/ If you put a runner on a treadmill that is travelling at...

This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
Mark Torrance on 26 Mar 2013
...a velocity exactly equal and opposite to his own (which I think is actually how treadmills work) what is the probability of him completing anything like a decent session without first pulling out his own teeth as a bit of light relief from the utter tedium of it all.

Never, ever again.

Oh, and EasyGym (pah!) staff quote when I asked how to get it to tell me minute/miles "Sorry, I don't get enough time to work out how the kit works". He was very nice about it, though.
Neil Williams - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance:

Can't expect too much if you're a member of a 10-20 quid a month gym, TBH. I pay a tenner a month for mine and don't really expect a lot other than a shed with a load of equipment in it.

A bit like flying Ryanair...

Neil
In reply to Mark Torrance:

Treadmills are in a different time zone to everywhere else, time just drags.
IainRUK - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: Mix it up... I did 17 k the other day with a mate.. 1 min at 15kph 1 min at 16 kph.. then 2 mins at 16 to one 1 at 15..

that sort of thing... change the incline..
pork pie girl - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: before i packed in running ( i bike alot now.. mainly cross country mountain biking.. as like it for fitness) i used to run on a treadmill quite a bit, especially after work over the winter

i found interval training helped pass the time , along with some very good music on my ipod/mp3 player (for me dance music)

i also used to really increase the incline alot too .. that really mixed things up..

i found i worked harder on a treadmill then i did out on the road or fells

i use turbo trainers and exercise bikes during the winter after work now and always vary the resistance levels and pace so i am interval training.. just maintain one speed bores me silly.. interval training really improves my pace too

wish i could find gym for 10-15 quid per month
FrankBooth - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance:

The treadmills at my gym have in-built TVs but I never remember headphone. This means enduring 20 minutes of a) Doctors b) local news or c) an old movie in silence.

I've found that using the treadmill twice a week just about bearable if I concentrate on speed-sessions, so that I'm running close to my max for a 20-25 minutes.
mrchewy - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: Rather than going on the machine behind the fit girl so you can admire her arse, try going on the one in front of her - it keeps the motivation to perform quite high!
pork pie girl - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to mrchewy: and wear only a thong whilst doing so (but not back to front, unless you're really confident) to increase her levels of attention
Mark Torrance on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to mrchewy:
> (In reply to Mark Torrance) Rather than going on the machine behind the fit girl so you can admire her arse, try going on the one in front of her - it keeps the motivation to perform quite high!

This is part of the problem: Motivation is entirely negative. In non-aberant actually-going-somewhere running, you kick to maintain pace, and feel good about it. In why-on-earth-did-I-think-this-might-be-a-good-idea treadmilling you keep going purely to avoid flying off the back of the thing, possibly taking out one or more gym-waifs in the process.

I came to the conclusion that if I ever do it again, I'll find a quiet corner, bring a good book, and run a long way slowly.

Liam M - on 26 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: You need to find somewhere interesting to do it - last one I ventured onto was in the concourse of Leeds Train Station, and watching confused commuters made the time flit by!
IainRUK - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Liam M: tonight was 10k.. + 1k to and 1k back from gym.

1.5 k warm up.. 3 x 2 k at 18kph, 5:20 min mile, 750m rest at 10 kph, then 1 k cool down, basically 30-60 seconds at 16,15,14,13,12,11,10,9,7kph..
Mark Torrance on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to IainRUK:

Whereas I ran 6 miles in the snow in the morning and 5 miles under the moon in the evening. And suddenly life was worth living again.
IainRUK - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: Aye.. the treadmill is very much for sessions..

I think it can help..

I wasn't doing it at all.. but my lesotho running mate.. aiming for 65 mins at Berlin half.. called me out for running too slowly too much..

It depends what you are after..

If you want to improve hard sessions have to be hard.. but you also need the miles.. and interesting runs help that..
Liam M - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to IainRUK:
> (In reply to Mark Torrance) Aye.. the treadmill is very much for sessions..
>
> I think it can help..
>
> I wasn't doing it at all.. but my lesotho running mate.. aiming for 65 mins at Berlin half.. called me out for running too slowly too much..
>
> It depends what you are after..
>
> If you want to improve hard sessions have to be hard.. but you also need the miles.. and interesting runs help that..

That's interesting, as tales of Kenyan athletes taking issue with British runners who join them for going out to hard on easy and steady runs are plentiful.
Mark Torrance on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to IainRUK:

I know, I know. I had a tempo run planned. I have a 1/2 marathon target in a few weeks. It was too icy. I went to the gym.

Four things I did wrong, I think.

(1) I need to convert min/k to min/miles in advance, rather than try and do this while running fast (during which I typically can't remember my own name, let alone do sums).

(2) I listened to music. I never normally do this. This screwed up rhythm and possibly also breathing (I don't know - I was listening to music).

(3) I couldn't keep my eyes off the km counter on the display. Not sure what the solution to this is, but it did my head in. With a watch, you can choose when you look.

(4) I was too far away from a fan (assuming, of course, EasyGym's actually have these).

Changing pace every k might help. I mixed it up a bit, but not that much. Given that it costs 5 per time I'm not going to go for short sessions.

Ah, now I'm talking myself into going back. Stop me.
IainRUK - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Liam M: I know.. but they are doing 130 mile weeks..


60-90 seconds off Marathon pace.. so 6 minute mile marathoner the slowest I should run is 8 min miles, the bulk will be low > mid 7's...

But also big mileage.. I was commented on a FB post and Jeff Norman commented.. he holds the Snowdon Marathon record.. basically he said as we were doing low mileage we should do X..

We were both 100 mile weeking.. 120-150 miles a week.. then the speeds are less crucial.. if only doing 40-60 miles a week I think there has to be more focus on the miles you put in..

Look at Farrah, 130 mile weeks.. for 5/10k's...
IainRUK - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: I find that running balls out.. time flies.. I'm learninG German so just count in german.. its quite a long complex system.. ein hundert zwei und swanzig etc. so by the time I get to 150.. a K's gone..

So I learn. but time flies..

Then the recoveries go way to fast..

I almost never do more than 10k unless running with Tsotleho then we can chat.
M0nkey - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: On the rare occasions i run on a treadmill i just try and keep increasing the speed until i am running at what i feel is almost maximum speed. I then try and keep that pace up for as long as possible. Probably not any good for training but it does bring the running session to a close within a reasonable period of time.
Jasperboy - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: Sorry guys but a treadmill is a lazy mans idea for a run. All you do is lift your feet up and down and the ground moves for you while you sing away to the latest pop music on your headphones or check out the totty on the next machine. If you want to train get outside in the rain, wind and hills.
IainRUK - on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Jasperboy: What an idiotic answer..

Stick it on 2%..

The guy I'm training with runs all winter on a treadmill, he's from Lesotho so not a fan of the cold.. he's aiming for 65 mins at a half marathon next week..

Whats your PB?

I actually think the opposite.. too many people take the easy option and go out for a fell run.. trick yourself into thinking its hard work. Aye its enjoyable.. is it good training? sometimes, often not.

Mark Torrance on 27 Mar 2013
In reply to Jasperboy:

Could it be perhaps that you've been facing the wrong way?


dissonance - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to IainRUK:
> (In reply to Jasperboy) What an idiotic answer..

is there any specific conversion ratio from normal running to treadmill?
Tad curious since slowly starting to run again and currently it is treadmill only.
The New NickB - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to dissonance:

The usual advice is to put it on 1% to give the feel effort wise of running on flat road, but you may want to vary elevation and speed to releve the tedium. Like the OP I love running, but treadmills.
Wonrek - on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: I'm with the OP and would rather pluck my own armpit hairs than run more than a 5k warmup on a dreadmill. Saying that though, I've got a cross trainer for intense cardio workouts and can happily while away an hour at max intensity on it.

Everything has its place and it depends on your ultimate goals and background as to what will benefit you most.

Both evil but I'd rather do my max sessions at the track than a dreadmill but living in Cornwall it's rare that I can't get outdoors.
LastBoyScout on 28 Mar 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance:

I use a rather swanky gym and the treadmills have screens and my headphones are always in my gym bag.

I can happily bung it on random profile, so it varies elevation, to make it more interesting while I giggle away to Big Bang Theory, or something.

If I can get one behind my wife on the exercise bike, so much the better ;-)

After 20 mins, or so, I'll pretend to know what I'm doing with the various weights machines and then pop next door and swim a mile.
mbh - on 09 Apr 2013
In reply to OP,

Time does run far too slowly on a treadmill, like it does in a swimming pool, so I only use them when the weather is really terrible or if I want to run fast, or do intervals, both of which I find easier to do on a treadmill than when outside.

To make it bearable, I often wear headphones and I use my heart monitor, though I never know what to make of the numbers afterwards. Doing intervals makes the time pass more quickly.

I use the gym at work, at the end of the day and try to do one treadmill session a week, to help my speed, but in fact do it less often. The choice, when I get there, is between going outside for a five mile run, through the local town which I quite like and know I can do, or going into the gym, and its world of tattoos, mirrors and muscles where I may well find all the treadmills occupied by slow walkers, or a queue of tut-tutters when I carry on past the regulation 20 minutes. Going outside seems a more attractive option.

The treadmill has definitely helped me to make myself go faster when outside. I could very well plod along the whole time at somewhere between 8:00 and 8:30 pace, but seeing that I can (just!) keep up sub 6:30 (15 kph) for 8 k on the treadmill has made me push myself to regularly do some sub 7:30 miles when outside.

I did fly off the back once.

IainRUK - on 09 Apr 2013
In reply to mbh: My mate just ran 66 mins at Berlin half marathon from training all winter on the treamill.. he was doing reps at 21.5 km / hour...
mbh - on 09 Apr 2013
In reply to IainRUK: that is quite amazing. I have for amusement put the machine up to 20 kph or so very briefly, which is 2:06 ish marathon pace, and can't fathom how any one can keep that up for over two hours.
IainRUK - on 09 Apr 2013
In reply to mbh: I was doing 2km reps at 18kph a few weeks back.. was watching the football and missed a step.. managed to stay up just.. that would have been horrific out the back of the treadmill...
streapadair - on 09 Apr 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance:

Once did a half-marathon on a treadmill at the work gym (50p a week). Things were very quiet, and I had to pass the time somehow. Never tempted to do it again though.
Ander on 09 Apr 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: My missus has been using turbo trainer DVD's to keep the interest up- quite successfully it seems too.

There are running versions out there, for example:
http://www.spinervals.com/products/item41.cfm
Ander on 09 Apr 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: I've done 150 minutes workouts on a cross machine- absolute murder...
Camm on 16 Apr 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance:
I like to play games in the gym, like going slightly faster than everyone else and trying to outlast everyone, I ended up doing a 2 hour session! I was also wearing a 20-25kg sack haha
Jonny2vests - on 16 Apr 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance:

Climbing indoors is one thing, the rock is often wet, dark or cold. But running indoors, and paying for the pleasure, wtf is that all about?
IainRUK - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:
> (In reply to Mark Torrance)
>
> Climbing indoors is one thing, the rock is often wet, dark or cold. But running indoors, and paying for the pleasure, wtf is that all about?

gains..
Camm on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:
For me, I pay a monthly fee so that I can use the free weights, maybe the resistance machines, the pool, the sauna, the steam room. Then I started to use the cardio equipment and found that I push myself when I think that people are watching, or I play games as I said above. I don't have the space for my own gym and if I did I'd probably not work out as hard as I would if I was in the gym. For some people it may be different but for me it works.
Rob Naylor - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance:
> ...a velocity exactly equal and opposite to his own (which I think is actually how treadmills work) what is the probability of him completing anything like a decent session without first pulling out his own teeth as a bit of light relief from the utter tedium of it all.
>

Tell me about it!!! Over here in Sakhalin I've had to use the hotel gym as we're now in the spring thaw and the roads and pavements, as well as being potholed to buggery are full of a slushy calf-deep wetness, often with a frictionless sheet of ice under it and deep invisble holes here and there.

I did a *whole half hour* on the damned thing last night and mentally it felt like running a half-marathon. I was bored stupid after about 2 minutes. Even changing speeds and inclines doesn't work for me: the sheer ennui of being on that bloody travelling belt is soul-destroying. I really dunno how people do it!

Still, looks like I'll be able to get on the roads again tomorrow as I can now see enough c;lear pavement for it not to be a big risk.
Jonny2vests - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to danrock101:
> (In reply to Jonny2vests)
> For me, I pay a monthly fee so that I can use the free weights, maybe the resistance machines, the pool, the sauna, the steam room.

Well that's all fair enough if you're into that stuff. But specifically, I find running indoors bizarre. I think motivating yourself to train outdoors, in the elements, day or night has a mental aspect to it that you cant get through group narcissism and shite MTV. Group narcissism is what climbing walls are for.

Also, having been in the army, part of me finds it hard to reconcile forking out for these things.
SteveP40 - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance: Best thing to do is change the pace about, only way to get over the tedium of running on a canvas belt!
IainRUK - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:
> (In reply to danrock101)
> [...]
>
> Well that's all fair enough if you're into that stuff. But specifically, I find running indoors bizarre. I think motivating yourself to train outdoors, in the elements, day or night has a mental aspect to it that you cant get through group narcissism and shite MTV. Group narcissism is what climbing walls are for.
>
> Also, having been in the army, part of me finds it hard to reconcile forking out for these things.

A mate just ran 66 mins at Berlin half from training on the treadmill.. not sure of wearing packs or any of that rubbish..

But I train on the treadmill in periods of snow as I just can't train hard enough.. not because people watch.. I run around 90 miles a week so not sure motivation is an issue.. I've had one day off in around 150 days..
ads.ukclimbing.com
Jonny2vests - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to IainRUK:

I concede that snow is fair enough, hence my analogy about climbing walls being there for when one can't do the real thing. But I don't understand why you would otherwise choose to do so. Unless you live in a big city with no big parks maybe...
mbh - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:

It's just one way of staying fit which brings its own specific gains. Just another variation of short-term grimness that helps the long term. Sometimes, when it's still cold, still dark and it's raining yet again, even the treadmill can seem an attractive option. Memory loss works wonders.

When I am on it, I run much faster than when I am outdoors, a good 60s faster. I don't like it, but once a week or less I can put up with it if it makes me do that.

I read on some blog of someone from Alaska who got into the US marathon team having trained entirely on a treadmill.
Helen R on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests:

My answer is talking books or the telly - but that's my answer to anything boring.

I live in a "up and coming" area of a city (no parks, intermittent pavements, fast traffic and bad lighting), and it will be dark most of the weekdays that I'm not in work for the next 6 months.

So i've hired a treadmill for the winter - cheaper than the gym and I can't really ignore it when it looks back at me in the morning....
mbh - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to Helen R:
I find that 3 x History of the World in 100 Objects or 1 x In Our Time = one tolerable treadmill session.
Jonny2vests - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to mbh:
> (In reply to Helen R)
> I find that 3 x History of the World in 100 Objects or 1 x In Our Time = one tolerable treadmill session.

I'm currently working my way through the in our time science back catalogue as I run to work and back each day. It's top drawer!

I guess a treadmill is kinder on the joints?
IainRUK - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests: I find it worse on my IT bands, calfs and achilles...

Jonny2vests - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to IainRUK:
> (In reply to Jonny2vests) I find it worse on my IT bands, calfs and achilles...

Right. You're not selling it to me.
IainRUK - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to Jonny2vests: My treadmill training 66 half marathon running mate and I just did 20 km on soft dirt trails through a secluded pine forest at dusk... incomparable how enjoyable that was to the treadmill.. it was a steady run for him... we were 6:40-6:30 minute miling by the end.. I was dieing keeping up...
Jonny2vests - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to IainRUK:

Splendid. I should go running more.
trollman - on 17 Apr 2013
In reply to Mark Torrance:its been a few years since using a treadmill, I only did 5 ks max or I got Bored. I used to do first 1k. steady pace warm up, say 12 kpm, then crank the speed up high for next half k then back down to 12 kph recovery, then up again faster than before for next half k, so on, till last half k I'm at full speed about 20 kph. The machine going so fast you have no choice but to run your heart out or fly off, always used a small incline, it makes it much tougher.
T

This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.