/ Top rope setup Qs - static rope or extending slings

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badgerjockey - on 13 Oct 2013
Ello,

Could of questions that I can't find answers to just by googling so hoped you'd be able to help out.

Top roping at Cheesewring in Cornwall recently, most of the anchors I found were located at least 5m, sometimes up to 10m back from the top of the crags we were on.

I know that the master karabiners at the top should be over the edge to prevent excess rope wear but getting them there with my gear was difficult.

Can you tell me if adding in sling after sling after sling connected by karabiners/QDs in order to extend the master karabiners over the edge is dangerous in anyway? I have a cordelette and a load of 120cm or 240m slings so I literally daisy chained them several meters to the edge.

How do you normally tackle this? Would you take a 20/30m bit of static rope and use that in stead?

Also, is there any way you could realistically rig a top rope and equalised anchors (on a short <10m crag) using just one long rope?

Cheers,
H
Choss on 13 Oct 2013
In reply to hazzeryoda:

In answer to your last question, yes. Hard to explain, Someone might have reference to it.

Involves 1 rope, 2 fig 8 Knots, 2 Crabs, and you dont tie into end of rope but Clip into a Running Bight of rope which runs to top of crag then Back down to bottom Belayer
JayPee630 - on 13 Oct 2013
In reply to hazzeryoda:

Not dangerous, but not the best thing to do.

I'd use a bit of static line for sure.
badgerjockey - on 13 Oct 2013
In reply to Choss:
YEah, I think I get this. Ends up with quite a bit of rope dangling around no?
badgerjockey - on 13 Oct 2013
In reply to JayPee630:
Right, off to the shops for some static rope then...
Choss on 13 Oct 2013
In reply to hazzeryoda:

Ends with 3 Strands, 1st down crag attached to crab on fig 8 at cliff edge, through crab on Climber, Back to top, through 2nd crab, then down to belayer.

Told you hard to explain. Hopefully, someone more eloquent can explain it Better.

But the system works fine and safe.
wivanov - on 13 Oct 2013
In reply to hazzeryoda:

> Can you tell me if adding in sling after sling after sling connected by karabiners/QDs in order to extend the master karabiners over the edge is dangerous in anyway? I have a cordelette and a load of 120cm or 240m slings so I literally daisy chained them several meters to the edge.

I've done this many times, depending on what gear I had available at the time. If you're worried, use screwgates or double up your karabiners and reverse the gates.

Or, you could simply belay from the top of the cliff and use your climbing rope and a couple karabiners to anchor yourself to the bolts. Sometimes this is a lot easier and faster.

> How do you normally tackle this? Would you take a 20/30m bit of static rope and use that in stead?

Here's one way: http://home.no/sittingduck/basictoprope.jpg
Replace the trees with bolts and karabiners. Clearly, you don't have to "wrap" around anything. I use a figure 8 at one anchor and clove hitch at the other.

> Also, is there any way you could realistically rig a top rope and equalised anchors (on a short <10m crag) using just one long rope?

Yes, as others have commented. Kind of a cluster though, isn't it?
Firestarter on 13 Oct 2013
In reply to hazzeryoda:

If you can, get hold of Libby Peter's 'Rock Climbing Essential Skills & Techniques'. Brilliant book with clear explanations and pictures/diagrams. Explains all.
jwa - on 13 Oct 2013
I've rigged top ropes just using one climbing rope. You don't need to clip into the middle of the rope though. Set up your rigging. The rope will then go down the climb to the belayer, up to the lower off then back down for the climber to tie on to the loose end. You obviously need a long rope to do this.
badgerjockey - on 14 Oct 2013
How about getting 20m or so of 7mm accessory cord? Would this be OK?

I guess it's less to cut through at the edge than an 11m static...

Gonna see if I can fashion a home made rope protector from an old bike tube...

H
Jamie B - on 14 Oct 2013
In reply to hazzeryoda:

Pretty much everyone I know who top-ropes regularly, either recreationaly or professionally, has a 20m+ length of static. Think of it as basic kit.
Lukem6 - on 14 Oct 2013
In reply to hazzeryoda:
> How about getting 20m or so of 7mm accessory cord? Would this be OK?
>
> I guess it's less to cut through at the edge than an 11m static...

depends on how sharp the edge is and what you are doing to protect the rope.

Depends on if accessory cord you mean 7mm static or 7mm dynamic. read label before buying dynamic will result in anchors moving more and rope rubbing more. Regards to what thickness, well it depends on how you use it, how you protect it and how safe you prefer to be.
r0x0r.wolfo - on 14 Oct 2013
In reply to hazzeryoda:
> How about getting 20m or so of 7mm accessory cord? Would this be OK?
>
> I guess it's less to cut through at the edge than an 11m static...
>
> Gonna see if I can fashion a home made rope protector from an old bike tube...
>
> H

Plump for 10-11mm its just more durable and confidence inspiring. Spreads the weight over a larger area so doesn't cut into soft rock as much. Protect the edge/rope from the rope/edge well and you can of course get away with either. The thicker rope is generally better/more versatile. 25m is a decent length. Check out your local crags to decide to go for shorter/longer.
badgerjockey - on 16 Oct 2013
Great responses all. Thanks.
Kelcat - on 16 Oct 2013
In reply to badgerjockey:
All three methods mentioned will work - the static is just a lot better/easier/safer than the others. When I first started instructing I didn't own/use a static, I.e. it wasn't part of my personal kit. It's now one of my most used group items - makes setting up top/bottom ropes v easy & quick. Not too expensive either.
Jamie B - on 16 Oct 2013
In reply to badgerjockey:

Don't bother belaying me on a 7mm rig! I'm sure others will give you the same response.
JimboWizbo - on 16 Oct 2013
In reply to badgerjockey:

I've used slings in a chain before to reach anchors for a top rope, I was aware that dyneema will stretch, so you are at risk of wearing the slings on the edge as it bounces up and down all day. We protected the edge with a boulder mat and everything went great.

I wouldn't advise doing this regularly though, you have lots of 'links in the chain' with daisy chained slings, best to go and buy 40-50m of static line.
Jordon Fleming - on 16 Oct 2013
In reply to badgerjockey: Done a fair bit at cheesewring and the ancors are quite far away however if you are top ropoing and its just 2 of you, you could just use one dynamic rope (probs possible on a 50m, unless your doing some of the bigger routes) and belay from the top.

quickest way to do this is use two fence posts, put a sling and screw gate on both. tie yourself or if swaping round reguarly just fig 8 on bite with clovehitch, and then clove hitch one of the anchors adjust it to were u want to be sat at the top. that one line done, now to save rope go back to the first anchor and take a bit of slack on the rope your not connected to; and clove hitch to the other anchor. you should be able to follow that rope back to the edge and clove hitch it to your harness. just throw the rest of the rope down and your mate can tie in and u can belay from the edge.

http://www.glenngordon.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/DSCF3791-768x1024.jpg

^just like this but a bigger version^
ads.ukclimbing.com
Crag Pony - on 16 Oct 2013
In reply to badgerjockey: Try a carpet tile(keep an eye out in skips)for a rope protector. Much tougher than bike innertube. Attach to anchor rope with a prussic. Or do the same with your rucksac.

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