/ Society of Black Lawyers

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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/9661263/Tottenham-defend-their-supporters-over-allegations...

I noticed this report, having recently read about this group having reported Mark Clattenberg to the Police over the allegations that he racially abused a Chelsea player.

A couple of things spring to mind. The first is that I'm surprised that it's possible to report something to the Police which has nothing directly to do with you. The second is that they are saying they'll report Spurs fans for calling themselves the Yid Army, in reference to the club's roots in the Jewish community. I have an issue with this. I'd always believed it acceptable for people to call themselves whatever they wanted - for example a black person could call themselves a nigger if they so wished. I'm starting to wonder if I've become one of those old people that doesn't "get it" any more (like I felt the first time I bought food in a Subway).

Any thoughts?
Steve John B - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Submit to Gravity:

1 - You see some kids smashing up a car down the road, you recognise one so you call the police and report the incident. Same thing innit.

2 - Spurs fans aren't all jewish...
Steve John B - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Submit to Gravity:

Oh, and (3), yes, you're turning into a confused old git. It happens to us all sooner or later ;-)
Steve John B - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Submit to Gravity:

(4) What is this "Subway" of which you speak...?
Postmanpat on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Submit to Gravity:

The other thing you have to recognise is that it's fine for a player to tell the ref "I'm going to break your f*c***g legs" but not the ref to call a player an inappropriate name.
In reply to Steve John B: On point 2, if I were a Spurs fan, a non-Jewish one, I can't imagine being offended by fans singing about the Yid Army.

And on point 2, if a copper were walking down the road and saw it you'd expect them to deal with it. I suspect many members of the Met were equally as aware of what was alleged about Clattenberg as Peter Herbert was.
In reply to Postmanpat:
> (In reply to Submit to Gravity)
>
> The other thing you have to recognise is that it's fine for a player to tell the ref "I'm going to break your f*c***g legs" but not the ref to call a player an inappropriate name.

Off course, they're such delicate flowers...
In reply to Steve John B:
> (In reply to Submit to Gravity)
>
> (4) What is this "Subway" of which you speak...?

Don't ever go there...
cragtaff - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Submit to Gravity: I am offended by the very existence of a Black Lawyers Association, or a Black Police Officers Association or a Black Teachers Association.

There would be absolute uproar if there was a White Lawyers Association etc.

PC liberals do my head in!
Timmd on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to cragtaff:
> (In reply to Submit to Gravity) I am offended by the very existence of a Black Lawyers Association, or a Black Police Officers Association or a Black Teachers Association.
>
> There would be absolute uproar if there was a White Lawyers Association etc.
>
> PC liberals do my head in!

If there wasn't racism they probably wouldn't exist as organisations.
Ridge - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Timmd:
> (In reply to cragtaff)
> [...]
>
> If there wasn't racism they probably wouldn't exist as organisations.

Quite right. I can only imagine the privations encountered by a black, privately educated barrister in contrast to his white working class peers ;-)
MonkeyPuzzle - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to cragtaff:

Just set one up. Whenever you feel the need.
Shearwater - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to cragtaff:
> I am offended by the very existence of a Black Lawyers Association, or a Black Police Officers Association or a Black Teachers Association.

I am continually startled by people who feel that society is genuinely equal and no-one is treated unfairly as a result of their skin colour, nationality, religion or gender... apart from the unfortunate Opressed White Western Middle Class Male demographic.
stroppygob - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to cragtaff:
> (In reply to Submit to Gravity) I am offended by the very existence of a Black Lawyers Association, or a Black Police Officers Association or a Black Teachers Association.

I'm not offended by it, I think every group should be allowed to form their own little associations, and demand rights and priviliges from the rest of society!


The fat, old, blonde, ex-pat, Welsh, crap climbers association, demands equal righst!!
John Rushby - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Ridge:

That's the sad thing here - the seemingly recreational outrage undermines the real racism and prejudice in the professions.


Having lived in north London, and with Jewish Spurs supporting mates, they love it - as it gives a bit of edge, recognition and there's a respect too. It is anything but anti- semitic.

Graeme Alderson on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to John Rushby: But how do Jewish Arsenal fans feel? Or does it give Anti-Semitic Chelsea fans an edge? I have no idea, it just doesn't seem quite right bringing a religious element into football. After all the Old Firm sectarian shit is repugnent.
I like climbing - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to cragtaff:
Oh dear ! Care to have a rethink ? 0/10
Graeme Alderson on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to cragtaff:
> PC liberals do my head in!

People who say anyone who questions bigotry are PC liberals do my head in. There is nothing PC or liberal about questioning bigots.

John Rushby - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Graeme Alderson:

It's quite different to the Old Firm. You can't compare it.

It has never been interpreted as anti-semitic. What do Jewish Arsenal or chelsea fans feel - dunno, but those are teams that do not have the same Jewish connections or ownership.

It has always been sung with pride - bugger sup the racialamailist thing.
stroppygob - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Graeme Alderson:
> (In reply to cragtaff)
> There is nothing PC or liberal about questioning bigots.

The only bigots would appear to be the society of black lawyers.

off-duty - on 07 Nov 2012
In reply to Shearwater:
> (In reply to cragtaff)
> [...]
>
> I am continually startled by people who feel that society is genuinely equal and no-one is treated unfairly as a result of their skin colour, nationality, religion or gender... apart from the unfortunate Opressed White Western Middle Class Male demographic.

Absolutely. Unfortunately as with any political cause the organisation has a danger of becoming an end in itself, with a risk that promotion within that organisation, and pandering to that organisation, becomes more important than addressing the causes that the organisation was set up to espouse.
The New NickB - on 08 Nov 2012
In reply to stroppygob:
> (In reply to Graeme Alderson)
> [...]
>
> The only bigots would appear to be the society of black lawyers.

Based on what exactly?
stroppygob - on 08 Nov 2012
In reply to The New NickB: Based on their trying to stop a group of people self-referring.

The club, as with many clubs in London, has a large Jewish following and this has led to much antisemitic provocation against Tottenham supporters. Tottenham supporters, Jewish and non-Jewish, united against this and adopted the nickname "Yids", developing chants to support this. Many fans view adopting "Yid" as a badge of pride, helping defuse its power as an insult.
In reply to Graeme Alderson:
> (In reply to cragtaff)
> [...]
>
> People who say anyone who questions bigotry are PC liberals do my head in. There is nothing PC or liberal about questioning bigots.

My question though, is whether this is actually a case of tackling bigotry? I wonder if he'll be reporting black rappers to the Police as well.
The New NickB - on 08 Nov 2012
In reply to stroppygob:

You seem to be defining bigot as "something I don't like" it is hardly a useful or accurate definition. Misguided as their position may be.
MJH - on 08 Nov 2012
In reply to The New NickB: My problem with it is that Peter Herbert is creating a problem where one doesn't exist - it smacks of publicity seeking.

Football crowds can be unpleasant but the Yid Army chants are nothing to do with anti-semitic behaviour but a reference to Spurs' past and present.

So not bigoted, just plain stupid.
Chris the Tall - on 08 Nov 2012
In reply to stroppygob:
> Many fans view adopting "Yid" as a badge of pride, helping defuse its power as an insult.

I wonder if the Society of Black Lawyers are familiar with the band NWA?

I have to say that the way they are wading into the racism problem in football seems misguided, particularly when they start having a go at referees
graeme jackson - on 08 Nov 2012
In reply to cragtaff:
> (In reply to Submit to Gravity) I am offended by the very existence of a Black Lawyers Association, or a Black Police Officers Association or a Black Teachers Association.
>
how do you feel about women only aerobics / swimming classes or women only motoring insurance?
In reply to Submit to Gravity: I also dislike the heavy-handed, threatening way they've dealt with the matter. It's clearly a nuanced case, and if they have concerns they should, in my opinion, have raised them in a more constructive way and started a debate.
In reply to Submit to Gravity: Oh, and judging by his proclamations on the matter, he clearly sees himself as the final arbiter in what is and isn't acceptable.
ads.ukclimbing.com
The New NickB - on 08 Nov 2012
In reply to MJH:
> (In reply to The New NickB) My problem with it is that Peter Herbert is creating a problem where one doesn't exist - it smacks of publicity seeking.
>
> Football crowds can be unpleasant but the Yid Army chants are nothing to do with anti-semitic behaviour but a reference to Spurs' past and present.
>
> So not bigoted, just plain stupid.

I agree
stroppygob - on 08 Nov 2012
In reply to The New NickB:
> (In reply to stroppygob)
>
> You seem to be defining bigot as "something I don't like" it is hardly a useful or accurate definition. Misguided as their position may be.

No, I am calling bigotry as displayed.


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