascd:

Whatever works for you.... i.e build your belay with just one rope if that is what you are confident with.

But I often find it simpler to use both ropes for example one to each side of the belay i.e use your left rope for gear to the left of the belay and right for the right.... a bit neater
Luke90 on 28 Feb 2011
In reply to paulascd:
I generally only clove hitch one rope to one piece of gear but often have the second rope going to a second anchor.
Al Randall on 28 Feb 2011
In reply to paulascd: This is much easier if you are using a direct belay but you need to be sure that the anchors are good enough. These days I always use a direct belay with a Reverso 3 when circumstances allow.

Al
paulascd on 28 Feb 2011 - students.shef.vic.ask4.co.uk
Cheers guys
EeeByGum - on 01 Mar 2011
In reply to paulascd: A much simpler mechanism with escape in mind is to always use direct belaying. Tie a loop in one of your ropes and then belay to this as you would to your belay loop. The result is that in order to escape, all you have to do is tie off your belay and simply undo the rope from your harness. Much simpler and efficient that faffing about with prussuks.
Offwidth - on 01 Mar 2011
In reply to EeeByGum: Or you apply the maxim that you won't need to escape from the system 99.99% of the time and deal with the 'faff' of prussics in the rare case you have to. I've climbed regularly for well over 20 years worldwide trad multi-pitch and scottish winter and only ever escaped from the system when training others.
Al Randall on 01 Mar 2011
In reply to Offwidth: Agreed, but there are other benefits to be gained from using a direct belay.

Al
EeeByGum - on 01 Mar 2011
In reply to Offwidth: Agreed. I still rarely climb with indirect belay after climbing with a bunch of Austrians when learning to climb. I also find you end up nearly amputating your leg on indirect belay if your second falls and you are sitting down.
Offwidth - on 01 Mar 2011
In reply to EeeByGum:

"I also find you end up nearly amputating your leg"

Only if you're stupid enough to run the rope over your leg. I find indirect belaying off my rope loop tie in by far the fastest and most convenient but sometimes use a direct belay on ledges with multiple seconds or when block leading.
EeeByGum - on 01 Mar 2011
In reply to Offwidth:

> Only if you're stupid enough to run the rope over your leg.

How do you do that? Either the ropes going to your belay gear will run over your leg (they have to in order to get to your belay loop) or you end up sitting on it all which is very uncomfortable and difficult to adjust once you are in place. I'm curious to know if there is a knack. I too use indirect out of convenience, but not if my second is a bit shaky.
Monk - on 01 Mar 2011
In reply to EeeByGum:

Keep the ropes to the side of you. You definitely don't have to have the ropes running over your legs - most people will only do that once before they seek out a better way.

I tried to find a photo, but got bored after a while. This is the best I could come up with http://www.ukclimbing.com/images/dbpage.html?id=96881 just imagine that the belayer has turned out to sea. The ropes and the belay are to his left and don't cross his legs at all.
EeeByGum - on 02 Mar 2011
In reply to Monk: That photo is fine, but if the anchors were at ground level, it illustrates my point perfectly. The ropes are going over his leg.
Monk - on 02 Mar 2011
In reply to EeeByGum:

But they aren't. He has twisted to look at the camera. If he is facing down the climb, feet dangling over the egde, and the anchors were at ground level then the ropes to the anchors and the ropes to the climber will not be over his leg, but too his side. Sure, it twists the harness a little, but it's far more comfortable than having your leg cheese-wired.
EeeByGum - on 02 Mar 2011
In reply to Monk: Ah I see - fair dos. In that case, I would probably belay direct and maybe clip in with a spare quick draw to stop the belay device flapping about. I don't think there is enough give in my harness to do what you are talking about which is why I have never discovered how to do it. ;-)

Cheers for the explanation though.

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