/ Is my bank telling me the truth....

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bluebealach - on 06 Nov 2012
For some stupid reason I walked away from the ATM at my bank leaving my bank card in the dispenser. I realised what I had done within about 10/15 seconds and even though no one was at/near the ATM there was no trace of my card.

I am told that after a few seconds, if I don't remove the card, it is automatically withdrawn back into the machine - I've no problem with this bit.

I offered to return in the morning to retrieve my card (after they had opened up the ATM to refill later that night) but was told that the ATM would have shredded the card already and I now have to wait between 3/5 working days for a new one.

Does anyone have any up to date info on the internal working of an ATM only I installed them about 6 years ago for about 12 months and there was no such mechanism installed then...... they are quite simple internally.

I think they just can't be bothered or it's going against their protocols and I'm being spun a line....
Postmanpat on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach:

Probably true. I did this a few years ago. The bank told me the same thing so I reported it by telephone and got a new card a few days later.
Neil Williams - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach:

I don't believe it shreds the card, but I could see that it might automatically have it blocked via software. That would make sense.

Neil
Indy - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach:

This happened to me while distracted by the kids. Card was sucked back into the machine. The non-issuing bank refused to give back the card even if I provided a mountain of I.D. My bank confirmed that its interbank policy. Was told (not sure if true) that the card is stopped electronically no mention of shredding!! If it had been my issuing bank I could have got it back. The money that I was attempting to get out wasn't debited from my account.
bluebealach - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach: If I'd been told that it had been stopped electronically I could have accepted the fact. But I was told categorically that it would have been shredded.

Having said that, why would it electronically stop the card? If the owner loses the card surely they will 'stop' it and across the banking network does it happen that often or am I being naive??

Sorry for the rant but angry at the bank and p*ssed off with myself for leaving it in the machine!

Ava Adore - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach:

I'm glad I'm not the only absent minded dumbass when it comes to ATMs. The other week, I did remember to take my card....but walked off without the cash. Fortunately, no-one was around. When I remembered a couple of minutes later, no cash in sight - it had been taken back into the machine. Wonder if THAT had been shredded...hmmmmm
VS4b - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach:
ATM won't shred it but whoever empties it would probably do so as std procedure.
I think
bluebealach - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to VS4b: Now that I agree with and told them so!!!!

I think that it was deffo bloody jobsworth and by the look on their faces, one or possibly two of the tellers agreed with me
bluebealach - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Ava Adore: I never forget the cash......but then I've never forgotten my card until today......bloody numpty that I am! lol
richprideaux - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Ava Adore:

There was something I read years back about how to steal from an ATM. It involved a sombrero, extracting the middle notes from the stack that comes out and then walking away leaving the rest.

I can't for the life of me remember where it was!
Ava Adore - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach:

Yep, and he's going to be doing it with glee tomorrow!
mack - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach:

A couple years back a supermarket ATM took my card as I put it in and refused to do anything else. Lost the card and was told that the person responsible for the ATM will shred any cards found inside as is procedure. Banks never try to get cards back for any customers, they simply renew them and cancel the old one.
Cthulhu on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Ava Adore:
> (In reply to bluebealach)
>
> I'm glad I'm not the only absent minded dumbass when it comes to ATMs. The other week, I did remember to take my card....but walked off without the cash. Fortunately, no-one was around. When I remembered a couple of minutes later, no cash in sight - it had been taken back into the machine. Wonder if THAT had been shredded...hmmmmm

Was the money debited from your account?


ayuplass - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach:
On a related note I left my Advantage card in a boots store and went back a couple of days later for it. Was told that they destroy all lost cards for security reasons to stop staff using the points on any cards they find (I had 46 on mine).
Do you really want your card to be left hanging around inside a bank where unscrupulous staff could use it to withdraw money? Isn't it better that there is a procedure that protects you even if the instant shredding part isn't true? It's just another way of saying the teller or customer service person you spoke to can't just pop into the back of the cash machine an retrieve lost cards
bluebealach - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to ayuplass:
> (In reply to bluebealach)

> Isn't it better that there is a procedure that protects you even if the instant shredding part isn't true?

If the banks are capable of lying over something so simple as this, what else are they capable of.......oh yes, I suppose Sir Fred didn't do a bad job!!

Milesy - on 06 Nov 2012
One time I was at the RBS in Carlisle and it chewed my card for absolutely no reason at all. It started whirring, said the ATM was out of order and never returned it. I went into the bank, explained, they opened the back of the ATM and it was sitting in a little pile of cards. They gave me it back again.
bluebealach - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Milesy: Finally a note of common sense and sanity - thank you!!
andy - on 06 Nov 2012
In reply to Milesy: just asked my mate who works in ATMs (he does systems - he's not one of the tiny men who actually works in there handing out money) and he says that the RBS staff were so completely out of order (and would have been for at least the last 15 years) they'd have been on a minimum stage 2 disciplinary for handing over a card no matter what ID you provided. They would have no idea whether it had been retained because of suspected fraud, machine malfunction, systems error etc, so to hand it back is massively against the rules.

Which seems fair enough to me.
Milesy - on 06 Nov 2012
I have an RBS account, it was a RBS card and a RBS branch. They checked some stuff and let me get it back. They heard the ATM malfunction - it it started whirring really loudly and making noises which the staff heard inside. I don't know but they did. Hey.
VS4b - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Milesy:
I used to work in this industry too. Id be amazed if they returned a card once the machine had eaten it. Far too much fraud risk...
andy - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Milesy:
> I have an RBS account, it was a RBS card and a RBS branch. They checked some stuff and let me get it back. They heard the ATM malfunction - it it started whirring really loudly and making noises which the staff heard inside. I don't know but they did. Hey.

Lucky old you. They probably ended up getting in trouble - as they should have. Rules in banks are a pain in the arse, but they're there for a reason. If someone can circumvent them because you seem a decent sort of chap and they heard a whirring noise then there's not a whole lot of point having them, is there?
yorkshireman - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Milesy:
> One time I was at the RBS in Carlisle and it chewed my card for absolutely no reason at all. It started whirring, said the ATM was out of order and never returned it. I went into the bank, explained, they opened the back of the ATM and it was sitting in a little pile of cards. They gave me it back again.

Once at Geneva airport arrivals I noticed some resistance when putting my card in the ATM, so gave it a bit more welly and it went in, but part of the mechanism behind the fascia came away and looking closer I saw the maintenance man at the other side fixing the thing. A surreal encounter of me pleading in French through the card slot resulted in the guy coming out through the service hatch and giving me back my card.


Milesy - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to VS4b:
> (In reply to Milesy)
> I used to work in this industry too. Id be amazed if they returned a card once the machine had eaten it. Far too much fraud risk...

Nah you right. I just made it all up. I completely fabricated the trip to Carlisle with my wife, and the lunch we went for afterwards when I got the card back and then the drive back to Glasgow.
EeeByGum - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach: You surprise me. I once used an ATM and although it returned my card, there was not enough card showing to allow me to take it out. It was sucked in. Popped into the bank and cashier retrieved it from the machine for me.

Sounds like a load-a-bollocks to me but I would imagine it is now bank policy on the basis of security to issue a new card rather than return the old one.
bluebealach - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to andy: My bank, my branch my account and I've been there for nearly thirty years....... if they cant suss out the fraud, system malfunction or system error on one of their own customers accounts then God help us with the other stuff.

It wasn't so much the 'sorry you cant have it back' it was the the, (in my belief), blatant lie that there is an integrated shredding apparatus within the ATM as being the reason why they couldn't return my card.
Scarab9 - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach:
> (In reply to andy) My bank, my branch my account and I've been there for nearly thirty years....... if they cant suss out the fraud, system malfunction or system error on one of their own customers accounts then God help us with the other stuff.

then you don't know just how much paperwork and strict policy is involved with fraud prevention

> It wasn't so much the 'sorry you cant have it back' it was the the, (in my belief), blatant lie that there is an integrated shredding apparatus within the ATM as being the reason why they couldn't return my card.

really? you're wound up by this? The result is exactly the same. Rather than "the machine shreds it" instead "the machine cancels the card and the operator shreds it when they open it"

oh my god. what a filthy lie you've been told! quick tell the press!

SHOCKINGLY bank tellers are HUMAN and may occasionally get details mixed up. It's a tiny difference and hasn't effected you at all.

Rob Exile Ward on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach: Perhaps they thought 'if he's too daft to understand why we can't just give it back, we might as well embroider the truth a little to keep him quiet.'

Disgraceful.

(God, dealing with the public can be difficult sometimes!)
Milesy - on 07 Nov 2012
And why should a bank be so strict about keeping the card if it can be proven that it was issued to you? Is it any different to me losing a card, being handed into a police station and then collecting it with ID. They don't go shredding them.

If an ATM was to keep my card, and I go into the branch, what is the odds of someone commiting fraud having assumed my identity with fake ID to match, knowing that there was a card retained with the same assumed identity inside that ATM. And of course walking into the bank under security camera in order to get a card which they might no nothing about the balance or the pin number.

There is fraud prevention and there is lack of common sense.
MG - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Milesy:
> And why should a bank be so strict about keeping the card if it can be proven that it was issued to you? Is it any different to me losing a card, being handed into a police station and then collecting it with ID. They don't go shredding them.

Are you sure - would they no phone the bank to cancel the card? Anyway, why should a bank (other than that of the card holder) go to the bother of tracking down careless card holders? Easier to cut the card up and get the card holder to ask for a new one.


>
> If an ATM was to keep my card, and I go into the branch, what is the odds of someone commiting fraud having assumed my identity with fake ID to match, knowing that there was a card retained with the same assumed identity inside that ATM. And of course walking into the bank under security camera in order to get a card which they might no nothing about the balance or the pin number.
>
> There is fraud prevention and there is lack of common sense.

Milesy - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to MG:

You never dropped a wallet in a taxi? Never once have my cards ever been shredded up. I get my wallet and cards back as I lost them (usually minus the cash though)

I already explained that the bank was an RBS and I was an RBS customer with an RBS card. If anyone is claiming that the bank staff were "out of order" for helping out a customer and using proper common sense then I dispair in a society which is being lost in bureaucracy, paper work, lack of responsibility and lack of common sense.

The RBS would have done a great diservice to their customer (me) who was clearly not at fault, and a hundred miles away from home and no way of getting to their money. They acted well and I remembered it.
MG - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Milesy:
> (In reply to MG)
>
> You never dropped a wallet in a taxi? Never once have my cards ever been shredded up. I get my wallet and cards back as I lost them (usually minus the cash though)

No I haven't. Interesting to know.

>
> I already explained that the bank was an RBS

I realize that, hence why I was explicit about other banks.

Neil Williams - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Ava Adore:

It will have been credited back to your account if you did not take it, AIUI.

Neil
Neil Williams - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach:

"It wasn't so much the 'sorry you cant have it back' it was the the, (in my belief), blatant lie that there is an integrated shredding apparatus within the ATM as being the reason why they couldn't return my card."

Two possibilities:-

1. They meant that they get them out and shred them manually per policy/procedure.

2. It's an internal slang term meaning that it's rendered useless.

Neil
Neil Williams - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach:

You'd be unlikely to because of the sensible design of the machines. You are never given the cash until you have taken your card, so cards don't generally get forgotten, unless you don't withdraw cash, but withdrawing cash is the great majority of transactions.

Receipts, which don't have that protection, are forgotten incredibly often.

Neil
Neil Williams - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to yorkshireman:

The Swiss, particularly the French ones, are not quite as procedurally driven as the English (perhaps surprisingly!)

Neil
Neil Williams - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Neil Williams:

...though I do wonder if, based on the fraud mentioned above, it is dumped into a separate bin so it can be checked manually that you haven't taken any of it before this occurs.

Neil
andy - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to bluebealach: http://www.ehow.com/about_6579614_happens-card-left-atm_.html

If you look at the bottom of this it appears some ATMs do have an "auto shredder".

Well i never...
bluebealach - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Rob Exile Ward:
> (In reply to bluebealach) Perhaps they thought 'if he's too daft to understand why we can't just give it back, we might as well embroider the truth a little to keep him quiet.'
>
Do you see a career in politics ahead?? ;)

bluebealach - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to andy: Cheers Andy and I accept that this may be the case although I note that this seems to be an American site.....

I also noted that it says...

"Some banks will allow you to retrieve your card the next day, whereas others dispose of the card immediately.

Retrieval

Call or go to the bank as soon as it is open and explain your situation. If the card is still intact, it may be as easy as showing proof of identity and/or providing a pin.

On the plus side, think of how many jobs are created in producing a new card, packaging it and delivering to me......thanks RBS, nice to know that you have all bases covered!!!


captain paranoia - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Neil Williams:

> Two possibilities:-

Third possibility:

3: That's what the member of bank staff thinks happens.

The OP seems to be assuming that all bank staff are familiar with all their operational procedures. They aren't. The ones I deal with don't seem to have a clue about anything... But, like many 'officials', they will stick to a story they've made up, once they've made it up.

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