In reply to neil the weak:
> (In reply to Robert Durran)
> However what many people (in fact the majority of indoor climbing customers I suspect) want I think, is a nice comfortable environment to hang out in and toprope easier routes (up to 6bish?) with their mates.
Evidently.
> Many are not terribly concerned with improvement, training, leading or pushing themselves awfully hard.
Evidently.
> This might seem like a strange mindset (or waste of time) to you but it's the commercial reality and sadly for ratho it's these customers it caters to least well.
You are, of course, absolutely right - Ratho provides a brilliant service to a pretty small regular hardcore, subsidised by these hard done by customers. This is great for the hardcore as long as this precarious balance is maintained.
> Whatever else you might say about alien one, it knows who it's customers are....
It keeps Ratho quiet. Again great for the Ratho hardcore as long as it can remain sustainable.