/ Golf GT TDI owners (or other mid-sized diesels
Selling my Land Rover Discovery with great sadness as I need something much, much, much more economical. I was looking at Citroen C3 1.4hdi's and such but 'm not dead yet, don't have kids, and quite fancy something that's fun but economical (talking average 50mpg+ and extra urban 60mpg+).
Not gonna get the £30 a year road tax that I'd like but would be worth paying a bit extra each year for something less like my mum would drive!
The golf meets the criteria on paper, specifically the torque figures as that would suit my driving style (and hence why I'd like a bit bigger engine). Shame it looks so boring, but I can live with that if it's fun behind the wheel :)
Working out my finances I do genuinely need to be getting over 50mpg on A roads, with 60mpg+ on long drives. I don't do town mileage, mostly going from Durham to the Lakes or South, so A roads and motorways mainly.
I know driving style will make a big difference, but I tend to drive economically/relaxed and sit at 65-70mph on the motorways.
I'd appreciate any pointers regarding the golf. Also looked at the Bora but need to see one in the flesh. Open to other suggestions if you have read this far and don't own a golf :P
I have just bought a Seat Leon TDI 150 which is the same engine as the Golf GT TDI 150. It is great fun to drive and I still get 50mpg average from it. Haven't had it long enough to gauge the mpg when driving sensibly though. The mpg is pretty poor when the engine is cold, so I would expect it is expensive if you are just doing short journeys around town. The other one to consider might be the Octavia VRS Diesel.
Not mid sized but Octavia Scout Estate 4x4 2.0tdi 140bhp, Got about 45mpg going from Nottingham to The Owgen/Tryfan Area in North Wales this weekend, plus driving around (about 450 miles), mostly tanking it. Can average over 50mpg if I drive 'normal' and could get about 60mpg if I kept at about 60-65mph. Around town I get about 50 aswell, which is strange. Though usually 40 if I just drive swift. Cracking climbing car. It's a volkswagen/vag engine btw.
When I wanted a Golf, I bought a Leon. Same engineering, massive drop in price for the same spec. Plus at the time (2004) the Leon was so much lighter, you got the same performance from a 1.6 Leon as a 1.8 Golf, and corresponding lower insurance.
Subaru Outback diesel you'll get around 48-50 mpg at 80 mph on motorway.
I've got a Golf 1.9PD 130 - great little car, on a long journey it gets around 50mpg at 80, 55 at 70 and 57 ish at 65-70.
I have had to replace one injector at massive expense (£600 + labour each) after owning it for 3 months, and I can feel another going (misfires once about every 50 miles) The way the engine is designed means the wiring loom breaks down easily too (£60 + labour). Reliability has not been good. I've only put about 6000 miles on it and spent in excess of £1000 ontop of the £2400 I paid for it on repairs. It has 135k on the clock, 2003 plate.
Also the paint is aweful - laquer peeling everywhere & finish is poor - seen this on more than one MK4 Golf!
Great car especially with the Recaro Leather interior, but reliability has been poor. It eats the miles too - i'm quite happy sitting in it for three or four hours straight and still don't have a numb bum! I'm keeping it though because I can't think of a replacement I want!
Oh and a FSH is vital as well as a strict oil change with special Diesel PD oil! Either long life changed every ~20k miles or short life changed every ~10k. Mine has got FSH from VW and is still breaking on me!
I have just had a quick look and the Seat Leon looks very appealing and is well within my budget. The Octavia VRS is well over my budget though! Looking around the £3k mark, there are a quite a lot of golfs and even more leons at that price. I don't really do cold journeys, pretty efficient with my driving and useage. Never thought of the leon so thanks, will have a look at some this weekend.
Gonna miss the Landy but am looking forward to having a "hot hatch" again :)
Will take a closer look. I used to drive a company Passat and got 48mpg out of that. Don't need anything quite so big and would like another 10mpg, hence looking at smaller cars. Wrongly thought I'd need a small diesel engine as well, but the 1.9tdi seems to meet my wants :)
Hope yours gets sorted!
I also find different filling stations affect performance/economy.
I wouldn't really describe it as 'hot'. Its not that quick (versus Focus ST, Golf R, Golf GTD etc.), but it is excellent overtaking stuff - stick your foot down in 5th and 6th on the motorway and watch it wizz past 80...90...
I had a 1.9 golf tdi sport, which had a 6speed box and slightly lowered suspension as standard. It was nice enough to drive and handled well but was underpowered for overtaking on A roads. I believe the GT tdi is much better and you get similar mpg.
"fun but economical"
And therein lies the issue. You need to compromise on one.
I've just bought a C220 CDi Sport. I should get 50+mpg but once you get used to putting the boot down.....
I've got a passat with the TDI 130 engine and its been amazing. No issues, 110k on the clock and runs like new. A friend of mine has the same car and he's covered 230k, still pulling strong - highly recommended.
I'm on my third Golf TDi, never had serious problems and two of those had/ have done 140,000 + miles. My current commute is a mix of twisty back roads and motorway and I get typically 52-55mpg without trying. When I was trying I could get 60mpg so long as there weren't loads of hills (600 miles from a tank before going on reserve was pretty normal). Rear beam bushes are a regular issue over 100K but other than that the mechanics have been pretty standard. Power is adequate once you get used to/ know how to get the most out of it. To be honest its about the best blend of sporty driving/ economy/ low maintenance you'll probably find.
I've got a 1.9tdi pd Golf. I quite like it, it's not one of the hot ones but drives ok. I'd advise you to get yours professionally inspected before buying. I just had to fork out big bucks for a new dual mass flywheel & clutch. Don't buy one blind, though I'd advise that for any 2nd hand car.
I live in Germany so on the autobahns it is superb - fast yet thoroughly safe, not as fast as my Saab Aero but significantly better than the 30mpg I get out of that on a run! The Golf seats are really comfortable too, after a 3 or 4 hour drive I get out feeling fresh. Boot space is sufficient for a family of four camping trip, or our trips back to the UK.
I summary, it is a brilliant car and I'm glad we have it. Highly recommended.
In the past I've owned both a 1.9 GTI 130 Golf and a 140 Bora. Both are great cars and as you say loads of torque and very economical, both easily returning 60 plus mpg on a run and 50 mpg plus around town.
The Golf is also a very sturdy car as I found when I was hit head on by an out of control car coming towards me on a bend, and walked away from the write of with hardly a scratch and just minor air bag burns. I suspect the Bora is the same.
The Bora has a huge boot and could carry more than the Golf when going away climbing/camping, although with it's hatchback the Golf was better for awkward shaped loads like a lawn mower.
The Bora was more balanced, cornered better and was altogether a nicer and better drive than the Golf. I also think it's a nicer looking car.
If I was in the market again for a VAG range car I'd definitely go for a Bora.
I meant to say that with the exception of my current car, which is a totally different concept, the Bora is probably the nicest car I've ever owned.
I have been looking at the Saab 9-3 saloon also. It claims to do 52mpg combined, 64mpg extra urban but I am dubious. Used to own a 900 and it was awesome, love the Saabs and can't believe that you can get them so cheap now. There's also the Astra 1.7cdti, but we used to have a couple of them in work and I wasn't very impressed. They did return awesome mpg though.
The sensible money does seem to be on one of the VAG 1.9tdi's. Surprised to hear of the problems, so will keep all of that in mind when I'm shopping.
Thanks for the great feedback, pretty confident I'll be getting the mpg I want. Hopefully the landy sells quickly!
My Leon PD 130 does about 49mpg average commuting (with plenty of hills and sheffield traffic). Around 54mpg on a longer journey.
I've heard of issues with build quality on the 9-3s - that might be a reason why they're surprisingly cheap.
One other thing which I don't think has been mentioned is that the VAG engines are normally due for a cam belt change at about 80,000 miles. This could set you back a few hundred quid, so if the mileage is close to that check whether it's been done or if buying from a dealer I'd ask for a new cam belt to be included for anything over 60,000 miles.
55000 miles, just done the big service (timing belt and water pump) so good for another 60000 with no major bills. Selling it to fund our campervan.
My Focus 1.8 TDCi (2005) gets 45mpg around town and short journeys and easily goes over 60mpg on a-roads. I used to get 65mpg+ on a 45mile each way commute entirely on a-roads, driven carefuly. It drops to 60mpg ish on the motorway because I tend to go much faster.
Thanks again all.
Just looked at "Real MPG" website and the VW's do well, the SAAB not so well. Not heard of build issues but know the company has gone bust so maybe, like rover, that's why they are so cheap now.
Will look at the focus as well.
Glad I asked, was getting bored of wading through autotrader at the same stuff.
Mid 40s from my 200,000 mile Peugeot 307 1.9l. If you are really that worried about economy, you probably need to swallow hard and think about this bit of your question:
"The golf meets the criteria on paper, specifically the torque figures as that would suit my driving style (and hence why I'd like a bit bigger engine). Shame it looks so boring, but I can live with that if it's fun behind the wheel :)"
You won't get economy if you drive like a boy racer !
I compared a Ford Focus 1.6 petrol (3k miles a year/urban/slow drive style) with a Discovery 3.0 ltr diesel (same stats as Focus)
A difference of £70 annual fuel costs. Can that be right?
I have a Ford Focus 1.6 petrol (53 plate) and it's not that hot on fuel consumption - not much over 40 to the gallon last time I checked. I don't drive like a nutter (regardless of anything else, I can't afford to!)
I'm on my second Passat 130 TDi Sport with the 6 speed box; the current one is a '53 plate. On a long run I can get mid 50's taking it easy. About town, it's nearer 30, if I'm only going a couple of miles. Not sure if it's exactly the same engine as the GT Golf, but it's way more torquey than the newer Passats which are 140bhp (new sport versions are the same engine, just different interior trim)
I'd considered a Golf, but felt it just a bit small in cabin space as well as boot space. I'd had a saloon Passat before getting my current estate, which wins hands down.
3000 miles a year? That's only 6 tanks of fuel so £70 is quite a lot!
At 20k miles a year that's £500 a year difference.
I've spent a lot of time working it out and doing EVERYTHING I can to NOT sell the discovery!
Mines a 2.5 diesel getting a combined average 25mpg. Can squeeze 29mpg out of it but that's the best. So it cost me £40 to get to Keswick and back, without any driving around when I'm there or going further to say the Langdales.
I'll be able to save at least £1612 per year, or £31 a week, driving a golf tdi. I was looking for a smaller diesel to save on road tax as well, but decided that's one price I am prepared to pay!
Haven't looked at petrols because It wouldn't be worth me chaniging to a petrol.
My 2005 2.0TDi Octavia with 144k on the clock gets 54mpg with normal driving, if I'm frugal I get 60mpg. That's on a 40 mile each way commute. On a longer run I still get about 60mpg. Shorter journeys through town return about 50mpg.
Running costs over the 65000 miles I've had the car have been nil, barring fuel tyres, MOT fharges and servicing. I know the EGR is playing-up, but that's only £70 to replace and the car runs OK even with the engine warning light on.
Sadly I've got to sell it soon - doubt I'll ever get something as reliable again.
Also looking at the Astra 1.7cdti estate (57mpg combined but a bit dull!)and another surprise, the A4 1.9tdi 130 (really like these).
Gonna enjoy test driving them all. An estate would be ideal fr the mountain bikes I guess, but I've managed with roofbars before :)
Thanks again, handy to bounce ideas around from people with similar interests/needs to mine as well. It's all about getting to the mountains more and having momey left to tell the tale in the pub afterwards :p
Beats my Pajero 2.8 tdi which did 23mpg - but then again it ran on cooking oil......
No-one's mentioned the Honda Civic Diesel yet. Probably the best car I've ever had, frankly.
Mine's the previous model (a new one came out last year I think) but the 2.2l diesel pulls like hell and does around 50mpg urban or motorway (more if I had a lighter right foot) . It also has significantly more space than a Golf and a much funkier dashboard. I'd buy another right away.
That's because it's not a true 4x4. In normal use it drives with 90% + power to the front wheels so it's a great and fairly economical cruiser.
I drive mine into wet fields quite a lot and it's then that the Haldex clutch kicks in and sends some power to the back wheels as well. So far I've only been bogged down once but you have to realise the limitations of what you're driving: it is no Defender!
TBH I have had a few hefty bills this year (shock absorbers, A/C pump ) but as you approach the 1000,000 mark you expect a few things to crop up.
It's a UK cliche but the Octavia, especially 1.9 or 2.0 TDI, is the car to beat.
There is a good reason why Taxi's have been using them for a while, they tend to be economic, hardwearing, and dealer garage costs were normally very cheap (or at least they used to be). That was one of the reasons taxi firms liked em, cheaper to fix than most other marques in the UK!
Oh - failed to mention - mine's a hatchback, but I can fit a bike in the boot (seats folded down) without taking the wheels off. Could probably get 2 in with front wheel off.
a million miles - really ?
All cars are "approaching" a million miles, just some faster than others ;)
Anyone got one of these?
Quite a few newer/cheaper than the VW/Audi group vehicles.
<sucks air through teeth>
Your call, but I'd take VAG over PUG any day. (There's a good reason they're a fair bit cheaper.)
Tanking it up to Pembroke from London as fast as I can on a friday evening (100 - 110mph wherever the traffic allows), I get about 43mpg from my 110 bhp 2.0 hdi citroen C5 estate, so I assume at 65mph I would be getting close to the figures you're looking for, and it's a great climbing car.
Absolutely cavernous in the back with the seats down (comfortable for two to sleep in if you're not a giant) and fine for a team of 5 with boulder mats down to bleau.
I also looked at a Saab diesel when changing but was put completely off the idea by owner's reviews. I ended up with a Vectra 150 bhp diesel. Not quite the economy of the Bora but otherwise fine. Dull, but fine. And the boot's enormous.
Just hit 100k in a 2000 mk4 TDI golf (not 130). Very little has gone wrong with it, never broken down, just needed to fix the usual small things which you can sort yourself in the main. The mkiv golf forum is a handy resource.
Really like it but now looking at new shocks etc that need replacing through age. I'd wager it would be good for another 50,000 as long as you replace the relevant old parts.
In terms of economy, never worked out exactly, but reckon it must be just over 50mpg on average. Recent trip from Yorkshire to font (driving around font for a week) with roof rack and four people only took two and half tanks. Economy really good on motorway even with roof rack.
Am trying to put the wife off a Peugeot despite an improving reputation.
In terms of build quality versus VAG- what are the main differences?
Lady Blue used to have a 1997 1.9 Golf Tdi (90hp) and despite being a severly ill car by the time we got rid use to regularly return 50+mpg, up to 65mpg if driven carefully.
She's now got a 2012 Seat Leon Ecomotive (1.6tdi), which returns 55mpg on her (stop-start) commute, and well over 70mpg on motoways. We've not hit the theoretical 84mpg yet, but we've had mid-70's. If you are looking for both fun to drive and economical the Leon is hard to beat, as slowing down for corners appears optional. :-) Plus its a Golf-based car.
I used to have an 2005 Octavia 1.9tdi (115hp) 4x4, which used to return 55mpg-60mpg on motorways (and I have a heavy foot).
The 2006 passat (1.9tdi 105hp) used to get 45 (heavy foot)-55 (economical)mpg on motoways. Quite a bit worse than the Octavia despite not being that much bigger, and having a lower power turbo.
I've currently got a 2011 Skoda Superb 4x4 2.0tdi (170hp), and that does about 45 mpg on motorways if seriously tanking it (90-100mph+), 50mpg at normal motorway speeds (70-80mph), 55mpg at 65mph-75mph and on one notable day where I had a puncture and hence was limited to 50mph but had to do a long journey whether I liked the idea of driving on a space saver spare or not returned 70mpg, which is outstanding for such a big car.
The above gives you a range for VAG-based cars, both current and past. Hope helpful. Basically it looks, from my experience and what you say about your driving, that any of the golf-based (Golf/A3/Leon/Octavia) 1.9tdi or 2.0tdi engines (with possible exception of the 170hp version of the 2.0tdi) will meet your criteria, and the 1.6tdi versions will exceed them.
Down. You go UP to London...
Try asking a Londoner.
My wife drives a Golf GT Sport TDi 170bhp, DSG. When I drive, I get low 40's MPG, however my wife easily gets mid 50's MPG.
Also something to note - We've had it since new - it's 2006 - last year we received a letter from VW stating there was a recall on some 2.0 TDis from that year. They replace all the injectors FOC.
Fingers crossed it is reliable and trouble free. I'm very pleased with it having looked at so much rubbish over the last week it's nice to find something clean, tidy, without any rattles!
Looking forward to giving it a run over to the Lakes at the weekend!
Ahh!! You mean it is an amphibicar!!
Hi ya Martin,
made a good choice the VWA group are great cars and really liked the A4 we had.
Why not take it in for a remap, an added 40 bhp and if you get the right map then a big increase in MPG's as well. Just had my T5 camper done 130 to 170 (well with the map Ive had on its more like 154) but an increase in mpg's from 37 ish to 45+and a much smoother drive.
Def worth the money I would say you could reach nearly 70+ mpg with yours (as mine did nearly 60 on long runs anyway) on the right map
2011 Passat B7 estate, 140 bhp Tdi model, with 22,000 miles on the clock I am now averaging 48 mpg, easily achieving 52 mpg on a short run and have seen 58.5 mpg on a long A road run.
I can fit 3 people and 3 bikes inside it, it handles well and is comfortable and accelerates very well. The winter pack gives me heated windscreen, seats, washer nozzles and mirrors. Oh, and the CO2 emissions are so much lower than my old B6 model that I got a £135 reduction in my monthly tax with the new car.
What's not to like?
60mpg on a run would be great and help with the higher £215 road tax that I am paying. Figured it was worth it though!
I miss my Land Rover but think I've made a good choice (and got a bargain!) with the A4. Much smoother/quieter than mostly everything else I drove, and I don't think the hatchbacks would have been big enough.
Do need to sort out a replacement for the radio cassette though!
If that's without trying I'm well pleased! If I stick to speed limits and go a bit easer on the right foot I'm sure this could increase further.
Brilliant! I can now get to the Lakes AND still afford to eat!
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