UKC

I love to go out for a moderate length cycle of around forty miles but my problem is that after as little as 10 miles my bum is aching and this situation only gets worse as the time goes on. I also get a pain in the gooch if I try and maintain a high cadence. Things have gone to the stage now that I am inclined to leave the bike in the shed and go for a run/hike instead. Could it be as simple as shifting the saddle??. I have been looked at in the bike shop a couple of times and they say my position is good. I sometimes feel myself that I am putting a bit too much weight on the handlebars. What should I try first as a fix?.

In reply to goatee:

If it's really that bad, you could get properly bike fitted - you may be riding either the wrong size frame, or have the bars/saddle in the wrong position. That will cost you about £100.

Other than that, I'm assuming you're wearing good quality shorts and have a decent saddle - changing that is a bit of a trial and error process, but some bike shops have a selection of trial saddles.

In reply to goatee:

Make sure that you're not wearing anything that aggravates the problem.

I find my arse hurts after a long layoff, I generally have to build up to longer rides again, you literally have to condition your bum. It gets better with time. Just rest your backside and when its comfortable to ride again (couple of days or whatever) go out again.

In reply to goatee:

I got a bike fit this week £40 for two bikes. Massive difference. Definitely give it a try.

In reply to goatee:

When I bought my bike it had an expensive saddle that turned out to be a source of agony like no other. I now have a saddle that is so comfortable I can do half hour rides without padded shorts and feel fine.
I would suggest, if possible, find a friendly shop and try every saddle they've got.

In reply to goatee:

I also had a fitting last week. Cost 45£ and has completely transformed my riding.
Def worth the money if you ride regularly

In reply to LastBoyScout:

If it's the wrong frame size it could cost a lot more than £100

In reply to DubyaJamesDubya:

Thanks for the replies guys. I guess I will have to go and get properly fitted. I would be reasonably happy that the frame is right (its a small) but I guess I will see. It would be a shame to give up the bike completely but right now there is no pleasure in cycling for me. A fitting it is so.

In reply to goatee:

Let us know how you go.

In reply to goatee:

Very interesting medical prog on radio 4 yesterday afternoon about the dangers of ill fitting saddles e.g impotence, dysfunction. well worth a listen on iplayer.

In reply to DubyaJamesDubya:

Will do. Thanks.

In reply to goatee:

As others mentioned; a proper bike fit. And a proper saddle. I'm the 'Slam that stem' type of guy and like ISM adamo saddles.

In reply to bleddynmawr:

Please post a link or title of the programme so we can search for it. I clicked about the iPlayer and BBC Radio 4 site but failed to find the program to which you refer.

Thanks

In reply to bleddynmawr:



Cycling is getting awfully mainstream! R4!

In reply to goatee:

I do a lot of riding, a few years ago I got a second hand cannondale road bike. I didn't make 12 miles before my bum was killing me, I had odd pains in the various tendons in my legs all due to the saddle which was described as an implement of torture in the reviews.
I was surprised it could be soo painful and have such an effect in such a short time.

If not the saddle a bad fit can have similar effects. There are a few online fit systems that can guide you if you don't want to fork out for a shop fit.

Good luck and I feel your pain.

Toby

In reply to Toby_W:

Cheers Toby, if it was as simple as replacing the saddle I'd be over the moon. I too get those pains in the tendons. Heres hoping.

In reply to goatee:

If you are getting pain anyway, why not try fiddling a bit just to experiment? Lower the saddle a bit, raise it. Slide it forward a bit or back etc etc. All very quick and easy to do.

A mate who is a pro rider is sceptical about there being one fit for every rider all the time. He says all the riders he knows fiddle with their bikes through the season, even things like your muscles changing shape if you ride loads, new shoes or pedals etc. lead him to move his saddle little amounts.

In reply to goatee:


Is your saddle level, nose up or nose down?
It can be hard to tell with many of today's highly sculpted saddles.

If you lift your hands off the bars and feel as if you are going to fall forwards then the chances are you saddle is a little too nose down.

Two main consequences of this:

- To stop you falling forwards your arms and upper back take a lot of weight. This is tiring and can cause upper back and neck pain.

- You naturally pivot on your sitbones as the seat is not level - You therefore roll forwards off the sitbones and onto soft tissue. You risk damage to nerves and blood vessels.

You need to check that the saddle is the correct width for you and that you are actually supported on your sitbones.
- You can learn to set a bike up yourself, or pay for a fitting - but as mentioned above, that is just a starting point.

In reply to interdit:

Saddle fit is largely down to the distance between your sitbones. I had a rough ride with most saddles until I discovered I have very wide sitbones, bought the widest saddle I could find which has been a big improvement.

In reply to interdit:

I'd disagree (a little bit) on the saddle tilt having a huge effect on putting weight on your hands (unless it's very down or up), this is more fore aft position.

Google
Andy Pruit who does all the pro fits and developed the specialized BG system

Or even better

Steve Hogg (?) who is well respected regarding bike fit and also posts some blogs/articles on fit adjustment (saddle height how hard can it be, and cleat adjustment).

I wish I could get him to do a bike fit for me, experience, knowledge and thought rather than a set of formulas.

Also totally agree with the constant fiddling.

Cheers

Toby

In reply to goatee:

programme was inside health on at 3.30pm yesterday. I suspect the roadies won't like it as it was talking about double nosed saddles - basically a conventional saddle puts all the weight on the nerves to your nadgers and they don't like it

In reply to goatee:
Go and buy a Charge Spoon or a Charge Scoop saddle and you'll say goodbye to all those problems. You've got to get it set up at the right height, angle and distance from the bars though.

You are wearing padded shorts, aren't you? dhb from Wiggle are excellent value for money.

In reply to Rigid Raider:


Better still get one that fits YOU.

In reply to goatee:

have you tried stretching you glutes, loosing your hips & performing strengthing exercises on you lower core.

In reply to toad:

Mr TC changed to Adamo (the aforementioned double-nosed saddle) for his summer and winter road bikes a few years ago and will extol their virtues to anyone who'll listen.

In reply to Toby_W:


I've seen it and corrected it for several cyclists - generally where they have been having soreness and numbness and have dropped the saddle nose in a mistaken attempt to ease pressure in the affected area - It can make the problem very much worse.
Generally in these cases the seat set-back and most of the rest of the set up has been in the right ball park.

I'm maybe assuming incorrectly that the OP has the basics right and is now looking for fine tuning. If that's not the case then they need to get someone to take it back to basics and do a fit.


Pruit's medical guide for cyclists is a useful reference book, but one I would use in conjunction with other sources.


Not heard of him. Will have a look when I have spare time. Cheers.

In reply to interdit:

I definitely feel like I'm going to tip forward when I lift my hands from the bars. I actually never fiddle with the positioning but I will start. I'm afraid I never heard of sitbones before. I think I need to visit a specialist and take it from there. Yes I wear padded shorts but I will investigate getting a different saddle. Anything is better than letting an expensive bike sitting in the shed.

In reply to goatee:

I wouldn't change your saddle until you've had the bike fit

In reply to interdit:

Well worth the read.

http://www.stevehoggbikefitting.com/bikefit/2011/05/seat-set-back-for-road-...

Though that link is for a specific page rather than the general site it should have links to all the other bike fit articles.

I'd still be very surprised if a tilted seat (unless very tilted) with a correct bike fit would put excessive weight on your wrists. If they were un comfy before tilting the saddle the fit was wrong or the saddle.

Cheers

Toby

In reply to Toby_W:



Cheers. Looks like I've already got him bookmarked, though I don't remember visiting the site.



I think that's the thing. The saddle should be correctly set up both set-back and angle if the bike has been fitted properly.
Unfortunately if perineal pressure problems develop for any number of reasons, or if the bike has not been totally correctly set up to start with, it's not uncommon for people to mistakenly drop the nose of the saddle believing that this will ease the pressure.

Unfortunately the tendency to roll forwards actually causes more problems.

The answer to the first question in the comments section of the page you linked to has Mr Hogg saying, amongst other things -

"I’m not a fan of having the nose of a seat down more than about a degree in an effort to relieve perineal pressure because doing so increases the tendency of the rider to slide forward OR have to use more upper body effort than is ideal to prevent themselves sliding forward."

In reply to interdit: they all blur into one after a while, so, are you an obsessive rider after marginal gains and comfort or a bike fitter

Cheers

Toby

In reply to Toby_W:


An obsessive gatherer of data and information, originally, some years ago, to fix issues my wife had so that she could come for rides with me over 100km without being crippled.

Not a pro fitter, but my cycling hobby seems to be continuously moving towards my work.
If you're going to do ride guiding and support then best brush up on navigation skills, mechanical skills and inevitably out of 16 new (even experienced) riders there will be one or two that have problems over the week of riding the Alpes or Pyrenees that can be traced back to bad fit, so it's more than useful to have that knowledge too.

Still always tons to learn, and one of the reasons I occasionally pop into UKC, rather than many of the biking forums is that there are many experienced riders here like yourself that have a wealth of knowledge that is generally shared freely with anyone else of any level.

In reply to goatee:

If it's not hurting you're doing something wrong

E

In reply to Enty:


Thought you were just going to tell him to ride standing up

ps. nice Marmotte for your lot.

In reply to Enty:

I was clearly doing everything right then when I let my skinny arse get talked into doing bloody Paris roubaix a year or two ago. I think Chris Froome crashed on purpose to avoid those awful cobbles. AND, I don't blame him, respect to Nibbles an amazing ride.

Dying to pop out to you at some point for some big riding.

Sorry off topic, agree with above, so much bike fit is not obvious, you can get by for years with an imperfect fit then visit the alps or post winter and awwww.

Cheers

Toby

In reply to kevin stephens:

I would change the saddle first. The last two stock saddles (Bontrager, Sella) I got with bikes were the worst torture implements that I've encountered. I conclude that maufacturers put them on to get people to immediately spend more money.

In reply to Toby_W:




Proper UKC bike meet?

In reply to woolsack:

Be lovely, few days riding and then up Mt Ventoux (cold beer on top or old school brandy, beer or any other alcohol you can get to help on the way up). I met up with Kevin Stevens and Sam a few years ago for a ride near Bristol. I've met some great people from this site.

Cheers

Toby

(We wouldn't have to shave our legs or anything would we??)

In reply to goatee:

An update on progress, I tried raising up the front of the saddle as suggested by one reply and after just a couple of miles the pain was considerable and after four I was ready to throw the thing over the ditch. I dismounted and tilted the saddle downwards and the relief was immediate. I have adjusted it a tiny amount since and I am now going out and enjoying short rides (25-30K) three or four times a week with no pain. I intend to keep the distance short for a little while and then gradually extend it. I will be less reticent in fiddling/adjusting the bike in the future. When I have the time?funds I will get fitted. I want to just get used to the bike first and rediscover the pleasure in it.

In reply to goatee:

Good to hear you are making progress!

In reply to goatee: that's great news some saddles are designed to hav the nose dropped. , after interdit posted the sentence from one of the fit sites I revisited my seat height ditching various methods of setting it and just looking at my hips. I dropped the height and now have my saddle dead flat and further back. Hoping I'll get more power on the flat.


I got an app called bike fast fit that was quite useful but any vid will give you an idea of how you move. I was rocking my hips on the saddle though I thought I was static.

Anyway good luck getting it dialled in

Cheers

Toby

In reply to goatee:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/1408190303?pc_redir=1405167839&robot_redir=1

As a cheaper option to getting a full bike fit, at least to see if you can make progress, have a look at this book from one of the BC staff.

By explaining why certain set up elements have the effect they do, he makes it easier to not only position components well, but also understand why you are likely to suffer particular discomforts in certain positions.

In reply to goatee:

Excellent news.

In reply to goatee:

Been prompted to look at my very old race bikes with - I now realise - appalling Brooks Swallow cut away saddles of rock hard leather. Can't understand how I was not damaged for life. The saddles with a central channel would be my choice now.

In reply to altirando:


Ooft. I got an impacted vein in my groin from riding a poor fitting saddle for too long. Felt like getting stabbed through the jigglies with fire running through the veins in my thighs when it would get going. The doctor spent about 5 seconds looking at it and said "you're a road biker." which I was somewhat impressed with (though in hindsight the shorts tan is rather obvious with your trousers around your ankles).

Getting the right saddle for your body is so important. I thought the split ones were more for prostate issues than anything else?