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Dachstein mountains
gave me two great days of high-mountain Via Ferrata climbing -- for me at least as good as the Dolomites.
Since it was so hot down south in the Dolomites, I decided instead to start in the north (and closer to the MUC airport) at Ramsau am Dachstein in the Steiermark region of Austria.
. GPS approx latitude/longitude : (N47.450 E13.617)
First day I climbed around the Koppenkarstein (east from top of the main glacier lift): four VF routes (German "klettersteig" = KS) : Irg KS to top of the Koppenkarstein (2863m), descend Westgrat KS, then down part of Hunerscharte KS, then climb Sky Walk KS up to top station of lift, and took the lift back down to parking.
One of my best VF days ever (and I've done like 40 in the Dolomites), based on: quality + variety of climbing (especially options for free climbing moves with hands + feet directly on the rock, using cable for protection only), quality + variety of scenery (including nearby large glaciers), variety of terrain overall, and ease of access.
Second day I started low at the Sued-Wand hut (1871m) and climbed first the Anna KS then Der Johann KS up to the Seethaler hut (2741m), then across a short section of glacier and up the Schulter-Anstieg KS and Rundkluft-Anstieg KS to the summit of the Hohe Dachstein (2995m), highest in this mountain group. Then a long walk on a groomed trail on the glacier to Hunerkogel (2687m) top of the main glacier lift, and rode the lift back down to parking.
I used many good ideas and info from the AlpinVerlag.at guidebook (Klettersfuehrer Oesterreich, by Jentzsch-Rabl et al, AlpinVerlag 2010) -- well worth owning for exploring hundreds of routes outside the Dolomites.
gave me two great days of high-mountain Via Ferrata climbing -- for me at least as good as the Dolomites.
Since it was so hot down south in the Dolomites, I decided instead to start in the north (and closer to the MUC airport) at Ramsau am Dachstein in the Steiermark region of Austria.
. GPS approx latitude/longitude : (N47.450 E13.617)
First day I climbed around the Koppenkarstein (east from top of the main glacier lift): four VF routes (German "klettersteig" = KS) : Irg KS to top of the Koppenkarstein (2863m), descend Westgrat KS, then down part of Hunerscharte KS, then climb Sky Walk KS up to top station of lift, and took the lift back down to parking.
One of my best VF days ever (and I've done like 40 in the Dolomites), based on: quality + variety of climbing (especially options for free climbing moves with hands + feet directly on the rock, using cable for protection only), quality + variety of scenery (including nearby large glaciers), variety of terrain overall, and ease of access.
Second day I started low at the Sued-Wand hut (1871m) and climbed first the Anna KS then Der Johann KS up to the Seethaler hut (2741m), then across a short section of glacier and up the Schulter-Anstieg KS and Rundkluft-Anstieg KS to the summit of the Hohe Dachstein (2995m), highest in this mountain group. Then a long walk on a groomed trail on the glacier to Hunerkogel (2687m) top of the main glacier lift, and rode the lift back down to parking.
I used many good ideas and info from the AlpinVerlag.at guidebook (Klettersfuehrer Oesterreich, by Jentzsch-Rabl et al, AlpinVerlag 2010) -- well worth owning for exploring hundreds of routes outside the Dolomites.
Dachstein first day -- Irg KS + Westgrat KS on Koppenkarstein
Way more details than you ever wanted . . .
I drove up the toll road to the main parking lot (1690m) for the glacier lift.
GPS approx latitude/longitude : (N47.450 E13.617)
The lift started operation surprisingly early. From the top station of the lift on the Hunerkogel (2687m) I walked the obvious path north down to the glacier then roughly east down the groomed trail on the glacier -- which was kind of slippery early in the morning - (wish I'd brought some light crampons) - to near the Hunerscharte (2600m).
. (Later I found out that I could have gone from the lift top station down to the Hunerscharte without walking at all on the glacier -- by using a via ferrata / klettersteig route. This route started where the steel cable is tied to the fence of the main outdoor platform of the lift top station, by the kiosk snack shop. I have not yet climbed this up or down myself, but I talked with two persons who were just finishing climbing up it - they didn't comment on any special difficulty.
Still I think it's more interesting to start this tour by walking on the glacier, so next time I'll plan to bring crampons.
Since I did not have crampons, I next got on rock and went roughly east toward the Koppenkarstein by climbing up the Westgrat KS -- mostly easy climbing on or near the crest of the narrow ridge, with great views out over both sides -- one of the best less-difficult ridge Via Ferrata routes I've done so far.
When I reached the cable suspension bridge (? near the Austriascharte ?), I noticed below to the south a cable-protected trail running west-east, nicely cut into the slope. So I climbed back down a short ways, then under the bridge, then south down the slope to that nice trail - (this slope was steep with much loose stone: Next time I'd bring crampons so I could be confident to use the normal glacier approach to avoid that slope).
Later I saw that there's a cable-protected route which leaves the Westgrat route just above the suspension bridge, and at first traverses east, then descends south toward the trail cut into the slope -- but some of the cables were broken or missing.
Next I checked that west end ("Rosmarie Stollen") of that nice trail cut into the slope, found out that it starts at tunnel thru the ridge. The north side of the tunnel is reached by a ladder. I think the ladder is near a supply-lift which is normally reached from near the Hunersharte by hiking up on a groomed trail on the glacier. Note that this trail is mostly in shade in the morning, so it could be rather icy. Next time I would bring light crampons (perhaps even an ice axe), since it looks like starting in the morning with hiking on the glacier to the tunnel is a more interesting start than by using various via ferrata / klettersteig routes to avoid the glacier - (instead save those routes for the return later in the day).
Then I did the obvious thing and hiked roughly east on that trail, which led to a sort of pass, then east down a steeper slope. Lower down the slope had old icy snow with rocks on top, some mud, also some fresher snow. There was a rope down the tricky part -- next time I would grab that sooner higher up. Another use for crampons (perhaps also ice axe) might be if that rope were missing or dangerously old or frayed. Lower down a steep gully, with another rope for assistance.
Next I traversed on scree across a large open half-bowl. Much of the scree had old icy snow underneath. Might be easier to find stable footing if go lower toward the bottom. Then I hiked up roughly east out of the half-basin to a sort of pass -- with a trail sign for the Irg klettersteig.
I could even see two climbers already on the rocks directly above, so I hiked up roughly north toward the wall. But this was a mistake, because those climbers were not on the Klettersteig; they were doing a free-climb route using a rope. So I walked back down toward the sign, and then found the correct trail . . .
From the trail sign at the sort of pass, I traversed hiking across the slope roughly east, following an unmarked "use" trail which soon went a little down, but overall gently rose upward toward base of south wall.
___________________
Irg KS:
The bottom of the Irg klettersteig / Via Ferrata was marked by a big blue sign. Tough move off the ground (early test if you're prepared to handle what comes later).
I went up the Irg route (somewhere around 300 vertical meters) using "free" climbing style, with my hands and feet directly on the rock, not grabbing the cable or stepping on the metal pegs, using the cable only for protection by clipping my via ferrata kit to it. Except for about three traverse sections of two to three meters each where the route traversed across a blank wall, and a couple of sections climbing upward of say three meters. I'd guess I did about 200 meters of free climbing in the difficulty range of French sport 4a to 5c, with many interesting sections around 5a-5c (perhaps some 6a?).
One hindrance on Irg KS to free climbing was the large metal pegs offered to aid footholds in steeper sections. Sometimes I was afraid that even a short fall might result in my hitting one of those protruding metal things with a very nasty wound. (I'm not usually a cable-hauling climber, but I felt there were too many spikes for interesting cable-hauling climbing).
Skylotec Skyrider: Note that there might be several sections on the Irg KS where the steel cable was too thick to allow use of a Skylotec Skyrider disk for superior protection against taking a longer-distance fall.
The Irg KS route finished at a helicopter pad on top of the Koppenkarstein (2863m).
Then I went west along the ridge on the Westgrat KS route, another highlight of the tour, over a couple of peaks and clefts, all the way down to the Hunerscharte (2600m).
Way more details than you ever wanted . . .
I drove up the toll road to the main parking lot (1690m) for the glacier lift.
GPS approx latitude/longitude : (N47.450 E13.617)
The lift started operation surprisingly early. From the top station of the lift on the Hunerkogel (2687m) I walked the obvious path north down to the glacier then roughly east down the groomed trail on the glacier -- which was kind of slippery early in the morning - (wish I'd brought some light crampons) - to near the Hunerscharte (2600m).
. (Later I found out that I could have gone from the lift top station down to the Hunerscharte without walking at all on the glacier -- by using a via ferrata / klettersteig route. This route started where the steel cable is tied to the fence of the main outdoor platform of the lift top station, by the kiosk snack shop. I have not yet climbed this up or down myself, but I talked with two persons who were just finishing climbing up it - they didn't comment on any special difficulty.
Still I think it's more interesting to start this tour by walking on the glacier, so next time I'll plan to bring crampons.
Since I did not have crampons, I next got on rock and went roughly east toward the Koppenkarstein by climbing up the Westgrat KS -- mostly easy climbing on or near the crest of the narrow ridge, with great views out over both sides -- one of the best less-difficult ridge Via Ferrata routes I've done so far.
When I reached the cable suspension bridge (? near the Austriascharte ?), I noticed below to the south a cable-protected trail running west-east, nicely cut into the slope. So I climbed back down a short ways, then under the bridge, then south down the slope to that nice trail - (this slope was steep with much loose stone: Next time I'd bring crampons so I could be confident to use the normal glacier approach to avoid that slope).
Later I saw that there's a cable-protected route which leaves the Westgrat route just above the suspension bridge, and at first traverses east, then descends south toward the trail cut into the slope -- but some of the cables were broken or missing.
Next I checked that west end ("Rosmarie Stollen") of that nice trail cut into the slope, found out that it starts at tunnel thru the ridge. The north side of the tunnel is reached by a ladder. I think the ladder is near a supply-lift which is normally reached from near the Hunersharte by hiking up on a groomed trail on the glacier. Note that this trail is mostly in shade in the morning, so it could be rather icy. Next time I would bring light crampons (perhaps even an ice axe), since it looks like starting in the morning with hiking on the glacier to the tunnel is a more interesting start than by using various via ferrata / klettersteig routes to avoid the glacier - (instead save those routes for the return later in the day).
Then I did the obvious thing and hiked roughly east on that trail, which led to a sort of pass, then east down a steeper slope. Lower down the slope had old icy snow with rocks on top, some mud, also some fresher snow. There was a rope down the tricky part -- next time I would grab that sooner higher up. Another use for crampons (perhaps also ice axe) might be if that rope were missing or dangerously old or frayed. Lower down a steep gully, with another rope for assistance.
Next I traversed on scree across a large open half-bowl. Much of the scree had old icy snow underneath. Might be easier to find stable footing if go lower toward the bottom. Then I hiked up roughly east out of the half-basin to a sort of pass -- with a trail sign for the Irg klettersteig.
I could even see two climbers already on the rocks directly above, so I hiked up roughly north toward the wall. But this was a mistake, because those climbers were not on the Klettersteig; they were doing a free-climb route using a rope. So I walked back down toward the sign, and then found the correct trail . . .
From the trail sign at the sort of pass, I traversed hiking across the slope roughly east, following an unmarked "use" trail which soon went a little down, but overall gently rose upward toward base of south wall.
___________________
Irg KS:
The bottom of the Irg klettersteig / Via Ferrata was marked by a big blue sign. Tough move off the ground (early test if you're prepared to handle what comes later).
I went up the Irg route (somewhere around 300 vertical meters) using "free" climbing style, with my hands and feet directly on the rock, not grabbing the cable or stepping on the metal pegs, using the cable only for protection by clipping my via ferrata kit to it. Except for about three traverse sections of two to three meters each where the route traversed across a blank wall, and a couple of sections climbing upward of say three meters. I'd guess I did about 200 meters of free climbing in the difficulty range of French sport 4a to 5c, with many interesting sections around 5a-5c (perhaps some 6a?).
One hindrance on Irg KS to free climbing was the large metal pegs offered to aid footholds in steeper sections. Sometimes I was afraid that even a short fall might result in my hitting one of those protruding metal things with a very nasty wound. (I'm not usually a cable-hauling climber, but I felt there were too many spikes for interesting cable-hauling climbing).
Skylotec Skyrider: Note that there might be several sections on the Irg KS where the steel cable was too thick to allow use of a Skylotec Skyrider disk for superior protection against taking a longer-distance fall.
The Irg KS route finished at a helicopter pad on top of the Koppenkarstein (2863m).
Then I went west along the ridge on the Westgrat KS route, another highlight of the tour, over a couple of peaks and clefts, all the way down to the Hunerscharte (2600m).
Dachstein - Sky Walk klettersteig
I was already at the Hunerscharte (2600m) after climbing down the Kopperkarstein Westgrat KS - (This point could also have been reached by a via ferrata / klettersteig route down from the main platform of the Hunerkogerl lift top station).
At the west end of the gap, I found the cable for the Hunerscharte KS route, and went down that (steep in places, with metal pegs to aid feet). Found the sign for the Sky Walk klettersteig, so I turned onto that.
___________________
Sky Walk KS:
My memory is that Sky Walk started down a slab in a sort of dihedral, then a long horizontal traverse west (with some interesting free moves). Next climbs up diagonally on somewhat loose rock. Then up a steep (slightly overhanging?) pillar, where I grabbed the cable and used the pegs for aid. Then a long section (say 50-60 vertical meters) directly upward toward a platform on the lift top station. The rock was less than vertical, and it was exciting for me to climb it almost all free (difficulty mostly French sport 5a-5c). Then another steeper pillar (with great exposure to long direct vertical drop) where I used cable and pegs for aid. Finally some more climbing (mostly free) to reach the lift top station. Hauled myself over the guardrail fence and join the other tourists. Overall climbing on Sky Walk KS somewhere around 150 vertical meters.
Overall more sustained steep strenuous sections than Irg KS, and a much larger percentage requiring cable-hauling style climbing.
One hindrance on the Sky Walk klettersteig route to free climbing was the large metal pegs offered to aid footholds in steeper sections. Sometimes I was afraid that even a short fall might result in my hitting one of those protruding metal things with a very nasty wound.
Skylotec Skyrider: There might be several sections on the Sky Walk KS where the steel cable was too thick to allow use of a Skylotec Skyrider disk for superior protection against taking a longer-distance fall.
I was already at the Hunerscharte (2600m) after climbing down the Kopperkarstein Westgrat KS - (This point could also have been reached by a via ferrata / klettersteig route down from the main platform of the Hunerkogerl lift top station).
At the west end of the gap, I found the cable for the Hunerscharte KS route, and went down that (steep in places, with metal pegs to aid feet). Found the sign for the Sky Walk klettersteig, so I turned onto that.
___________________
Sky Walk KS:
My memory is that Sky Walk started down a slab in a sort of dihedral, then a long horizontal traverse west (with some interesting free moves). Next climbs up diagonally on somewhat loose rock. Then up a steep (slightly overhanging?) pillar, where I grabbed the cable and used the pegs for aid. Then a long section (say 50-60 vertical meters) directly upward toward a platform on the lift top station. The rock was less than vertical, and it was exciting for me to climb it almost all free (difficulty mostly French sport 5a-5c). Then another steeper pillar (with great exposure to long direct vertical drop) where I used cable and pegs for aid. Finally some more climbing (mostly free) to reach the lift top station. Hauled myself over the guardrail fence and join the other tourists. Overall climbing on Sky Walk KS somewhere around 150 vertical meters.
Overall more sustained steep strenuous sections than Irg KS, and a much larger percentage requiring cable-hauling style climbing.
One hindrance on the Sky Walk klettersteig route to free climbing was the large metal pegs offered to aid footholds in steeper sections. Sometimes I was afraid that even a short fall might result in my hitting one of those protruding metal things with a very nasty wound.
Skylotec Skyrider: There might be several sections on the Sky Walk KS where the steel cable was too thick to allow use of a Skylotec Skyrider disk for superior protection against taking a longer-distance fall.
OK - so anybody have some other experiences with those or other Via Ferrata routes in the Dachstein?
I've got this new German-language guidebook with hundreds of klettersteigs in Austria and Germany. How about some recommendations for other high-quality routes I can try -- especially I like routes with opportunities for sustained free-climbing using the cable only for protection, not aid. And routes with interesting terrain features, like sharp narrow ridges, or deep gorges.
Also I like to know easy + moderate routes I can try with Sharon.
Thanks a lot,
Ken
I've got this new German-language guidebook with hundreds of klettersteigs in Austria and Germany. How about some recommendations for other high-quality routes I can try -- especially I like routes with opportunities for sustained free-climbing using the cable only for protection, not aid. And routes with interesting terrain features, like sharp narrow ridges, or deep gorges.
Also I like to know easy + moderate routes I can try with Sharon.
Thanks a lot,
Ken
In reply to kenr:
Via Ferrata not really my thing, but here are a few I have some acquaintance with:
In the Mieminger Kette: Seeebener - Tajakante - Coburger. Quite a tough day out linking three D/Es. I turned back in June last year before the top of the Taja due to dangerous amounts of unstable fresh snow. Could make a great weekend round, if you're also up to un-cabled grade I/II scrambling, by staying at the Coburger Hut then doing the traverse of the Sonnenspitze the next day.
In a similar vein:
Steinernes Meer: the Wildental on the Persailhorn, continue over the Breithorn to the Riemannhütte. Next day, Schönfeldspitze either via the normal route (I/II; metal steps on one exposed section but no cables) or the direct west ridge (II: pretty steep & exposed, more like real climbing than your typical Grade II scramble). Normal route is very good but requires confidence on unprotected rock scrambling in exposed situations.
Via Ferrata not really my thing, but here are a few I have some acquaintance with:
In the Mieminger Kette: Seeebener - Tajakante - Coburger. Quite a tough day out linking three D/Es. I turned back in June last year before the top of the Taja due to dangerous amounts of unstable fresh snow. Could make a great weekend round, if you're also up to un-cabled grade I/II scrambling, by staying at the Coburger Hut then doing the traverse of the Sonnenspitze the next day.
In a similar vein:
Steinernes Meer: the Wildental on the Persailhorn, continue over the Breithorn to the Riemannhütte. Next day, Schönfeldspitze either via the normal route (I/II; metal steps on one exposed section but no cables) or the direct west ridge (II: pretty steep & exposed, more like real climbing than your typical Grade II scramble). Normal route is very good but requires confidence on unprotected rock scrambling in exposed situations.
In reply to kenr:
If Sharon is up for technically straightforward but long, I've heard good things about the Nuaracher Hohenweg in the Lofer. Not personally acquainted with it though.
> Also I like to know easy + moderate routes I can try with Sharon.
If Sharon is up for technically straightforward but long, I've heard good things about the Nuaracher Hohenweg in the Lofer. Not personally acquainted with it though.
In reply to kenr: Mittenwalder Hohenweg - easy but high and spectacular ridge - very much an 'old skool' ferrata like the Brenta ones. Probably best to start at the Karwendelbahn cablecar, do the VF then reverse it to avoid the looong descent back down to the lower cablecar station, although there is a long suspension bridge and the entertaining Brunnstein hutte on that way down. Lachenspitze KS is also good - we took the Vogelbahm cablecar up to the north and walked in and back. The descent down the northern ridge of the lachenspitze is chossy and dangerous, so take the main path to the south and back past the Landsberger hutte.
We also looked at the Tajakante enchainement as mentioned above and doing a 5 day hut-to-hut of the Lechtaler Hohenweg but snow down to 1700m thwarted those plans
We also looked at the Tajakante enchainement as mentioned above and doing a 5 day hut-to-hut of the Lechtaler Hohenweg but snow down to 1700m thwarted those plans
In reply to Toerag: The other one we fancied was the 'Mauerlaufer' ("wall runner") KS on the Alpspitze but again, the snow stopped us. The Garmisch alpineguide office recommended wearing rockshoes for that as it's proper steep and hard.
In reply to AlanLittle:
Thanks for the ideas around the Mieminger -- sounds like the kind of thing I'd enjoy trying after Sharon flies home -- hope I get the chance.
Persailhorn + Breithorn + Schoenfelfspitze -- another thing that sounds like a fit for me.
(Last year with some German friends I climbed up some rock scramble route on S side of Breithorn (interesting, but significant loose rock if other parties are also on it). Then a ridge traverse, then down one of the Persailhorn VF routes.)
Ken
Thanks for the ideas around the Mieminger -- sounds like the kind of thing I'd enjoy trying after Sharon flies home -- hope I get the chance.
Persailhorn + Breithorn + Schoenfelfspitze -- another thing that sounds like a fit for me.
(Last year with some German friends I climbed up some rock scramble route on S side of Breithorn (interesting, but significant loose rock if other parties are also on it). Then a ridge traverse, then down one of the Persailhorn VF routes.)
Ken
In reply to AlanLittle:
Nuaracher Hohenweg -- even if not for Sharon -- one of my German friends mentioned some less-technical traverse in the Lofer which he enjoys -- so maybe that's it.
(Or maybe he should add the Nuaracher to his route.)
Nuaracher Hohenweg -- even if not for Sharon -- one of my German friends mentioned some less-technical traverse in the Lofer which he enjoys -- so maybe that's it.
(Or maybe he should add the Nuaracher to his route.)
A couple of others I got to try recently:
Postalmklamm klettersteig ...
in the Salzkammergut: Really two klettersteigs of very different character. Sharon did the main one in the deep narrow gorge: exciting, exposed, committing - including some tricky cable-bridge (and one non-bridge "jump") over the gorge. We both felt that if we had known how intimidating it was going to be, she would have chosen not to do it -- but actually she made it thru in good style.
The other higher section is a steep strenuous "sport" via ferrata. There's a marked trail to avoid it, and Sharon took that. I tried it and found it more strenuous than I expected - (Note that they have added an even harder variation which I did not attempt -- since I'm not much interested in difficulty for difficulty's sake in via ferrata routes).
Note that the main parking space has been moved higher since the AlpinVerlag.at guidebook, and the new + narrower trail to access the bottom of the gorge VF is shorter.
GPS approx latitide/longitude of Parking = (N47.663 E13.459)
______________________
Leoganger Sud klettersteig . . .
One of the most interesting + varied strenuous "cable-hauling" style VF routes I've done (without Sharon). I liked the design approach of fairly minimal steel footholds. Additional short leash with carabiner ("cow's tail") attached to harness belay loop highly recommended (to rest on the overhanging traverse sections). Descent by another VF route (Leoganger Nord) also with some exciting steep sections, but not as sustained and with lots more steel footholds. Nice hut nearby for a snack afterward (Passauer hut).
Only drawback: big vertical in the approach hike (but trail is straightforward)
GPS approx latitide/longitude of Parking = (N47.453 E12.756)
___________________________________
Postalmklamm klettersteig ...
in the Salzkammergut: Really two klettersteigs of very different character. Sharon did the main one in the deep narrow gorge: exciting, exposed, committing - including some tricky cable-bridge (and one non-bridge "jump") over the gorge. We both felt that if we had known how intimidating it was going to be, she would have chosen not to do it -- but actually she made it thru in good style.
The other higher section is a steep strenuous "sport" via ferrata. There's a marked trail to avoid it, and Sharon took that. I tried it and found it more strenuous than I expected - (Note that they have added an even harder variation which I did not attempt -- since I'm not much interested in difficulty for difficulty's sake in via ferrata routes).
Note that the main parking space has been moved higher since the AlpinVerlag.at guidebook, and the new + narrower trail to access the bottom of the gorge VF is shorter.
GPS approx latitide/longitude of Parking = (N47.663 E13.459)
______________________
Leoganger Sud klettersteig . . .
One of the most interesting + varied strenuous "cable-hauling" style VF routes I've done (without Sharon). I liked the design approach of fairly minimal steel footholds. Additional short leash with carabiner ("cow's tail") attached to harness belay loop highly recommended (to rest on the overhanging traverse sections). Descent by another VF route (Leoganger Nord) also with some exciting steep sections, but not as sustained and with lots more steel footholds. Nice hut nearby for a snack afterward (Passauer hut).
Only drawback: big vertical in the approach hike (but trail is straightforward)
GPS approx latitide/longitude of Parking = (N47.453 E12.756)
___________________________________
In reply to Toerag:
Mittenwalder Hohenweg - Yes ...
Sharon + I got to try that just a few days ago on a nice mid-week day -- including your clever suggestion of doing it out-and-back to avoid the long descent hike (just the sort of thing Sharon hates). Pleasant views in all directions, wonderful day to be out on a mountain ridge (with a lift supplying most of the work to get there).
Actually we only went as far as the Suedliche Linderspitze (something around halfway). At that point Sharon looked south toward the next likely rocky-climbing section and decided it would be too much hiking to get there, so we turned around. I thought the most interesting section on rock to that point was between the Mittlere Linterspitze and the Suedliche Lsptze. But the cable went mostly below the ridge-top thru there, so we unclipped and scrambled unprotected up on the true ridge - (being careful to test holds, and stopping our climbing if anyone was on the cables below us -- uncrowded that day).
Fortunately it was an uncrowded day, so there was only a small traffic-jam on the ladders going back the other way (north-bound against the generally south-bound flow) over the Mittlere Linderspitze. Then instead of going back again over the Nordliche Linderspitze (which didn't seem to have so much rock-scrambling), we just took the Heinrich-Noe trail around its east side.
Karwendel klettersteig
we did next. Excellent rock (surprisingly unpolished for so close to the lift), interesting climbing moves (esp on the traverse section with slopy footholds but positive handholds if found them). Well-protected by cable with well-placed anchors. I climbed it all free, Sharon grabbed the cable for aid in some places - (her comment afterward, "Where was the crux supposed to be?").
Only drawback: Too short.
. (made me think about coming back up the lift next time with a rope and draws to check how the rock was on some of the free-climbing routes)
After reaching the top of the Westliche Karwendelspitze (2385m), we took the normal route hiking/scrambing (some polished sections, some cable sections) back down to the lift.
Ken
P.S. off-topic
Since we had time left over after turning back half-way, on our way driving back to our base thru Innsbruck we stopped off and tried a couple of sport-climb routes at the Martinswand AV klettergarten - just five minutes off the A12 motorway, easy straightforward walk to the crag. Interesting moves, but some of the holds gave a whole new meaning to the word "polished" -- seemed like black porcelain. Anyway before I could decide if I was too scared to lead another route, lots of after-work Innsbruckers arrived to crowd the climbs, so we just left.
Mittenwalder Hohenweg - Yes ...
Sharon + I got to try that just a few days ago on a nice mid-week day -- including your clever suggestion of doing it out-and-back to avoid the long descent hike (just the sort of thing Sharon hates). Pleasant views in all directions, wonderful day to be out on a mountain ridge (with a lift supplying most of the work to get there).
Actually we only went as far as the Suedliche Linderspitze (something around halfway). At that point Sharon looked south toward the next likely rocky-climbing section and decided it would be too much hiking to get there, so we turned around. I thought the most interesting section on rock to that point was between the Mittlere Linterspitze and the Suedliche Lsptze. But the cable went mostly below the ridge-top thru there, so we unclipped and scrambled unprotected up on the true ridge - (being careful to test holds, and stopping our climbing if anyone was on the cables below us -- uncrowded that day).
Fortunately it was an uncrowded day, so there was only a small traffic-jam on the ladders going back the other way (north-bound against the generally south-bound flow) over the Mittlere Linderspitze. Then instead of going back again over the Nordliche Linderspitze (which didn't seem to have so much rock-scrambling), we just took the Heinrich-Noe trail around its east side.
Karwendel klettersteig
we did next. Excellent rock (surprisingly unpolished for so close to the lift), interesting climbing moves (esp on the traverse section with slopy footholds but positive handholds if found them). Well-protected by cable with well-placed anchors. I climbed it all free, Sharon grabbed the cable for aid in some places - (her comment afterward, "Where was the crux supposed to be?").
Only drawback: Too short.
. (made me think about coming back up the lift next time with a rope and draws to check how the rock was on some of the free-climbing routes)
After reaching the top of the Westliche Karwendelspitze (2385m), we took the normal route hiking/scrambing (some polished sections, some cable sections) back down to the lift.
Ken
P.S. off-topic
Since we had time left over after turning back half-way, on our way driving back to our base thru Innsbruck we stopped off and tried a couple of sport-climb routes at the Martinswand AV klettergarten - just five minutes off the A12 motorway, easy straightforward walk to the crag. Interesting moves, but some of the holds gave a whole new meaning to the word "polished" -- seemed like black porcelain. Anyway before I could decide if I was too scared to lead another route, lots of after-work Innsbruckers arrived to crowd the climbs, so we just left.
In reply to kenr:
The AV Klettergarten does indeed have some of the worst polish I've ever seen. Just to its left, though, there's a multipitch secfor that has nice rock that's still in good nick despite a fair amount of traffic. Although speaking of traffic: the main drwaback is that being directly above the autobahn does make commnication with one's partner a bit strenuous.
Depending on which direction you're staying from Innsbruck, Oberried in Ötztal is a very pleasant laid back little sport climbing spot
The AV Klettergarten does indeed have some of the worst polish I've ever seen. Just to its left, though, there's a multipitch secfor that has nice rock that's still in good nick despite a fair amount of traffic. Although speaking of traffic: the main drwaback is that being directly above the autobahn does make commnication with one's partner a bit strenuous.
Depending on which direction you're staying from Innsbruck, Oberried in Ötztal is a very pleasant laid back little sport climbing spot
I posted some more detailed reports on klettersteigs at
http://www.roberts-1.com/c/v/e/11d
also some routes not mentioned here (e.g. Pidinger, Mandlgrat).
Also some reports from a couple of months ago at
http://www.roberts-1.com/c/v/e/11b
(Koenigsjodler, Drachenwand, Gruenstein, Jubilaeumsgrat, Waidringer Steinplatte, Kaiser Max)
Be glad to find more sources of English-language reports.
Ken
http://www.roberts-1.com/c/v/e/11d
also some routes not mentioned here (e.g. Pidinger, Mandlgrat).
Also some reports from a couple of months ago at
http://www.roberts-1.com/c/v/e/11b
(Koenigsjodler, Drachenwand, Gruenstein, Jubilaeumsgrat, Waidringer Steinplatte, Kaiser Max)
Be glad to find more sources of English-language reports.
Ken
In reply to AlanLittle:
A couple of days I met a German hiker/klettersteiger on top of the Watzmannfrau. He was glad to share ideas in English with me as we were looking around at potential routes in all directions -- and he especially mentioned the
Schönfeldspitze as a fine peak to climb -- I was very impressed just looking at it.
Another friend mentioned the idea of extending that trip for additional days, to the Hochkeonig, or even to the Koenigssee.
He also spoke rather favorably of the Nuaracher route in the Lofer.
Ken
> Steinernes Meer: the Wildental on the Persailhorn, continue over the Breithorn to the Riemannhütte. Next day, Schönfeldspitze ...
A couple of days I met a German hiker/klettersteiger on top of the Watzmannfrau. He was glad to share ideas in English with me as we were looking around at potential routes in all directions -- and he especially mentioned the
Schönfeldspitze as a fine peak to climb -- I was very impressed just looking at it.
Another friend mentioned the idea of extending that trip for additional days, to the Hochkeonig, or even to the Koenigssee.
He also spoke rather favorably of the Nuaracher route in the Lofer.
Ken
In reply to kenr:
Wife & I two years ago walked Königssee to Riemannhütte, then Schönfeldspitze the next day. Excellent trip, I recommend it highly. First boat in the morning on Königssee, but don't go from St Bartholomä, take the boat all the way up to Saletalm. Pleasant, steep, uncrowded path up from the lake, amazing landscape.
That was our first and so far only trip to the area, but there are other fantastic looking possibílities, albeit more in the realm of Grade I/II unprotected scrambling than VF. For eaxmple Königssee early morning boat as above, Übersee-Röthsteig-Wasseralm (hut)-Teufelshörner. Next day Funtenseetauern.
Wife & I two years ago walked Königssee to Riemannhütte, then Schönfeldspitze the next day. Excellent trip, I recommend it highly. First boat in the morning on Königssee, but don't go from St Bartholomä, take the boat all the way up to Saletalm. Pleasant, steep, uncrowded path up from the lake, amazing landscape.
That was our first and so far only trip to the area, but there are other fantastic looking possibílities, albeit more in the realm of Grade I/II unprotected scrambling than VF. For eaxmple Königssee early morning boat as above, Übersee-Röthsteig-Wasseralm (hut)-Teufelshörner. Next day Funtenseetauern.
In reply to AlanLittle:
The AlpinVerlag.at guidebook has the Schoenfeldspitze on its CD-ROM (but not in its paper text). They suggest approaching the Riemann hut from the south (around Maria Alm) -- and that there might be up 1800 vertical meters of climbing and significant unprotected scrambling of a sort which would typically expected to have a cable on other via ferrata routes.
(another idea from the south might be loop with the Selbhorn and traversing the Schoenfeldspitze).
Ken
The AlpinVerlag.at guidebook has the Schoenfeldspitze on its CD-ROM (but not in its paper text). They suggest approaching the Riemann hut from the south (around Maria Alm) -- and that there might be up 1800 vertical meters of climbing and significant unprotected scrambling of a sort which would typically expected to have a cable on other via ferrata routes.
(another idea from the south might be loop with the Selbhorn and traversing the Schoenfeldspitze).
Ken
Watzmann traverse (Ueberschreitung) --
I did this yesterday in the unusual south-to-north direction (so it might not be a helpful characterization of the far more popular north-to-south direction). My impressions:
* as an alpine peak traverse, it delivers.
* if looking for lots of interesting climbing without too much approach/descent, this is not it.
* not over-protected: had significant unprotected sections where I might have expected a cable.
* not over-aided: had climbing sections where most other VF routes would had more metal pugs or rungs to aid foot-holds. - (but maybe this is because I was doing it in the "wrong" direction).
* polished rock in many sections, which was uncomfortable for me, especially going down-ward. (Perhaps this would have been less of a problem if I had been going in the popular direction, since I'll guess there was more polish closer to the popular Watzmann-haus, my direction had more downhill closer to that hut, while the "normal" direction would have most of its downhill far from the Watzmann-haus.
* some climbing directly on the ridge (which I favor), but most is below the ridge on the west side (more often exposed to wind than the east side).
* very big approach hike and very big descent -- over 2000 vertical meters (at least two huts along the way). I'd say that's a disproportionate amount of knee-and-ankle pounding for the amount of interesting Via Ferrata climbing moves + situations.
The route is popular -- I saw lots of people out doing it on a mid-week day. I think the reason for doing it is not the VF climbing itself, but the overall achievement of traversing all three summits of a great mountain (the highest completely within the borders of Germany).
Ken
I did this yesterday in the unusual south-to-north direction (so it might not be a helpful characterization of the far more popular north-to-south direction). My impressions:
* as an alpine peak traverse, it delivers.
* if looking for lots of interesting climbing without too much approach/descent, this is not it.
* not over-protected: had significant unprotected sections where I might have expected a cable.
* not over-aided: had climbing sections where most other VF routes would had more metal pugs or rungs to aid foot-holds. - (but maybe this is because I was doing it in the "wrong" direction).
* polished rock in many sections, which was uncomfortable for me, especially going down-ward. (Perhaps this would have been less of a problem if I had been going in the popular direction, since I'll guess there was more polish closer to the popular Watzmann-haus, my direction had more downhill closer to that hut, while the "normal" direction would have most of its downhill far from the Watzmann-haus.
* some climbing directly on the ridge (which I favor), but most is below the ridge on the west side (more often exposed to wind than the east side).
* very big approach hike and very big descent -- over 2000 vertical meters (at least two huts along the way). I'd say that's a disproportionate amount of knee-and-ankle pounding for the amount of interesting Via Ferrata climbing moves + situations.
The route is popular -- I saw lots of people out doing it on a mid-week day. I think the reason for doing it is not the VF climbing itself, but the overall achievement of traversing all three summits of a great mountain (the highest completely within the borders of Germany).
Ken
In reply to kenr:
Are you based out there locally in Pinzgau? My family are from that area. The Leogang KS is my local 'warm-up'.
Have you tried the Koenigsjodler on the Hoch Koenig? This is an absolute must. Long, varied, extreme, a full day out. Up to the Athur Haus one day, overnight stay and a very long walk back.
http://www.bergsteigen.at/de/touren.aspx?ID=121
Are you based out there locally in Pinzgau? My family are from that area. The Leogang KS is my local 'warm-up'.
Have you tried the Koenigsjodler on the Hoch Koenig? This is an absolute must. Long, varied, extreme, a full day out. Up to the Athur Haus one day, overnight stay and a very long walk back.
http://www.bergsteigen.at/de/touren.aspx?ID=121
In reply to kenr:
We walked from the Riemannhütte down on the south side to Saalfelden (to get the train home) and I wouldn't recommend it: steep, badly eroded in the sections where it hasn't been concreted over, busy. Does go through some improbable-looking terrain for an easy path, admittedly, but I'd still recommend the longer approach over the Steinernes Meer.
Schönfeldspitze is indeed not easy - especially for a route that's marked as a "path" on the DAV map - but the rock quality is outstanding compared to e.g. the Karwendel.
We walked from the Riemannhütte down on the south side to Saalfelden (to get the train home) and I wouldn't recommend it: steep, badly eroded in the sections where it hasn't been concreted over, busy. Does go through some improbable-looking terrain for an easy path, admittedly, but I'd still recommend the longer approach over the Steinernes Meer.
Schönfeldspitze is indeed not easy - especially for a route that's marked as a "path" on the DAV map - but the rock quality is outstanding compared to e.g. the Karwendel.
In reply to Jules King:
I asked some Austrian climbers on the Watzmann-Ostwand why anyone does the easier multi-pitch free-climbing routes on the south face Hochkoenig any more, since the Koenigsjodler via ferrata (roughly on the same wall) is so great. Their answer: "Because on weekends the Koenigsjodler KS is too crowded, and people won't let you overtake."
Ken
> Are you based out there locally in Pinzgau?
No, just a sometime visitor with a modern German-language guidebook. Very lucky for you to have the Leoganger KS as a regular warmup.> Have you tried the Koenigsjodler on the Hoch Koenig?
Yes back in June (and reported on it on this forum). Yes it was great. Look forward to doing again (without so much snow on the Birgkar descent).I asked some Austrian climbers on the Watzmann-Ostwand why anyone does the easier multi-pitch free-climbing routes on the south face Hochkoenig any more, since the Koenigsjodler via ferrata (roughly on the same wall) is so great. Their answer: "Because on weekends the Koenigsjodler KS is too crowded, and people won't let you overtake."
Ken
Dachstein: I made up a GPX file with latitude/longitude waypoints and tracks for some of the higher-altitude via ferrata routes in the Dachstein mountains, linked from
www.roberts-1.com/c/v/e/11d
since I loved the total adventure of doing the routes and reaching and connecting them, but thought that understanding where they were located was a bit complicated.
Alas no more high-mountain rock adventures for me this year in Austria, since my trip there had to end. And I suppose getting tough for anybody else either, after the snowfall a couple of weeks ago.
Ken
www.roberts-1.com/c/v/e/11d
since I loved the total adventure of doing the routes and reaching and connecting them, but thought that understanding where they were located was a bit complicated.
Alas no more high-mountain rock adventures for me this year in Austria, since my trip there had to end. And I suppose getting tough for anybody else either, after the snowfall a couple of weeks ago.
Ken
>And I suppose getting tough for anybody else either, after the snowfall a couple of weeks ago.
It is like mid summer here this weekend. All the snow from a few weeks ago has gone, at least in Western Austria. i was up on the top of the Silvretta pass yesterday and it was sunny and 17deg at 2000m. I reckon most of the klettersteigs would be ok until this hot weather breaks.
It is like mid summer here this weekend. All the snow from a few weeks ago has gone, at least in Western Austria. i was up on the top of the Silvretta pass yesterday and it was sunny and 17deg at 2000m. I reckon most of the klettersteigs would be ok until this hot weather breaks.
In reply to stevev:
Who would have guessed it would be so warm -- too bad I'm missing out -- but good news for somebody.
Ken
Who would have guessed it would be so warm -- too bad I'm missing out -- but good news for somebody.
Ken
In reply to kenr:
I agree. The Koenigsjodler KS is a virtual death trap at the weekends. Because of it's length and difficultly it gets loads of attention. It is difficult to overtake in places, but worse there have been a couple of deaths from stone fall - kicf-off.
The S face routes, and in fact climbing in general in the area is always quite. I've been enjoying peaceful ascents where I've has whole faces of the mountains there-about to my self for years. These mountians were the forcing grounds of peole like Bhul & Diemberger, the Huber Bros live over the border. If you are looking for great climbing check out routes by Adi Stocker, a local activist.
I agree. The Koenigsjodler KS is a virtual death trap at the weekends. Because of it's length and difficultly it gets loads of attention. It is difficult to overtake in places, but worse there have been a couple of deaths from stone fall - kicf-off.
The S face routes, and in fact climbing in general in the area is always quite. I've been enjoying peaceful ascents where I've has whole faces of the mountains there-about to my self for years. These mountians were the forcing grounds of peole like Bhul & Diemberger, the Huber Bros live over the border. If you are looking for great climbing check out routes by Adi Stocker, a local activist.
In reply to Jules King:
Good warning about the Koenigsjodler via ferrata -- more serious than I thought. Actually there are some popular VF routes in the Dolomites with substantial stonefall danger -- I don't what the statistics on injuries and deaths are for those.
Oddly, when I did the Koenigsjodler this year, I had the whole route to myself -- saw no one else the whole day until I got down to the hiking trail by the trees.
That was on a mid-week day in early June -- with a surprising amount of snow remaining on the south-facing Birgkar descent.
Ken
Good warning about the Koenigsjodler via ferrata -- more serious than I thought. Actually there are some popular VF routes in the Dolomites with substantial stonefall danger -- I don't what the statistics on injuries and deaths are for those.
Oddly, when I did the Koenigsjodler this year, I had the whole route to myself -- saw no one else the whole day until I got down to the hiking trail by the trees.
That was on a mid-week day in early June -- with a surprising amount of snow remaining on the south-facing Birgkar descent.
Ken
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