UKC

Hello UKC gurus
Hope we're all well and thanks felt reading this post !
I'm looking for either a recommendation for a decent school thing or a person with the skills to teach me french in preparation for a relocation over there in the near future - have been looking at the actual schools and stuff but seems like it's not that useful
In real life !

Thanks

Alex

In reply to 1906johns:

I know that my kids would just say ' there is an app for that'

Good luck.

In reply to 1906johns:

Try Michel Thomas, then get yourself some French pals on My Language Exchange to practise with.

In reply to 1906johns:

Where are you based ?

In reply to RomTheBear:

Nottingham mate, yourself

In reply to Submit to Gravity:

Thanks for the tip

In reply to 1906johns:

How long have you got?
Do you want to learn French more fully in the longer term?
There is loads of excellent free stuff online - the BBC site is good:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/languages/french/

The good thing about lessons is that you tend to get a more rounded approach.

In reply to tlm:
A good few months bud. Again thanks for the advice

In reply to 1906johns:

The thing is, the only way to get it into your own head is to spend time on it - a little bit of time every day soon makes a difference. Going to an hours class once a week will be very slow, but practising for half an hour, twice a day, will rapidly make a difference.

Also, maybe find out now if there are any classes where you are going, so that you can continue to learn once you are there.

In reply to tlm:

Daily practice is really important. As is motivation.

In reply to 1906johns:

Then there is probably a French consulate there with a state sponsored French cultural centre, they would probably offer French lessons, the price is likely to be a lot lower than more commercial providers. It also gives you the opportunity to meet lots of French people and establish some links.

In reply to RomTheBear: they teach french to all applicants, the thing is that being a new life and having much stuff to learn I'm keen to get a jump on learning it so there's not as much to panic about, I've found that classroom lessons don't really give a good handle on what it's like to hold real life conversations

In reply to 1906johns:

They probably have a French conversation group going on, with a mix of British and French people there. There is one where I live in Edinburgh organised by the consulate and I heard it's quite good.
However French is not really an easy language, ( I'm French and I am struggling with it sometimes ! ) I think lessons can really make a big difference. University evening classes can be quite good too.

In reply to RomTheBear:
I will definitely have a look into that thanks, french really isn't easy you're quite right,

In reply to 1906johns:

Immersion is effective so create your own french bubble with french films, french TV and french internet news sites. Get used to hearing it and seeing it.

As stated or implied above, hard work and self-discipline is essential.

In reply to 1906johns:

As a former TEFL and FLE teacher there's some good advice in this thread. Having something structured is recommended, as it should offer a programme of progression which will cover the basics of the language; it will also provide an approach that requires less self discipline. Classroom environments and the relevance of what is taught, with regard to your particular situation, will depend highly upon the teacher and the specific course, I'd still highly recommend it though. Try contacting Nottingham Uni, they have a good French department.

However, as tlm points out, once or twice a week will result in very slow progression. Which is where regular, focused practice/immersion is key and the best way to do this prior to your move is through topics which are relevant and interesting to you. Start following French news (TV and online is easiest, try France24.com or BFMTV.com, or playtv.fr: the options are limited from the UK, but you should find something to watch, such as TV8 Mont Blanc!) a lot of the world topics will be the same as the UK, but with a different spin; the key thing is, the subject will already be known to you. Check your DVD collection, see if you've got any films that have been dubbed into French. Or, look for books you've already read, but in French (there are loads of climbing/Alpinism books, cf. Guérin). Start following some of the French climbing forums/blogs. The important things are to make it interesting, fun and relevant to your new life!

I presume you're moving to France, which part, if you don't mind me asking?
Feel free to PM me if you want any other info, as I've lived in France and taught languages for a while.

In reply to 1906johns:

Think of a sentence you'd like to say (a phrase or sentence) in french and sit down and write it out as best possible (with aid of dictionaries etc), then use a translation program to get a better idea (but sometimes worse!).

There is a softwarel dictionary from Ultralingua which includes v useful conjugator.

Useful online is Linguée:

http://www.linguee.fr/francais-anglais

which allows you to look up words and phrases in context.

PS. Don't get too stressed about gender.

In reply to gouezeri:

I think "immersing" yourself in a language when you don't really know it, is dooming yourself to boredom and failure.

In reply to 1906johns:
French Dvds with french subtitles for deaf people - if you don't catch then spoken language you can read it.

In reply to Submit to Gravity:
I'm not totally disagreeing with you, cos I think there is some validity to your point, ie. total immersion in a language that you have no knowledge of and in a subject/field that you know nothing about. However, my point about DVD's, TV, Climbing sites etc. was for the OP to be in contact with the language, but in domains that he is already familiar with and are of interest to him. Climbing and Alpinism for example already share many words with Alpine countries, watching a film in French, that he's already watched in English, so he already knows the plot, etc. Consequently it should be quicker and easier to make connections between things as well as logical assumptions. I would not recommend total immersion, via aural sources, listening to the news on a radio, for example as for most people, in my experience, it leads to the overload that you are suggesting.

Having spoken to the OP directly, he seems to have exactly the right attitude which will help him to progress, as without which, in his particular circumstance, he certainly would find himself in a pretty full-on situation. Instead, he should be able to learn enough of the language now, to have a good basis, in the right areas, to make decent progression later on. As I said, the important thing is for him to make it interesting, fun, and relevant to his new life.

Edit: Linguée is a good site for getting multiple examples of context, however, a lot of the French it references is from Canadian/Québécois sites, so the usage can be quite different. It also references a lot of government sites, using specific language.

In reply to 1906johns:

Get hold of your favourite book, in French translation. (For example, we have Harry Potter et la coupe de feu here on our shelves because one of our daughters does French at school...) Read a chapter of it a day. And/ or: don't go on the bbc.news.co.uk website to read about the news, go on http://www.lemonde.fr/.

When you were a baby you learned English because people kept speaking it all around you. They rarely if ever explained, they just ploughed on and you learned--pretty quickly--to follow.

You could do that then. You're less clever now than you were when you were a baby, but you can still do it. Just let go of your inhibitions and let it happen to you, and it will.

In reply to gouezeri:


But it does reference european sites - including my own izaut-rustica alors attention !

In reply to LeeWood:

Yeah, it's definitely a site worth knowing about, I pretty much use it daily for work. I also like the fact that it gives multiple examples. I didn't say that it didn't reference European sites. My comment was that it is a good idea to look at where the sites it references are hosted and what kind of site it is; context is always key when it comes to translation. As it favours sites that are already translated (hence why there are so many Canadian sites), there is bound to be a bias towards countries that use more than one language officially as well as by the local community.
Wordreference.com is also a useful site.

By the way, you might want to correct your site, the preposition is à, not á Your chutneys look great, sadly there's nothing like that around here!

In reply to 1906johns:

Watch re-runs of Allo Allo regularly

In reply to gouezeri:


But you only find *one* mistake ?! Read on

For the OP: Bilangual material is also a good source for learning from, whether it be books or webpages. Simply find material which interests/motivates you, read in english, try to translate (I mean 'with effort' - seated with dictionaries etc), then refer to the french copy. I have used Lleida Climbs in this fashion ... but for learning spanish!

In reply to 1906johns:

Find out whether there is an Anglo/French club in Nottingham. A lot of towns have them, and we have one here in Hastings. We meet weekly at a cafe and all conversation is in French, but it's very informal. There are people of all abilities from complete novices to people like myself with basic "O" level French to French Nationals living in the UK. I've found it very useful and the others are helpful. I also have the advantage of having a French girlfriend and we speak in French a lot and often text each other in French.

An excellent text book I have got is Collins "Easy Learning French Conversation" ISBN 978-0-00-722974-1

In reply to LeeWood:

I was being kind Plus, normally I get paid for translations and proofreading! What struck me as a little odd is that you make the mistake 4-5 times on the home page, but not elsewhere, so it must have been an off day/late at night! The rest of what I read was pretty decent, far better than what I would normally expect and certainly better than loads of the tourism information centres around here! Some of the stuff I get sent is shocking.

Looks like a lovely area, I don't know it at all, I've only spent time in the 11 and 66 Depts down there. I'll have to swap you some pink onions or artichokes for some of those chutneys!

To the OP: As Lee says, some bilingual stuff can certainly be helpful (if properly translated). I would try to vary as to whether you start with the English first, or the French. What you want to focus on is whether you can get the general gist of what is being said, don't get hung up on specific words, look at the wider context. In my experience as a teacher, the quicker you can do this, the quicker you will progress and new learning opportunities will open up to you. Again, as Lee & Tim say, don't get hung up on grammar or inhibitions to make mistakes. I've known people who could copy out pages from the Bescherelle from memory, but who were incapable of having a conversation, without first mentally constructing the sentence in their head to make sure it was perfect, by which point the conversation had moved on!

Conversation groups are great, but people don't always manage to strike a balance between correcting mistakes, or not. Being corrected all the time can be both embarrassing and incredibly frustrating, not correcting someone who repeatedly makes the same mistakes, hinders their progression. The important thing is practise whenever you can, both in groups and pairs! Reading skills, aural skills and oral skills all develop at different rates and need to be worked on.

Do let us know how you get on though!

In reply to gouezeri:

But thankyou anyway for looking at the site. There are tow features of the french language which I despair over - gender and accents. ( OK its myself I despair of !) So I'm often lazy - but I shouldn't be on the index page !!! I'll put it right soon. In html these accents are written à or á so when I (errantly) trust memory it can turn out wrong (ie. the result is not immediately visible).

If you're ever down this way I'll be delighted to do some swapping. We've run out of the normal commercial chutneys at present but still have a stock of beetroot-with-fennel and plum-with-orange-zest.

Thanks for that WordReference link. I note that it really is 'word' unlike Linguée. I typed a phrase and it only picked up the 1st word. Useful conjugators too.

Ironically I gave up school french at the age of 14 - believing that it could never be useful to me; I also gave up woodwork. Both are now essential! I never considered myself to have any particular skill for language (NB. we have many visitors who help sort out the webpages) but finally having come here, total immersion was the real cure.

In reply to LeeWood:

I had a good gander around as it's nice to see expats making the effort to be a part of their community and the culture. Plus, it was good to see a small business in France with its own website! I think half of them still think that people only use Minitel!

The Wordreference dictionary is far from complete (well, at least for my kind of work). Sometimes it is worth looking at the Collins definitions as well (available via a link at the top), but I tend to use it the most for the forum results, as this gives you loads of different options/opinions (even though some are often wrong) which is normally enough to push me out of any writer's block, particularly when it comes to idioms. CNRTL tends to be the best as an online French resource (lexicography, synonymy, etymology, etc.), but it's probably a bit over the top for most people! Proz can also be useful for technical terms.

I discussed your final point with the OP privately. The way languages are often taught, make them boring and totally irrelevant to most students; which is why I'm against English being taught here in primary schools (the teachers have had little training for it and tend not to be interested in it). The wrong teacher, teaching the wrong subject, can turn a kid off it for life, I think we've all experienced that at some time. Making a subject _relevant_ and interesting to kids is what makes it come alive.

I do think that SubmittoGravity had a valid point that the wrong kind of "immersion" can have a detrimental effect, but in the right context it can provide the quickest results, as you're learning what you need and want to learn. It can be a bit intense for some people though.

Totally OT. With regards to having visitors and without knowing your setup, have you looked at FrancePassion? My parents use it loads, they always buy produce from the people they meet and end up becoming ambassadors for them and revisiting places on purpose!