/ NEWS: National Park Extensions - Inquiry Underway

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UKC News - on 05 Jun 2013
Swarth Fell: Right of the wall it's National Park, left it isn't, 3 kbA Public Inquiry into proposals to make major additions to the Lake District and Yorkshire Dales National Parks got underway yesterday, and is expected to run until the middle of June

Read more at http://www.ukclimbing.com/news/item.php?id=68106
Lankyman - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to UKC News: this was featured on the local BBC news last night. According to the Northwest Tonight report one of the five authorities (Cumbria County Council) objects on the grounds that NP status will result in house price rises. This has to be one of the weakest arguments I've come across to block the process. I'm sure the poor and destitute of Kirkby Lonsdale (one of the blighted communities where the poor of Cumbria huddle by the park boundaries) will be glad of this.
NottsRich on 05 Jun 2013
What benefit do national parks provide in the UK? They all seem to have buildings popping up all over the place and roads everywhere.

Presumably a national park (in England and Wales anyway) just has more regulations regarding new buildings/roads, rather than an outright ban on development?
Steve John B - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Karl Lunt:
> (In reply to UKC News) this was featured on the local BBC news last night. According to the Northwest Tonight report one of the five authorities (Cumbria County Council) objects on the grounds that NP status will result in house price rises. This has to be one of the weakest arguments I've come across to block the process. I'm sure the poor and destitute of Kirkby Lonsdale (one of the blighted communities where the poor of Cumbria huddle by the park boundaries) will be glad of this.

Taking out the sarcasm - could you explain what you mean? Do you think house prices will rise in the 'new' areas? Do you think this is a good or a bad thing? What benefits do you envisage for, say, the residents of Kirkby Lonsdale?

I haven't got an axe to grind either way, just curious as to the arguments for and against expansion.
johncoxmysteriously - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Steve John B:

Presumably prices will go up because the properties will be viewed as more desirable. I'm guessing this will be because their views and amenities will be preserved. Presumably those would be the benefits.

And I suppose the supply of new build will be considerably restricted.

I'd have thought house prices in KL rising would actually benefit the present residents of KL. It's would-be residents who might suffer.

jcm
Simon Caldwell - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to NottsRich:
> What benefit do national parks provide in the UK?

None that I can see.
Half the Howgills are currently in the National Park, the other half aren't. But a few years ago, an ugly track was allowed to be bulldozed across the tops, almost entirely within the national park.
Steve John B - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:
> (In reply to Steve John B)
>
> I'd have thought house prices in KL rising would actually benefit the present residents of KL. It's would-be residents who might suffer.
>
> jcm

Do you mean residents or homeowners?
johncoxmysteriously - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Steve John B:

Homeowners. Why, is there a lot of renting in KL, do you reckon?

jcm
Steve John B - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to johncoxmysteriously: I thought you legal types were supposed to be precise in your use of language!

No idea about renting in KL, I assume from your sarcasm (what is it about this thread?) that there isn't much. Price rises wouldn't help school leavers though, or young families trying to move to a bigger house.
Lankyman - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Steve John B: for those not familiar with the area, Kirkby Lonsdale is not by any means a poor area. In fact it is a highly desirable place to live due largely to its very pleasant location in the Lune Valley. As a result of this house prices are already well out of the range of the poor. For Cumbria CC to use this as an argument is ludicrous. Another opponent (a landowner I think) interviewed in the same BBC report stated that the area just cannot cope with a huge influx of visitors. He obviously wasn't thinking of Kirkby Lonsdale and the Devil's Bridge which have large car parks and are usually heaving with visitors without even being in the national park. There are numerous quiet areas within both national parks so to say the inquiry areas will be swamped is again not true. I suspect that one of the reasons some people object is that they may not be able to just get on with their plans for 'development'. Several wind farms have been proposed in the past for these areas - Whinash was one which, if it had gone ahead, would have visually destroyed the Westmorland Borrowdale. Wainwright (with justification) described this as the finest valley outside the Lake District. This went to public inquiry and the inspector rejected it on the grounds of visual impact. More recently it narrowly avoided having an 'exclusive' holiday resort inflicted on it. Park status would effectively limit this kind of insensitive development - not guaranteed I know before anybody starts posting up examples of grot spots in the Lakes/Dales!
Lankyman - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Toreador:
> (In reply to NottsRich)
> [...]
>
> None that I can see.
> Half the Howgills are currently in the National Park, the other half aren't. But a few years ago, an ugly track was allowed to be bulldozed across the tops, almost entirely within the national park.

Aren't you being a little bit disingenuous here, Toreador? I assume you mean the track that was made from Calders to The Calf summit. I saw that being constructed - a small digger with one man - and it was to control the erosion that was getting pretty bad. Granted, it's not ideal but it has mellowed and there was little to no native stone to construct a path like, say, on The Band or Great Gable. The erosion was also becoming bad beside Cautley Spout - there is plenty of stone there and a reasonable job resulted. Both projects were funded partly by the Dales NP.

Simon Caldwell - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Karl Lunt:
Yes I mean that track, and its continuation. I was walking in the area a couple of months before it was built, and strongly disagree that erosion was getting pretty bad. In parts there was no obvious erosion at all, just green grass. They took a few eroded spots as an excuse to destroy the rest.
Hardonicus - on 05 Jun 2013
In reply to Karl Lunt: Kirkby Lonsdale is caveman country if you are from Appleby! However on the grand scheme of things, I think it's pretty well to do, as is most of the Eden Valley.
Carolyn - on 07 Jun 2013
In reply to UKC News:

I wonder if it's not entirely about housing....

Local Authority funding formula (ie how what they get from national govt is decided) has changed recently. Cumbria's lost quite badly. New formula allows them to keep money from business rates. Cumbria's already quite limited in where it can develop business premises because of national park restrictions. I'd have thought area around Kendal, just off M6, might just possibly be top of the list of areas they have in mind for development....
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a lakeland climber on 07 Jun 2013
In reply to Carolyn:

Well Kendal Auction Mart have just finished their new market at Crooklands next to J36 on the M6 so development does happen and there's a good chance that more will take place there. There's also a small light industrial estate on the A65 just west of Kirkby Lonsdale. One other place that might be considered for development is Tebay though the ban on HGVs using the A685 between Tebay and Brough and the A66 might limit this.

Kendal itself isn't in the national park or the proposed extensions - http://www.naturalengland.org.uk/ourwork/conservation/designations/new/northwestdesignationproject/l... - so there's no conflict there. In fact as far as the new (Lake District) areas are concerned other than quarrying there's little industry as such so unless there was a new site singled out for development I don't see this as a valid argument.

KL is generally a very well-off area even considering the general prosperity of south Lakeland so a lot of the opposition does seem a peculiar form of nimbyism.

ALC

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