/ pulling the wings off flies

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freerangecat - on 12 Feb 2013
Listening to Radio 2, and on today's Jeremy Vine show (which I avoid if at all possible) they're going to be discussing how, basically, kids who pull the wings off flies go o to become the worst sort of cold calculating animal abusers and then are likely to abuse their partners. I just wondered what people thought of this - were you a small child who maybe didn't initially realise removing the limbs of insects was wrong but wouldn't dream of harming anyone/any animal now?
dale1968 - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat: yes; it was the slippery slope, I now pull off all sorts of things.....
EeeByGum - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat: I think I will be publishing my study where I discovered that all people who died of cancer at some point in their lives ate salad.

SALAD CAUSES DEATH BY CANCER!!!
Tony the Blade on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat:

Stop listening to the Jeremy Whine show!

It's the Daily Fail of the radio!
Tom Last - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat:

Oh dear, did somebody buy him The Wasp Factory for Christmas?
Philip on 12 Feb 2013
I don't remember that programme being so appealing when Jimmy Young presented it. It does seem to be a platform for Daily Mail believers (I won't say readers as we buy the DM on Saturday only because we can't agree on an alternative that has Fred Basset and a TV Guide).
freerangecat - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to Tony the Blade:

I've switched it off now - it was only the introductory thing they do at 11.30; I hate the show and the presenter.

You've probably guessed that I was guilty of torturing defenceless insects as a small child. We had pets/farm animals at the time that I wouldn't have dreamt of hurting, and I still love animals (not too bad with humans either). I guess I just hadn't made the connection between what I was doing and the fact I was harming a living creature. It makes me uneasy when 'kids who pull the wings off flies' are referred to in the same breath as 'evil animal abusers' now, so I wondered if I was an anomaly or if others, who are now decent members of society, will admit to the same crime.
EeeByGum - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to Philip:
> I don't remember that programme being so appealing when Jimmy Young presented it. It does seem to be a platform for Daily Mail believers (I won't say readers as we buy the DM on Saturday only because we can't agree on an alternative that has Fred Basset and a TV Guide).

So you are basically saying you are the CofE inequivalent of a Daily Mail believer. You read, but are quite happy to apologise for it. :-)
IainRUK - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat: Probably taken too far but abuse of animals.. abuse of people are linked.. its why abuse of animals should be dealt with more severly as the people are a threat to society..

Not sure I'd take that all the way down to flies though..
Philip on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to EeeByGum:
> (In reply to Philip)
> [...]
>
> So you are basically saying you are the CofE inequivalent of a Daily Mail believer. You read, but are quite happy to apologise for it. :-)

No, the opposite. I'm forced to pay for a copy I don't read. We keep it for fire lighting. I read the cooking, gardening and Fred Basset (it's a cartoon of a dog). I make no excuses for the appalling journalism, it's offensive.

If you want a religious equivalent. I think that organised religion is responsible for terrible atrocities, but I still go to a carol concert once a year ;-P
freerangecat - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to IainRUK:
> (In reply to freerangecat) Probably taken too far but abuse of animals.. abuse of people are linked.. its why abuse of animals should be dealt with more severly as the people are a threat to society..

I completely understand that - empathy for another living thing and/or complete lack of control over temper

> Not sure I'd take that all the way down to flies though..

I hope not, or I'm never going to get another climbing partner though here after starting this thread!
dissonance - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat:

> You've probably guessed that I was guilty of torturing defenceless insects as a small child.

checks profile picture to add to the avoid list. If i see anyone hiding by reindeer i know to run.

> It makes me uneasy when 'kids who pull the wings off flies' are referred to in the same breath as 'evil animal abusers' now, so I wondered if I was an anomaly or if others, who are now decent members of society, will admit to the same crime.

i thought the connection between animal abuse and future violence was a bit more nuanced than that eg its severe cases of animal cruelty rather than all cases.
freerangecat - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to dissonance:
> (In reply to freerangecat)
>
> [...]
>
> checks profile picture to add to the avoid list. If i see anyone hiding by reindeer i know to run.
>

:-)

>
> i thought the connection between animal abuse and future violence was a bit more nuanced than that eg its severe cases of animal cruelty rather than all cases.

So did I, but it wasn't the first time I'd heard people connecting childhood removal of insect limbs and animal abuse. Maybe I won't suddenly wake up an axe-wielding maniac one morning after all.
Neil Henson - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat:
> were you a small child who maybe didn't initially realise removing the limbs of insects was wrong but wouldn't dream of harming anyone/any animal now?

Yes.

The Jeremy Vine show really does produce some absolute c**p. What's next? Babies who use a potty will be incontinent in old age?

Children don't always realise the consequence of their actions. Don't give him the credit of adding to the listening figures.
freerangecat - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to Southern Man:
> (In reply to freerangecat)
>
> Oh dear, did somebody buy him The Wasp Factory for Christmas?

I'm half way through Consider Phlebas, and enjoying it, but from Wikipedia's description there's no way I'd read The Wasp Factory (I understand there's quite a difference between his 'normal' fiction and science fiction though).

Pinged - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat:

I used to inject slugs full of quink ink, place them in the centre of a piece of a3 paper annd then, you've guessed it, stamp on the little bleeders. Do I need help? I've never progressed to beating elephants or owt else.
Craigie17 on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat:

Not listened to the programme but I wonder if there is some sort of postulated link between this and the Macdonald triad theory

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macdonald_triad

Definitely seems a bit of a leap though!
freerangecat - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to Pinged:
> (In reply to freerangecat)
>
> I used to inject slugs full of quink ink, place them in the centre of a piece of a3 paper annd then, you've guessed it, stamp on the little bleeders. Do I need help? I've never progressed to beating elephants or owt else.

Not sure if that's worse than my crime or not! I used to take the wings and legs off flies and watch them spin round in circles on the windowsill. I don't know how I even managed it. I sometimes kill wasps now, but nothing else - spiders get carefully evicted if they're in danger of getting in the way or ignored if not
freerangecat - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to Craigie17:
> (In reply to freerangecat)
>
> Not listened to the programme but I wonder if there is some sort of postulated link between this and the Macdonald triad theory
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macdonald_triad
>
> Definitely seems a bit of a leap though!

Maybe - I can't find the research he mentioned in the discussion with Ken Bruce, and didn't listen to the show as it might have brought out my suppressed violent tendencies!
Trangia - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat:

I don't listen to Radio 2 so can't comment other than to say that my experiments confirmed that flies can't fly without wings and removing the little wings only but retaining the main ones made them fly as though drunk bumping into everything.

Spiders could still walk even after you'd pulled off 5 legs, but annoyingly tended to die if you tried to pull off a 6th one.

I was never brave enough to try and pull the wings off a wasp, which goes to show that all bullies are basically cowards....

freerangecat - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to Trangia:

I feel a lot better now (assuming you didn't progress to hamsters etc?!). Like you, it seems, my aim was 'what happens if I do this' not 'let's cripple this insect'. I now have a Chemistry PhD...
dissonance - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat:
> (In reply to Trangia)
>
> I feel a lot better now (assuming you didn't progress to hamsters etc?!). Like you, it seems, my aim was 'what happens if I do this' not 'let's cripple this insect'. I now have a Chemistry PhD...

chemistry phd and a relaxed approach to the ethics question whilst carrying out experiments?
I am not sure that is reassuring.
freerangecat - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to dissonance:

Luckily it was a mainly analytical PhD... I work in science publishing now and although we require that all work that we publish complies with the ethical policy of the authors' institution, some of the papers that I see either the peer review or editing stages are basically fairly unpleasant! I would out myself if I linked to the worst I've seen, but it's a little shocking what is allowed.
cuthill76 - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to Tony the Blade:

"Stop listening to the Jeremy Whine show!

It's the Daily Fail of the radio!"

You should try listening to the car crash that is Call Kaye on Radio Scotland!!!
Ciderslider - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat: Yep I did that sort of stuff when I was a kid but I wouldn't think of tormenting a dumb creature now (apart from maybe thinking that one day I'll be good enough to climb E1).
Ciderslider - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to Pinged: People like you disgust me ;-) Made me laugh to the point of tears!
Mr Moac on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat:

As a child I used to pull the legs off flies so they couldn't land. As a grandfather and pet owner it didn't do me any harm.
Jim C - on 12 Feb 2013
In reply to Mr Moac:
> (In reply to freerangecat)
>
> As a child I used to pull the legs off flies so they couldn't land.
As a grandfather and pet owner it didn't do me any harm.

It is not YOU that we are now worried about !
ads.ukclimbing.com
panz - on 13 Feb 2013
In reply to freerangecat:
some 40 years before Ive met a guy that was working hard on his PhD paper for how to rightly cut off frog legs at school.
I wonder how many expensive grants were payed since then to improve lessons on frogs tissues and adults still indulge in robbery and manslaughter mainly for not having read his paper I suppose.

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