This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
What can I say... looks awesome! They've made a great and now doubt iconic design based on the old 3p piece. Anyone else agree?
Shame those in Scotland won't be able to use it
Shame those in Scotland won't be able to use it
In reply to crayefish:
based on the old thruppeny bit apparently?
Looks quite nice from what I've seen on so far
based on the old thruppeny bit apparently?
Looks quite nice from what I've seen on so far
In reply to ThunderCat:
Can someone send me two of them please?
I like a nice pair of thruppenies.
Can someone send me two of them please?
I like a nice pair of thruppenies.
Post edited at 00:27
In reply to stroppygob:
Two in the hand is worth one in the bush.
> I like a nice pair of thruppenies.
Two in the hand is worth one in the bush.
In reply to crayefish:
Hmm. Looks OK yes. But we do seem to get through currency designs rather quickly in the UK. The USA and Switzerland , for exmaple, keep things the same for ages. I quite enjoy getting old coins.
Hmm. Looks OK yes. But we do seem to get through currency designs rather quickly in the UK. The USA and Switzerland , for exmaple, keep things the same for ages. I quite enjoy getting old coins.
In reply to crayefish:
Rather pretty
We're going to start making ours this week .
Will have perfected them by 2017.
Rather pretty
We're going to start making ours this week .
Will have perfected them by 2017.
In reply to MG:
It's been the same coin for 30 years. And anything up to 3% of the total in circulation are duds.
Well overdue update
It's been the same coin for 30 years. And anything up to 3% of the total in circulation are duds.
Well overdue update
In reply to imkevinmc:
I know and understand the forgery problem. Still, 30 years isn't that long in comparison to some coins.
I know and understand the forgery problem. Still, 30 years isn't that long in comparison to some coins.
In reply to crayefish:
The BBC report says it incorporates a new secret technology, 'ISIS' that make forgery near impossible, it sounds like something distinctive in the alloy, perhaps a stable synthetic isotope or something with curious magnetic properties?
Now I'm probably being dense here but if it's a secret how can it prevent forgery, if nobody knows what to look for any fakes can still be passed off as genuine and fake coins are surely only of criminal value at the point where they're used by someone who knows they're not genuine. After that, those that pass a cursory inspection go into circulation and are just coins, you could destroy/withdraw real (and or fake) ones at the same rate that they're illegally minted to maintain the total number in circulation under control if that were a goal.
jk
The BBC report says it incorporates a new secret technology, 'ISIS' that make forgery near impossible, it sounds like something distinctive in the alloy, perhaps a stable synthetic isotope or something with curious magnetic properties?
Now I'm probably being dense here but if it's a secret how can it prevent forgery, if nobody knows what to look for any fakes can still be passed off as genuine and fake coins are surely only of criminal value at the point where they're used by someone who knows they're not genuine. After that, those that pass a cursory inspection go into circulation and are just coins, you could destroy/withdraw real (and or fake) ones at the same rate that they're illegally minted to maintain the total number in circulation under control if that were a goal.
jk
In reply to imkevinmc:
Other than the fact that someone once made whatever '3% of the value of pound coins in circulation' (less production costs, general overheads, fines etc)in proceeds from their crime, what's the problem? So long as we all accept that the pound coin, whether real or fake, can be used to pay for something we can all crack on as though nothing has happened can't we? The reason we adopted a pound coin in place of a pound note was that it would not wear out, so a 100% replacement seems overkill.
As the cost of replacement will be a net cost to all of us, I'm not sure this is a good idea. If it were £50 notes, that may be a different matter.
The new 'more secure' design should be used for a five pound coin.
Other than the fact that someone once made whatever '3% of the value of pound coins in circulation' (less production costs, general overheads, fines etc)in proceeds from their crime, what's the problem? So long as we all accept that the pound coin, whether real or fake, can be used to pay for something we can all crack on as though nothing has happened can't we? The reason we adopted a pound coin in place of a pound note was that it would not wear out, so a 100% replacement seems overkill.
As the cost of replacement will be a net cost to all of us, I'm not sure this is a good idea. If it were £50 notes, that may be a different matter.
The new 'more secure' design should be used for a five pound coin.
In reply to DNS:
Why use money at all and avoid the cost of producing it, it occured to me that I don't use money any more, I pay for my car parking using a debit card, buy lunch with a debit card, pay for shopping with a debit card, pay for fuel with a debit card. I normally have a £100 in my wallet to pay for dinner if we go out because we like to pay and go, rather than wait for a waiter to wander over with the card machine, but otherwise, I don't use money!
Why use money at all and avoid the cost of producing it, it occured to me that I don't use money any more, I pay for my car parking using a debit card, buy lunch with a debit card, pay for shopping with a debit card, pay for fuel with a debit card. I normally have a £100 in my wallet to pay for dinner if we go out because we like to pay and go, rather than wait for a waiter to wander over with the card machine, but otherwise, I don't use money!
In reply to crayefish:
i for one would welcome not having any coins any more
Yay theres a new £1 coin! so what.
i for one would welcome not having any coins any more
Yay theres a new £1 coin! so what.
In reply to jkarran:
My understanding is that - with notes - there are a series of anti-forgery methods that almost nobody knows about, and that these are used not to prevent forgery but to allow the powers that be to accurately gauge the proportion of forged notes in circulation, and to allow them to spot emerging problems, such as an attempt to destabilise a currency by large scale high quality forgery. If you subscribe to this view, the chances are that the methods are as closely guarded as the recipe for Irn Bru.
> Now I'm probably being dense here but if it's a secret how can it prevent forgery, i
My understanding is that - with notes - there are a series of anti-forgery methods that almost nobody knows about, and that these are used not to prevent forgery but to allow the powers that be to accurately gauge the proportion of forged notes in circulation, and to allow them to spot emerging problems, such as an attempt to destabilise a currency by large scale high quality forgery. If you subscribe to this view, the chances are that the methods are as closely guarded as the recipe for Irn Bru.
In reply to cander:
Electronic fraud seems easier than counterfeiting money. You are paying for this fraud through bank/card charges - maybe not directly but businesses will pay them and pass them on to you.
Electronic fraud seems easier than counterfeiting money. You are paying for this fraud through bank/card charges - maybe not directly but businesses will pay them and pass them on to you.
In reply to wintertree:
Indeed. Perhaps it was just the emphasis given by the report that's perplexing me or more likely it's coffee o'clock but sophisticated invisible technology in the atomic structure of the metal doesn't prevent forgery/fraud if only the mint or machines in the central repositories of banks can identify these things, at best it allows you to keep tabs on it or remove fakes from circulation. I suppose being able to reliably remove them from circulation is valuable.
I wonder if this is the last £1 coin we'll see? A lot has changed in the last 30years, if this one lasts another 300 it'll likely be replaced in a very different world.
jk
> ...the chances are that the methods are as closely guarded as the recipe for Irn Bru.
Indeed. Perhaps it was just the emphasis given by the report that's perplexing me or more likely it's coffee o'clock but sophisticated invisible technology in the atomic structure of the metal doesn't prevent forgery/fraud if only the mint or machines in the central repositories of banks can identify these things, at best it allows you to keep tabs on it or remove fakes from circulation. I suppose being able to reliably remove them from circulation is valuable.
I wonder if this is the last £1 coin we'll see? A lot has changed in the last 30years, if this one lasts another 300 it'll likely be replaced in a very different world.
jk
In reply to DNS:
The old pound coin is the only one that hasn't changed in size since decimalisation. Why not have a change?
I've had enough pound coins rejected by machines to be quite happy with an alternative.
Bring on change
The old pound coin is the only one that hasn't changed in size since decimalisation. Why not have a change?
I've had enough pound coins rejected by machines to be quite happy with an alternative.
Bring on change
In reply to imkevinmc:
The old pound coin is the only one that hasn't changed in size since decimalisation. Why not have a change?
Apart from 1p and 2p coins, though they did change from copper to coated iron in the early 90's.
The old pound coin is the only one that hasn't changed in size since decimalisation. Why not have a change?
Apart from 1p and 2p coins, though they did change from copper to coated iron in the early 90's.
In reply to crayefish:
Sorry to be pedantic but it was the 3d piece
> design based on the old 3p piece. Anyone else agree?
Sorry to be pedantic but it was the 3d piece
In reply to crayefish:
I googled it to find out what all the fuss was about.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-26632863
Am quite happy with my current £1 coin. It seems we are wasting resources redoing a job that isnt needed.
I googled it to find out what all the fuss was about.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-26632863
Am quite happy with my current £1 coin. It seems we are wasting resources redoing a job that isnt needed.
In reply to Graeme Alderson:
Or get rid of the arbitrary £5 limit that people seem to have accepted and make paying for small items like cups of coffee, a couple of stamps or a mars bar with a debit card normal practice like in NZ, especially now paywave is standard.
I now virtually only use cash in market stalls, some pubs and the hospital canteen. I used my debit card for all of these situations in NZ.
Or get rid of the arbitrary £5 limit that people seem to have accepted and make paying for small items like cups of coffee, a couple of stamps or a mars bar with a debit card normal practice like in NZ, especially now paywave is standard.
I now virtually only use cash in market stalls, some pubs and the hospital canteen. I used my debit card for all of these situations in NZ.
In reply to crayefish:
I like it, but I'd been hoping for a coin with a central hole. We're long overdue one of those, and the missing area could be 10% of the disks area, representing the little hole left by Scotland.
We cold have a public vote on what shape the hole could be...
I like it, but I'd been hoping for a coin with a central hole. We're long overdue one of those, and the missing area could be 10% of the disks area, representing the little hole left by Scotland.
We cold have a public vote on what shape the hole could be...
In reply to Sharp:
Probably the same as what you could buy with 3d, back in the day.
> meh, what can you buy for a pound these days?
Probably the same as what you could buy with 3d, back in the day.
In reply to crayefish:
Nothing new there - not being able to exchange Scottish legal tender south of the border is commonplace....
S
> What can I say... looks awesome! They've made a great and now doubt iconic design based on the old 3p piece. Anyone else agree?
> Shame those in Scotland won't be able to use it
Nothing new there - not being able to exchange Scottish legal tender south of the border is commonplace....
S
In reply to Slugain Howff:
Except for the fact that Scottish money is not legal tender anywhere in the first place.
> Nothing new there - not being able to exchange Scottish legal tender south of the border is commonplace....
Except for the fact that Scottish money is not legal tender anywhere in the first place.
In reply to cander:
And what do you use when your kids want an ice cream from the van? Bank transfer?
> Why use money at all and avoid the cost of producing it, it occured to me that I don't use money any more, I pay for my car parking using a debit card, buy lunch with a debit card, pay for shopping with a debit card, pay for fuel with a debit card. I normally have a £100 in my wallet to pay for dinner if we go out because we like to pay and go, rather than wait for a waiter to wander over with the card machine, but otherwise, I don't use money!
And what do you use when your kids want an ice cream from the van? Bank transfer?
In reply to woolsack:
My kids are in their twenties - so not really an issue for me - you'll be able to flash your contactless debit card. I'm making the perfectly reasonable point that I do not use cash in my day to day life - you seem to to have aproblem with this.
My kids are in their twenties - so not really an issue for me - you'll be able to flash your contactless debit card. I'm making the perfectly reasonable point that I do not use cash in my day to day life - you seem to to have aproblem with this.
In reply to cander:
You obviously spend the majority of your life in close proximity to card machines. Fair enough
You obviously spend the majority of your life in close proximity to card machines. Fair enough
In reply to crayefish:
Does no one else think the timing of this release is rather diversionary to the budget?
Does no one else think the timing of this release is rather diversionary to the budget?
In reply to crayefish:
What an absolute waste of money!!
At the present rate the it will soon cost forgers more to make a pound coin than the bloody thing is worth!!!
Why bother creating a "new" coin?
What an absolute waste of money!!
At the present rate the it will soon cost forgers more to make a pound coin than the bloody thing is worth!!!
Why bother creating a "new" coin?
In reply to higherclimbingwales:
Does no one else think the timing of this release is rather diversionary to the budget?
When's The Budget?
Does no one else think the timing of this release is rather diversionary to the budget?
When's The Budget?
In reply to Cardi:
The problem is that there is a transaction charge for both debit and credit cards. I sell you a cup of tea for 50p and you pay on debit card it costs me 25p straight away, so I put my prices up to 75p so I make the same profit. Who loses out? You the customer. Who wins? The banks
The problem is that there is a transaction charge for both debit and credit cards. I sell you a cup of tea for 50p and you pay on debit card it costs me 25p straight away, so I put my prices up to 75p so I make the same profit. Who loses out? You the customer. Who wins? The banks
Post edited at 14:15
In reply to Bob:
I don't agree with any other method of paying for items. Nightmare buying that car mind!
I don't agree with any other method of paying for items. Nightmare buying that car mind!
In reply to JoshOvki:
Why not? If vending machines can handle a 50p piece they can certainly handle this new coin
Why not? If vending machines can handle a 50p piece they can certainly handle this new coin
In reply to crayefish:
There was a 3 penny coin??? An according to he BBC they were worth an 80th of a pound!!!! £1 = 240 pennies???? You brits are weird...
There was a 3 penny coin??? An according to he BBC they were worth an 80th of a pound!!!! £1 = 240 pennies???? You brits are weird...
In reply to Bob:
at least 1.
> (In reply to JoshOvki)
>
> You carry pound coins around in your trollies?
>
> You carry pound coins around in your trollies?
at least 1.
In reply to Mr Lopez:
There was a 3 penny coin??? An according to he BBC they were worth an 80th of a pound!!!! £1 = 240 pennies???? You brits are weird...
...and a four penny coin called a 'Groat'.
There was a 3 penny coin??? An according to he BBC they were worth an 80th of a pound!!!! £1 = 240 pennies???? You brits are weird...
...and a four penny coin called a 'Groat'.
In reply to Mr Lopez:
Before 1971 we had 1/2d, 1d, 2d, 3d, 6d, 1s, 2s, 2.5s, 5s in coins (s = shilling, 12d (pennies) equalled one shilling. Then in notes we had 10 shillings, one pound, five pounds, ten pounds, etc.
The 5 shilling was also known as a Crown and the 2.5 shilling a half-crown. Other names were Florin for the 2 shilling piece and Tanner for the sixpence. In even earlier times there was a farthing which was 1/4 of a penny.
Having a base 12 system isn't that silly as it's divisible by 2, 3, 4 & 6
Before 1971 we had 1/2d, 1d, 2d, 3d, 6d, 1s, 2s, 2.5s, 5s in coins (s = shilling, 12d (pennies) equalled one shilling. Then in notes we had 10 shillings, one pound, five pounds, ten pounds, etc.
The 5 shilling was also known as a Crown and the 2.5 shilling a half-crown. Other names were Florin for the 2 shilling piece and Tanner for the sixpence. In even earlier times there was a farthing which was 1/4 of a penny.
Having a base 12 system isn't that silly as it's divisible by 2, 3, 4 & 6
Post edited at 15:09
In reply to Mr Lopez:
The currency was/is the easy bit.
Weight
16 ounces = 1 pound
14 pounds = 1 stone
Distance
12 inches = 1 foot
3 feet = 1 yard
1760 yards = 1 mile.
Liquids
1 fluid ounce of water weighs 1 ounce (this bit is logical)
So you would think 1 pint would be 16 fluid ounces so it weighed 1 lb (pound). But no 1 pint = 20 fl oz
8 pints = 1 gallon.
All very obvious when you have grown up with it.
But why on earth do the Yanks us 1 pint = 15 fl oz?
The currency was/is the easy bit.
Weight
16 ounces = 1 pound
14 pounds = 1 stone
Distance
12 inches = 1 foot
3 feet = 1 yard
1760 yards = 1 mile.
Liquids
1 fluid ounce of water weighs 1 ounce (this bit is logical)
So you would think 1 pint would be 16 fluid ounces so it weighed 1 lb (pound). But no 1 pint = 20 fl oz
8 pints = 1 gallon.
All very obvious when you have grown up with it.
But why on earth do the Yanks us 1 pint = 15 fl oz?
In reply to Bob:
I rest my case.
First thought was "how could people this convoluted have forged an empire the size they did", second thought was "probably by short-changing everybody they traded with"
I rest my case.
First thought was "how could people this convoluted have forged an empire the size they did", second thought was "probably by short-changing everybody they traded with"
In reply to JoshOvki:
>"But they won't fit in the trollies! Or the lockers at the pool."
We'll get new trollies and lockers. Some of them were needing replaced anyway. What's the problem?
>"But they won't fit in the trollies! Or the lockers at the pool."
We'll get new trollies and lockers. Some of them were needing replaced anyway. What's the problem?
In reply to mgco3:
Just to annoy people like you
Spoken like a true forger! Or maybe you were opposed to decimalisation? Lol
> What an absolute waste of money!!
> At the present rate the it will soon cost forgers more to make a pound coin than the bloody thing is worth!!!
> Why bother creating a "new" coin?
Just to annoy people like you
Spoken like a true forger! Or maybe you were opposed to decimalisation? Lol
In reply to Graeme Alderson:
A Yank pint is 16 fluid oz, although their fluid oz is about 1ml equivalent larger than ours.
A Yank pint is 16 fluid oz, although their fluid oz is about 1ml equivalent larger than ours.
In reply to crayefish:
Not a forger. I gave that up years ago and with my trouble drugs mule is out of the question!!
Not a forger. I gave that up years ago and with my trouble drugs mule is out of the question!!
In reply to Cardi:
My mistake. So their pint is logical whereas our isn't. But it means we get more pissed on the same number of pints
My mistake. So their pint is logical whereas our isn't. But it means we get more pissed on the same number of pints
In reply to Mr Lopez:
Back in the day we didn't trade, we just nicked everything and then killed you
Back in the day we didn't trade, we just nicked everything and then killed you
In reply to jkarran:
I guess what they need is (manufacturing cost + cost of metal) > face value of coin) and cost of metal < face value of coin. If it costs more to make than its face value there is no point in forging it but if the metal is worth more than the face value people will melt them down. So a complex coin with a couple of different metals and a fancy shape would make sense.
> After that, those that pass a cursory inspection go into circulation and are just coins, you could destroy/withdraw real (and or fake) ones at the same rate that they're illegally minted to maintain the total number in circulation under control if that were a goal.
I guess what they need is (manufacturing cost + cost of metal) > face value of coin) and cost of metal < face value of coin. If it costs more to make than its face value there is no point in forging it but if the metal is worth more than the face value people will melt them down. So a complex coin with a couple of different metals and a fancy shape would make sense.
In reply to imkevinmc:
Trollies and lockers rely on size unlike vending machines that take much more into consideration. I imagine vending machines can be upgraded easily enough tough, although vending machine manufacturers are saying it will cost 13bn to retrofit the machines.
Trollies and lockers rely on size unlike vending machines that take much more into consideration. I imagine vending machines can be upgraded easily enough tough, although vending machine manufacturers are saying it will cost 13bn to retrofit the machines.
In reply to crayefish:
N.B. Its going to cost a lot of money to convert all those vending machines over, hope the cost isn't passed onto the consumer. It could put large numbers of people out of business.
N.B. Its going to cost a lot of money to convert all those vending machines over, hope the cost isn't passed onto the consumer. It could put large numbers of people out of business.
In reply to JoshOvki:
Yeah you're bag of crisps for the vending machine is going to cost an extra 10p!
Mind, blown.
> Cost, and the cost getting pushed onto us as end users?
Yeah you're bag of crisps for the vending machine is going to cost an extra 10p!
> A Yank pint is 16 fluid oz, although their fluid oz is about 1ml equivalent larger than ours.
Mind, blown.
Post edited at 01:10
In reply to higherclimbingwales:
Yup, the general population are so thick that they just cant handle more then one nugget of news at a time. They'll doubtless not even notice there was a budget yesterday, so keen will they be to get hold of the shiny new coins and play with them like the brain dead children that they are.
> Does no one else think the timing of this release is rather diversionary to the budget?
Yup, the general population are so thick that they just cant handle more then one nugget of news at a time. They'll doubtless not even notice there was a budget yesterday, so keen will they be to get hold of the shiny new coins and play with them like the brain dead children that they are.
In reply to Blizzard:
Yeah... it's not like doing the work to convert is done by any people requiring jobs or anything!
> N.B. Its going to cost a lot of money to convert all those vending machines over, hope the cost isn't passed onto the consumer. It could put large numbers of people out of business.
Yeah... it's not like doing the work to convert is done by any people requiring jobs or anything!
In reply to woolsack:
Until hookers and drug dealers take chip and pin, we'll all need cash!
> And what do you use when your kids want an ice cream from the van? Bank transfer?
Until hookers and drug dealers take chip and pin, we'll all need cash!
In reply to Cú Chullain:
Shiny things!!!!!
> Yup, the general population are so thick that they just cant handle more then one nugget of news at a time. They'll doubtless not even notice there was a budget yesterday, so keen will they be to get hold of the shiny new coins and play with them like the brain dead children that they are.
Shiny things!!!!!
This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
Loading Notifications...