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I'm planning a road trip to the US in the Summer.
Planning to leave in mid-June, and stay until mid-September.
If anyone could give some advice on destinations, costs, logistics etc. that would be perfect.
I'm wanting to do some massive multipitch rock routes. WOuld like to get some sport in as well though.
I lead E1 consistently but pushing at E4.
Hopefully be about 6 of us, so thinking of renting an RV. Has anyone done this/know how much it costs?
Was thinking Wind Rivers in Wyoming. Probably want to go north/high to avoid summer heat.
Cheers!
Planning to leave in mid-June, and stay until mid-September.
If anyone could give some advice on destinations, costs, logistics etc. that would be perfect.
I'm wanting to do some massive multipitch rock routes. WOuld like to get some sport in as well though.
I lead E1 consistently but pushing at E4.
Hopefully be about 6 of us, so thinking of renting an RV. Has anyone done this/know how much it costs?
Was thinking Wind Rivers in Wyoming. Probably want to go north/high to avoid summer heat.
Cheers!
In reply to Edvenables: Guess you're a trad climber! I would go to Devil's Tower in Wyoming and spend the rest of my time in the Black Hills/Needles area of South Dakota. The weather might be hot, but its the best trad climbing in the US, aside from maybe Joshua Tree which is too hot that time of year, or the Gunk's, in New York.
In reply to sadiegirl:
Devil's Tower is fantastic, but that is a BIG claim.
> (In reply to Edvenables) Guess you're a trad climber! I would go to Devil's Tower in Wyoming and spend the rest of my time in the Black Hills/Needles area of South Dakota. The weather might be hot, but its the best trad climbing in the US
Devil's Tower is fantastic, but that is a BIG claim.
In reply to Edvenables:
I haven't done any climbing in the States so won't comment on that, but I have done some roadtripping in that area.
Washington/Montana/Idaho/Wyoming are good bets for temperature at that time of year - it will still be very hot in the daytime in July/August, but OK with early starts and high altitude. Colorado is a good bet too if you are doing high/multipitch stuff rather than bouldering, but more prone to thunderstorms.
RV rental is mind-blowingly expensive, particularly after insuring a few of you properly. It's often cheaper to book a package from the UK. It could potentially be worth buying and then selling a vehicle, but this obviously comes with a huge faff-factor and more risk. If you can't stomach the RV prices, you could consider renting a couple of cars (one large, one small?) and just camping.
If you haven't been to the States before, bear in mind that camping is typically a more private and relaxed affair than in Europe, typically in beautiful spots with large, private pitches, and always with your own picnic table and fire-ring. State and National parks are far nicer than most commercial offerings, but often have very basic sanitation (ie pit toilets and no sinks/showers) and need more careful advance booking. Plan ahead if you can to stay in the best places.
Cost wise, budget around $15 per night for camping per site. A site will usually accommodate 1-2 RVs or 2-3 tents and a car or two (additional cars are often charged at a few dollars). RVs are sometimes charged a little more, and hookup for power etc can add $5-10 depending on the site.
You can get a tankful of petrol for about $50-$60. Food shopping is very similar to the UK, but there is more very cheap stuff if you want it. Eating out is usually 10-20pc cheaper than the UK.
Have fun.
I haven't done any climbing in the States so won't comment on that, but I have done some roadtripping in that area.
Washington/Montana/Idaho/Wyoming are good bets for temperature at that time of year - it will still be very hot in the daytime in July/August, but OK with early starts and high altitude. Colorado is a good bet too if you are doing high/multipitch stuff rather than bouldering, but more prone to thunderstorms.
RV rental is mind-blowingly expensive, particularly after insuring a few of you properly. It's often cheaper to book a package from the UK. It could potentially be worth buying and then selling a vehicle, but this obviously comes with a huge faff-factor and more risk. If you can't stomach the RV prices, you could consider renting a couple of cars (one large, one small?) and just camping.
If you haven't been to the States before, bear in mind that camping is typically a more private and relaxed affair than in Europe, typically in beautiful spots with large, private pitches, and always with your own picnic table and fire-ring. State and National parks are far nicer than most commercial offerings, but often have very basic sanitation (ie pit toilets and no sinks/showers) and need more careful advance booking. Plan ahead if you can to stay in the best places.
Cost wise, budget around $15 per night for camping per site. A site will usually accommodate 1-2 RVs or 2-3 tents and a car or two (additional cars are often charged at a few dollars). RVs are sometimes charged a little more, and hookup for power etc can add $5-10 depending on the site.
You can get a tankful of petrol for about $50-$60. Food shopping is very similar to the UK, but there is more very cheap stuff if you want it. Eating out is usually 10-20pc cheaper than the UK.
Have fun.
In reply to Edvenables:
Official west coast USA climbing guide here: http://tinyurl.com/pcu5j9w
Sample entry -
Joshua Tree
What’s good about it
Single pitch trad. (mostly) routes in stunning desert environment.
A little bouldering, often pretty highball.
Massive scope: always possible to get away from people.
The ‘third most cosmic place on the planet’ according to UFO experts.
Best time
October - mid-December; mid-Feb - April.
What’s not so good about it
Cold and windy at night and not much to do after climbing other than take drugs and go wild (perhaps that should go in What’s good...).
The nearest civilisation isn’t.
Busy areas are carnage at public holidays: think Stanage on May Day weekend without the same exhibition of skill and judgement. I saw three ground-falls in two days over Thanksgiving.
Tweakers.
Official west coast USA climbing guide here: http://tinyurl.com/pcu5j9w
Sample entry -
Joshua Tree
What’s good about it
Single pitch trad. (mostly) routes in stunning desert environment.
A little bouldering, often pretty highball.
Massive scope: always possible to get away from people.
The ‘third most cosmic place on the planet’ according to UFO experts.
Best time
October - mid-December; mid-Feb - April.
What’s not so good about it
Cold and windy at night and not much to do after climbing other than take drugs and go wild (perhaps that should go in What’s good...).
The nearest civilisation isn’t.
Busy areas are carnage at public holidays: think Stanage on May Day weekend without the same exhibition of skill and judgement. I saw three ground-falls in two days over Thanksgiving.
Tweakers.
In reply to duncan:
I like it.
Take several UKC karma points for the post in full, good summary.
> (In reply to Edvenables)
> ... think Stanage on May Day weekend without the same exhibition of skill and judgement.
I like it.
Take several UKC karma points for the post in full, good summary.
In reply to duncan:
Weird review in places there...I've changed a few things:
Good bits...
You could climb multi-pitch or long two pitch for a couple of weeks if you wanted. A lifetime of single pitch. Anything below 10m is a boulder problem.
A lifetime of bouldering mostly not in guidebooks, enough for weeks in a guidebook.
Nomad Ventures is one of the best climbing shops in the world who will chat about great things to do and repair cam triggers for a few dollars (take all your busted cams).
Coyotes (if you like wildlife)
Best time....
Also good: mid-december to mid feb (often better than october and April)
What’s not so good about it....
Rock can be scritty on the surface on less popular areas.
It can get a bit samey but a ready solution is at hand: combine with Red Rock.
Sometimes cold and windy at night and not much to do after climbing other than various things you normally do in the dark after climbing when camping.
The nearest civilisation is OK for food and access to the internet and local art. Like many OK places unfairly regarded as bad, talking to locals can pay dividends.
Areas can get busy but never anything like Stanage on May Day. People will be more polite than on Stanage but fall off more often on lead as they try hard despite inexperience and brutal JT grading (convert from Stanage UK grades then add 2-4 notches: eg expect HVS at times on 5.7 PG and upto E2 on 5.7R slab)
Coyotes (if you dont like wildlife)
Crossroads was wonderful but it's changed owners and now is only OK.
Weird review in places there...I've changed a few things:
Good bits...
You could climb multi-pitch or long two pitch for a couple of weeks if you wanted. A lifetime of single pitch. Anything below 10m is a boulder problem.
A lifetime of bouldering mostly not in guidebooks, enough for weeks in a guidebook.
Nomad Ventures is one of the best climbing shops in the world who will chat about great things to do and repair cam triggers for a few dollars (take all your busted cams).
Coyotes (if you like wildlife)
Best time....
Also good: mid-december to mid feb (often better than october and April)
What’s not so good about it....
Rock can be scritty on the surface on less popular areas.
It can get a bit samey but a ready solution is at hand: combine with Red Rock.
Sometimes cold and windy at night and not much to do after climbing other than various things you normally do in the dark after climbing when camping.
The nearest civilisation is OK for food and access to the internet and local art. Like many OK places unfairly regarded as bad, talking to locals can pay dividends.
Areas can get busy but never anything like Stanage on May Day. People will be more polite than on Stanage but fall off more often on lead as they try hard despite inexperience and brutal JT grading (convert from Stanage UK grades then add 2-4 notches: eg expect HVS at times on 5.7 PG and upto E2 on 5.7R slab)
Coyotes (if you dont like wildlife)
Crossroads was wonderful but it's changed owners and now is only OK.
In reply to hamsforlegs:
This sounds expensive. What's the deal with wild camping? Illegal?
We're talking student budget with no summer job here. Summer before last I was in Chamonix and managed it on 50 euros for a month. (Hitch-hiked there, ate out of bins and slept at the gaillands.)
Certainly no eating out.
This sounds expensive. What's the deal with wild camping? Illegal?
We're talking student budget with no summer job here. Summer before last I was in Chamonix and managed it on 50 euros for a month. (Hitch-hiked there, ate out of bins and slept at the gaillands.)
Certainly no eating out.
In reply to Edvenables:
The $15 dollar per night quoted is probably per pitch not per person. Most places will allow up to 6 people and a couple of tents per pitch.
> This sounds expensive. What's the deal with wild camping? Illegal?
The $15 dollar per night quoted is probably per pitch not per person. Most places will allow up to 6 people and a couple of tents per pitch.
In reply to Edvenables: You need to go to California at some point in your trip! Tuolumne and the Sierra Nevada will be great in the summer, though it'll be rather warm in Yosemite.
Devil's Tower is great, though I wouldn't say it counts as "massive multipitch rock routes".
Here is a list of routes to salivate over, the American equivalent of Hard Rock: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fifty_Classic_Climbs_of_North_America
though bear in mind they are sometimes known as the "50 Crowded Classics"!
As others have remarked, RV rental is going to be extortionate. And you need to pay for a campsite on top. Campsites are generally ~$15-20 in national parks and $10-15 in other state or federally owned land (BLM, National Forest). There's often free "dispersed" camping in these areas, but none in national parks. Privately owned campsites are more expensive.
Hope that helps! (currently packing for 4th climbing trip to the US...)
Devil's Tower is great, though I wouldn't say it counts as "massive multipitch rock routes".
Here is a list of routes to salivate over, the American equivalent of Hard Rock: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fifty_Classic_Climbs_of_North_America
though bear in mind they are sometimes known as the "50 Crowded Classics"!
As others have remarked, RV rental is going to be extortionate. And you need to pay for a campsite on top. Campsites are generally ~$15-20 in national parks and $10-15 in other state or federally owned land (BLM, National Forest). There's often free "dispersed" camping in these areas, but none in national parks. Privately owned campsites are more expensive.
Hope that helps! (currently packing for 4th climbing trip to the US...)
In reply to ebygomm:
More than that camping is free in most national forest areas. If you want cheap head the Needles. I think there is some free camping at Idylwild too (Tahquitz/ Suicide) and just outside Sequoia.
More than that camping is free in most national forest areas. If you want cheap head the Needles. I think there is some free camping at Idylwild too (Tahquitz/ Suicide) and just outside Sequoia.
In reply to Edvenables:
You specifically mentioned the Wind Rivers and I've been there in the summer. The temperatures were ideal during the day (nights are noticeably colder); the alpine scenery's totally stunning. Probably the most scenic and wild mountain area I've been to; a true alpine wilderness. Climbing in the Cirque of the Pinnacles - access from Big Sandy trailhead - is a definite 'must'. Afternoon thunderstorms can be an issue but it was settled the whole time I was there.
You'll get an RV to the trailheads but be prepared for 10s of miles of dirt road driving once the pavement ends. As someone who has a big camper van, personally I wouldn't hire an RV due to cost (hire and fuel) as well as general slowness/ unwieldiness. Think perhaps of hiring a big people carrier instead. Also, if you're climbing in somewhere like the Wind Rivers you'll need camping/ bivying kit too as nothing is 'roadside', so most walk-ins are fairly major efforts, often from quite remote trail-heads and will involve wilderness camping. (Buy cheap camping gear once in the States. Don't bother taking any with you.)
The area has lots of moose, elk, deer as well as various raptors. Grizzlies and black bears are both common, usually seen daily (and hopefully from a good distance!) Wild camping/ bivvying not a problem but day stay regulations apply to avoid over-use. These can be ignored for a few days in somewhere like the Cirque but rangers do venture that far, so be very discreet.
Very important to brush up/ take advice on anti-bear procedures with food and scented stuff. Camp hygiene needs to be impeccable otherwise bears can be a serious problem and they can climb 5.10 so just simply hanging food off a branch is a bit pointless. Latest bear info is usually posted on trail head notice boards. Wolves, both lone and in packs, are an issue too and they're bold enough to enter your campsite once you're in the tent. Wolf pee on tents and other belongings isn't especially appealing! Giardia and other micro-organisms are a serious problem, so all water needs to be filtered or treated. Take plenty of mozzie repellent too.
Base yourself in Pinedale, which still has a bit of a frontier town feel to it, with working cowboys commonly seen in their chaps and spurs. The town has good facilities, with a scenic campground on the outskirts of town (which also had a resident grizzly raiding the bins when we stayed there!)
If you're thinking about the Wind Rivers, also consider the (nearby) Tetons; another fantastic area but less of a wilderness than the Winds.
HTH and have a good trip.
Dave
You specifically mentioned the Wind Rivers and I've been there in the summer. The temperatures were ideal during the day (nights are noticeably colder); the alpine scenery's totally stunning. Probably the most scenic and wild mountain area I've been to; a true alpine wilderness. Climbing in the Cirque of the Pinnacles - access from Big Sandy trailhead - is a definite 'must'. Afternoon thunderstorms can be an issue but it was settled the whole time I was there.
You'll get an RV to the trailheads but be prepared for 10s of miles of dirt road driving once the pavement ends. As someone who has a big camper van, personally I wouldn't hire an RV due to cost (hire and fuel) as well as general slowness/ unwieldiness. Think perhaps of hiring a big people carrier instead. Also, if you're climbing in somewhere like the Wind Rivers you'll need camping/ bivying kit too as nothing is 'roadside', so most walk-ins are fairly major efforts, often from quite remote trail-heads and will involve wilderness camping. (Buy cheap camping gear once in the States. Don't bother taking any with you.)
The area has lots of moose, elk, deer as well as various raptors. Grizzlies and black bears are both common, usually seen daily (and hopefully from a good distance!) Wild camping/ bivvying not a problem but day stay regulations apply to avoid over-use. These can be ignored for a few days in somewhere like the Cirque but rangers do venture that far, so be very discreet.
Very important to brush up/ take advice on anti-bear procedures with food and scented stuff. Camp hygiene needs to be impeccable otherwise bears can be a serious problem and they can climb 5.10 so just simply hanging food off a branch is a bit pointless. Latest bear info is usually posted on trail head notice boards. Wolves, both lone and in packs, are an issue too and they're bold enough to enter your campsite once you're in the tent. Wolf pee on tents and other belongings isn't especially appealing! Giardia and other micro-organisms are a serious problem, so all water needs to be filtered or treated. Take plenty of mozzie repellent too.
Base yourself in Pinedale, which still has a bit of a frontier town feel to it, with working cowboys commonly seen in their chaps and spurs. The town has good facilities, with a scenic campground on the outskirts of town (which also had a resident grizzly raiding the bins when we stayed there!)
If you're thinking about the Wind Rivers, also consider the (nearby) Tetons; another fantastic area but less of a wilderness than the Winds.
HTH and have a good trip.
Dave
"We're talking student budget with no summer job here. "
hopefully one of you is older than 25 otherwise you won't be able (easily? at all?) to rent a car/RV
hopefully one of you is older than 25 otherwise you won't be able (easily? at all?) to rent a car/RV
In reply to Edvenables:
Some more good advice above. Do check that you will be able to hire anything!
As noted, there are some free and/or very cheap campsites in more out-of-the-way forestry areas. You can wild camp, or even just park up on forestry roads in some places, but you need to be cautious and be aware of what restrictions or permits apply to each place, if any.
I'm sure you can do things really cheaply if you research carefully, but the size, insurance costs and relatively regulated nature of the wild areas all add to the costs of travelling.
It's worth doing some homework as you're sure to have an amazing trip if you can make it work.
Some more good advice above. Do check that you will be able to hire anything!
As noted, there are some free and/or very cheap campsites in more out-of-the-way forestry areas. You can wild camp, or even just park up on forestry roads in some places, but you need to be cautious and be aware of what restrictions or permits apply to each place, if any.
I'm sure you can do things really cheaply if you research carefully, but the size, insurance costs and relatively regulated nature of the wild areas all add to the costs of travelling.
It's worth doing some homework as you're sure to have an amazing trip if you can make it work.
sadiegirl wrote:
You have gotten some good advice, but this really isn't it. I'm very fond of both Devil's Tower and the Needles and have done lots of climbing there, especially in the Needles, but I wouldn't recommend either to a trad climber from another country looking to hit the high points of U.S. climbing. Both these places are small in terms of height and are suited to someone who's been to the major locales and wants to go someplace a little different for a change. The claim that these places have the "best trad climbing in the U.S." is, I'm afraid, preposterous.
I agree that summer temps will keep you out of the Southwest and that the higher alpine areas are the place to go. This means Tetons, Wind Rivers, Cascades, Colorado and Canadian Rockies, and the High Sierra (including Tuolumne) in California. Do your research well on the nature of approaches. Much of the Wind Rivers, for example, is back-country climbing, which means substantial backpacking to get in and full lightweight camping gear (tents, stoves, etc.) that you can carry along with your climbing stuff. Some of these areas will have snowfields you need to cross, more so early in the summer, and some parts of the Cascades have very serious bush-whacking.
The Tetons and Rocky Mountain National Park have perhaps the easiest access and so make a good place to start and get fit, with many routes accessible from the valley (and many more from a single high bivouac) without the need for full-on backpacking to a high camp.
I'd say the RV is a bad idea even if you can afford it. OK, it is nice for rainy days. Still, if you are going to do any kind of back-country climbing, you'll have to have all the camping accouterments anyway, so you might as well use them for everyday camping. A van you can sleep in is good too, as is an SUV with high ground clearance, which may be helpful for some of the back-country trailheads. Nonetheless, you can probably manage with any kind of ordinary car and it might make a lot more sense to make gas mileage a primary consideration, 'cause you're going to put thousands of miles on your vehicle over the course of the summer.
> I would go to Devil's Tower in Wyoming and spend the rest of my time in the Black Hills/Needles area of South Dakota. The weather might be hot, but its the best trad climbing in the US, aside from maybe Joshua Tree which is too hot that time of year, or the Gunk's, in New York.
You have gotten some good advice, but this really isn't it. I'm very fond of both Devil's Tower and the Needles and have done lots of climbing there, especially in the Needles, but I wouldn't recommend either to a trad climber from another country looking to hit the high points of U.S. climbing. Both these places are small in terms of height and are suited to someone who's been to the major locales and wants to go someplace a little different for a change. The claim that these places have the "best trad climbing in the U.S." is, I'm afraid, preposterous.
I agree that summer temps will keep you out of the Southwest and that the higher alpine areas are the place to go. This means Tetons, Wind Rivers, Cascades, Colorado and Canadian Rockies, and the High Sierra (including Tuolumne) in California. Do your research well on the nature of approaches. Much of the Wind Rivers, for example, is back-country climbing, which means substantial backpacking to get in and full lightweight camping gear (tents, stoves, etc.) that you can carry along with your climbing stuff. Some of these areas will have snowfields you need to cross, more so early in the summer, and some parts of the Cascades have very serious bush-whacking.
The Tetons and Rocky Mountain National Park have perhaps the easiest access and so make a good place to start and get fit, with many routes accessible from the valley (and many more from a single high bivouac) without the need for full-on backpacking to a high camp.
I'd say the RV is a bad idea even if you can afford it. OK, it is nice for rainy days. Still, if you are going to do any kind of back-country climbing, you'll have to have all the camping accouterments anyway, so you might as well use them for everyday camping. A van you can sleep in is good too, as is an SUV with high ground clearance, which may be helpful for some of the back-country trailheads. Nonetheless, you can probably manage with any kind of ordinary car and it might make a lot more sense to make gas mileage a primary consideration, 'cause you're going to put thousands of miles on your vehicle over the course of the summer.
In reply to Edvenables:
As an idea of cost, this summer I did a 2 month US road trip. California, through the desert, vegas, grand canyon, page,, zion, moab, yellowstone then back down to san diego and LA. Rented a campervan. Stayed mostly in campsites. Trip cost £12000 For 2 people!!
We were ppanning on camping the whole way round but we just couldn't stomach the heat at night in the desert, 39 degrees celcius at 11pm while trying to sleep in the back of a campervan thats been cooking all day...horrendous. if you go to the desert just get an air conditioned hotel and save yourself the bother. Get up and 5am, do your thing then retreat to the room at midday. In the cooler places like yellowstone its much more bareable, but still the same as top end britain in the summer.
-whenever you see a price it doesnt include tax...go into a "dollar store" and itll cost qbout about $1.10 for anything....its the same on everything everywhere!
-be prepared the horse and deer flys.
My top advice is go for it....its a great country and the people are so friendly (though they dont say thanks when you wait for them to pass on a trail...I guess its cultural differences). Dont underestimate the cost, however I'm sure you coupd do it cheaper than us...we spent quite a while in vegas and san diego and did white water rafting. That being said, for 3 months I reckon about £6000 each minimum. Car/RV rental will be by far your biggest cost.
If you want any more advice feel free to pm me
If you go to yosemite its lovely and cool at night, though tuoloumne meadows is actually cold enough for down jackets at night, even in the summer!!
We planned on climbing...but was just far to hot so didnt do any. However, if you go to the desert there is canyoneering which is incredible and worth doing as theres nothing like it in Europe. In fact the desert in general is spectacular...the grand canyon is nice, but iinda what you expect it to be, head to page and check out upper antelope canyon and horseshoe bend, go to the coral pink sand dunes and then zion national park. Zion is the best for canyoneering but moab is pretty good as well.
We kinda went with the idea of doing lots of climbing...in the end we did none, but did do canyoneering, white water rafting, mountainbiking in moab and a host of spectacular hikes. We are glad we did...while I am sure the climbing is great, abseiling into a 2 foot wide slot canyon with shafts of light from above and not another soul around is amazing wnd unlike anythink in this country!!! I highly recommend it.
Some tips;
-everyone says it, but the distances are VAST
- you will need full collision damage waiver and supplimentary liability insurance on top of your base rental price. A lot of rental companies only add this price on at the end. You also have to pay sales tax not included in the headline price. For example, the 'price quoted' for our rental was $4300 for 2 months..the final price was $6000. Dont take the risk...get the insurance
As an idea of cost, this summer I did a 2 month US road trip. California, through the desert, vegas, grand canyon, page,, zion, moab, yellowstone then back down to san diego and LA. Rented a campervan. Stayed mostly in campsites. Trip cost £12000 For 2 people!!
We were ppanning on camping the whole way round but we just couldn't stomach the heat at night in the desert, 39 degrees celcius at 11pm while trying to sleep in the back of a campervan thats been cooking all day...horrendous. if you go to the desert just get an air conditioned hotel and save yourself the bother. Get up and 5am, do your thing then retreat to the room at midday. In the cooler places like yellowstone its much more bareable, but still the same as top end britain in the summer.
-whenever you see a price it doesnt include tax...go into a "dollar store" and itll cost qbout about $1.10 for anything....its the same on everything everywhere!
-be prepared the horse and deer flys.
My top advice is go for it....its a great country and the people are so friendly (though they dont say thanks when you wait for them to pass on a trail...I guess its cultural differences). Dont underestimate the cost, however I'm sure you coupd do it cheaper than us...we spent quite a while in vegas and san diego and did white water rafting. That being said, for 3 months I reckon about £6000 each minimum. Car/RV rental will be by far your biggest cost.
If you want any more advice feel free to pm me
If you go to yosemite its lovely and cool at night, though tuoloumne meadows is actually cold enough for down jackets at night, even in the summer!!
We planned on climbing...but was just far to hot so didnt do any. However, if you go to the desert there is canyoneering which is incredible and worth doing as theres nothing like it in Europe. In fact the desert in general is spectacular...the grand canyon is nice, but iinda what you expect it to be, head to page and check out upper antelope canyon and horseshoe bend, go to the coral pink sand dunes and then zion national park. Zion is the best for canyoneering but moab is pretty good as well.
We kinda went with the idea of doing lots of climbing...in the end we did none, but did do canyoneering, white water rafting, mountainbiking in moab and a host of spectacular hikes. We are glad we did...while I am sure the climbing is great, abseiling into a 2 foot wide slot canyon with shafts of light from above and not another soul around is amazing wnd unlike anythink in this country!!! I highly recommend it.
Some tips;
-everyone says it, but the distances are VAST
- you will need full collision damage waiver and supplimentary liability insurance on top of your base rental price. A lot of rental companies only add this price on at the end. You also have to pay sales tax not included in the headline price. For example, the 'price quoted' for our rental was $4300 for 2 months..the final price was $6000. Dont take the risk...get the insurance
In reply to candy_girl:
"though they dont say thanks when you wait for them to pass on a trail"
They nearly always do for us, often we end up in a conversation. If you count climbs in that we have been invited to share 'summit beer' a few times now by people we passed en route or vice versa.
We always look for the best deal and hire economy cars and always end up with at least a compact (they try an argue you to upgrade saying how crappy the car is and potentially dangerous for a long drive...ignore them...if the car IS too small when you get to the garage, upgrade then). So we are normally talking around £500 a month including full insurance, purchasing on UK prices from big name companies.
"though they dont say thanks when you wait for them to pass on a trail"
They nearly always do for us, often we end up in a conversation. If you count climbs in that we have been invited to share 'summit beer' a few times now by people we passed en route or vice versa.
We always look for the best deal and hire economy cars and always end up with at least a compact (they try an argue you to upgrade saying how crappy the car is and potentially dangerous for a long drive...ignore them...if the car IS too small when you get to the garage, upgrade then). So we are normally talking around £500 a month including full insurance, purchasing on UK prices from big name companies.
In reply to Edvenables:
I'd second a lot of what Candy Girl has said - I really don't think it would be worth going to the States for a couple of months if you can't afford to do it 'properly'. I'm not talking about staying in luxury hotels etc but 'eating out of bins'? Your call but I don't think it's worth it.
I have travelled a lot in the US, I have a huge affinity for the country. It will cost you more than you think, even staying in budget places. For example, you will be hard pushed to find accommodation in the big cities (SF, NYC etc) for less than $40-50 per night, per person (after tax etc). If you do, it will be a long way from where the things you want to see and do are and you will make up the difference in travel/petrol/car parking.
I think the only way you will do it on a seriously low budget (and still nowhere near 50 euro for a month) is if you pick a climbing area and lead the full on climbing bum lifestyle. Even so, bear in mind that flights are going to cost you £600-700 - is this really worth the expenditure if you're going to then live like a tramp for 2 months? You can do that in the Alps.
I'd second a lot of what Candy Girl has said - I really don't think it would be worth going to the States for a couple of months if you can't afford to do it 'properly'. I'm not talking about staying in luxury hotels etc but 'eating out of bins'? Your call but I don't think it's worth it.
I have travelled a lot in the US, I have a huge affinity for the country. It will cost you more than you think, even staying in budget places. For example, you will be hard pushed to find accommodation in the big cities (SF, NYC etc) for less than $40-50 per night, per person (after tax etc). If you do, it will be a long way from where the things you want to see and do are and you will make up the difference in travel/petrol/car parking.
I think the only way you will do it on a seriously low budget (and still nowhere near 50 euro for a month) is if you pick a climbing area and lead the full on climbing bum lifestyle. Even so, bear in mind that flights are going to cost you £600-700 - is this really worth the expenditure if you're going to then live like a tramp for 2 months? You can do that in the Alps.
In reply to Edradour:
Maybe but there is a huge difference between candy girls trip and a £2k autumn budget trip mainly based on world class climbing in Yosemite, using public transport or a £3k trip with hire car and more comfort and flexibility of venue.
Maybe but there is a huge difference between candy girls trip and a £2k autumn budget trip mainly based on world class climbing in Yosemite, using public transport or a £3k trip with hire car and more comfort and flexibility of venue.
In reply to Offwidth:
Agreed, 7 years ago we had a budget of $20 a day excluding flights for a 2 month trip which didn't feel particularly like scrimping. I would expect $30 a day to be quite doable now.
If there's 6 people going as well it makes a huge difference. The first US road trip I did there were 7 of us and once you split things 7 ways it's much more affordable, e.g. a 7 seater hire car cost $200 dollars a month each, campsite fees are often per pitch not per person so can work out a couple of dollars per night.
Agreed, 7 years ago we had a budget of $20 a day excluding flights for a 2 month trip which didn't feel particularly like scrimping. I would expect $30 a day to be quite doable now.
If there's 6 people going as well it makes a huge difference. The first US road trip I did there were 7 of us and once you split things 7 ways it's much more affordable, e.g. a 7 seater hire car cost $200 dollars a month each, campsite fees are often per pitch not per person so can work out a couple of dollars per night.
Wow $200 per month car rental...ours cost $100 dollars per day!!! I agree that our trip wasnt the cheapest....but did want to "do it properly", once in a lifetime sort of thing. Our daily budget was about $15 per person per day...which is quite doable ( not including camping or any activities). There are a lot of really cheap blm campgrounds.
The biggest costs will be flights, car rental and travel insurance. These costs are pretty much fixed. Where you can make savings are on activities and accommodation. Food (cooked not restaurant or fast food) is about $15 pppd...maybe $10 at a push.
Back of fag packet I would say £700 flights, minimum £50 per day all in car rental, £10 per
person per night camping (blm will be cheaper), £8 food per day, £300 travel insurance.
So for 90 day trip would say about £3200 minimum.
It depends what you want from the trip. We wanted to see and experience as much of the country as possible, this included seeing shows in vegas, white water rafting, boat tours on lake powell etc. For really cheap you could bum it in a campsite for 3 months but when your paying about £3000 min fixed costs you might as well wait till you have more money to really see the country...just my 2 cents worth
As for american politeness. ..they were so friendly, helpful and polite...but we did notice they didn't say thanks when you stand asside on a trail....also, when in britain you say cheers to someone, you rarely get a reply, but in the US they always say 'no problem' or something like. Tbh it can be difficult to find cultural differences between UK and US, this was about the only differences we found
In reply to ebygomm:
Sorry just reread your post. .. $200 each pm. Having lots of people going will make it a lot cheaper than just 2!!
Sorry just reread your post. .. $200 each pm. Having lots of people going will make it a lot cheaper than just 2!!
In reply to candy_girl:
You can get a year long policy with a 90 day trip allowance for about fifty quid
> £300 travel insurance
You can get a year long policy with a 90 day trip allowance for about fifty quid
In reply to ebygomm: Not that would cover you for climbing you can't.
In reply to Edvenables:
Anyone mentioned the wildlife yet. In your more remote areas you will need to be bear aware, especially if you are wild camping.
Anyone mentioned the wildlife yet. In your more remote areas you will need to be bear aware, especially if you are wild camping.
In reply to kestrelspl:
Just to back this up. Do NOT go to the US with inadequate health insurance cover.
> (In reply to ebygomm) Not that would cover you for climbing you can't.
Just to back this up. Do NOT go to the US with inadequate health insurance cover.
In reply to Edvenables:
I realise some don't have the flexibility, but mid summer really isn't the best time to go to the US, see Candy girl's big post for example. Why miss the best of the UK weather to get cooked over there?
I realise some don't have the flexibility, but mid summer really isn't the best time to go to the US, see Candy girl's big post for example. Why miss the best of the UK weather to get cooked over there?
In reply to kestrelspl:
You can get an annual worldwide policy including USA cover that includes rock climbing up to 5000m and skiing etc with columbus for £90.
BMC/Snowcard etc are a waste of money if you're just rock climbing (no ice or snow etc)
You can get an annual worldwide policy including USA cover that includes rock climbing up to 5000m and skiing etc with columbus for £90.
BMC/Snowcard etc are a waste of money if you're just rock climbing (no ice or snow etc)
In reply to Jonny2vests:
I would agree with planning a trip at some other time than our summer. It is F'n hot just about everywhere. The US has many full on winter destinations for climbing with weather that still requires suncream. Any of the shoulder seasons are probably the best, as in Spring or Fall, but even January/Feb is very climbable across the Southwest.
I would agree with planning a trip at some other time than our summer. It is F'n hot just about everywhere. The US has many full on winter destinations for climbing with weather that still requires suncream. Any of the shoulder seasons are probably the best, as in Spring or Fall, but even January/Feb is very climbable across the Southwest.
In reply to Russ Walling:
Another perspective: I climbed in the US and Canada every June, July, and August for at least fifteen years before family and work constricted disposable free time. Heat is not a problem if you avoid the Southwest and, as I said before, climb in the higher elevations. Take a look at http://www.supertopo.com/climbingareas/highsierra.html for just a sample of what's available in the Sierra. And here is what they say about summer months:
"June – Aside from a rare storm, June is usually dry with warm temps and nice long days. Most of the access roads are plowed but there will still be snow on most approaches. Thunderstorms begin to develop so keep a close eye on the weather. The crowds start showing at the end of June and it becomes more competitive to get overnight camping permits. Charlotte Dome and Temple Crag are usually the first climbs to easily access.
July and August – Prime Sierra climbing weather. Temperatures are hot at the trailheads but perfect on the climbs. This is also prime thunderstorm season so watch the weather closely. There are lots of crowds and it is competitive for overnight camping permits (get reservations at least a month in advance)."
In the Cascades, Washington Pass is a good bet for alpine rock climbing. See http://www.supertopo.com/packs/washington-pass.html for a sample.
Weather and conditions in the Colorado Rockies ( http://www.mountainproject.com/v/rmnp---rock/105744460 ), Tetons ( http://www.mountainproject.com/v/grand-teton-national-park/105802912 ) and Wind Rivers ( http://www.mountainproject.com/v/wind-river-range/105823538 ) are similar to the High Sierra. Temps in the valleys could get up into the eighties during hot spells, but the higher elevations will generally be perfect.
Canada is a whole other subject.
These climbs are not cragging, however. They are generally more remote, involve much more hiking, require more in the way of routefinding and general outdoor sense, and are subject to potentially severe weather. On the other hand, it ain't the Alps. There is little or no glaciation, depending where you go, scale is not generally as big , and the weather, even with the thunderstorms, is much less severe and more stable.
It is certainly true that you can come in the Fall/Winter and have an awesome time in Yosemite Valley and the Southwest, with locations that have some of the world's best and most demanding trad climbing. But there is no reason why you can't come on over and climb all summer long without roasting in the heat if you are up for a bit of the back country.
> (In reply to Jonny2vests)
>
> I would agree with planning a trip at some other time than our summer. It is F'n hot just about everywhere. The US has many full on winter destinations for climbing with weather that still requires suncream. Any of the shoulder seasons are probably the best, as in Spring or Fall, but even January/Feb is very climbable across the Southwest.
>
> I would agree with planning a trip at some other time than our summer. It is F'n hot just about everywhere. The US has many full on winter destinations for climbing with weather that still requires suncream. Any of the shoulder seasons are probably the best, as in Spring or Fall, but even January/Feb is very climbable across the Southwest.
Another perspective: I climbed in the US and Canada every June, July, and August for at least fifteen years before family and work constricted disposable free time. Heat is not a problem if you avoid the Southwest and, as I said before, climb in the higher elevations. Take a look at http://www.supertopo.com/climbingareas/highsierra.html for just a sample of what's available in the Sierra. And here is what they say about summer months:
"June – Aside from a rare storm, June is usually dry with warm temps and nice long days. Most of the access roads are plowed but there will still be snow on most approaches. Thunderstorms begin to develop so keep a close eye on the weather. The crowds start showing at the end of June and it becomes more competitive to get overnight camping permits. Charlotte Dome and Temple Crag are usually the first climbs to easily access.
July and August – Prime Sierra climbing weather. Temperatures are hot at the trailheads but perfect on the climbs. This is also prime thunderstorm season so watch the weather closely. There are lots of crowds and it is competitive for overnight camping permits (get reservations at least a month in advance)."
In the Cascades, Washington Pass is a good bet for alpine rock climbing. See http://www.supertopo.com/packs/washington-pass.html for a sample.
Weather and conditions in the Colorado Rockies ( http://www.mountainproject.com/v/rmnp---rock/105744460 ), Tetons ( http://www.mountainproject.com/v/grand-teton-national-park/105802912 ) and Wind Rivers ( http://www.mountainproject.com/v/wind-river-range/105823538 ) are similar to the High Sierra. Temps in the valleys could get up into the eighties during hot spells, but the higher elevations will generally be perfect.
Canada is a whole other subject.
These climbs are not cragging, however. They are generally more remote, involve much more hiking, require more in the way of routefinding and general outdoor sense, and are subject to potentially severe weather. On the other hand, it ain't the Alps. There is little or no glaciation, depending where you go, scale is not generally as big , and the weather, even with the thunderstorms, is much less severe and more stable.
It is certainly true that you can come in the Fall/Winter and have an awesome time in Yosemite Valley and the Southwest, with locations that have some of the world's best and most demanding trad climbing. But there is no reason why you can't come on over and climb all summer long without roasting in the heat if you are up for a bit of the back country.
In reply to rgold:
Sure there are places to go, but climbing in the US in non-prime season when IT IS prime season in the UK just seems crazy to me if you can push your holiday to Autumn. But maybe the OP is a teacher.
You might well end up climbing less than you would in a year with no holiday. See Candygirls trip.
Sure there are places to go, but climbing in the US in non-prime season when IT IS prime season in the UK just seems crazy to me if you can push your holiday to Autumn. But maybe the OP is a teacher.
You might well end up climbing less than you would in a year with no holiday. See Candygirls trip.
In reply to Jonny2vests:
Read what rgold says again... there are huge expanses of world class climbing in prime nick in the summer. Just not always what is regarded as the 'big name' areas in the UK.
Read what rgold says again... there are huge expanses of world class climbing in prime nick in the summer. Just not always what is regarded as the 'big name' areas in the UK.
In reply to Offwidth:
Yes I know there are (and you know I know there are!), but why cut short your season in the UK?
> (In reply to Jonny2vests)
>
> Read what rgold says again... there are huge expanses of world class climbing in prime nick in the summer. Just not always what is regarded as the 'big name' areas in the UK.
>
> Read what rgold says again... there are huge expanses of world class climbing in prime nick in the summer. Just not always what is regarded as the 'big name' areas in the UK.
Yes I know there are (and you know I know there are!), but why cut short your season in the UK?
In reply to Jonny2vests:
And I know you know he knows you know there are.......
but does the Op?
Steve
And I know you know he knows you know there are.......
but does the Op?
Steve
In reply to SteveSBlake:
The nature of these threads means that he has long since left the building, arm in arm with Elvis.
> (In reply to Jonny2vests)
>
> And I know you know he knows you know there are.......
> but does the Op?
>
> And I know you know he knows you know there are.......
> but does the Op?
The nature of these threads means that he has long since left the building, arm in arm with Elvis.
In reply to Edvenables: With careful planning you can visit some wonderful places throughout the summer and get the best weather for each. I agree with others about NOT getting a camper van, or other fitted-out transport. They`re really expensive. Stay in a cheap motel once in a while for a good shower and to do laundry. A minivan should work and will be much less expensive. You're going to need tents anyway, so camp on the ground rather than in a vehicle.
If you can get to the Wind Rivers, go there, it is wild and beautiful. If you want to go in and have a comfortable time, hire a mule train to carry your gear and eat well. We rode horses in about 25km, an experience not to be missed. Bear proof barrels are MANDATORY.
You could spend all summer in Washington State and Southern BC and hardly scratch it. Advantage there is the distances are reasonable. You`ll also have a chance to get into mountains which range from moderate day trips in which you`re likely to see a few parties, to summits which see an ascent every five years or so. You`ll find comfortable temperatures there from June to September.
Places to look at are: Washington Pass, Leavenworth, Rogers Pass. These are good because you can drive near to the mountains and crags.
The multi-pitch rock routes range from Red Rock and Yosemite in the south to Squamish in the north with plenty in between. The southern places will be hot in the summer.
If you can get to the Wind Rivers, go there, it is wild and beautiful. If you want to go in and have a comfortable time, hire a mule train to carry your gear and eat well. We rode horses in about 25km, an experience not to be missed. Bear proof barrels are MANDATORY.
You could spend all summer in Washington State and Southern BC and hardly scratch it. Advantage there is the distances are reasonable. You`ll also have a chance to get into mountains which range from moderate day trips in which you`re likely to see a few parties, to summits which see an ascent every five years or so. You`ll find comfortable temperatures there from June to September.
Places to look at are: Washington Pass, Leavenworth, Rogers Pass. These are good because you can drive near to the mountains and crags.
The multi-pitch rock routes range from Red Rock and Yosemite in the south to Squamish in the north with plenty in between. The southern places will be hot in the summer.
In reply to Edvenables:
RV is madness; rent a car, campsites cheap and very pleasant.
Did a summer trip along these lines:
Fly to Seattle, Cascades (Washington Pass etc), Idaho (Elephant's Perch, Sawtooths and City of Rocks), Wyoming (Wind Rivers, maybe Devil's Tower), big drive for a few days through Utah, Arizona, Death Valley to see the desert canyon sights (too hot to climb), ending in California (Sierra Nevada, Tuolomne), fly out of San Francisco.
Basically stick to the high areas.
RV is madness; rent a car, campsites cheap and very pleasant.
Did a summer trip along these lines:
Fly to Seattle, Cascades (Washington Pass etc), Idaho (Elephant's Perch, Sawtooths and City of Rocks), Wyoming (Wind Rivers, maybe Devil's Tower), big drive for a few days through Utah, Arizona, Death Valley to see the desert canyon sights (too hot to climb), ending in California (Sierra Nevada, Tuolomne), fly out of San Francisco.
Basically stick to the high areas.
In reply to Jonny2vests:
Candygirl went to the wrong places if climbing was the goal.
As for staying in the UK, here's a totally random collection of images of what you'd be missing out on. If nothing else, look at the first video...
Sierra
Incredible Hulk
Gotta watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGA1vI2HxTs#t=504
Wind Rivers
Mt Hooker. 1800 feet.
http://m5.i.pbase.com/g1/99/822099/2/112344275.tNGsgp9u.jpg
Ambush Peak, 1500 feet.
http://www.summitpost.org/images/original/236190.jpg
The rampart from Ambush to Raid peak
http://www.wildlandart.com/Winds-Images/8-5514-Ambush%26RaidPks.jpg
East Temple Peak, 1200 feet
http://www.summitpost.org/images/medium/866444.JPG
Haystack, 1000 feet.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8320/7998354382_682afb775b_h.jpg
Cirque of the Towers, up to 1200 feet
http://c0278592.cdn.cloudfiles.rackspacecloud.com/original/577700.jpg
Wolfshead E Ridge (only 5.6!)
http://www.farewelltospring.com/wyoming/smaller/IMG_0455.jpg
NE Face of Pingora (11 pitches, 5.8, in the 50 CC’s book)
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1119/1354748174_79b81fe41b_o.jpg
Warbonnet, NE Face
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Xj6-H0_LpN0/UTWuOXw8IvI/AAAAAAABtjo/AQMf...
Tetons
Traverse on South Buttress Right, Mt. Moran (5.11 if done all free)
http://patagonia.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341d07fd53ef014e864b2c64970d-800wi
Complete Exum Ridge
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-EcXGAHsXwKA/UFK6fP8TbHI/AAAAAAABOn8/ISej...
Irene’s Arete, Disappointment Peak (5.8-5.10-)
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-8LWpMq8bCAY/UIESepYGgRI/AAAAAAABb9Y/KyD8...
> (In reply to rgold)
>
> ...climbing in the US in non-prime season when IT IS prime season in the UK just seems crazy to me if you can push your holiday to Autumn.
>
> You might well end up climbing less than you would in a year with no holiday. See Candygirls trip.
>
> ...climbing in the US in non-prime season when IT IS prime season in the UK just seems crazy to me if you can push your holiday to Autumn.
>
> You might well end up climbing less than you would in a year with no holiday. See Candygirls trip.
Candygirl went to the wrong places if climbing was the goal.
As for staying in the UK, here's a totally random collection of images of what you'd be missing out on. If nothing else, look at the first video...
Sierra
Incredible Hulk
Gotta watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGA1vI2HxTs#t=504
Wind Rivers
Mt Hooker. 1800 feet.
http://m5.i.pbase.com/g1/99/822099/2/112344275.tNGsgp9u.jpg
Ambush Peak, 1500 feet.
http://www.summitpost.org/images/original/236190.jpg
The rampart from Ambush to Raid peak
http://www.wildlandart.com/Winds-Images/8-5514-Ambush%26RaidPks.jpg
East Temple Peak, 1200 feet
http://www.summitpost.org/images/medium/866444.JPG
Haystack, 1000 feet.
http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8320/7998354382_682afb775b_h.jpg
Cirque of the Towers, up to 1200 feet
http://c0278592.cdn.cloudfiles.rackspacecloud.com/original/577700.jpg
Wolfshead E Ridge (only 5.6!)
http://www.farewelltospring.com/wyoming/smaller/IMG_0455.jpg
NE Face of Pingora (11 pitches, 5.8, in the 50 CC’s book)
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1119/1354748174_79b81fe41b_o.jpg
Warbonnet, NE Face
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-Xj6-H0_LpN0/UTWuOXw8IvI/AAAAAAABtjo/AQMf...
Tetons
Traverse on South Buttress Right, Mt. Moran (5.11 if done all free)
http://patagonia.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8341d07fd53ef014e864b2c64970d-800wi
Complete Exum Ridge
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-EcXGAHsXwKA/UFK6fP8TbHI/AAAAAAABOn8/ISej...
Irene’s Arete, Disappointment Peak (5.8-5.10-)
https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-8LWpMq8bCAY/UIESepYGgRI/AAAAAAABb9Y/KyD8...
In reply to Edvenables:
Did a two month road trip from June onwards in the states a few years ago.
Firstly the vehicle cost, the rvs are expensive. Haven't got recent prices, but we eventually plumped for a 4x4 & a tent. You also add a big premium for having a different drop off location to collection.
Some of the areas mentioned do have climbing bans at certain points, eg devils tower. The local indigenous tribe consider it holy, and it's banned for some of July.
We did a lot of miles. Colorado, Wyoming, Montana, Idaho, Utah, Arizona, Nevada, California.
Climbed at twenty four venues. The best One in my opinion was city of rocks, idaho. But I loved elderado, lumpy ridge, lander, bishop, Tuolumne meadows.
We ignored the heat but did suffer on occasions, Moab, Zion, Yosemite in particular.
Montana was a mosquito fest & the bears (grizzly) had cubs. So we sacked off the climbing and went out on horses for a few days.
Oregon may have been a better option than Montana.
We did some states that we knew would be too hot, but we wanted to do other stuff as well ( slick rock trail, Moab, awesome).
Enjoy.
Did a two month road trip from June onwards in the states a few years ago.
Firstly the vehicle cost, the rvs are expensive. Haven't got recent prices, but we eventually plumped for a 4x4 & a tent. You also add a big premium for having a different drop off location to collection.
Some of the areas mentioned do have climbing bans at certain points, eg devils tower. The local indigenous tribe consider it holy, and it's banned for some of July.
We did a lot of miles. Colorado, Wyoming, Montana, Idaho, Utah, Arizona, Nevada, California.
Climbed at twenty four venues. The best One in my opinion was city of rocks, idaho. But I loved elderado, lumpy ridge, lander, bishop, Tuolumne meadows.
We ignored the heat but did suffer on occasions, Moab, Zion, Yosemite in particular.
Montana was a mosquito fest & the bears (grizzly) had cubs. So we sacked off the climbing and went out on horses for a few days.
Oregon may have been a better option than Montana.
We did some states that we knew would be too hot, but we wanted to do other stuff as well ( slick rock trail, Moab, awesome).
Enjoy.
In reply to Edvenables:
I met a German climber who almost annually flies to Vegas and gets great airfares. Due to your dates no one mentioned Red Rocks but you might consider flying in or out of Vegas so you could climb there either early June or late September.
Plenty of good summer climbing is available. Anywhere in Wyoming, e.g., Lumpy Ridge/RMNP was mentioned. Look into the Elephant's Perch in Idaho and combine it with City of Rocks. Washington Pass or Leavenworth in the Cascades. Tuolumne or any number of areas in the eastern Sierra will be in shape.
http://www.mountainproject.com/destinations/
I met a German climber who almost annually flies to Vegas and gets great airfares. Due to your dates no one mentioned Red Rocks but you might consider flying in or out of Vegas so you could climb there either early June or late September.
Plenty of good summer climbing is available. Anywhere in Wyoming, e.g., Lumpy Ridge/RMNP was mentioned. Look into the Elephant's Perch in Idaho and combine it with City of Rocks. Washington Pass or Leavenworth in the Cascades. Tuolumne or any number of areas in the eastern Sierra will be in shape.
http://www.mountainproject.com/destinations/
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