UKC

For years ive always Used a Larks foot for shortening a Long peg. Last week i Tried a clove Hitch, but couldnt Decide, Knot up or Knot down? So Larks Footed as usual instead.

which way would you do Clove hitch. Knot up or down? Or not Matter?

In reply to Choss: Knot up is better, think it's because it tightens the clove hitch if you fall on it.

In reply to Choss:

Knot on the side of the direction of pull, but with an extra turn to close it.

In reply to Jonny2vests:

So that would be Knot down?

In reply to Choss: loop a wire over it? Easier to do on lead and keeps the load as closer to the base of the peg

In reply to Choss:

I think the way I said it is less ambiguous. Not everything in climbing is up or down.

In reply to Choss: What is wrong with sticking with a larks foot ? It worked for me all my climbing career, its fast easy and foolproof.

In reply to Al Evans:

Thats what ive always used. Was trying something different, then couldnt Decide Which way up Knot should face, so used larks foot as usual.

Just wondering how Other people used a clove Hitch on a peg

In reply to Al Evans:

Yes but that might reduce the strength of the the knot to only three times that of the dodgy, half-in peg. Why take the risk?

In reply to Jonny2vests:

That's what I do, so knot down.

In reply to john arran:
There was a thread on here recently about the strength of a larks foot. I doubt the clove hitch in dyneema is any stronger!

http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=559130

Clove hitch knot up is the way to go (but strength matter less than slippage).

The lark's foot is a weak knot because of the tightly curved and highly stressed bends which amplify the stresses at the corners.

A clove hitch, knot up, tends to tighten (rather than loosen) under use so it doesn't slide from the set point and the most highly stressed bends are around the peg. "Knot down" it tends to loosen and can be more highly stressed because the bends are around the diameter of the sling rather than the peg.

In practice, when confronted with a manky, protruding peg it is likely that the sling won't fail (whatever knot) before the peg so prioritise not slipping as this will protect the peg from being levered.

Same for belay stakes.

(knot up means knot on the opposite side to the pull)

In reply to Choss:

More often than not I'm trying to tie off a peg one handed and in that case its whatever I can get to stick !

In reply to duchessofmalfi:


Did you read the thread I linked, if not this link from it may be of interest to you:
http://adriannelhams.blogspot.co.uk/2010/11/sling-strengths.html

A larks foot in dyneema is not actually an especially weak knot. Interestingly when tested around a 10mm pin (which wouldn't be that different to a peg) it the strength of the sling was still 19.70 kn or 88.25% of the rated strength, I'd be willing to bet the clove hitch is no better (and argue that it doesn't need to be even if it is!)

In reply to CurlyStevo:

I'm slightly amused about why anyone would be worried about the strength of a sling used to tie of a partly inserted peg !

In reply to GrahamD:
Quite.

In reply to Al Evans:

Ditto.

In reply to Choss:


I have always used a slip knot when tieing off pegs, screws, etc.

In reply to Choss:

Bt default knot up, simply becuase i find it easier to tie one-handed that way.

As others have said, usually the least of my worries.