/ Tips for organising/carrying/storing rack (off the harness)

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martinph78 on 05 Nov 2012
Hi all,

My rack has just got bigger. I am stripping out some stuff to make room for my new stuff and don't think it excessive for the mixture of crags/locations I climb at.

Obviously I'll only put on my harness what I think I'll need for the route, but I am looking for tips on storing the rack and moving it from say my local crag (short walk in) to the bottom of needle ridge (long walk in), and to help keep an eye on all my gear (easily spot if anything is, erm, missing).

Currently I have an old 120cm dyneema sling that I've tied knots in every 150cm to give me 8 loops to clip gear to. This seems ok. I then lower this carefully into my rucksack, usually on top of my shoes. Harness and helmet sit on top (as that's the order I tend to gear up).

Usually when I lift the sling out things are still in a pretty big tangle.

I have tried laying the rack out on a towel and rolling it, which worked well but was very bulky.

Any other tips/ideas? I guess everyone has there own way!
Robert Durran - on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:

Just in case this is a serious post, may I suggest just clipping together similar bits of gear (cams, quickdraws etc.) and chucking it in your rucksack
The Norris - on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:

I just clip everything to a loop of 7mm cord. I sometimes keep similar bits of kit clipped next to each other if im feeling a bit ocd that day. Not had any tangling problems.
Madden - on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978: Instead of a towel, you could use a bin liner?
cuppatea on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:

Group things together in small plastic bags? Dog poo bags / nappy sacks are lightweight.
Adam Hughes - on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978: I use my slings to group my rack and it works great,
I clip all my wires to a sling and place in rucksack then hexes to another sling, cams to another then belay devices spare crabs etc to another sling, it all comes back out neatly and it's easy to see what's missing :)
Merlin - on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:


Gear that gets damaged if badly twisted (cams and wires) are racked on a 120 sling, using the excess length to wrap the bundle tightly togeather so they don't get tangled togeather. That goes in the pack first.

Everything else goes on another sling, which is dumped in on top of the the previous sling in the pack.
Northern Climber on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978: have you tried flight cases with foam inserts. you'll need to cut some recesses into the foam inserts so that they fit each piece of gear. its brilliant for keeping your gear neat and tidy and is great when it comes to flying for those rock trips abroad - pre packed in cases that'll handle the flight!



alternatively you could do what the rest of us do and just put your gear into your rucksack. much easier to carry this way.
martinph78 on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Merlin:
>
> Gear that gets damaged if badly twisted (cams and wires) are racked on a 120 sling, using the excess length to wrap the bundle tightly togeather so they don't get tangled togeather. That goes in the pack first.
>
> Everything else goes on another sling, which is dumped in on top of the the previous sling in the pack.

Like that idea, will give it a go, thanks. It is the cams and wires that are getting tangled together.



martinph78 on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Adam Hughes: Will try using seperate slings instead of one, thanks.
martinph78 on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to The Norris: I find everything comes out pretty tangled like this, hence why I knotted an old, frayed sling to keep things seperated a bit. Didn't work either lol.
martinph78 on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978: Regarding the bag ideas, I do have a nylon hessian type sack that I put my rack in (acts like a rucksack liner as well) and a smaller one for slings.

I do keep it all in a rucksack, but as I said, when I come to pull it all out at the ottom of a climb it's often tangled. Plus I can't believe everyone just dumps all their bits in loose?
Dr.S at work - on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:
I find a boot bag (footie) works really well for lots of gear - use one for my (not very big) rack, and keeps stuff tidy and easy to pack.
Kevster - on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:
I leave it permanently on my harness, good to go. Seems to work fine.
martinph78 on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Robert Durran: It is a serious post. Not sure why it wouldn't be.

If I just drop bits of gear in my pack I will/do forget something (ie my prussiks, or my nut key usually). I do clip my draws, cams, etc together in groups, then on a sling.

Quite like the idea of seperate slings for different groups of gear.

One advantage with my method (the knotted 120cm sling) is that when I pull it out of my pack I can hang it on a nut/spike/branch and select my gear/re-rack the sling at the start/end of the day.

Sure I'm not the only one who finds that sort of thing helpful in keeping track of stuff?

Thanks for the suggestions.
martinph78 on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Kevster: Can see how that works well if you use the same rack each time, and would do that if I was on multi-day climbs as well.

I spend as much time top roping mates as I do leading so don't always take my rack with me, hence why I looked towards having an easy way of removing my rack from my rucksack whilst keeping everything organised.
martinph78 on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Dr.S at work: Like that idea a lot, cheers.
butteredfrog - on 05 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:

I leave the servants to worry about this sort of thing! This post was produced by a ghost writer (in case you wondered) :)
jwa - on 06 Nov 2012
I got hold of a load of old harness bags a little while back and keep things in them. I have my rack split into screwgates and slings, quickdraws, passive pro, cams. Each type of gear gets its own bag. Helpful if I'm doing a sport, trad or top rope day just to take the things I need neatly organised in the relevant bag. Belay device and prusiks always stay on the harness.
David Ponting on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978: For storage, I have it all clipped to a few lengths of cut-up old prussiks (about 30cm long, ends double-fisherman's knotted together) which I lay in a box that slides under the bed: nuts; hexes; cams; slings; 'draws; ice; (spare SGs, prussiks, biners, ascenders...); and finally "old stuff". The belay plate, nut key and one short prussik stay on the harness.

I then take what I want to take for the trip from these and clip it to an old 4' sling before shoving it in the pack if there's a walk-in, or loose in the boot of the car if not. The regular racking and deracking avoids the tangles you describe, and I can check that everything is there and in good nick as I go. Once I've loaded my harness, I then throw the (nearly empty) 4' sling in my bag (rope-bag if cragging) so I don't forget it!

That said, I only climb once a fortnight or once a month, so it isn't too much of a time burden - it goes with checking the car as a necessary ritual before something exciting happens...
GridNorth - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978: I put my nuts in a small nylon bag krabs first i.e. krabs in the bottom of the bag with the nuts just pointing out of the top. I store my Cams in a crampon bag, the type that is formed and not just a loose folder. This also offers some protection to the Cams. I keep QD's on bits of cord with plastic tubing round them. I use two as one is too bulky. Longer slings are just dropped in the sack loose.

It makes everything easy to transfer from sack to sack, sack to harness and sack to cupboard and easy to check that everything is there.

Thing is though that I'm a bit anal when it comes to racking and storing gear. :-)
Robert Durran - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to GridNorth:
> Thing is though that I'm a bit anal when it comes to racking and storing gear. :-)

Well this thread is certainly the right place to come for extreme anality. Hilarious.



GridNorth - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Robert Durran: But where else would you discuss trivia on a rainy, dismal afternoon :-)
martinph78 on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Robert Durran:
> (In reply to GridNorth)
> [...]
>
> Well this thread is certainly the right place to come for extreme anality. Hilarious.


Agreed, but it isn't as daft as half of the threads here ;P I guess I'll never be in the "throw it all loose in your bag" crowd and I'll not reach the "seperate bag for everything" group either. I do like having things racked on slings as these will be used anyway. And I do think it makes sense to have a sytsem that allows you to check gear regularly/easily.

As I said, I'm pretty forgetful. Yes, I've got to the crag and forgotten my belay device, got half way to the climbing wall and forgotten my shoes, etc. Hence why I need to be more organised!

That and I am cautious of damaging kit if it's just thrown in (I'm thinking slings on cams for example).

I'm pretty disorganised at the crag and on the rock compared to many. I guess we all have our little quirks :)

Some more good ideas, cheers.
jonnie3430 - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:

Instead of racking on an old sling, rack on a new sling and add a couple of carabiners. Once all the gear is off you can then use it as a long runner. Loops are just faff, 8 cams, 2 crabs of nuts and 14 runners is easy to count.
airbournegrapefruit on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978: Surely if you climb at so many different locations and have a wealth of experience you should have worked out a system that works for you by now?!

Everyone has their own way of doing things and this is no different.

When at home my gear is stored in two large boxes, one with winter kit and the other summer. Solid unlikely to get damaged things (krabs mainly) go at the bottom on top of my shoes and first aid kit. Above this go nuts and hexes and then above that are cams and draws and then slings. On top of all that goes my harness, helmet, shell and warm kit.
martinph78 on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to airbournegrapefruit:

> Everyone has their own way of doing things and this is no different.

Totally agree and said that in my opening post:

>Any other tips/ideas? I guess everyone has there own way!


I never said I have a wealth of experience, I have a way that's ok but no harm in discussing other ways. Someone else may have read my way and thought that sounded ok.

I'm the only one who has/carries a rack in our group so I don't have a wealth of other peoples knowledge/tips/experience to gain from. I am learning all of the time, hence why I'm stripping bits out of my rack I don't use and tryng to organise/consolidate the gear I do.

Have you never seen someone do something and think "I like that" and then gone on to do it that way yourself?



airbournegrapefruit on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978: Maybe begin to think about a rack that you'd be ok with at the majority of locations?

There aren't many places you'd need more than a few cams, a couple of hexes, a rack or two of nuts and a load of extenders (try ditching your standard quickdraws and replacing them with looped slings). I climb all over the country and find this to be enough without weighing me down too much and doesn't really restrict the type of placement I have available.

And yes I have seen and copied, with the optimal word there being 'seen'. Maybe vary who you climb with a bit. I have learnt a fair few things that have and haven't worked for me off people I have climbed with who use this forum. There must be times when you are free and your regular partner(s) aren't?? Put a post out on here and see what happens. You'll probably find that your overall perspective on climbing alters by climbing with different people.
martinph78 on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to airbournegrapefruit: I did meet with one member of the forum doing his SPA at the start of the year and picked up lots of tips, especially regarding rope management/quicker setting of anchors. I should do this more often as you say, it is the best way to learn. Also I do need to climb with someone who climbs harder grades than as I know this pushes me harder as well.

Might be the wrong time of year to start looking for new partners lol.

Cheers, Martin.

PS - pretty organised now. Got everything clipped in groups on several slings and I like that. Seems to be working. Will try it next time I'm out.
Mr. K - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978: I employ a small Philipino boy to transport my rack from crag to crag with each piece of gear arranged neatly upon a purple velvet gear cushion. Gear cushions are available from DMM in a range of sizes.

Before this I used to clip it all to a 60cm sling, lob it in my bag and hope for the best. =o)
Cameron94 on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978: I put my rack on my harness and just chuck it into my bag. usually works fine for me. Any gear that I'm taking not on the harness goes onto a sling!
metal arms on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:

I shrink wrap and number everything. If you get more gear then you can use consecutive numbers so as long as you keep a note of what number you are up to it is easy to find if anything is missing. The shrink wrapping also stops the gear getting scratched in a rucksack.

With regards transporting the rack this is a bit more complex. I presume you don't mind moving it one piece at a time for a short walk in (allowing a full inventory to be completed by your partner on delivery), but may find this very time consuming for a longer walk. Could you use some kind of trolley, and just have a check-in/check-out process for the gear you need?
Robert Durran - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:

I send my entourage of minions and groupies ahead to the crag to neatly lay out all my gear in order of size at the foot of my proposed route. Upon arrival I stand and examine the route and command appropriate pieces to be clipped in their customary places onto my harness. Upon completing my lead I leave my entourage to strip the route and reorganise the gear at the foot of my next target while I relax, spout bullshit etc
butteredfrog - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:

On a serious note, to everyone worried about damaging cams whilst in your rucsack, how do you dare trust them in use?

Adam
jkarran - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:

> I have tried laying the rack out on a towel and rolling it, which worked well but was very bulky.

Wow! I just throw mine into the rucsack at the end of the day then next time I need it I tip the bag upside down and shake. I don't really see what needs to be improved!

Perhaps you could roll it in something less bulky than a towel.
jk
Will Hunt - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978: A sherpa team is what you need. Urchins and the unemployed make a good substitute but are more unruly and liable to turn up to work intoxicated. Each member of the team carries a piece of equipment in an airtight vacuum container to prevent contamination. When handling gear all parties wear gloves and clean suits to avoid any further risk of tangling or contamination. One the climb is conquered, each piece of equipment is discarded and reorded in case cam wires etc have become damaged during the ascent. If any member of your sherpa team fails to comply with the strict equipment transport guidelines the best solution is to place them in a burlap sack, savagely beat them, forcibly remove their fingernails and leave them for dead under a nearby flyover.
Radioactiveman - on 07 Nov 2012
Bimble on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Martin1978:

Most stuff goes on a 2m length of cord tied into a loop, and that along with all other bits & bobs gets lobbed into a dry bag and into my rucksack. My shoes are kept in one of those pull-cord boot bag things I got free from some PR event.
martinph78 on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Radioactiveman: Now THAT is a very useful link, and is now on my xmas wishlist!

Easy to transfer between crag bag, small rucksack and house. I can hang it to store, and handy for sorting/checking gear. Could strap to the top or outside of my smaller climbing pack if I want to take more sandwiches...looks just the job!

Awesome, thanks :)

And it will drive some of the above nuts when they see me so organised at the crag ;P
jimtitt - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Radioactiveman:
Ive climbed with someone who used one of those. Strange.
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