/ Pigstone Walls

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The New NickB - on 17 Apr 2014
Does anyone know what I am talking about? Google brings up a picture of one within a few hundred metres of where I am sitting, but nothing else.

I am after some ballpark figures for restoring / reinstating. I know there are a few wallers on the forum. I suspect it is a term and possibly a technique that is quite local.
Bob on 17 Apr 2014
In reply to The New NickB:
The first hit on Google has a photo of what I'd term a flag wall so I suspect it's whatever the local term for a dressed slab of stone is. Maybe pigstone comes from them being used for flooring in pig styes. I've seen them made from gritstone in Saddleworth - my mother-in-law's house has them as boundary stones for the back yard - these are big being about 8' x 4' x 4" and have the advantage that they don't take up much space.


They do exist elsewhere - there's a lot around Hawkshead using slate rather than gritstone and I think I've seen shots of similar walls in the States. See some of the shots at the bottom of this page http://www.keswick.u-net.com/90331.htm for the Hawkshead style.
Post edited at 16:33
wilkie14c - on 17 Apr 2014
In reply to Bob:

Lots of these around berris / nant peris. All over the slate area of Wales too I would have thought. The theory of pig sty flooring sounds plausable too.
Dave Perry - on 17 Apr 2014
In reply to The New NickB:

Nick, I had to look that up but couldn't find the image you referred to. I'm assuming you mean walls from large upright slabs like the pics Bob has posted? I've never built them but I do know someone who has and he's from the SW Lakes I've taken the liberty of copying his contact profile off the Drystone Walling Association forum:- http://forum.dswa.org.uk/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=11

If you don't get anywhere with Gerry could do no worse than either posting a request on the 'work wanted/offered' section of the forum or searching the appropriate area on the 'professional members' map and contacting a waller that way.
The New NickB - on 17 Apr 2014
In reply to Dave Perry:

Thanks Dave, that is useful. This is was the only thing google brought up http://www.alamy.com/stock-photos/AW1XED/Traditional%20Pigstone%20Walls%20Middleton%20Greater%20Manc...
Now this thread is the top google search for 'pigstone walls'.

Bob, yes I have seen the slate ones in the Lakes, the ones I am after are more like the gritstone ones in Saddleworth, which isn't so far from here, even if it is the other side of the hills.

Interestingly, my colleague from Cleckhuddersfax, also calls it pig stone.
Dave Perry - on 17 Apr 2014
In reply to The New NickB:

They shouldn't be too difficult to fix provided they are not broken. As you'd expect the main construction technique is sitting them upright in the soil and close together. Some of the slate ones I've seen have little nicks in them which the next stone just slightly rests in and so on, thus the whole 'wall' is slightly but cleverly connected.
The New NickB - on 17 Apr 2014
In reply to Dave Perry:

> They shouldn't be too difficult to fix provided they are not broken. As you'd expect the main construction technique is sitting them upright in the soil and close together. Some of the slate ones I've seen have little nicks in them which the next stone just slightly rests in and so on, thus the whole 'wall' is slightly but cleverly connected.

Some probably need re-sitting, but it will mainly be a reinstatement job, will need about 50 appropriate gritstone slabs sourcing and laying (probably not the right term). Quite a big job, but I'm not personally paying for it. They tend to be fixed together with two diamond shaped metal plates on a bolt.
tlm - on 20 Apr 2014
In reply to The New NickB:

There's a page about them with examples here:

http://www.valleyofstone.org.uk/journey/stoneinthelandscape/countryside
tlm - on 20 Apr 2014
In reply to The New NickB:

and here is one with iron clips:

http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/689013
tlm - on 20 Apr 2014
In reply to The New NickB:

Ooo! A load of information here:

http://www.stoneroof.org.uk/fence.html
tlm - on 20 Apr 2014
In reply to The New NickB:

and here is a list of dry stone wallers in Lancashire...

http://www.dswa.org.uk/lancaster.asp
johncook - on 20 Apr 2014
In reply to The New NickB:

Contact the stone museum, not sure of it's proper name, at Wirksworth. They have examples of many different types of 'walls' and who built them. They may have a list or know of a source of suitably qualified people. Will find it's name on Monday when I am in Wirksworth.
tlm - on 20 Apr 2014
In reply to johncook:

The national stone centre, you mean?

http://www.nationalstonecentre.org.uk/
johncook - on 20 Apr 2014
In reply to tlm:

That's the one. Please allow for old age when it comes to memory (especially recent memory, have a great memory for stuff from 30+ years ago!)
Haggis on 20 Apr 2014
In reply to The New NickB:

I'd call it a flag fence and if I had any experience with them, I'd do you a quote. Sadly I haven't yet worked on that type of wall but I will pm you with the details of some local wallers who should be able to help you out.
The New NickB - on 22 Apr 2014
In reply to Haggis:

Thanks for all the replies and interest. Given me a good starting point. Apologies if anyone emailed me direct, this profile isn't linked to an active email account.
Haggis on 22 Apr 2014
In reply to The New NickB:

Since you won't have got my email then, I recommend Gordon Lyons and Peter Walker from the DSWA professional register for Lancashire (both near to Rochdale).
Dave Perry - on 22 Apr 2014
In reply to The New NickB:

The list you'e been given contains all the members of the DSWA operating in Lancashire.

Just a couple of points to consider when choosing someone:-

I don't think there is a great deal of conventional drystone walling skill in building/repairing these - but if I was picking someone I'd choose some one who'd done it before (OK, so I'm a bit contrary!!).

They appear rather uncommon around your area but they are relatively common in some areas of the lake district.

One practical problem you or the guy/girl you use may be finding a quarry still open which can obtain the slabs in the right thickness and size.
Bob on 22 Apr 2014
In reply to Dave Perry:

The cost might be eye watering. Rough stone for a conventional drystone wall is around 30/tonne delivered. 1 tonne is enough for roughly 1 running metre of wall. Then there's the cost of labour to build the wall: 25-30 per running metre.

Just costed some reclaimed Yorkstone slabs - not sure of the thickness but I think they are around 60-70mm, Delivered cost is 90 per square metre. The slabs at my mother-in-laws are around 6ft6" x 4ft so 2.4m^2, they are a bit thicker as well so each one would be over 200!
Dave Perry - on 23 Apr 2014
In reply to Bob:

Now you've spoilt it!!
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The New NickB - on 23 Apr 2014
In reply to Bob:

To be honest that is what I guessed, 100 sq.m plus just for the stone.
Tom V - on 23 Apr 2014
In reply to Dave Perry:

Indeed!

If Bob can get me stone at 30 /tonne I'm all ears.

Not so keen on working for 25 /metre, though, or giving UKC the impression that that's the "going rate".
Bob on 23 Apr 2014
In reply to Tom V:

That was the last price I paid for rough "field" stone.

As for the labour rate - again that was the last price I heard which was about five years ago - if I need any walling doing, I'll do it myself and it's a long time since I've done it as a paying job.

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