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Hello,
Basically I have fallen out of love with my current stead - a 2006 or 7 Specialized XC - my first full sus bike, but it weighs a lot, and I'm not fond of the riding position. I also have a bit of cash I've saved to spend on this.
I have ridden MTBs a lot over the last 18 years or so, Hard tails for at least 13years until I got this XC, and I definitely lean towards the Cross Country style bikes (hence going for the XC). I have recently revived my Aluminium Cannondale (16 years old) and this has reminded me of the lovely feeling of a nice light weight hard tail bike unfortunatley being ally and 16 years old, it is not really up to the battering of XC riding and is now a commuter.
Essentially what I want is a bike that I will be comforatble on for long distances off road, but is lively and easy to throw around. Being used to Hard tails, I'm not convinced I need the rear suspension, but I'm not fully ruling it out (it is nice on the down hills), and I need to consider a range of bikes to go and ride to make my choice and I'm hoping people can suggest a range of bikes to go and test ride.
Also, should I consider a 29r - are all bikes going this way soon?
And what is it with all these bikes being equipped with double chainsets instead of triples?
Criteria:
Cross Country/Race geometry
Front suspension at least, rear optional
Light Weight
Price range: £2K-£3k (I'm not looking to buy until they come down in the end of year sales)
On the list so far:
Specialised Epic Carbon
Stumpjumper Carbon
Cannondale Flash Carbon (2-4)
Cannondale Scalpel
Lapierre Zesty (is this more of an "All mountain"?
Lapierre X Flow
Whyte 20
Whyte 146
Cube Super HPC
Cube AMS110
Anything I really must avoid, or really ought to try?
Cheers for your help
Basically I have fallen out of love with my current stead - a 2006 or 7 Specialized XC - my first full sus bike, but it weighs a lot, and I'm not fond of the riding position. I also have a bit of cash I've saved to spend on this.
I have ridden MTBs a lot over the last 18 years or so, Hard tails for at least 13years until I got this XC, and I definitely lean towards the Cross Country style bikes (hence going for the XC). I have recently revived my Aluminium Cannondale (16 years old) and this has reminded me of the lovely feeling of a nice light weight hard tail bike unfortunatley being ally and 16 years old, it is not really up to the battering of XC riding and is now a commuter.
Essentially what I want is a bike that I will be comforatble on for long distances off road, but is lively and easy to throw around. Being used to Hard tails, I'm not convinced I need the rear suspension, but I'm not fully ruling it out (it is nice on the down hills), and I need to consider a range of bikes to go and ride to make my choice and I'm hoping people can suggest a range of bikes to go and test ride.
Also, should I consider a 29r - are all bikes going this way soon?
And what is it with all these bikes being equipped with double chainsets instead of triples?
Criteria:
Cross Country/Race geometry
Front suspension at least, rear optional
Light Weight
Price range: £2K-£3k (I'm not looking to buy until they come down in the end of year sales)
On the list so far:
Specialised Epic Carbon
Stumpjumper Carbon
Cannondale Flash Carbon (2-4)
Cannondale Scalpel
Lapierre Zesty (is this more of an "All mountain"?
Lapierre X Flow
Whyte 20
Whyte 146
Cube Super HPC
Cube AMS110
Anything I really must avoid, or really ought to try?
Cheers for your help
In reply to balmybaldwin: I know nothing about their mountain bikes, but I've just ordered my new roadie from Rose Bikes. They're a German internet-only company and the spec for the money is way beyond anything else I've seen. They have a UK agent who will provide test bikes, but you order online from Germany and then they deliver it.
www.rosebikes.co.uk
Mine should hopefully be here next week. I'm salivating...
www.rosebikes.co.uk
Mine should hopefully be here next week. I'm salivating...
In reply to balmybaldwin: Not on the list, but I love my Whyte E120. Nice and light and tackles everything I throw at it with impeccable manners.
In reply to balmybaldwin:
If your tall, or going for a hardtail, then definately consider a 29er.
I have both a full-suss and a hardtail - both Trek/Gary Fisher - and I love them, really got me back into MTBing
Best approach would be to find a demo day and try some out - I posted a link to demodaze earlier
Do you need a full-suss ? I'm also more into XC than DH, but feel happier on the FS on technical descents. Plus I have a saddle-dropper(Reverb) on the FS, and that makes a huge difference. Then again, I often suprise myself how much you can do on a hardtail, and how much faster generally it is.
Whatever bike you buy, I'd check the seatpost diameter to see if you can fit a Reverb, and also get Tubless ready rims.
If your tall, or going for a hardtail, then definately consider a 29er.
I have both a full-suss and a hardtail - both Trek/Gary Fisher - and I love them, really got me back into MTBing
Best approach would be to find a demo day and try some out - I posted a link to demodaze earlier
Do you need a full-suss ? I'm also more into XC than DH, but feel happier on the FS on technical descents. Plus I have a saddle-dropper(Reverb) on the FS, and that makes a huge difference. Then again, I often suprise myself how much you can do on a hardtail, and how much faster generally it is.
Whatever bike you buy, I'd check the seatpost diameter to see if you can fit a Reverb, and also get Tubless ready rims.
In reply to balmybaldwin: You may want to consider some of the on-one bikes. I have an on-one inbred 29er (with no suspension), that I'm using as a touring bike. Not that I'm suggesting an inbred, but as a result of getting that I did spend a fair bit of time looking at on-one and they do seem to have a pretty good range of bikes and the prices are pretty good.
In reply to andy:
I'd be very interested to know how you get on. Their bikes seem good value. Couldn't find details of the UK test contact though?
> (In reply to balmybaldwin) I know nothing about their mountain bikes, but I've just ordered my new roadie from Rose Bikes. They're a German internet-only company and the spec for the money is way beyond anything else I've seen. They have a UK agent who will provide test bikes, but you order online from Germany and then they deliver it.
>
> www.rosebikes.co.uk
>
> Mine should hopefully be here next week. I'm salivating...
>
> www.rosebikes.co.uk
>
> Mine should hopefully be here next week. I'm salivating...
I'd be very interested to know how you get on. Their bikes seem good value. Couldn't find details of the UK test contact though?
In reply to balmybaldwin:
Hi mate.
I have had my Rock Lobster 853 steel framed hardtail for about 4 years, and couldn't recommend it enough. The spec seems to have changed since I bought mine, I got XT everything, Fox 32 forks and raceface finishing kit, but as far as I'm aware, if you give them a ring they will do a custom order for you with any components you wish to have. (They build them from the frame up anyway).
It is possibly the best value hardtail on the market and the geometry and ride is sensational for a bike this cheap.
Give them a ring, I think you would be able to get XTR and top-drawer forks for under £2000.
The only problem is trying one, unless you can visit the store itself you'd have to risk it. I didn't try one and have found it perfect.
http://www.merlincycles.co.uk/Bike+Shop/Bikes/Mountain+Bikes/Rock+Lobster+B...
http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/bikes/mountain/product/review-merlin...
http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=16086628
Hi mate.
I have had my Rock Lobster 853 steel framed hardtail for about 4 years, and couldn't recommend it enough. The spec seems to have changed since I bought mine, I got XT everything, Fox 32 forks and raceface finishing kit, but as far as I'm aware, if you give them a ring they will do a custom order for you with any components you wish to have. (They build them from the frame up anyway).
It is possibly the best value hardtail on the market and the geometry and ride is sensational for a bike this cheap.
Give them a ring, I think you would be able to get XTR and top-drawer forks for under £2000.
The only problem is trying one, unless you can visit the store itself you'd have to risk it. I didn't try one and have found it perfect.
http://www.merlincycles.co.uk/Bike+Shop/Bikes/Mountain+Bikes/Rock+Lobster+B...
http://www.bikeradar.com/gear/category/bikes/mountain/product/review-merlin...
http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=16086628
In reply to balmybaldwin:
Oh and with regard to doubles instead of triples, its to save weight. The up side is its less maintainance, cheaper and lighter, downside is less choice of gears, super steep hills may be a problem unless you're really fit. You can specify the size of the rings though to get something to suit your individual fitness level!
Oh and with regard to doubles instead of triples, its to save weight. The up side is its less maintainance, cheaper and lighter, downside is less choice of gears, super steep hills may be a problem unless you're really fit. You can specify the size of the rings though to get something to suit your individual fitness level!
In reply to blurty:
It's a lad called Findlay. If you look on Rose's website on the contact bit there's a section for "English speaking contacts". There's a thread on bike radar that says he apparently offered to fly up to Scotland with some bikes, but this chap seems to have had a good experience:
http://ifonlyiwerebelgian.com/2012/02/
Scroll down to the Feb 10th posting.
> (In reply to andy)
> [...]
>
> I'd be very interested to know how you get on. Their bikes seem good value. Couldn't find details of the UK test contact though?
> [...]
>
> I'd be very interested to know how you get on. Their bikes seem good value. Couldn't find details of the UK test contact though?
It's a lad called Findlay. If you look on Rose's website on the contact bit there's a section for "English speaking contacts". There's a thread on bike radar that says he apparently offered to fly up to Scotland with some bikes, but this chap seems to have had a good experience:
http://ifonlyiwerebelgian.com/2012/02/
Scroll down to the Feb 10th posting.
In reply to balmybaldwin: I've just built a specialised S-Works HT, and its amazing, very fast and light, to the point I need to slow down as since building if I've not ridden my full sus all mountain bike but still tackling the same kind of riding... The frame is a couple of years old, 26" but everything else is more or less new kit.
I'm now looking at a On-One Inbred as a touring bike, something I can go everywhere on... and maybe ride that bit harder than the s-works...
I'm now looking at a On-One Inbred as a touring bike, something I can go everywhere on... and maybe ride that bit harder than the s-works...
In reply to andy: Thanks andy
In reply to balmybaldwin:
Thanksfor the recomendations.. I have also now added to the list
Trek Fuel 26/Flyte 29"
Whyte E120
Rose Bikes (If I can get to ride one)
It seems specialized only do 29rs now, and I think I'll have a good look at them.. LBS has a Fuel 26" and a Flyte 29" to have a go on to compare
Thanksfor the recomendations.. I have also now added to the list
Trek Fuel 26/Flyte 29"
Whyte E120
Rose Bikes (If I can get to ride one)
It seems specialized only do 29rs now, and I think I'll have a good look at them.. LBS has a Fuel 26" and a Flyte 29" to have a go on to compare
In reply to balmybaldwin: Gaint Anthem
In reply to balmybaldwin: With that budget you can certainly look at a top range bespoke hardtail frame with all the weightsaving bling you like bolted on.
I wouldnt go for an allu hard tail. Steel has a better feel. Titanium is supposed to be superb but Ive never had the pleasure of riding one, Then of course there are various carbon HTs for XC racing.
I ride a steel P7 and its been superb. Sadly since my operation I have a lot of bum pain and as I cannot afford a full sus at the moment Ive ordered a Cane Creek Thudbuster seatpost which may be worth fitting to your new hardtail - they seem to get universally rave reviews.
If going steel hand made british bikes like Cotic Soul and B,Fe and Ragleys Blue Pig are all 140mm travel "hardcore hardtails" which will take on the full sussers at the trail centre as will the Orange P7. Adjustable forks are useful for climbing.
If doing mainly XC 100mm of travel is probably enough.
Im jealous - you have a lot of good choices with your budget.
I wouldnt go for an allu hard tail. Steel has a better feel. Titanium is supposed to be superb but Ive never had the pleasure of riding one, Then of course there are various carbon HTs for XC racing.
I ride a steel P7 and its been superb. Sadly since my operation I have a lot of bum pain and as I cannot afford a full sus at the moment Ive ordered a Cane Creek Thudbuster seatpost which may be worth fitting to your new hardtail - they seem to get universally rave reviews.
If going steel hand made british bikes like Cotic Soul and B,Fe and Ragleys Blue Pig are all 140mm travel "hardcore hardtails" which will take on the full sussers at the trail centre as will the Orange P7. Adjustable forks are useful for climbing.
If doing mainly XC 100mm of travel is probably enough.
Im jealous - you have a lot of good choices with your budget.
In reply to balmybaldwin: Check out Ghost - the AMR 5900 is the best bike I've ever ridden - most reliable too.
In reply to Tom Hutton: Ghost bikes are available from a few UK dealers. Canyon and Rose are internet only.
In reply to Tom Hutton: Ghost,Orange,LaPierre and possibly Ibis is my shortlist Tom. I will have to pick your brains when I get my budget together.
In reply to David Hooper:
The P7 and Cotic BFe are brilliant but not sure they are the best choice of XC stuff. A blinged up Cotic Soul might fit the bill a bit better.
The P7 and Cotic BFe are brilliant but not sure they are the best choice of XC stuff. A blinged up Cotic Soul might fit the bill a bit better.
In reply to David Hooper: I like the idea of me having brains! Happy to talk about my Ghost though...
In reply to David Hooper: I went from a specialized S works enduro (2003) to a cotic Soul, with adjustable rockshox rev fork (100-140mm travel) and a titanium seat post and saddle. I really find it offers some middle ground between a HT and full susser. The reynolds 853 steel frame and titanium post etc really take the sting out of the bunps while keeping the power direct through the back wheel.
It depends what you want though, if you want a HT for trail riding I think this bike or similar steel HT is great, if you want a HT XC race machine something stiffer and lighter and with less travel on the fork might suit better. I'm not a fan of carbon MTB's tho, too easy to damage if the frame take a dink its expensive.
It depends what you want though, if you want a HT for trail riding I think this bike or similar steel HT is great, if you want a HT XC race machine something stiffer and lighter and with less travel on the fork might suit better. I'm not a fan of carbon MTB's tho, too easy to damage if the frame take a dink its expensive.
In reply to balmybaldwin: Personally for what you're looking for I'd go Canyon. They're without a shadow of a doubt the best value bikes on the market at the moment. For 1.7k you'll get a full xtr alloy hardtail. Up that to 2.5K and you'll get a 20lb carbon fibre XTR race machine. If you decide to go for a full sus you can get a carbon fibre 100mm racing bike. Should you decide to go for something with a bit more of a trail balance you'll get a 120mm machine with full XTR for 2.5k. They consistently get great reviews in terms of both handling and value for money and even though they're a German factory direct brand they also have a UK service representative so should you have the misfortune of having any issues with yours there's someone comparatively local to talk to.
Check em out http://www.canyon.com/_uk/shop/?type=mtb#tab-mountainbikes
Check em out http://www.canyon.com/_uk/shop/?type=mtb#tab-mountainbikes
In reply to Frank4short: As I said earlier I don't know a right lot about MTBs but for road bikes I found Rose more appealing - with Canyon you undoubtedly get phenomenal value, but you get what you're given. Rose are equally good value (in fact better on some models as Canyon save a bit on wheels), but their site also has this amazing configurator thingy that means you can swap pretty much any component and get exactly what you want.
I was looking at either Canyon or Rose for my new roadie but in the end a discontinued 2011 Red Bull from Rose was such a spectacular deal I couldn't turn it down.
I was looking at either Canyon or Rose for my new roadie but in the end a discontinued 2011 Red Bull from Rose was such a spectacular deal I couldn't turn it down.
In reply to andy: A quick look at bike radar would indicate that the Rose Bikes road bikes get very good reviews, whereas the mtbs only get average reviews. However if you were to do the same thing for canyons they consistently get excellent reviews for both mtb and road bikes. Now for want of a better way to put it, whilst they both offer brilliant value for money, clearly canyon have got their mtb geometry/handling a lot more sorted than Rose have.
In reply to balmybaldwin: I love my zesty , light , climbs well and is great fun to ride
In reply to balmybaldwin: As said above, get a top range frame and build your own, I did that with a Cotic Soul and its far more satisfying and you can spec what you like...it can be at first glance more expensive but I bought a Marin Riftzone and love it, but ended up changing loads of stuff on it anyway.
The Cotic Soul is an amazing steel frame(www.cotic.co.uk). Fitted an adjustable fork (Fox Talus) so can have it in race mode at 100mm travel, or for the gnarly stuff at 150mm...the frame can cope with either. Fitted flat bars on it.
The list you have is great, but building your own is better, as long a you take your time, get good deals (otherwise your 3k top range will be tested!).
The Cotic Soul is an amazing steel frame(www.cotic.co.uk). Fitted an adjustable fork (Fox Talus) so can have it in race mode at 100mm travel, or for the gnarly stuff at 150mm...the frame can cope with either. Fitted flat bars on it.
The list you have is great, but building your own is better, as long a you take your time, get good deals (otherwise your 3k top range will be tested!).
In reply to Frank4short: I can well believe it - never looked at the MTB reviews but the Rose road frames get solid reviews and the flexibility to swap out bits made it the better option for me (having said that I've bought a model from last year without the option to customise, but full Dura Ace with a grand off softened the blow!).
In reply to balmybaldwin:
Have you checked out the YT Industries Wicked, V similar to Canyon, but even cheaper, getting good reviews at the minute.
Maybe a bit more AM than you require, but 2400 euros for an X0 equipped stead.
Have you checked out the YT Industries Wicked, V similar to Canyon, but even cheaper, getting good reviews at the minute.
Maybe a bit more AM than you require, but 2400 euros for an X0 equipped stead.
In reply to balmybaldwin: Im selling my Orange ST4 pro if you were interested. £3200 new. Its been out about 25-30 times. Great bike! Just need some cash. £1700 to a good home! Edinburgh/Peebles area.
In reply to balmybaldwin:
I've got a Zesty and it's ace but probably not what you want from your description of the kind of riding you do.
A few folk have namechecked the Cotic Soul but you might want to consider this: http://www.cotic.co.uk/product/solaris basically a 29er Soul.
29ers are not the total revolution some would have you believe but the big wheels do roll better and give better traction.
As far as the double / triple thing goes I ditched my big ring when I realised I was only using it to knock holes in logs or scratch rocks. If you are wanting to charge hard XC then you might need it but I haven't missed it once since I ditched it.
I've got a Zesty and it's ace but probably not what you want from your description of the kind of riding you do.
A few folk have namechecked the Cotic Soul but you might want to consider this: http://www.cotic.co.uk/product/solaris basically a 29er Soul.
29ers are not the total revolution some would have you believe but the big wheels do roll better and give better traction.
As far as the double / triple thing goes I ditched my big ring when I realised I was only using it to knock holes in logs or scratch rocks. If you are wanting to charge hard XC then you might need it but I haven't missed it once since I ditched it.
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