UKC

Facebook is about to get even worse

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 stp 13 Nov 2013
If direct links to the NSA weren't bad enough Facebook is now about to implement technology allowing them to detect and record users mouse movements on the screen.

http://blogs.wsj.com/cio/2013/10/30/facebook-considers-vast-increase-in-dat...


(BTW If anyone is still using FB there's a good section in the comments about how to delete your data (though it will take several weeks.)
 LastBoyScout 13 Nov 2013
In reply to stp:

Actually, the article says "may", rather than "will" - and it won't be happening for a few months yet, if at all. Depends on the outcome of their testing of the technology.
Wulfrunian 13 Nov 2013
In reply to stp:

Am I in a minority in not giving two hoots about this sort of thing. I use Facebook. I ignore the adverts. Sounds like all I will be doing if this happens is ignoring more targetted adverts. It's not as though they're coming round my house in the night and pooing on the carpet is it?
 Banned User 77 13 Nov 2013
In reply to Wulfrunian:
> (In reply to stp)
>
> Am I in a minority in not giving two hoots about this sort of thing. I use Facebook. I ignore the adverts. Sounds like all I will be doing if this happens is ignoring more targetted adverts. It's not as though they're coming round my house in the night and pooing on the carpet is it?

no.. stp lives in a tin foil hat...
 Rampikino 13 Nov 2013
In reply to stp:

Jeez, first JFK, then the moon landings, then 9/11, then chemtrails and now this.

My world just imploded, how will I manage?
 mal_meech 13 Nov 2013
In reply to Fultonius: Glad to see your working hard
I'll second adblock for chrome... though chrome has it's own google based conspiracy fears.
 yorkshireman 13 Nov 2013
In reply to mal_meech:

I'm currently on a conference call discussing how we can use Nosql databases to store activity streams of our millions of registered users (billions of records) and the data this will allow us to store is mind boggling, and especially what we plan to do with it.

It's not going away. And its not just Facebook.
 balmybaldwin 13 Nov 2013
In reply to stp:

THe bit I'm stuggling with is what sort of information about my mouse movements is useful? other people knowing the fact that my mous slipped off the sofa again isn't going to keep me up at night
 Toby_W 13 Nov 2013
In reply to balmybaldwin:

Early diagnosis of parkinsons?

Cheers

Toby
 mal_meech 13 Nov 2013
In reply to yorkshireman: Indeed, even the adblock style plug-ins still track data on what their blocking, for who, to improve performance, and it does not change the data held by any of the major corporations, just stops you seeing the result.

The truth is everything that you put online, or do online/electronically, leaves some form of trace, and companies are now becoming very adept at using, storing and adapting this information into revenue streams.

You can worry about it, ignore it, use it, or change your online activity by being aware of it. But you won't stop it.





 yarbles 13 Nov 2013
In reply to mal_meech: Will ghostery work? It's what I use (as well as adblocker), supposedly stops trackers, advertising, beacons, widgets etc. Can any computer whizzes shed any light?
Eg. according to ghostery ukclimbing uses Google Analytics and skimlink advertising, both can be blocked.
 yorkshireman 13 Nov 2013
In reply to balmybaldwin:
> (In reply to stp)
>
> THe bit I'm stuggling with is what sort of information about my mouse movements is useful?

Its all about the focus of your attention. Knowing that you hovered over a menu option momentarily before picking something else is useful. Knowing which parts of the page get the most/least attention (since your mouse is often a good indicator to where you're looking) is useful.

The thing about Big Data, is that it's not one single metric that is the silver bullet for consumer insight, it is the combination. So when we cross reference your GPS location (often inadvertently given away), engagement history, the likes of you and your friends (and friends of friends) etc etc it becomes possible to spot trends and segment users into groups to be targeted in a specific way. We're only beginning to see the possibilities of this but we're definitely lookng at next generation advertising, and this (users getting relevant adverts, businesses getting a more receptive audience) is surely a good thing.

There will still be morons stuck in the 90s that think sticking a banner advert on a site and selling the space to a media agency for 0.0001$ per eyeball is a good business model, but it will change.
 yorkshireman 13 Nov 2013
In reply to yarbles:

> Eg. according to ghostery ukclimbing uses Google Analytics and skimlink advertising, both can be blocked.

UKclimbing.com provides a free service which you obviously appreciate. Why do you want to deprive them of one of their revenue streams? I'll admit the advertising on the site is unsophisticated and not very targeted considering the wealth of user information they could exploit, but its easy just to ignore.

I'm sure UKC would be happy to charge everyone £10 per year and drop the adverts but would you swap?
August West 13 Nov 2013
In reply to yorkshireman:

I'd be a lot happier if there was less movement and flashing images in the adverts.
In reply to yorkshireman:
> (In reply to yarbles)

> I'm sure UKC would be happy to charge everyone £10 per year and drop the adverts but would you swap?

Probably. At the risk of raising Alan's ire I do use a certain plugin. I avoid embedded adverts like the plague and avoid Arsebook and its ever changing terms of use which increasingly benefit the company rather than the user. I don't care if the adverts are or become "targeted" , I'm not interested.

Probably just as well for your business that enough people believe the hype.

ALC
 Mikkel 13 Nov 2013
In reply to stp:

Cool, i will start spinning the cursor around madly whenever i am on FB then, wonder if we all do this we can make the poor analysts looking at the data dizzy?
 yarbles 13 Nov 2013
In reply to yorkshireman: It's about trust. I find the whole thing creepy and would rather have control over what data I send third parties. I certainly object to my PC sending stuff out without my knowledge / permission.
 Lord_ash2000 13 Nov 2013
In reply to Wulfrunian:
> (In reply to stp)
>
> Am I in a minority in not giving two hoots about this sort of thing. I use Facebook. I ignore the adverts. Sounds like all I will be doing if this happens is ignoring more targetted adverts. It's not as though they're coming round my house in the night and pooing on the carpet is it?

No you're right, I don't really care who knows what I buy what I like or what I do. I don't care if I'm on CCTV 24 hours a day really. What's the worst they can do, advertise a product to me that I've more chance of actually wanting?

The only way I see it being a bad thing is if the UK is taken over by some totalitarian regime that use those monitoring powers to keep us under tight control and punish anyone who steps out of line. But I can't see that happening any time soon. I've nothing to hide.
 yorkshireman 13 Nov 2013
In reply to yarbles:
> (In reply to yorkshireman) It's about trust. I find the whole thing creepy

Hmm, well its a tricky one. There's already a lot of information gleaned from you without your explicit permission every day.

- APNR cameras picking up spots you're driving
- Logs of which towers your mobile phone registers wiht certain cell towers.
- Credit card payments in store, cash machine withdrawals
- Tesco clubcard?
- Login in to UKC forums
- CCTV

> and would rather have control over what data I send third parties. I certainly object to my PC sending stuff out without my knowledge / permission.

Well you do - I work for one of the biggest brands on the planet and reputation is everything so we play by the rules - and handling personally identifiable information is strictly enforced. Anything that can individually identify you is controlled by you, can be deleted at your request and is only collected if we explicitly ask for it.

The bottom line is that on the whole we're not bothered about YOUR personal data. YOU, are not very important. However analysing you and people like you en-masse is useful to spot trends and tailor content. When we do use your personal data mapped to your profile history it is generally there to make your life better (personalising an experience) and this will only increase as people are happy to trade a bit of perceived privacy for a more convenient lifestyle.

Look at 'Google Now'. That is creepy but it is genuinely useful although you have to give up some personal data and let it intrude in your life a bit. However I'm happy to let it see my calendar or know where I live if it is going to tell me that a flight is delayed or there are traffic jams without me needing to look.

Anyway, it keeps me in a job


In reply to mal_meech: I see I got censored. I rarely post on here any more, even less likely to now...
 yorkshireman 13 Nov 2013
In reply to Lord_ash2000:

> The only way I see it being a bad thing is if the UK is taken over by some totalitarian regime that use those monitoring powers to keep us under tight control and punish anyone who steps out of line.

Seriously, if this ever happened, if you were the regime, who would you pay a visit in the night to first? Those with the ad-blockers and tin-foil hats or Mr and Mrs Avg with a full (but largely uneventful) online profile?

Don't get me wrong, there is huge potential for abuse here but I think with a new generation of digitally native people coming through who have never known a world without the internet, its important to teach an acceptable way of presenting and handling yourself online. I
 Carolyn 13 Nov 2013
In reply to yorkshireman:

> I'm sure UKC would be happy to charge everyone £10 per year and drop the adverts but would you swap?

Yup. I've paid £10/year to access other forums (although it was paid membership to avoid trolls as much as to avoid ads)

 Fat Bumbly2 13 Nov 2013
In reply to balmybaldwin: "THe bit I'm stuggling with is what sort of information about my mouse movements is useful?"

Its when they log what the other hand is doing - then its time to be afraid.
 Brass Nipples 13 Nov 2013
In reply to stp:

Mouse movements, won't get very far with tablet and mobile users then will they? Finger hovering anyone?
 Bulls Crack 13 Nov 2013
In reply to Wulfrunian:
> (In reply to stp)
>
> Am I in a minority in not giving two hoots about this sort of thing. I use Facebook. I ignore the adverts. Sounds like all I will be doing if this happens is ignoring more targetted adverts. It's not as though they're coming round my house in the night and pooing on the carpet is it?

No, me too
OP stp 13 Nov 2013
In reply to IainRUK:

> no.. stp lives in a tin foil hat...


You are somewhat behind the times Iain. The conspiracy theory that Facebook is linked with US Govt agencies is now established fact. Try doing as search for 'Edward Snowden'.
 ByEek 14 Nov 2013
In reply to Wulfrunian:
> I use Facebook. I ignore the adverts.

You can go one better. If you install Adblock plus, you don't even have to ignore the ads. They disappear all together including suggested posts which I found particularly annoying.
Kipper 14 Nov 2013
In reply to ByEek:
>
>... including suggested posts which I found particularly annoying.

Interesting; a few years ago, when Facebook introduced 'frictionless sharing', I worked on some stuff that was gathering the interests of your 'friends' and targeting posts (and Ads ) at what was going on in your world.



 Brass Nipples 14 Nov 2013
In reply to stp:
> (In reply to IainRUK)
>
> [...]
>
>
> You are somewhat behind the times Iain. The conspiracy theory that Facebook is linked with US Govt agencies is now established fact. Try doing as search for 'Edward Snowden'.

They must be getting concerned about all this funny cat videos...

 Fat Bumbly2 14 Nov 2013
In reply to Beat me to it!: I am sure they are up to speed on the clear and present danger posed by funny cats.

(Note to NSA - I am not in anyway in league with funny cats.)

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