/ Guardian picture

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johncoxmysteriously - on 03 Jun 2013
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/picture/2013/jun/03/sport-picture-of-the-day-spider-man-el-delfin

Golly. Is this is a new high-water mark for press idiocy in covering climbing?!

I very much doubt it, actually, but still amusing, given that the route is AFAIK a popular bolt-protected 7c.

jcm
idiotproof (Buxton MC) - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

Its not even that good a photo...
Bulls Crack - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

At least they didn't start banging on about 'those foolhardy risk-takers idiots' etc etc as per the Daily Mail
Pinged - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:


Its a (seemigly welcome) opportunity for all you ocd/anal/purist/spitty/wasnt like that in my day/kids huh/cliquey/I know lots you know nowt head shakers to get yourselves all up in arms and mortified.

Its the post on your link from a daveweston that provides perfect commentary.
John_Hat - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

Personally I'm amazed JCM is reading the guardian.
johncoxmysteriously - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to Pinged:

You are daveweston and I claim my 5.

Actually, the commentary has been slightly deludicrised since I posted it. It used to refer to the 'treacherous' route.

jcm
Blue Straggler - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

The headline has been changed from "hardest" to "most dazzling" which just makes it a non-story with a relatively undramatic photo, rather than "idiocy"
Blue Straggler - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:
> deludicrised

Good grief
Alun - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to idiotproof (Buxton MC):
> Its not even that good a photo...

Oh get real, it's a fantastic shot of one of the more interesting rock features in Europe.

Also they've now changed the caption in response to feedback. Also, I confess, every time the mainstream press uses the word 'Spiderman' in association with rock-climbing, a little part of me dies inside...
Pinged - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

Haha Nope...sorry, I am not Daveweston.

However...I am Brian...and so is my wife
MJ - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to Alun:

every time the mainstream press uses the word 'Spiderman' in association with rock-climbing, a little part of me dies inside...

My Grandfather used to be known as Spiderman. Not because he was a good climber, but he needed help getting out of the bath.
toad - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to MJ:
> (In reply to Alun)
>
> every time the mainstream press uses the word 'Spiderman' in association with rock-climbing, a little part of me dies inside...
>
> My Grandfather used to be known as Spiderman. Not because he was a good climber, but he needed help getting out of the bath.

<snigger>
galpinos - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to the thread:

For all the whinging, it's a good photo that will hopefully have earnt Dan Arkle (of this parish I believe) a few bob.

What're we complaining about?
Ally Smith on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to galpinos: Where's my share of the cash? ;-)
Blue Straggler - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to Alun:
> I confess, every time the mainstream press uses the word 'Spiderman' in association with rock-climbing, a little part of me dies inside...

What about when I use it? I think when I came to see you in Barcelona (that time when Ryanair impounded the Marmite) I told my parents I was going to see a Welsh Spiderman in Spain :-P

dek - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to ally smith:
> (In reply to galpinos) Where's my share of the cash? ;-)
Don't hold your breath! Notoriously stingy to freelancers, the Guardian cut the rates they pay photogs a few years ago. Scroll down the link for a rough idea?
http://www.bjp-online.com/british-journal-of-photography/news/1647833/guardian-slash-photographers-f...
Blizzard - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

I must be missing something. What is the problem?
Blue Straggler - on 03 Jun 2013
In reply to Blizzard:

Read the whole thread. The text around the picture has been changed since the OP.
Alun - on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to Blue Straggler:
> I think when I came to see you in Barcelona (that time when Ryanair impounded the Marmite)

I still havent forgiven Ryanair!

xplorer on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

Issue's
galpinos - on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to ally smith:

You're the hero, the star of the show! What more payment do you need than basking in the glory of stardom?
Morgan Woods - on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

"before swinging through the air on their safety rope"

and i thought it was just called "a rope". I'll have to change how i refer to it from now on.
MJ - on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to xplorer:

Issue's

Shouldn't that be 'Issues'?
In reply to Morgan Woods: Loads more pictures on the Mail website http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2335109/He-makes-look-easy-Rock-hard-climber-conquers-worlds...

How do these things work? Does a photo agency get to suggest an interesting photo or photo set a day or something? Like a wire service sending out news stories? Because suddenly you see the same photos in lots of different publications. Great for the photographer!
Morgan Woods - on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to TobyA:

and 7 hours on it...what a punter :p
In reply to Morgan Woods:

We even have the national press getting in touch with us now to try and track down Ally Smith!

To paraphrase John Lennon, "hardest route in the world?! El Delfin isn't even the hardest route on the pillar of rock featured in the photograph!"

Alan
Ally Smith on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

My PR agent can be contacted here

http://www.douggoodmantravelpr.com/

And i'm only half joking...
Quiddity - on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to ally smith:

The comments on the Mail thread are hilarious!

> Get a real job - boring people. Mountaineering does NOT get you on the employment ladder!! - Hendonman , London, United Kingdom
In reply to ally smith:

Care to elaborate on how this got to the Daily mail?
It's a bit late for 1st April
Ally Smith on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to Paul Phillips - UKC and UKH:

Not my doing; i'm guessing an agency is pushing some of Dan Arkle's photos into the national press?

In reply to ally smith:

Dan's photos are particularly good to be fair :o)
lone - on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

I wonder how it fairs up against the Indian Face on Cloggy ?

Jason
Steve Crowe - on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

A quick search for ally smith climber would have led them to Ally's blog
http://allysmithblog.blogspot.co.uk/

useful on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to TobyA: Almost regretting having installed Kitten Block now...
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/kitten-block/dicomhebenajaeajoaehlhebjjehjahd?hl=en-GB

No more Daily Mail: only tea and kittens for me!
useful on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to Steve Crowe: Yes, but this is the national press we're talking about.
Red Rover - on 04 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously: I read in the Metro this morning that it defeats 99 out of 100 climbers.
Dan Arkle - on 05 Jun 2013
Hi All, the system works something like this...
I was approached by Caters, a press agency last year and have ran a few photo based stories with them. They provide news content and photos to all the major newspapers, which is released to all of them at the same time.

I answer all their questions to try and help them produce clear and accurate captions that a non-climber could understand. This press release then gets rewritten by journalists at any of the papers which take up the story.

As it can be rewritten twice, errors can creep in, although I'm not sure at which point it changes from this (from my email to them)

"The route is graded 7c+, meaning around only 1 percent of climbers could manage it. However, the grading system goes up to a dizzying 9b+"

to

"Rock hard climber conquers one of world's most treacherous peaks in just seven hours"

I'll try and make sure I see the press release before it goes out next time.

Don't forget that most of what you'll read in the papers about any subject will have gone through the same filter!

Presumably Ally, you also supplied the quotes that go with the MailOnline piece since they actually make sense and seem to be at complete odds with the rest of the baloney in the article.

If that is the case, did you really use the word 'scale' ? That is such a non-climbers word!

Alan
Dave Garnett - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:

> If that is the case, did you really use the word 'scale' ? That is such a non-climbers word!


It's pretty much obligatory for press purposes. If you aren't going mention 'hanging by fingertips' then the words 'scale' and 'sheer' must be included.
SteveRi - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Dan Arkle:
Mm, it's fairly common for someone entirely different to bolt the headline on later.

We cancelled a race in Jan because of the snow. We were still able to give some decent amounts to charity from donated entry fees. So a few of us decided to drop the cheques off by running between the two hospices. Front page of local paper with massive picture from last year's race...

'Runners forced to pull out of Helsby Half Marathon get chance to run in special race'
In reply to Dave Garnett:
> It's pretty much obligatory for press purposes. If you aren't going mention 'hanging by fingertips' then the words 'scale' and 'sheer' must be included.

And 'treacherous'

... and on that topic, I notice that Ally has changed his user name this morning in an attempt to hide from the paparazzi

Alan
Chris the Tall - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to C Chestwig; Treacherous climber:
> (In reply to galpinos) Where's my share of the cash? ;-)

You expect to be paid?

You ought to have to pay for the people who have to rescue you. SELFISH IDIOT.

Sorry, about that, don't know what came over me. I must remember not to read the comments....
Ally Smith on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Alan James - UKC and UKH:
> ... and on that topic, I notice that Ally has changed his user name this morning in an attempt to hide from the paparazzi

Hide from the paparazzi? No.

Take the pi$$ out of the article? Yes.

Ian Bentley - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously: radio times article isn't much better! Stumbled across it this morning! http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2013-06-04/brit-successfully-climbs-the-perilous-el-delfin
John2 - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Ian Bentley: I like it - 'Now Smith has his eyes on an even more challenging climb, the Kilnsey crag in the Yorkshire Dales'.
Angrypenguin - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Ian Bentley:

"is only completed by one per cent of climbers" implies that 1% of all climbers have completed it,
"only finished by one in every 99 climbers." implies that 99% of people that attempt it fail, both of which are different to the actual message,
"The route is graded 7c+, meaning around only 1 percent of climbers could manage it."

It's scary how the media just mangles stuff and you only notice when it is something that you know about.
Chris the Tall - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Angrypenguin:

> It's scary how the media just mangles stuff and you only notice when it is something that you know about.

Alternatively, it's a really good example of how statistics can get manipulated by the media, and a useful reminder not to believe all we read
Ally Smith on 06 Jun 2013

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