UKC

I've found a bike I like on Chain Reaction's site, but it's one from last year and a brand that isn't stocked in any bike shops near me. Their website says to contact them if you want to get a return as they can get reduced courier rates.

Has anyone here returned a bike to them, and if so, what did it cost? (I know it may vary depending on location.)

Or has anyone posted a bike using a courier before?

In reply to Pink Marshmallow:

I've read this a few times and I'm not 100% sure what you mean.

However, if you're saying that you'd like to go and try the bike in your LBS but can't because it's last year's model then buy it from Chain Reaction but if it's not 100% right you want to return it - well that is despicable.

E

In reply to Enty:
I think hes just asking how much it costs to return a bike to Chain Reaction. I guess he wants to know that if it doesnt fit he can return it without it costing him through the roof.

In regards to being despicable I think if he were to try it in a LBS then go online it is a bit unfair on the LBS but I'm sure theres plenty of us who do similar with climbing shoes. (Although I do it with GoOutdoors then order on bananafingers or rock and run so don't feel so guilty)

Back on topic afraid I can't help specifically with chainreaction but I've couriered bikes for less than 20 quid before.

In reply to Dustyw:

I think "he" is a "she" and I get what Enty is saying but I think Despicable is a little strong. Unethical might be more appropriate.

I just paid $120 for a set of pedals I could have got online for $80 but I wanted to support my LBS. I have to say it was a bit of a stretch for me.

In reply to Removed User:

Testing a bike at your LBS a then buying it online is despicable. I'm not saying the OP is doing this - just my view that's all.

E

In reply to Enty:

I do agree that it isn't very nice. I'd also suggest that you miss out so much of the essential service and input that the LBS can give.

In reply to Removed User:

Slightly tongue in cheek using the word despicable - maybe shoddy is a better word

E

In reply to Pink Marshmallow:

I'm all up for supporting local shops, but when they can't even come close to online prices they don't stand a chance of getting my custom.

Chain reaction are great and I can't imagine their couriour returns are going to be any more than about £25.
When you keep in mind that any bike you buy is liable to be between 25% and 50% cheaper in the first place it's probably worth it.

In reply to Enty:

I think they key thing when buying stuff is to think about what service you get, and how much you're paying for it. When I buy a bike, I want to be able to sit on it, ride it a bit, chat to staff about it. That's a service - so I'll go to my LBS and be aware that I'll be paying a bit extra, but knowing I'm getting more for my money. If I try it there, and go online, then the final consequence has to be that eventually my LBS will die out. On the other hand, if I need new cleats for my pedals, I know what I want, I don't need any advice, I'm happy with buying online and paying less. If my LBS eventually doesn't stock replacement cleats, and they're only available online, then then I'm not too bothered.

I try to ask myself:
Need advice?
Want to try it on/out?
Want to have it in my hand before I buy it?
Might I need some service on this part in the future (fitting, replacement etc.)

Yes? LBS's

Know what I want?
Would I be happy only being able to buy this thing online in the future?

Yes? Try the internet.

In reply to tatty112:

I think that's ok, IF you're happy that in the future you might only be able to buy them online. Personally, in the future, I still want to be able to go in the shop to try a bike out before I buy it.

Going into your LBS to try it out and then ordering online is proper shoddy though. Online is ok, but don't use your LBS for free, and spend your money elsewhere (obviously, if there's more than one bike shop in your area then go to both!)

In reply to Pink Marshmallow: Getting back on topic, most of Chain Reaction's stuff comes with a free returns label, but I don't know if this would apply to full bikes. Perhaps best to give them a ring/email to find out how much it would be? In my experience they are very helpful.

In reply to Enty:

I think Chain Reaction is the only place the OP can buy it from due to it being last year's model and it not being a brand stocked in bike shops near her.

Funny how reading can clarify things... ()

I'm not sure where the LBS argument even comes into this?
The OP is simply asking how she'd go about returning a cycle to an online retailer.

In reply to Glyno:Indeed. ()

In reply to Pink Marshmallow:



Bloody hell. Has it really not crossed your mind to ask them?

In reply to Timmd:

A fair point. If it is "I really want this bike, but I can't get it in my LBS so I'm going to have to go online" then fine. I think a couple of us read it as "I saw this bike, but I might have to send it back as I can't find any LBS where I can try it out before buying it at CRC" which I would disagree with. Apologies to the OP if this was misinterpreted.

In reply to Green Porridge:

I don't think it was misinterpreted. We all accept that she can only get it online but her post indicates that her intent would be to try it in a shop and then order it if she could and the fact that she can't is why she is concerned about the cost of a return......and that is what Enty is calling out.

In reply to Removed User:

Yes - apologies to the OP if that isn't the case - but it sounds like it to me.

E

In reply to Enty: I think despicable sums up folk who do that quite nicely actually.

My LBS have introduced 10% store credit back on bikes, e.g. you pay £2500 and you'll get £250 to spend in store on additional kit.

C

In reply to Chay:

Sounds like a good idea! Certainly, the shop where I've bought my last two bikes from gives me 10% generally, or does me some kind of other deal. With my last bike it was an early year model, with a couple of changes from the standard, so he did me some deal on that. He knows I don't try stuff from him and buy it online, and if I go in and get some advice, then he gets my cash. He also knows that I buy some things online, or at other bike shops.

It might be more expensive with some things than if I was ruthless and solely went for the best price for everything online, but it's got other advantages. Sometimes I go in just to look around, they end up giving me an espresso, and we sit in the workshop chatting, whilst he tells me of some new bit of kit that's being released, or gives me a tip for some problem on my bike. Sometimes, he'll also lend me an expensive tool that I don't have, but only need the once. It's a good relationship to have, and it works both ways.

In reply to Green Porridge:


It's called business. These arguments are nonsensical. Customers can spend their money as they choose. The fact of the matter is that if LBS were even close to competitive with online prices most people would use their LBS.
The owner of our LBS said he can't even buy bikes at trade prices for what online retailers sell them for (luckily for him in the Cotswolds their are plenty of people with more money than sense who keep him going)

For example my LBS has a top of the line Trek for £3200 you can buy exactly the same bike online for £2460, you're telling me you would spend £800more just to keep some high and mighty principle about LBS's

In reply to tatty112:

Not the point though, is it. Its not where she wants to spend her money that's the issue here its that she would (if she could) use the LBS for a try out and then buy on line. Again this is an interpretation of the OP.


So you would prefer that he shut up shop?


Yep

In reply to tatty112:

Not at all - I've had a long chat with my LBS owner about this. I basically told him that I can't afford to shop with him for stuff like groupsets and wheels. I'll pay a fiver or a tenner more for stuff like tyres, tubes and consumables but I can't afford the 30% more on major hardware.

The problem I have is if you go and test ride the 3200 Trek at the LBS, say thanks very much I'll have a think about it, then go and buy it for 2460 online - that is basically taking the piss.

E

In reply to tatty112:

Are you sure it is the same bike officially supplied by Trek with a full UK Trek warranty?

In reply to Enty:

Also, that you aren't paying extra for nothing, that you get correct fitting, after sales tuning, discounts on other items and a different experience.

I realise that there is a limit to this but everyone needs to consider their own value equation.

In reply to Pink Marshmallow:

apart from anything else ,I wouldn`t be interested in the hassle of sending a bike back ,or waiting for a courier to collect.

If I was ordering a bike I would only go ahead with the order/purchase if I was sure it was the bike I wanted.

In reply to Horse: Not to you in particular, but I think there can be a lot of the 'romance of the LBS' in these conversations. If you have a great LBS that is, well, "L" to you, then good. But I've seen plenty of BS from LBSs as well! Having bought three bikes locally: 13 years ago, 8 years ago and 5 years ago (for me); over the last few years we've bought another 4 bikes (2 for me, my wife's and my son's) from the UK via the internet. Increasingly the UK shops will deliver a bike here to Finland for free, which just make it even better. But it wasn't just the price, a big bit of it was just that the local shops were pretty crap both in terms of choice and service. When we were looking for my wife's bike the guy in one of the big specialists shops in Helsinki was trying to convince me a women's frame was _only_ a step through frame. I was trying to suggest that women riding in the Olympics or MTB XC world champs circuit wouldn't be doing so on step through frames! He really didn't seem to have thought about this.

A couple of the shops were excellent (although one was just this old fella who has since retired and the shop has gone), others were lousy and I felt that they saw themselves as quite entitled - only place in the country selling certain brands etc.

When I bought my first road bike 13 years ago, I sat on jig, they measured me up, and faxed the results off to Italy and a month later my (steel framed) bike turned up, sized just for me. But now the same brand, and local shop sell L,M and S sized "off the peg" frames at that lowish price point, so it doesn't feel so much like you need that local service to the same extent.

Anyway - that's all by-the-by; I read the OPs post as asking just how much it cost to send a bike back to Chain Reaction if you buy it and then it doesn't fit or you don't like it. Nothing more.

Wow, this received a lot more responses than I expected - thanks to those who did actually answer the question - <£25 seems reasonable to me.

The OP reads "...a brand that isn't stocked in any bike shops near me", i.e. it is a brand of bike which I cannot get in any of my local stores. No implication whatsoever that I would not buy it in my local stores if they did stock it.

Yes, I could have contacted Chain Reaction re. the cost of returning a bike, but I imagined the response would be fairly non-committal given the lack of quote on the website in the first place, hence the query for anecdotal costs.

In reply to Pink Marshmallow:

OK, we'll give you the benefit of the doubt

Still, it was a good discussion surrounding the ethics of internet shopping.

In reply to Pink Marshmallow: too many posts to read them all but I found the company really good to deal with. I bought body armour off of them and needed the size down so returned it via collect+ (very easy) and had the money refunded very quickly. Obviously to send a bike back will require some other courier but the company themselves seem to be excellent.

In reply to Enty:

.....and of course marking a bike up at £800 more than an online retailer for the benefit of an hours fitting isn't taking the piss......

In reply to tatty112: It's not called "marking up" - it's the MRP.......... it's they who give the wrong idea to buyers.

What actually happens is the cheap remote seller cuts his preferred margin and profit, making the local purveyor look greedy.

Don't forget that under sale of goods act the local retailer has to offer back up , servicing, warranty and responsibility for ongoing performance IN STORE.

The online seller does none of that, he is a remote seller and he should, but people won't bother sending it back just to get the cables retensioned or brakes reset, wheels trued and so on. So he/she does it at home. Or goes to the more "expensive" local bike shop - and gets pissed when they have to pay....................

In reply to unclesamsauntibess:

Slightly complicated, of course, by some of the online suppliers being LBSs expanding their business!

It's the same with outdoor stuff generally - The Outdoor Shop, for example, is one of the local outdoor shops in Milton Keynes as well as having a large web presence.

Neil

In reply to Dustyw: Why would you not use their price promise and get your shoes cheaper then? http://www.gooutdoors.co.uk/price-guarantee

In reply to tatty112:

If it was so simple.....

E

In reply to tatty112:

Previously you said:

"The owner of our LBS said he can't even buy bikes at trade prices for what online retailers sell them for"

Which suggests a rather more fundamental problem than the LBS trousering a huge profit.

In reply to TobyA:

I dont think so. Its more that its bad manners to use a shop as a fitting service and then go elsewhere.
Better the shop the worse manners it is since they are more likely to put time into helping you but even some shite shop should either be used properly or not at all.

Wiggle charge £20 to arrange return of a complete bike, I would think CRC would charge similar.

Otherwise Paisley Freight (search eBay or the web) charge about £25 to ship a complete bike in a big box.

Mark

Hum, erm, ah, distance selling regulations anyone ?

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/shopping/consumer-rights-refunds-exchange#...


I quote :

The seller must then pay back any cash within 30 days, including cost of delivery to you – although be sure to specifically ask for this to be included as some stores don't add it automatically. If it didn't tell you about your cancellation rights, you may have longer to cancel the order.

THE SELLER IS RESPONSIBLE if the item is not suitable.

In reply to New POD: They have to refund what they have charged for the goods to be delivered to you. They are not responsible if you are returning the goods to them.

SHOUTING doesn't make you right!

In reply to dissonance:


Of course it is, but that isn't what I was suggesting.

I happily paid a fiver more for a pair shoes from an LBS near my parents home than they would have been from Wiggle because I it was great I could try them on first and know what size was best. No problem with that at all, my point was just that not all LBSs have that great a choice.

In reply to Enty:
Funnily enough, I read the OP completely opposite — Their LBS didn't stock the bike they wanted (which would have been their preference), so as a fall-back they're going to buy it from Chain Reaction?

In reply to Pink Marshmallow:
To actually answer your question, I have returned a bike to Chain reaction recently and it was £15 for the courier.

In reply to Pink Marshmallow:
Is a whole bike to big for Parcel plus?
Have used the labels send with the order for the last 3 returns to them.

In reply to Pink Marshmallow:

Don;t worry about the JOBSWORTH daily mail readers like Enty

In reply to Hirosim:
Thats hardly mail readerish. If you don't buy from your LBS eventually it will close. then you'll have no where to go to try on bike clothes/shoes/bikes etc or look at nice shiney new stuff.

In reply to TomBaker:


Read the OP. They were asking abut the cost of the return, I was pointing out 'Enty's tendency to fly off the handle Daily Mail style

In reply to Hirosim:

That was my fault for bringing my capitalist (torygraph)ideas into a discussion about LBS's

In reply to Hirosim:

Oh dear I just spent 7 days bollocking my dad for buying the DM........

E

In reply to Enty:

Now I'll have to spend the next 7 days banging my head against the wall trying to get a thread on UKC which doesn't mention the DM....

E

In reply to: Whats interesting about this thread is the obvious difference between the cycle community and the climbing community

innocent post about chain reaction as she cant get a bike nearby and post gets hit but multiple people saying support your local bike shop

where as down at the gear forum, http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=545663 it always awash with plenty of help on where to buy cheap....

why the difference? every shop needs local shoppers?

In reply to gear boy:

No. Again you have missed the point about the comments. No one is suggesting that it isn't ok to buy cheaper gear online. The issue raised is whether it is ok to use the services of a local shop in order to try things out and then buy online.

More than one person has read the OP as implying that this would have been the intent had it been possible. The fact that it wasn't possible doesn't actually make the difference if the intent was still there.

In reply to Pink Marshmallow:

zero offence to OP ,and his enquiry.....

but what is the point of this thread.

has gone of on a boring tangent.

In reply to andymac:

Well don't read it then.

In reply to Removed User:

Good idea that,Sitting Bull.

In reply to Pink Marshmallow:


Hi there. My experience of CRC's customer service over the phone has always been exemplary. Give them a call - you get to hear a pleasant northern irish accent, and your question will probably be answered in 5 minutes i.e half the time it takes to wade through bored UKCers arguing over the semantics of your original post.

Once you do get your answer, please post again to let us know!

In reply to tatty112:

No its not because its not as simple as marking it up by £800.
The LBS has to buy the bike in the first place and display it in multiple sizes and hope it sells before it becomes last years model and he has to discount it just to break even.
A lot of the online places dont actually hold any stock and when you place an order they get your item dispatched direct from the manufacturer to you, little or no stock means a drastic reduction in overheads alowing for cheaper prices. Cheaper prices leade to more sales and more sales = a bigger discount from the manufacturer and that in turn leads to being able to offer even cheaper prices and that of course leads to even more sales.
This ever decreasing spiral keeps going until the online retailer hits the minimum price point that the manufacturer can sell the item for. Meanwhile the LBS is squeezed out of the market because people are selling online for less than he can buy them for and to add insult to injury he gets to waste a lot of time letting people demo bikes who then go home and order online.

My take on this is simple.
If I know what I want I will get it online, if its something I either need to see in person or try on then I go to a local shop and buy it there.

The last time I changed my van I got a few prices from online guys and they all advised me to go for a test drive at my local dealer (online obviously much cheaper because they have no stock or showroom, just a phone and office).
I got my prices and went to my local dealer, told them what I could get the van for and we worked out a deal, I paid about a grand more than online and was happy with that.
I was exceptionally happy when the van developed a fault 6 months down the line and the dealer went a long way above and beyond to sort me out.

The moral is support your locals because they are becoming extinct and before too long online will be the only way to obtain goods, when that happens good luck getting something in a hurry or the correct size first time.

In reply to andymac:

No, Sitting Bull was Hunkpapa Sioux

In reply to Enty:

Why? Is your local shop owner a good friend or is it just another high street business? What harm is it doing to take a bike for a test spin? You haven't reduced the value of that bike and if you weren't going to buy it from him anyway you haven't reduced his income. He would be pretty naive to think that everyone who tests a product is going to buy.

On the other side of the argument. What you are gaining by buying locally is a bike that is fully set up and ready to go. Probably a free service after the first month, and somewhere to wheel it back into if something goes wrong.

It's business. If you feel that trying then buying elsewhere is taking the piss, then go ahead and spend the extra money if it makes you feel better.

In reply to estivoautumnal:
Wherever I've been I've been friends with at least one LBS owner.


It does.
But like I have said before, being matey with the owner means I can walk in the shop and say with a smile "Look JC, you're Mavic wheels are way too expensive and 30% dearer than Chain Reaction" and I'll get 20% off because he'll more often than not meet me half way and keep my business. That's business isn't it?

E

In reply to Enty:

As oppossed to most LBS who will say 'sorry thats the price' or 'i can give you 5% off'or 'buy them from CRC then'

LBS's are in business. They know the way it works.

I have to confess Iwent to try on some shoes at my LBS and then bought them online, but they were about £55 cheaper online in a CRC sale. £55 might be nothing to some folks but to most of us it's quite a lot of money.
I appreciate all the arguments about this sort of thing but it's BUSINESS.

In reply to Enty:

Article today on the BBC website about 'showrooming'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-22098575

An interesting point being raised is that online big-box retailers stand to lose by the closure of shops with knowledgeable staff, fitting rooms etc, and may in the future have to open their own high street 'show rooms'.

In reply to Captain Fastrousers: Existing retail models will change dramatically in the next few years. We're just at the beginning. Those who can adapt will not just survive, they will drive the changes. Retail is the new manufacturing........