/ AAC vs BMC Insurance

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dutybooty - on 19 Nov 2013
I know this gets covered alot. I've searched and searched and searched but can't find the answer definitively to what I want, so I'm asking here.

Going to Europe, so EHIC card should cover most of the medical expenses.

But looking at rescue cover, AAC covers 25,000 euro and BMC covers up to 100,000.

Medical and repatriation, AAC covers up to 10,000 euro and BMC up to 10,000,000.

Are the AAC amounts really enough if the worst was to happen? Say extended rescue so that amount goes over, followed by severe injury so unable to drive back and need repatriation?
remus - on 19 Nov 2013
In reply to dutybooty: worth remembering that the BMC is also tea el insurance so will cover lost luggage etc. Whereas the AAC won't.
Jim Hamilton - on 19 Nov 2013
In reply to dutybooty:

there is no limit for repatriation under the AAC, only medical treatment
dutybooty - on 19 Nov 2013
In reply to dutybooty:

Travel insurance for me is covered through my bank. Was hoping to save some money but simply looking at the rescue cover I'm really doubting.

Don't some European resorts charge 2500 euro per minute in the air?
psaunders - on 19 Nov 2013
In reply to dutybooty: There are a lot of crazy rumours about the cost of helicopter rescue, 2500/minute is definitely an exaggeration!

A lot of areas in France and Switzerland do not charge for helicopter evacuation, you should check the individual commune/canton to find out.

My (not very scientific) research seems to suggest a typical charge of 1-10k in those that do.

Also note that the EHIC only entitles you to the same medical charges as a national of the country you are treated in. You should check the individual countries for details. You would have to require something quite special to exceed 10k of emergency medical treatment (that couldn't wait until you could travel back to the UK).

I, personally, am completely happy with the cover of the AAC insurance.
Simon4 - on 19 Nov 2013
In reply to psaunders:

> You would have to require something quite special to exceed 10k of emergency medical treatment (that couldn't wait until you could travel back to the UK).

Not really.

Several broken bones, internal injuries preventing movement for a couple of weeks, can easily run that up.

I am not quite sure what AAC insurance does for repatriation, which can be quite a difficult task, though I normally take AAC membership for hut reductions anyway, but still usually have snowcard as well.
KlaasW on 20 Nov 2013
In reply to dutybooty: For me the the main reason not to go for the BMC insurance is that they do not cover anything at all if your trip involves any work. I do most of my climbing abroad in conjunction with some work related thing like a conference. I'll go for AAC in 2014.
psaunders - on 20 Nov 2013
In reply to Simon4: Several broken bones and internal injuries leading to weeks of hospitalisation sounds quite special to me!

I'm not saying there aren't circumstances which could lead to that level of medical bills but it's important to think about what the level of risk actually is. The probability of incurring medical bills substantially over 10k seems so unlikely that I don't think it's worth it.
Will_he_fall - on 20 Nov 2013
In reply to dutybooty:
Can someone give a definitive answer on this: Say I fall off an alpine route in Europe in winter, get smashed up, need choppering to hospital after a long and complicated rescue and then need lots of treatment before getting flown back to the UK- will ACC cover all of the costs? If yes, then I'll sign up now.

Interestingly the (British) alpine club looks to be trying to sort some sort of similar insurance out, I completed the questionnaire that they needed to gather info (for a possible underwriter?)a while ago- so hopefully that will prove fruitful and it will no longer be an issue.

Cheers,

Will
dutybooty - on 20 Nov 2013
In reply to Will_he_fall:

Not sure if you're taking the mickey but thats exactly what I'm asking.
Andy Lagan - on 20 Nov 2013
In reply to dutybooty:
I have had AACUK insurance for the past few years. I had an accident in France, an operation in Grenoble, and then AAC organised a flight with Tirol Air Ambulance back to UK. The operation was mostly paid for with EHIC, AAC will make up the remainder of the bill after I invoice them. I had really good service from AAC,and think the price/service is great, however it's important to know that if you are outside of the UK for more than 8 weeks then you are no longer covered, and they will ask for travel details to make sure. Therefore if you're planning to spend a winter or more in the Alps, AAC isn't a good option (although you would still have reduced hut fees).
If you're just heading over to Europe for small trips AAC is brilliant.
Gael Force - on 21 Nov 2013
In reply to Andy Lagan: they cover rescue costs for the year, its only medical etc that has the 8 week limit, and that restarts if you return to the UK.
Edradour - on 21 Nov 2013
In reply to psaunders:
> (In reply to Simon4)
>
> I'm not saying there aren't circumstances which could lead to that level of medical bills but it's important to think about what the level of risk actually is. The probability of incurring medical bills substantially over 10k seems so unlikely that I don't think it's worth it.

This, to me, is a perverse argument. As climbers/skiers/mountaineers/whatever we engage in activities that carry with them a certain level of risk. The probability of the risk occurring is slight but the outcome is high. Therefore, we insure ourselves to pay for medical bills if the worst should happen. By your argument, you may as well not insure yourself at all because the 'level of risk' is so low. Personally, I would argue the exact opposite, i.e. that insurance is there for big expenses and big accidents.

10k is not a lot for medical bills. I had an accident in the Alps in 2010. My medical bills were more than 250k, excluding repatriation, rescue and then further costs in the UK.

Juki - on 21 Nov 2013
In reply to Edradour:
> 10k is not a lot for medical bills. I had an accident in the Alps in 2010. My medical bills were more than 250k, excluding repatriation, rescue and then further costs in the UK.

In what country that accident happened? Did you have a EHIC-card?
Edradour - on 21 Nov 2013
In reply to Juki:
> (In reply to Edradour)
> [...]
>
> In what country that accident happened? Did you have a EHIC-card?

France and yes.

Juki - on 21 Nov 2013
In reply to Edradour:
Would it be possible to get more details? For me it's very difficult to understand how that's possible.
Jim Hamilton - on 21 Nov 2013
In reply to Gael Force:
> (In reply to Andy Lagan) they cover rescue costs for the year, its only medical etc that has the 8 week limit, and that restarts if you return to the UK.

That's not how I read (what I think is) the policy wording - 2 sides of A4 folded in 3. The 8 week limit appears only to apply to Expeditions/Treks, so presumably a season ski-ing/climbing in the Alps is ok ?
HeMa on 21 Nov 2013
In reply to Jim Hamilton:

Nope, next years UNIQA provided OeAV insurance is only valid for the first 8 weeks of any given trip... Returning home zeroes this, and you're again good for another 8 weeks.

http://oeav.at/portal_wAssets/docs/service/versicherung/2013_10_29_WWS_Folder_2013_14_E_ebook.pdf
Gael Force - on 21 Nov 2013
In reply to Jim Hamilton:
> (In reply to Gael Force)
> [...]
>
> That's not how I read (what I think is) the policy wording - 2 sides of A4 folded in 3. The 8 week limit appears only to apply to Expeditions/Treks, so presumably a season ski-ing/climbing in the Alps is ok ?

I rang them yesterday, the 8 week limit applies to medical repatriation, the rescue cover is unlimited in terms of trip length, as He Man says. A trip home for a day restarts the 56 day clock.

psaunders - on 21 Nov 2013
In reply to Edradour:
> Therefore, we insure ourselves to pay for medical bills if the worst should happen

I don't insure myself if the worst should happen; I insure myself if something fairly bad should happen. I accept that there is a risk that I might exceed this just as I accept there is a risk I will die doing these activities. I don't expect to be 'covered' for every possible eventuality.

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