UKC

This looks pretty good. Not a gimmick like the heavy Magnetron, or the fiddly looking Grivel double gate biner.

Will need to have a go myself, but i can see myself buying a few of these.
Not sure about the quickdraw one though...

http://www.epictv.com/content/no-screwgate-carabiner-still-locks-tight-here...

Worth watching to the very end as the guy explains some of his own personal experience with them with some other guides.

In reply to CharlieMack:

I Look forward to trying these as well.

I dont think the magnetron is a gimmick... i Like them, a solid Piece of Kit. Easy to operate one Handed, yet needs 3 actions to make it Accidentally open... when open stays Primed to lock and when gate shuts it autolocks... quality i reckon

In reply to Choss:

I like the action on them, they are just so heavy! If they were lighter i'd maybe get one.

In reply to Choss: The standard one with out the wire gate is imo too easy to open. It's not three actions, it's one. If the carabiner were to be placed over an edge, gate facing the rock it WOULD open if loaded. A solution that has gone looking for a problem I'd say...

In reply to mike kann:

It is most definitely two. "Push" and then "Slide". It is probably marginally less susceptible to accidental opening than a standard twistlock but you may well be correct in that it may be less secure than the Magnetron or other 'triple lock' designs.


I'd disagree. There is a clear advantage to krabs that can freely rotate and a clear rational for having a locking quickdraw. Also, DMM tried to do something similar with their shadow snapgates but never brought it to market.

Whether this particular attempt is ultimately successful is an open question, but it definitely tries to address real, albeit minor, problems with existing carabiners.

In reply to The Ex-Engineer:

Unless I've seen a different version (which I doubt) all you have to do is slide the catch and the gate can open. With the wire gate it's obviously different but to my way of thinking the standard version is a locker-lite, not a full locker. It's just too easy to open it. As I said before, all you've got to do is have the gate facing down on an edge, the rope to load the biner and it moves the slider and it's open over the edge. If you like it crack on, personally I don't. Yes, what I'm saying will only occur very infrequently, but having a locker which relatively easy to load open gate is not a great solution. Just like having a stainless steel belay plate that scores the crap out of your belay biner is a bit darwin for my liking, another Edelrid cracker.

In reply to CharlieMack:

I have one of the Strike karabiners with the anti-twist spring. I'm using this with a mega-jul. It replaces a BD magnetron, so I have experience of both karabiners. So far I like the Edlerid krab, but the catch to open the gate is low profile and while OK with bear hands, I don't know how easy it would be to open with gloves?

I have on at least one occasion been asked by observant climbing wall staff to stop belaying using a snap-gate until it's explained that I am actually using a locker.

The main reason for swapping was the mega-jul was marking up the magnetron and Edlerid were starting to sell this krab as a matched pair with the mega-jul. It hasn't marked up nearly as much.

In reply to mike kann:

If your binner gets loaded over an edge you have bigger problems than the crab opening, incompetence for once. If your binner gets loaded over an edge AND on the gate you should maybe take up golf or other sport where you are not likely to be scooped up with a shovel when you do something stupid. Gear is not a replacement for common sense, i know you know that and it's not directed personally at you, but i'll just drop it here for arguments sake.

Anyway As i mentioned in the other thread i really like the little ones for the quickdraws, and i'll be nabbing a few of them which i can see getting loads of use. The bigger ones are a bit meh, but i'm a screwgate type of guy and don't get along with the other locking systems.

In reply to CharlieMack:

For me, the acid test would be whether the think seized up when subjected to a graunchy gully, a bit of ice or a dose of sea water. Otherwise they look pretty neat. Not that I'm in the market for new gear right now.

In reply to CharlieMack:

A very easy to clip locking quickdraw is a great idea, about the best use for this tech I'd say.

For belaying, the magnetron is king for me. So easy to open, especially when indoor toproping etc where you are changing leads all the time. All that screwing, gone.

Screwgate for belays. Much harder to open if something leans on it.

In reply to purplemonkeyelephant:

I don't see why you'd want a locking quickdraw? Surely if you're running out a piece of gear and you don't want it to unclip when you fall on it, a regular quickdraw would do the job. Surely they are designed to be fallen on without unclipping?
Otherwise i've been doing it wrong all these years?!

In reply to CharlieMack:

If it was your last piece for a while, and it was the only thing between you and the deck, I dunno - sounds like some nice extra security. Though rare, biners can unclip?

In reply to purplemonkeyelephant:

Yea i can see how it's psychological reassurance. The only time i use a screwgate for a runner is if it's a sling over a big flake, so the biner is somewhat more likely to turn around on the gear.

In reply to Mr Lopez:

So you can categorically say that on pitch 20 when you're a bit strung out and you place a sling over a flake and the carabiner could rotate, that the gate will definitely not rub against an edge when loaded? You know as well as anybody that you can make mistakes. All I'm saying is that a screwgate should be fail safe. This is NOT fail safe. Yeah I could take up knitting. Or I could just use a proper locker, just like you do.

In reply to mike kann:

Of course you are right, but the moment we start thinking "oh, the crab is being loaded over an edge, but it's ok, it's a screwgate, so i'll probably be fine", then we start trawling murky waters and it may end up not being a good day to remember.

Making sure the carabiner is not over an edge is more important than the type of carabiner, we shorten the sling, we lengthen the sling or whatever, and then we won't have to worry about gates being pushed open or crabs failing at very low loads.

Careful with those knitting needles, they are damn sharp.

In reply to mike kann:


You're over egging your pudding here or you have a belay biner made of pudding. I've been using the Jul a fair amount now - there are some scratches on my biner but they're not that major and aren't going to damage the rope - particularly being on the outside of the curve.

In reply to purplemonkeyelephant:


Maybe not even that rare. Screwgate on the first bolt isn't that unusual at all I don't think.

In reply to TobyA:

Do they really unclip that often if they've not been back clipped?

In reply to Mr Lopez:

Yep, you're right, you shouldn't have a krab over an edge, whether its a locker or a locker lite, or a standard crab. Out of those three, which is the most secure? The full locker, without any doubt. Personally I'd rather (and do) use a standard crab and make sure that its away from edges rather than getting complacent and think "well thats a locker so i don't have to worry about it". And thats what this krab will do, breed complacency.

Outraged of knittingham.

In reply to TobyA:

Try using the magic plate mode Toby. Have your mate fall off and then get lowered. The belay plate is rotated around the inside of the crab to release it and leaves a score mark just like a stainless steel folded bolt hanger does. I'm not talking about your belay crab, but the strong point crab. Trust me, its a retarded bit of design. In other highlights on the Jul, you can get burns from using it as stainless retains heat very effectively, and owing to its small size makes the thing scorching hot after an abseil. The volume of metal is also important here. Its just not a great piece of design... Sorry...

In reply to TobyA:

I'll just stick to trad. Far safer. Sport climbing scares me too much. Can't tell the condition of bolts. Quick draws getting wedged.
When you're run out on an rp you know where you stand :p

In reply to mike kann:

I'll give it go. I have abseiled on it - maybe 25 mtrs max so far and not found it got excessively hot but I can see why it could being small.

I find it odd that the Jul gets either loved (Climbing mag gear of the year, Andrew Bisharat's rave review etc) or hated (you! and quite a few others). So far I think its OK. Works well with some ropes, locks up to much with others. Some strong points some week points etc.

In reply to TobyA:

To be honest its as much that Edelrid are on a massive drive to be the lightest of everything, compromising safety or efficacy of the product in doing so. Www.justdontdigit.com

In reply to mike kann:

Jeez, I can't spell first thing in the morning (last message)! "Week"? "To much"? Humble apologies etc.

In reply to TobyA: i'm an engineer Toby. I'm lucky I can even read.

In reply to mike kann:

I personally am more concerned with getting Camp stuff stuff like the nano 23 and the photon being at least 2 KN weaker than allot of dmm stuff also the push in strength for the Edelrid locker is relatively weak to with the dmm rhino being rated to 5X stronger at 5kn.
That being said i'm using the camp photon locker as my connection point to my anchors and to my belay device when I'm belaying direct from anchor. :P

In reply to CharlieMack:
i've played with the Pure Slide in the store.

i have a hard time considering it as a locking carabiner. it opens very easily. there are a couple of uses for it that i can think of, and using it as a critical locker (i.e. master point, belay biner) does not seem like the best idea.

i see it as a possible replacement for non-lockers that we often use to put another level of safety or a replacement for heavier lockers that might be overkill in some situations (i.e. prussic back up biner)