UKC

How do I set up a belay anchor for a second climber using only my main rope (also slings, screw gates Etc...) after I have led the climb?

In reply to moot: There is no easy answer to this as the situation dictates the best method. The Libby Peters book looks very comprehensive and easy to follow. Failing that get an experienced trad climber to demonstrate.

On places like Stanage it is sometimes simply a matter of passing the rope round a boulder and tying back through your tie in loop with a couple of hitches or a clove hitch to a screwgate karabiner.

Al

In reply to Gaston Rubberpants: Thanks for the advice Al

In reply to moot: You can sometimes put your main rope round a boulder and clove hitch it to a screwgate on your rope loop. This lets you ajust the distance between you and the anchor so you can sit on the edge. I do this when there is a very large, conveneint boulder.

I presume you just want to do this for speed as apposed to using nuts, hexes and cams.

In reply to CharlesE:

You're right, but it tends to bugger the rope quite quickly. Big slings are better & cheaper at that job.

In reply to jonny2vests: True. Good way to save weight in the alps perhaps, not really necessary on the top of Stanage.

In reply to CharlesE:

Yeah, fair enough. In the alps, quite often I don't bother with anchors on easier stuff, I'd just run the rope around a convenient spike and belay from that.

In reply to jonny2vests: You are mis-interpreting the rope round a boulder solution. This not a proposal to use a direct belay where the rope would be moving against the boulder, it is just simply a way of not using slings so I can't see how it will wear the rope significantly. Some boulders at the top of Stanage would in any case require a bloody long sling.

Al

In reply to moot: Hi Moot. This is not something you can learn to do by asking on an internet forum. Yes, you can learn to do it by reading a description, it's not ideal but I understand not everyone has a more experienced friend to learn from. If you are going to learn that way, get the book (Libby Peter) or find a proper article, don't just piece together bits of advice you get on here as it will end in tears! This is something you need to do properly or there are rather drastic consequences!

Luke

In reply to Gaston Rubberpants:

No, I wasn't misinterpreting Al, I thought I would just add that in to say that there are occasions where you might run the rope around the boulder - I was conceding a point to Charles E.

And a 16ft sling will lasso pretty much anything you would use as a belay at Stanage - even if it only goes over one end.

In reply to Gaston Rubberpants:

No, I wasn't misinterpreting Al, I thought I would just add that in to say that there are occasions where you might run the rope around the boulder - I was conceding a point to Charles E.

And a 16ft sling will lasso pretty much anything you would use as a belay at Stanage - even if it only goes over one end.

To the OP: Grit addict is right - asking these sorts of complex questions on a forum will just confuse. Read a book, watch some videos, get shown.

In reply to moot:

There is some information in an article here:

http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=2592

If you don't know someone more experienced to show you the ropes and you are climbing somewhere busy, you can always ask another climber if they think your belay looks OK?

In reply to moot: I know how to set up an anchor with slings, screw gates, nuts,cams etc. It was just a general wondering weather it is possible to use only your rope (if ever i lost my slings on a crag).
Thanks for all your advice!

In reply to moot:

Yes it is, in fact many default to just using the rope. Your original question mentioned slings as well though which confused me.

In reply to jonny2vests: yeah sorry that was ment to say "with out" slings etc.

In reply to moot: Take most of the advice given here with a liberal pinch of salt and consult either someone know can show you in the flesh and / or one of the standard texts. I guarantee that you will get 100 different answers on here some of which may be dangerous, misinformed or confusing.

That said, it isn't rocket science. A bit of trail and error combined with a healthy dose of common sense should see you clear.

In reply to moot:

Your aim is to attach yourself securely to the top of the crag so you won't be pulled over the edge (or move for that matter) should your partner fall.

There are 1001 was of achieving this but all the good one share some common traits.

Good anchors - choose something solid to anchor to, stout trees, big boulders, threads (care - these often look better than they are), well wedged hexes, big nuts in solid cracks... you get the picture, big stuff.

Redundant anchors - you want at least two, there's no harm in three, you will occasionally cock up the odd one, this is your safeguard against that.

Equalised - all your anchors should be working for you at all times, they should ideally be sharing the load equally.

Independent - A failure of one should not lead to a failure of the others, eg. a nut either side of a block is no good if the block falls out.

Inextensible connections - A failure of any piece should not effect your positioning relative to the other pieces.

Position - You should be positioned so you can see your partner and you are well supported by your belay. You can stand but bear in mind what will happen if your legs buckle. You should have space to operate your belay device.

So, bearing in mind there are a few quick and simple set-ups to get you started:

eg: Good boulder and good nut nearby, both 3-4m back from the edge. Drop a sling over the boulder, seat it so it can't slip off then give it a tug to test. Clip your rope to it then walk carefully back to the edge* when you're where you want to be put an HMS on your tie in loop and clove hitch the sling rope too it, you now are secure (so could shout safe if you like). Walk back to the nut, clip the loose strand of rope to it, back to the edge and repeat the clove hitching. You're now properly secured to two good anchors and are 'safe'.

To add a third piece, just repeat the process though you'll need an extra krab for the clove hitch.

That's not the simplest technique but it's versatile and teaches you all the basics, you can adapt it from there to suit you, the kit you carry and the anchors you find so long as you bear in mind what you are actually trying to achieve. A good book will provide plenty of ideas.

*You're still on belay at this point.

jk

In reply to moot:

Hi saw your post and thought these might be of help they are two short instruction films one aimed at sorting out the belay using the rope and the other using a sling !

Hope they help

Using a sling vimeo.com/22550979

Using the rope vimeo.com/14729672

There is a channel here which I have been slowly building that has a few more climbing related things http://vimeo.com/channels/131785

Dan

In reply to moot:

Yes. I do this all the time, generally becausue either the ropes are simply closer to hand or I've forgotten the slings

There's - as others have said - about a thousand good ways of doing it. Unfortunately there's another thousand which are dodgy as hell. As others have said, read books, watch videos, etc.