/ problem with a strange grade

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Mountain Spirit - on 12 Apr 2014
Hi

While I was inserting links into my blog post....

I stumbled upon a boulder problem called Puck that had the unusual grade of....

VB 7a+

http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=217732

Strange grade

Strange huh?

:-)
deacondeacon - on 12 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

The info on ukc is put into the logbooks by users of te site. Every so often someone will put the wrong grade in by accident. That's what looks like has happened here.
Puck is a F7A+ boulder problem. I wouldn't worry too much about it, it's supposed to be quite scary and you'll be toproping easier stuff than this tomorrow. In the logbooks I'd look at stuff severe an below.

I bet you're getting really excited, only one more day to go :)
Mountain Spirit - on 12 Apr 2014
In reply to deacondeacon:

Really psyched

:-)
deacondeacon - on 12 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

Just read your blog post too. Good stuff :)
Mountain Spirit - on 12 Apr 2014
In reply to deacondeacon:

thanx

cool as beanz

:-)
paul__in_sheffield - on 12 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

Hey, Savvas, there's been a stiff, cold westerly wind blowing in Burbage valley over the last couple of days. Absolutely freezing on the boulders (maybe me being nesh). Wrap up warm.
Mountain Spirit - on 12 Apr 2014
In reply to paul__in_sheffield:

Thanx for the info.

Will do.

Cool as beanz

:-)

Offwidth - on 12 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

That's good news, as the best friction is when things are colder. If you are top roping there is little faff on an ascent.
Offwidth - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

So how did it go? I was at Widdop on Sunday and it was pretty chilly but the friction was as good as I can remember for April. Amongst other things I flashed a couple of (overgraded) F6a's yet didnt use chalk once, whereas on Friday I was deperately chalking up sweaty hands on a sunny Baildon Severe!
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Offwidth:

Had to cancel due to sprained wrist then got delayed pains from cracking at The Castle. :(
Choss on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

> Had to cancel due to sprained wrist then got delayed pains from cracking at The Castle. :(

Oh Mate, you didnt go?

You were still Psyched for it up til Saturday night. How did you Injure yourself between then and Sunday? Everyone was stoked for you.

Im going to have to Cancel our sandstoning in May buddy. Im down for a not too often Long weekend camping with my Daughter that weekend. I was going to Spend some of that to help you out, but you keep blowing people out. I dont want to organise that into my weekend and have you cancel at the last minute. Sorry.
CurlyStevo - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
you always cancel don't you this is the third time you have canceled that I know of when people try and meet up with you. You did the same to me earlier this year.
Post edited at 12:08
McKEuan - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

I broke my arm in font at the weekend and still climbed, best to just ebay your kit because noone is going to offer to take you again.
CurlyStevo - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

What is the real reason you canceled?
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to CurlyStevo:

Still up for sandstoning though
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to McKEuan:

How do you do that?

How do climb when injured?
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to CurlyStevo:

It is the real reason and if you want to go The Arch one Sunday or new Brighton High Sports PM me.
seankenny - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to CurlyStevo:

> What is the real reason you canceled?

Messy reality just not as enticing as the glorious fantasy.
McKEuan - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit

Broke it topping out!

You shouldn't climb when injured but I just lowered my grade and manned up, I've never been to font before and didn't want to be the group let down,

You need to start accepting these offers and following through or stop wasting peoples time.
James Gilbert on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to McKEuan:

> You need to start accepting these offers and following through or stop wasting peoples time.

I doubt there are going to be many more offers...
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to McKEuan:
Still going Sandstoning.

That is different as you were already there.

I would do the same if I was injured topping out.

If was seconding HS or toproping VS I would lower my grades to seconding Diff or V.Diff and toproping S.

I dont even indoor boulder when injured....

I made that stupid mistake at Craggy 2 a while back.

Post edited at 12:38
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to James Gilbert:

Ive not arranged any more dates with Nath yet but I am still goin through with Sandstoning on the 11th and going to take up the Lakes climbing later.

Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Choss:
Did it in the bath and it was Saturday afternnon.

Have fun with your daughter

I might be there anyway doing crag maintenance.

:)
Post edited at 12:43
sbattams - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

Have you done any seconding of these grades or any grades to that matter? Following all the posts you seem really keen on talking about climbing, learning all there is from the internet, asking for advice and people to help you, which they have many times. Yet not managed to make it to the rock.

Im beginning to doubt if you can even tie the rope onto your harness or if you have just been practising this in-front of the internet.

No one is judging your disability they are judging the fact that you never go through with your plans. Many experienced people keep offering to take you climbing, they will go for a low grade first to gauge your ability then you can move on to your ambitions and work from there. I think you may not get many more offers of people going out of there way for you. now you will see the invites to say where they are going, join if you like.

Steve
McKEuan - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

Chance of you getting up a hs first time out on grit, slim to nill.

I don't consider it a stupid mistake I just got on with it. By the sounds of it an Injury for you is a runny nose

Man up or shut up

Choss on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

> Ive not arranged any more dates with Nath yet but I am still goin through with Sandstoning on the 11th and going to take up the Lakes climbing later.

You need to check my Earlier post Sav, ive cancelled that sandstoning trip.

Maybe some future date when youve Proved yourself more reliable eh.
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Choss:

Done

Checked it and edited reply.

:)
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to sbattams:

No I have not I just was using them as an example.

I know how to tie-in with a rethreded Figure of Eight knot.

Will do
Nath - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Sav

I will make myself available for a day after Easter - if you can get to me in Hinckley or tell me where you are staying in the Peak I will get you to some rock.

If I arrange a date - you must turn up - I have arranged for a qualified instructor to come along to give you some "over the shoulder" support for the day.

I will be missing a day with my family, and he will be missing a days pay.

Nath
Post edited at 12:50
McKEuan - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

> I might be there anyway doing crag maintenance.

> :)


Crag Maintenance?? Didn't know there where youtube videos that showed you how to do that......
CurlyStevo - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

I've already explained why I will not take you climbing outside in detail and I don't see the point in meeting up to boulder inside - I don't like indoor climbing and am not much of a boulderer. In any case you will just cancel anyway.
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to McKEuan:

Okay.

:)
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to CurlyStevo:

who knows?
CurlyStevo - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Nath:

"If I arrange a date - you must turn up "

forth time lucky?
McKEuan - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

Everyone knows your as reliable as a chocolate fireguard
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to McKEuan:

Someone suggested to do volunteer with The BMC or National Trust as a way og getting into the progessional side of the outdoors.

I have done conservation work before.

:)
deacondeacon - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain spirit
Savvas, I really think that if I you really haven't been diagnosed with any mental conditions it would be worth speaking to your Doctor again.
As far as your linkedin and Twitter accounts go you have an issue with what's truth and reality.

You cancelled climbing with me three times and every time it was the day before. You said you were definitely going to make it to Burbage North and not let this guy down and as expected you did the same thing Again.

STOP MESSING PEOPLE AROUND!
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to CurlyStevo:

Okay Stevo.

CurlyStevo - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to deacondeacon:
> "You cancelled climbing with me three times and every time it was the day before. You said you were definitely going to make it to Burbage North and not let this guy down and as expected you did the same thing Again."

Ok so this is actually atleast the fith time he has canceled.

> "Savvas, I really think that if I you really haven't been diagnosed with any mental conditions it would be worth speaking to your Doctor again."

Apparently he asked his mum and she said he was OK!

She is wrong or he is lieing and many people I know that have met him or read what he writes agree. I suggest collectively we stop playing pretend that his disability is physical only and assume that his judgement is not up for: scrambling, trad climbing, sport climbing or outdoor bouldering.

Also I asked Savvas privately why he writes some things that are clearly not true and he said its because he bullshits a lot. So I think we treat all his posts with a VERY LARGE PINCH OF SALT.

I am convinced of his existence and disability though, another well known climber who has met him confirmed this yet again today!
Post edited at 13:05
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to deacondeacon:

Ive changed my twitter and linked In accounts.

https://twitter.com/GREAKLHOULDING

https://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=96521172&trk=nav_responsive_tab_profile

My doctor is away on holiday.

ads.ukclimbing.com
Offwidth - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

Bad luck. For the record, climbing with an injury is not a good idea but sometimes it might be best to go on the trip anyway to learn other skills and have a look around with a knowledgable local.

As for someone claiming to be climbing with a broken arm telling you to man up: that's straight out of fictional humour, like the Ascent of Rum Doodle, and you should award yourself bonus points for getting someone to post such wonderful bullshit.

Another potential date for your diary is the BMC Stanage festival. Subject to bad luck I will be there helping out...just ask for Offwidth.

https://www.thebmc.co.uk/bmc-stanage-festival-2014-Peak-climbing-bouldering-event
Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to CurlyStevo:

I will speak to the GP.

I have asked her.

I just will not post anymore.
McKEuan - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Offwidth:

I wasn't aware you where hiding behind a boulder watching?? But you seem such a supremely confident person that you know exactly what is right and wrong.
deacondeacon - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

> Ive changed my twitter and linked In accounts.

The first bit of information on your linkedin account is instructor.

I've stuck up for you on here but more importantly I've always stuck up for you in the real world.
Stop posting, see a doctor and sort it out mate :)

Mountain Spirit - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to deacondeacon:

I've only changed the main section.

I will see the doctor soon.

:)
Offwidth - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to McKEuan:

I would climb with a broken arm but only if I did it on a route when continuing would entail less risk than stopping (say in a storm where rescue wouldnt arrive soon). I'm sure you can explain why its right though (even though I think it's as stupid as could be when bouldering).
McKEuan - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Offwidth:

Don't remember saying it was right, its just what i did, don't try and pick a fight where there isnt one.,
CurlyStevo - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Please seek medical help and listen to them and accept what they say Savvas. I would also not bother trying to climb with UKCers as I feel they will not understand your needs and I think you should for the time being only climb outside with professional instructors used to instructing disabled people. They will be by far the best placed people to advise you on how you can progress with climbing outside if indeed you can atall.
Post edited at 13:16
Offwidth - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to McKEuan:

You used it as an example to indicate someone should 'man up'. I think that was plain stupid, especially to someone like Sawas; thats not picking a fight, just a firm opinion.
McKEuan - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Offwidth:

Fair.
krikoman - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

Is this not the best troll on UKC?
CurlyStevo - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to krikoman:
Please explain the pictures of him on facebook with many famous climbers, I think these confirm exsistence and disability. Johnny Dawes and Jack Geldard have both confirmed meeting him (by email/facebook) to me and confirm everything also.

If it is a troll he has been trolling the whole climbing community including at the london walls and the training events. Either that or well known climbers have been involved in this troll which IMO would be incredibly bad taste and not in the slightest bit funny when they would have to explain they were in on a climber pretending he has disabilities.
Post edited at 13:51
mark s - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

i was going to say id show you around the roaches but from what i can see you are a dreamer and need to stop wasting yours and more importantly other peoples time.
the blog wont last long without any climbing in it.trips to walls and dreams about E8's maketh noteth a blogeth
Choss on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

Sav.

Im largely falling in Line with Stevo on this now, and Like him i do want you to realise your great passion and Enthusiasm for the outdoors, but in a way that is safe and Appropriate for your abilities (i dont like the term disabled. Concentrate on what youre able).

To this end, i think Nath's offer he is holding to is the best Opportunity you are ever going to get. Climbing with Nath, and Supervised by a qualified instructor. I reckon not only would you have a great day, but they can more than likely give you a good analysis of your current Limitations, and allow you to tailor your ambitions to your reality. And weve all got Limitations. Im Limited by being weak in the arms, well, that and being generally rubbish ;-)

Take Stevos Advice, Talk with a Doctor who Knows you about your Condition and outdoor ambitions. Take Nath up on his great offer, and find out what your level of participation and ambitions are going to be. But be Warned, i reckon youll be Drinking in the last Chance saloon if you bail on Nath.

Ps dont stop posting

CurlyStevo - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Choss:
yes I think naths offer is the exception to the rule - he has gone out of his way to make everything as safe as possible and has even organised a free instructor that is used to working with people with disabilities.

If Savvas agrees to go on this but doesn't turn up I will have have to strongly advise anyone else offering to take him outside that it is not worth their while.

IMO there is more going on with this than meets the eye you can not be as enthusiastic about climbing as Savvas is and cancel meeiting up with UKCers 5 times on the trot.
Post edited at 13:57
blackcat on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to CurlyStevo:Maybe all this is just a confidence issue,i think hes a climbing fan who wants to climb and meet other climbers,who buys all the gear and when it comes to it basically bottles in part due to his disabilities.I think savvas needs to go with a group led by an instructor with spiecial needs skills.I have a family member who has learning difficulties in terms of problem solving,in that if you put him on a building site he would be a danger to himself and others.
chrissyboy - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

You sprained your wrist in the bath!
Sounds nasty.
CurlyStevo - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to blackcat:
Sounds likely to me. Could be any number of reasons possibly to do with meeting new people or aprehension of actually climbing outside or not living up to his expectations of himself. I guess we'll probably never know but I'm not buying the colds and sprained wrist (and I guess other excuses for the other 3 times he cancelled)
Post edited at 14:53
Jonny2vests - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to blackcat:

That sounds like a fair analysis. Some of the harsher responses to his continued no show are making me cringe, tread litghtly on Curlystevo, and McKeuan can just piss off forever.
CurlyStevo - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Jonny2vests:
I think honesty is the best policy wrt this whole situation now. This treading lightly and pandering to Savvas's unrealistic wishes has gone too far. I know him I'm guessing far better than you or most the posters on UKC do.
Post edited at 16:13
ads.ukclimbing.com
McKEuan - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Jonny2vests:

Or, you can read all of his other threads and get a better understanding of the situation, I admit i may have been a bit harsh earlier I'm just getting slightly ratty with all the bs flying about.
splat2million on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:

For what it's worth, I would still be happy to take you out climbing sometime if you do come up to the Peak District. I think you do understand that you need someone else to make sure you are safe while you learn, whether a formal instructor or experienced climber.
I have experience of working with people with disabilities, including some coaching of rowing (but not climbing) as well as experience taking complete novices climbing. I am comfortable that you would be safe with me and I with you (otherwise I would not offer).
I don't want to tell you what to do or not do, just giving you an option.
David
abseil on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to James Gilbert:

> I doubt there are going to be many more offers...

What about me??

*I was just going to do the Eiger 1938 route, but my black cat sneezed so I cancelled.

*I was just going to do Great Wall, but the post was late so I cancelled.

*I was going to do Everest NE Ridge, but something just didn't feel right so I cancelled.

All true. How unlucky is that? Anyone fancy Right Wall Friday?
Jonny2vests - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to CurlyStevo:
> I think honesty is the best policy wrt this whole situation now. This treading lightly and pandering to Savvas's unrealistic wishes has gone too far. I know him I'm guessing far better than you or most the posters on UKC do.

Yeah, but your not a trained psychologist with the requisite skills and experience (I assume). And neither am I. I just think in the absence of real knowledge, one shouldn't hammer the guy and give him as many chances as he needs.

Big respect to you and others for offering in the first place, but who does it serve to give up on him? It's not tough love, he'll just stop posting eventually.
Post edited at 16:52
James Gilbert on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to abseil:

Sounds like you should team up with Savvas! ;-)
Jonny2vests - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to McKEuan:

> Or, you can read all of his other threads and get a better understanding of the situation, I admit i may have been a bit harsh earlier I'm just getting slightly ratty with all the bs flying about.

Ok, you no longer have to piss off forever :-)
Choss on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Jonny2vests:

people have been Hammering Sav for ages, and kudos to him for seeing through it. plenty more have been fighting his corner.

I do think you are confusing giving up on Sav with people Understanding that there is more at play here than Appears. We are not all Equipped to Take that forward as is.

what do you Suggest johnny, and i respect what you say by the way
CurlyStevo - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Jonny2vests:
I honestly believe it maybe for everyones best interst if Savvas leaves the forums (or atleast stops looking for advice on how he should climb outdoors right now and stops looking for partners) and concentrates on climbing indoors as he does just now and climbing outdoors with people trained to do so. Some of the advice and offers for climbing on here have been questionable in my opinion and possibly dangerous.
Post edited at 17:14
Skyfall - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Choss:

Sadly, this has all become a bit of a car crash with some people trying to be very helpful, others being incredibly unsympathetic and unnecessarily unpleasant and probably a lot of people being rather voyeuristic (myself included to an extent I guess) even if willing Sav to get out there and have a go on real rock.

As such, whilst I can see that some people have been motivated for the right reasons to a lesser or greater extent, I now feel quite uncomfortable about watching this play out.
Choss on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Skyfall:

Thats some wise words my Friend
Jonny2vests - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Choss:

> what do you Suggest johnny, and i respect what you say by the way

Thanks. Unfortunately I have no golden goal, but I disagree with suggestions of him leaving the forums or giving up trying to climb outdoors. And I disagree with armchair psychiatric evaluations from those who have no basis to give it.

Nath's offer seemed generous and appropriate, sounds like a good plan.

Savvas, are you up for that? Genuinely? Most people here think you won't show up, including me I'm afraid, are you determined to prove us wrong?
jkarran - on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Jonny2vests:

> Nath's offer seemed generous and appropriate, sounds like a good plan.
> Savvas, are you up for that? Genuinely?

I'll second that Savvas. Nath's offer sounds perfect for a safe introduction to climbing outside as part of a small team.

Whatever it is that keeps you from getting out and meeting people who are up for climbing with you you need to give it some thought before you decide to go (or not). Maybe talk it through with people you can trust like your folks well before the event or perhaps chat in private with the people you're thinking of meeting if you have any general or specific concerns.

Don't worry about the details of needing to know this or that (abseiling seems to crop up frequently) I'm sure you'll be in really good hands and won't need to do anything you haven't been taught to do safely.

Good luck, I hope you are able to get out, learn loads and have a good time.
jk
Post edited at 19:26
liz j on 14 Apr 2014
In reply to Mountain Spirit:
Savvas, I see you didn't make the trip to the Peak afterall. You state on your Linkedin page that -
"I am a climber who is passionate about climbing in all its forms from bouldering to DWS and alpinism."
If that is really true, then surely you would be doing everything possible to get out climbing when the opportunity arises. Plenty of people have offered to take you climbing but you just bail at the last moment.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but I think climbing is a fantasy for you rather than a reality, and you could be doing something that is a reality rather than spending hours on the internet researching a fantasy.

Have you considered joining Crossfit/FitQuest/Bootcamp classes? It's physically and mentally challenging, but also social and more importantly, there will be a class near to your home. It seems to me that you are wasting a lot of time in a fantasy world where you could instead be out doing something and meeting people without having to rely on someone else. If you decide not to go, then you are only letting yourself down, not someone who may have arranged their weekend around taking you climbing.

If you do decide to pursue the climbing, then you need to stop messing people around. I do think your best course of action would be pay an instructor to take you climbing. It might give you the incentive to turn up as you would be unlikely to get your money back if you cancelled the day before.
Post edited at 23:25
Frank the Husky - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to all: I'm amazed that people are still replying to this guy. Many weeks ago I was pretty direct about him and his antics and received a "cease and desist" email from the good folks of UKC. I was told that "many people" were upset by my approach; fair enough thought I...and I stood back. Since then, he has been banned from The Castle, refused membership by all the climbing clubs in London and has cancelled 5 diferent crag meetings at the very last minute with people off here who were kind enough to offer their time and energy. The latest cancellation was after spraining his wrist in the bath the previous night. While it's nice to be proved right, it's turned into a car crash that is being fed by...us!

Sure, he has a disability and we're all very respectful of that etc, but if he cannot even walk on rough ground (see posts from Curly Steve) then he has no hope of climbing. Ever.

His blog is full of nothing, and his claims of what he can do/will do are utter rubbish. Please people, stop replying, stop wasting your time and his, stop pandering to his delusions. When I say "delusions" I use that word with some thought. His alter ego on his blog is "spartanpowerhouse".

Cool as beanz.

Mountain Spirit - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to liz j:

I am going to hire an instructor after Easter or go 1:1 with Plas Y Brenin

Mountain Spirit - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to Jonny2vests:

I am sticking with Nath's offer after I have some 1:1 instruction.
Mountain Spirit - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to jkarran:

I agree with you.

:-)
Lusk - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to Frank the Husky:

I couldn't agree more, he's f*cking time waster!

Cool as nicely chilled Weissbier!


Nath, don't waste that instructors time on this geezer.
Jonny2vests - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to Frank the Husky:

> Sure, he has a disability and we're all very respectful of that etc

Yeah, you're the epitome of compassion.
mark s - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to Jonny2vests:

frank is compassionate,i know him.
he also speaks the truth.
Jonny2vests - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to mark s:

> frank is compassionate,i know him.

Yeah, he certainly sounds it. I wonder if he's considered a career lecturing to people in the autism spectrum.
Simon - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to Jonny2vests:

Apologies if I have come into this thread a little late, I have been reading about Savvas and quietly, like others been rooting for him to get out and enjoy some of the wonderful benefits climbing outdoors can bring.

I'm sorry to hear things have not worked out for him and in all effect have turned a bit sour from reliability issues, which will obviously irk for you guys who have been so kind to offer a day out with help and guidance for him out on the crag.

Not wishing to stick my oar in, but I have worked with people with dyspraxia whist doing my BSc Psychology training years ago and also in my work in the NHS and thought it may help if I shared some of my experiences to get a bit of balance. Feel free to stop reading if you so wish now, and Savvas please do not take anything personally in this.

One of the main area I discovered and worked on with people with dispraxia was where they were extremely willing to listen and seemingly very keen with ideas, but ultimately did not understand the brevity of what was being put on offer to them.

Almost, as some people have alluded, a fantasy like situation, where every things sounds great & wonderful, but ultimately it isn't a reality. This is common and it's basically thought to be a problem with the two hemispheres (H) in the brain not coordinating with each other.

One H maybe thinks: Great - Climbing - Burbage - beautiful - lets go!

Yet the other H doesn't follow this thought through, it doesn't quite get the message and doesn't like adapting to a situation which may be new or unpredictable. So it puts the kibosh on it with a justification or two, its; too hot, too cold, too early, too late etc.

The ideology in the other H however, remains and doesn't give up easily, it really does want to go climbing. Frustrating!

This can often lead to avoidance behavior, especially with situations that have the potential to be difficult, demanding and outside of every day
normality.

I suppose it can seem like an 'all the gear no idea' situation, which it literally can be. It's almost like when you tell some one to do something and they go and do the opposite, despite all you have said and thought they have understood at the time, but with a more severe underlying issue about 'the understanding' part.

The work I have done with people with dyspraxia, was to try to get the both sides of the brain to have a mutual understanding with each other, very slowly at first, initially introducing an idea & goal setting - then working on strategies and coping mechanisms to see them through the practical stages. Almost breaking through the 'negative' thoughts with some blind faith (and with much friction) to achieve the goals set.

Almost trying to fool the H that is trying to spoil the party by shutting out the negative chatter, with cognitive behavioral techniques to help with the distorted patterns of thinking. It's a hard fought battle and we all have them in some form or other every day. Head games, as we climbers call them, needing that little bit of faith in the friction to move forward.

I'm not decrying anyone who has posted on this thread and offerd help, it is commendable, but it seems for this chap, a qualified instructor, experienced in working with people with disabilities would be able to take into account Savvas's many challenges before he even stepped onto rock.

Again sorry if I have stuck my nose in where not wanted, however I wish Savvas all the best in his endeavors to get climbing outdoors, hopefully in the right environment and conditions for him whenever he is ready.

cheers all

Si
Choss on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to Simon:

great post Simon. very Thoughtful and informative. hopefully given us all a bit more insight. thanks
Skyfall - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to Simon:
Thanks for your post Simon. I think that helps explain what appears to be happening ie. genuine desire to climb frustrated by something internal holding MS back. I'd hoped it was fairly obvious what was going on and that it wasn't something intentional. Many of us will experience periods of inability to make decisions, or at least to make them but not stick with them, often around times of other stress. I know I have. I'd hoped that some of the more accusatory posters (I guess you know who you are) would have been able to empathise with someone who has a few more difficulties to cope with on top of normal life. My concern is with this playing out in public. I am struggling to see how threads such as this on UKC can help move things on for MS who probably needs some good 1:1 coaching, in private.
Post edited at 09:34
CurlyStevo - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to Simon:
Spot on and said so much better than I can (I'm not a particularly empathetic person although that is no excuse) and with a much better understanding of the condition too.
Post edited at 09:51
RockSteady on 15 Apr 2014
Simon - on 15 Apr 2014
In reply to Skyfall:
> My concern is with this playing out in public.


Mine too, which is why I thought hard about posting initially. What did convince me, was the way in which perceptions can be cruel in every walk of life & it's easy to dismiss people and conditions as 'bollocks' really.


I hope I'm not wrong, and I don't think I am, but if it is bollocks, then fair enough and I can only speak from experience where others can't and so such is life I suppose.

The Blog that Jamie wrote really should be a fitting read for all who have read this post, very inspiring and a great insight.

cheers

Si
Post edited at 10:19

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