/ Recommend me some Double Ropes

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sianabanana - on 12 Jun 2012
Up until now I have only been leading on a single rope, but it has come the time when I think to reduce rope drag and to aid climbing in a 3, I should get two ropes.

The other weekend I climbed on single Beal Joker, and this kind of appealed to me as its triple rated.

I haven't got the greatest of budgets ( around 200 for both)

Any advice anyone?
wivanov - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

I use two Mammut Genesis 8.5mm x 60m ropes. I like them a lot.
GrahamD - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to clifffhanger:

Me too, but I think you will struggle to get a pair for 200
sianabanana - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to clifffhanger:

Would it just be the weight that would make a pair of these better than a pair of jokers?
GrahamD - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

Don't get too hung up with getting a pair - most climbers climb with a partner who brings a totally different type of rope to yours.

A skinny single and a double work fine together.
sianabanana - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to GrahamD:
I thought that you should have the same diameter?
1poundSOCKS - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana: I just bought a pair of Tendon Ambitions 60m 1/2 ropes, about 185 for the pair from Banana Fingers. I haven't used them yet but they don't seem much different the Mammut's I have looked at, and they're a lot cheaper.

Mathew.
GrahamD - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

Ideally, but it isn't that important as ropes are clipped independantly.

The only situation where it might be important are when using the really thin ice climbing ropes with both ropes clipped through the same gear but that isn't what we are talking about here.
sianabanana - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to GrahamD:

I thought it was important for the belaying aspect - ie being able to break both ropes easily. If one was a larger diameter you might not grip it as well?
GrahamD - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

In practice if the ropes aren't that different it makes no difference.
wivanov - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

Never used the Joker that I can recall so I really can't comment. I've used the Genesis 8.5 and, before that, a pair of Beal 8.8mm doubles. Being triple rated, the Joker sounds like it could be a nice compromise for you.

I sometimes use one of my Genesis paired with a partner's 10.2 - only because he prefers leading on SRT and I prefer DRT. Yeah, it's a heavier combination :( We haven't had any problems braking or abseiling with this setup. (Although, I'm slowly converting him to the wisdom of DRT)

The only potential problem I can think of is a higher combined impact force if a fall occurs on both ropes immediately at the belay station. I suppose that can be mitigated by getting a piece in right away or leaving a bit of slack in one of the ropes.

I bought the Genesis ropes when I saw they were on sale. BTW, being from the States, I really don't have a feel for what "around 200" is...
sianabanana - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

Thanks for the info so far.

So what i think im asking is - other than price - is there a disadvantage to getting a triple rated rope rather than halfs?
GrahamD - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

If I wereonly getting two ropes, I would get one that could be used as a single and a standard half rope.
sianabanana - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to GrahamD:

So i currently have a 60m single rope - could i get a half to go with it?
sianabanana - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to clifffhanger:

Thanks for that.

I can get two beal jokers (50m) for 210.
or two Tendon ambition 8.5 (60m) for 185
or two Eldelrid Shikra 8.5mm x 50m for 170

What I was thinking was - if there is not too much difference in price (30~) would I be better going for the beal joker?

As I am buying them now together as a pair, so could get the same thickness etc to avoid different impact forces?
mattrm - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

What size is the 60m single that you currently have? If it's similar to the joker, then I'd be tempted to do that. The Joker looks like a nice rope. I'm currently tempted to buy a pair myself.

I know that some people do use two single ropes as double ropes and apart from the weight, then it's fine.

Personally I have a pair of 8mm ropes and I'd say if you're getting a pair of ropes, then I'd go for 8.5mm or above. They generally handle better, tangle less and prussiks grip on larger ropes much easier. They're just a bit heavier, but for normal single pitch trad, that's not a problem.
mattrm - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

Sorry for the Joker meant use the Joker and your existing single together. If you're keen to save some cash.
wivanov - on 12 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:
> (In reply to GrahamD)
>
> So i currently have a 60m single rope - could i get a half to go with it?

Sure. If you don't mind the weight, why not? I've used this combination myself. Seems like you even have a bit more flexibility in terms of what you can do. When the time comes, you may decide to replace the 60m single rope with another Joker (or other half rope). For now, save some $$

Disadvantages:
Extra weight
Should NOT be used as twins (both clipped in each piece)

Advantages:
Can be used are half/doubles
Can be used as single with a tag line
Longer abseils
Can bring up two seconds at the same time
Use your single rope for toproping
If your second is stuck she can prusick up the single and you can belay her on the half rope.
Probably some others I can't think of right now...
Mark / Alps - on 13 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:
There are advantages and disadvantages. To answer your question the disadvantages include:
1) When used as a single rope they are not quite as robust as a dedicated single rope - they will tend to wear more quickly. Do not waste the rope on the wall....
2) Being skinny and quite slick ( the rope not me! ) you need to pay particular attention when belaying; some belay devices grip them well others can feel too slick. I use an ATC which works brilliantly.
3) I would need to double check but I think they take less falls compared to a dedicated half rope.

If aware of these disadvantages having a triple rated and a half rope combination is great. That's what I often use. However, as mentioned by others why not buy a rope combination with a friend / partner / club members. Buy one half rope and a triple rated between you...
Doing a variety of climbing we have built up a range of different ropes over time. Two halves, wall rope, sport single, heavier single for easier alpine / winter use and the awesomely lovely triple rated. Divorce settlement will be tricky...
sianabanana - on 13 Jun 2012
In reply to Mark / Alps:

Hi

I already have a long single for sport and a short single for indoors.

I am buying rope as I am taking others out and they do not have rope themselves.

I am mostly climbing with non experienced people so don't have the advantage of sharing ropes.
ads.ukclimbing.com
Bomber on 13 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:
Hi

Urban rock have some pretty good deals on Beal ropes, i would go and check them out.

Beal Cobra 2, 8.6 mm, Golden Dry, 60m, 220
Beal Cobra 2, Dry cover, 8.6 mm, 60m, 200.

I also find the Beal website very good.
Trevor Langhorne on 13 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

V12 have a pair deal on Mammut Phoenix, an 8mm "skinny" half rope (which I think are lovely ropes - I have a pair which replaced a pair of Mammut genesis and I much prefer the feel and handling of the Phoenix). They are selling 2 * 50m Phoenix which have a superdry coating as standard for a mere 175. Just need to be careful with your belay plate as they are slick, I use a WC VC Pro II but a reverso 3 or ATC-XP would be just as good.
sianabanana - on 13 Jun 2012
In reply to Bomber:

Would you recommend these over Beal Jokers then?

I think this is what im asking.... I can get two half ropes for around the same price as two triple rated ropes. So why would you not go for two triple rated ropes?

I'm thinking that this would give more flexibility if you did want to use just one.

Or is it that they are just less durable etc that its better to buy just half ropes and use my current single if i wanted a single.

I wouldn't use the the triple rated rope for sport or anything like that so shouldn't be taking loads of falls or anything.
sianabanana - on 13 Jun 2012
In reply to Bomber:

Thanks for the link though, i think this is the best priced deal i have seen so far.
http://www.urbanrock.com/cobra-2-drycover-50m-pair-deal

That would make them 50 cheaper than the Jokers, that might be enough to make my mind up?
Bomber on 14 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

Hi

Sorry never used the Beal Jokers so am unable to give an opinion on these. From research it seems like they are a great jack of all trades, but this would also be their biggest disadvantage.

In my research for a rope i spent quite a bit of time searching various sites, which i feel the Beal one is excellent, it allows you to compare various (Beal) ropes against each other and gives you recommendations for usage.

The Joker is 9.1 mm and 53g per meter whilst the Cobra is 8.6 mm and 48g per meter. How important is weight? Would you be better off with a 60m rope instead of a 50m?

The choice of coating also makes a difference to cost, again depends on intended usage.

Hope this is of some help.

sianabanana - on 14 Jun 2012
In reply to Bomber:

If I could get dry treatment then I would but I don't think its really too important at the moment.

As for 60m vs 50m - everyone i have spoken to suggests that 60m for doubles is over kill

Also carrying 50m instead of 60m will obviously cut down on overall weight?

So why would being a jack of all trades be a disadvantage? The extra weight and less durability?

I am tempted to think this wont be a problem for me as i wouldnt wear them out by sport climbing and i dont think i would even notice the weight difference.
Kaya - on 15 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana: If it is for English Trad get 50s as 60m is a nightmare on some small ledge. I would recommend all ways using a buggett or similar device for skinny ropes.
unless your operating at a high level the weight in not important, Super dry/ Golden Dry will last longer.
I climb in Cornwall and personally use Jokers as my half rope, or as a single on really long single pitch routes. it is slightly thicker so is a bit better for those unseen sharp edges, better for ascending and can be used as a single if need be.

If I am heading out for a chilled day ill use a hybrid system as well and find it works perfectly.
sianabanana - on 17 Jun 2012
In reply to Kaya:

Thanks for the insight Kaya.
McKEuan - on 17 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana:

Hello!!

Check out urban rock, they always have wicked deals on doubles and now is no exception ;)

http://www.urbanrock.com/half-double-rope-pair-deals

I bought some Mammut obsessions last year and love them. For the price they are a fantastic rope and being mammu are top quality. Plus Urban rock are amazing at delivery and customer service, receieved my within 2 days of ordering.

Hope this helps :)
mrchewy - on 17 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana: I just bought a pair of Edelrid Merlin 8mm dry ropes for well under 200 from Cotswolds. Can't remember how much exactly but they are 60m in length. I'm liking them so far.
Kaya - on 19 Jun 2012
In reply to sianabanana: So go spill the beans, what did you get?

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