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Hubble is the latest in the Mammut series, 'Reclimbing the classics', with the very talented Canadian Sean McColl climbing. He didn't actually manage to reclimb it but to be fair the conditions don't look great.
youtube.com/watch?v=5Nbzj3TxDKE&
Interesting that he uses a knee bar on the crux which he then makes look pretty easy. Did anyone else do it that way?
youtube.com/watch?v=5Nbzj3TxDKE&
Interesting that he uses a knee bar on the crux which he then makes look pretty easy. Did anyone else do it that way?
In reply to stp: None of the successful ascentionists (Moon, Smith, Gaskins, Dunning, McClure) have used the knee bar.
Andy F
Andy F
In reply to stp: Not the knee bar debate again, please.
I enjoyed how unimpressed BM appeared to be by this attempt in what were ideal conditions, apparently.
I enjoyed how unimpressed BM appeared to be by this attempt in what were ideal conditions, apparently.
In reply to andy farnell:
Have you personally confirmed this grading?
> it has been recently upgraded to 9a.
> Andy F
Have you personally confirmed this grading?
In reply to Lusk: no. But given the calibre of people who have failed on it (Ondra, Graham, Moffatt etc) I don't have to.
Andy F.
p.s. can you?
Andy F.
p.s. can you?
In reply to andy farnell:
>"But given the calibre of people who have failed on it (Ondra, Graham, Moffatt etc) I don't have to."
For me, the jury is still out until Cookson fails on it.
>"But given the calibre of people who have failed on it (Ondra, Graham, Moffatt etc) I don't have to."
For me, the jury is still out until Cookson fails on it.
In reply to andy farnell:
More likely he climbs it, confirms 9a, and you say its 8b
More likely he climbs it, confirms 9a, and you say its 8b
Post edited at 15:27
In reply to Offwidth:
Because he's not done any other sport climbs ever, therefore has no benchmark against which to grade it....
Andy F
> More likely he climbs it, confirms 9a, and you say its 8b
Because he's not done any other sport climbs ever, therefore has no benchmark against which to grade it....
Andy F
In reply to grumpybearpantsclimbinggoat:
It was originally graded 8c+ because it was felt to be notch harder than the 8c's at the time: Agincourt, Liquid Amber. As a boulder problem it was thought to be font 8b. When Ben tried Action Directe a short time later he thought it was similar in difficulty but a different style of route. Unfortunately he pulled a tendon when warming up on Action so never finished it off despite doing very well on it in a short space of time.
Since then, from what I've read, it seems like big grades have been given out all over the place especially in Spain. Comments like 'the old french 8b+s would be 8c+ in Spain' suggest there are different grading scales in different places. Britain, where these grades were first introduced, had a harder scale than elsewhere whereas the softer scale seemed to stick in Europe. Had Ben completed Action Directe things might have been different.
It was originally graded 8c+ because it was felt to be notch harder than the 8c's at the time: Agincourt, Liquid Amber. As a boulder problem it was thought to be font 8b. When Ben tried Action Directe a short time later he thought it was similar in difficulty but a different style of route. Unfortunately he pulled a tendon when warming up on Action so never finished it off despite doing very well on it in a short space of time.
Since then, from what I've read, it seems like big grades have been given out all over the place especially in Spain. Comments like 'the old french 8b+s would be 8c+ in Spain' suggest there are different grading scales in different places. Britain, where these grades were first introduced, had a harder scale than elsewhere whereas the softer scale seemed to stick in Europe. Had Ben completed Action Directe things might have been different.
In reply to stp: Didn't Wolfgang give AD a UIAA grade (11- iirc) rather than a French grade. It translated as 8c+/9a. Since then its become regarded as benchmark 9a. Hubble was also give E9 7b in the mags at the time, useless grade for a sport route, but an interesting historical side note.
Andy F
Andy F
In reply to andy farnell:
In the Frankenjura guide it's given 11 (and three overflowing tankards of beer, their excellent alternative to stars).
In the Frankenjura guide it's given 11 (and three overflowing tankards of beer, their excellent alternative to stars).
In reply to thepeaks:
Sean is Canadian...
> BM giving a masterclass in how to deal with overexciteable Merkans!
Sean is Canadian...
In reply to thepeaks:
Except Sean McColl is Canadian. And he didn't come over as overexcitable, at least not to me.
> BM giving a masterclass in how to deal with overexciteable Merkans!
Except Sean McColl is Canadian. And he didn't come over as overexcitable, at least not to me.
In reply to thepeaks:
He's got his phone in his hand at one point "right… yeah" and he's got the carpet fitter in the background.
Jerry Moffat was pretty keyed up in "the face" one but I get the impression he's like that anyway.
He's got his phone in his hand at one point "right… yeah" and he's got the carpet fitter in the background.
Jerry Moffat was pretty keyed up in "the face" one but I get the impression he's like that anyway.
Post edited at 13:41
In reply to Mr Lopez:
If you're talki' about geographical location... but then you'd need to use the term North American...
'Mericans is generally reserved when talkin' about those living in the United States of America...
If you're talki' about geographical location... but then you'd need to use the term North American...
'Mericans is generally reserved when talkin' about those living in the United States of America...
In reply to HeMa:
Nah, the continent is called "America", so the term 'American' applies to anything from Canadians to Chileans.
That depends if you want to play to their egos in believing that America is the US. However you'll be losing on the amusement of watching their faces drop when after they tell you they are 'mericans you start going on about how you were once on holiday in America and you loved Rio de Janeiro, and ask them if they live close to there
> (In reply to Mr Lopez)
>
> If you're talki' about geographical location... but then you'd need to use the term North American...
>
> If you're talki' about geographical location... but then you'd need to use the term North American...
Nah, the continent is called "America", so the term 'American' applies to anything from Canadians to Chileans.
> 'Mericans is generally reserved when talkin' about those living in the United States of America...
That depends if you want to play to their egos in believing that America is the US. However you'll be losing on the amusement of watching their faces drop when after they tell you they are 'mericans you start going on about how you were once on holiday in America and you loved Rio de Janeiro, and ask them if they live close to there
In reply to Mr Lopez:
Think again...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plate_tectonics#mediaviewer/File:Plates_tect2_...
> Nah, the continent is called "America", so the term 'American' applies to anything from Canadians to Chileans.
Think again...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plate_tectonics#mediaviewer/File:Plates_tect2_...
In reply to HeMa:
Not need to think. Regardless of the US loving the idea of having their own continent, classically America has been referred to as a single one and it's still taught as such. Nought to do with geological reasons as the classification has not actual scientific use, but as a cultural way of splitting and bunging stuff together.
Lack of commitment from their part as they still haven't re-branded themselves as the United States of North America
Not need to think. Regardless of the US loving the idea of having their own continent, classically America has been referred to as a single one and it's still taught as such. Nought to do with geological reasons as the classification has not actual scientific use, but as a cultural way of splitting and bunging stuff together.
Lack of commitment from their part as they still haven't re-branded themselves as the United States of North America
In reply to Mr Lopez:
Common USAge is for America to be used as shorthand for the USA. It can refer to the whole land mass of N and S America but this is more commonly called 'The Americas'.
Refer to anyone from the continent that isn't from the USA as American and you will piss them off no end.
Common USAge is for America to be used as shorthand for the USA. It can refer to the whole land mass of N and S America but this is more commonly called 'The Americas'.
Refer to anyone from the continent that isn't from the USA as American and you will piss them off no end.
In reply to Mr Lopez:
If someone is from Canada, you say they're Canadian. You don't say they're American.
If someone is from Canada, you say they're Canadian. You don't say they're American.
In reply to Mr Lopez:
Oh does it now.
> Nah, the continent is called "America", so the term 'American' applies to anything from Canadians to Chileans.
Oh does it now.
In reply to Mr Lopez:
'America' is short for 'United States of America'.
There are 2 continents, 'North America' and 'South America'. The USA is part of 'North America'.
Come on, this is primary school stuff!
'America' is short for 'United States of America'.
There are 2 continents, 'North America' and 'South America'. The USA is part of 'North America'.
Come on, this is primary school stuff!
In reply to Michael Gordon:
And none of it now relevant.
So I take it Sean could do the moves but just not link it?
And none of it now relevant.
So I take it Sean could do the moves but just not link it?
In reply to Michael Gordon:
Typical anglo-centric look of the World I think you'll find that depending where you are in the World you'll be taught that there are anything between 4 and 7 continents, with some of them not considering Europe to be one of them. Did you not notice there are 5 rings in the Olympic logo to represent all inhabited continents?
English speaking countries, or are a grand total of 4, split both sub-continents in America, whereas Spanish speaking countries and most of Europe takes it as one single continent. Seeing as you guys are still using stuff like stones, feet, and cups as measurement units then its no wonder you get a bit lost with stuff as big as a continent...
> (In reply to Mr Lopez)
>
> There are 2 continents, 'North America' and 'South America'. The USA is part of 'North America'.
>
> Come on, this is primary school stuff!
>
> There are 2 continents, 'North America' and 'South America'. The USA is part of 'North America'.
>
> Come on, this is primary school stuff!
Typical anglo-centric look of the World I think you'll find that depending where you are in the World you'll be taught that there are anything between 4 and 7 continents, with some of them not considering Europe to be one of them. Did you not notice there are 5 rings in the Olympic logo to represent all inhabited continents?
English speaking countries, or are a grand total of 4, split both sub-continents in America, whereas Spanish speaking countries and most of Europe takes it as one single continent. Seeing as you guys are still using stuff like stones, feet, and cups as measurement units then its no wonder you get a bit lost with stuff as big as a continent...
In reply to DaveHK:
Cool video that, pretty much sums it up. Other than the final statement that is...
Cool video that, pretty much sums it up. Other than the final statement that is...
In reply to tony:
Right, and someone from Norway is Norwegian but not European, right?
> (In reply to Mr Lopez)
>
> If someone is from Canada, you say they're Canadian. You don't say they're American.
>
> If someone is from Canada, you say they're Canadian. You don't say they're American.
Right, and someone from Norway is Norwegian but not European, right?
In reply to Stevie989:
Oh come on. It's turning into a more interesting and educational thread than just another "Hotshot climber fails to climb Hubble in 3 days".
> (In reply to Michael Gordon)
>
> And none of it now relevant.
>
> And none of it now relevant.
Oh come on. It's turning into a more interesting and educational thread than just another "Hotshot climber fails to climb Hubble in 3 days".
In reply to stp:
If a thread on Hubble gets diverted into geo-ethnological pedantry like this after so few posts then it's questionable whether Hubble can still be considered a classic.
If a thread on Hubble gets diverted into geo-ethnological pedantry like this after so few posts then it's questionable whether Hubble can still be considered a classic.
In reply to Mr Lopez:
If you know they're from Norway you say they're Norwegian. You certainly wouldn't describe them as European in preference to describing them as Norwegian.
> Right, and someone from Norway is Norwegian but not European, right?
If you know they're from Norway you say they're Norwegian. You certainly wouldn't describe them as European in preference to describing them as Norwegian.
In reply to Removed User:
You're quite right, it's a distraction.
Plus I've just realised the comment was probably just a bit of harmless trolling. With that user name and no response from them thus far....? Hook line and sinker, and I fell for it - oh the shame.
> If a thread on Hubble gets diverted into geo-ethnological pedantry like this after so few posts then it's questionable whether Hubble can still be considered a classic.
You're quite right, it's a distraction.
Plus I've just realised the comment was probably just a bit of harmless trolling. With that user name and no response from them thus far....? Hook line and sinker, and I fell for it - oh the shame.
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