UKC

Anchor Set-up Approval Needed.

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 WayneB 24 Aug 2014
Hello,

This will be my first post. I have been climbing at my local climbing wall for the past 6 months or so, on top rope and bouldering.

I'm really enjoying it, so now I'm going out to climb at Bowles Rock in Sussex to get some real climbing. I'll be getting an hour and a half with an instructor and think I'll probably be good to set out on my own (with other climbers) after that so I want to have the equipment to do so. On the Bowles website they said all you need is - "...just a rope, two harnesses, some karabiners, a couple of slings and a belay device." I think I may have this stuff, although after reading through pages and pages about setting up anchors I've become unsure about if my set-up is going to be correct or not.

I took a photo but I can't see that I can upload one here so I'll try to explain what I have - I'm envisioning 2 anchors bolts where I'd be clipping an oval screw gate karabina on each, they would each have a sling and the 2 slings meet at a quick link that the climbing rope goes through.

Does that makes sense? Would that be safe?

Thank you for any advices anyone can offer.
 Otis 24 Aug 2014
In reply to WayneB:

What you've described above isn't a million miles away (although I'm not sure what you mean by a quick link.... a carabiner will do the job where the slings meet.

However, there are a few subtleties in setting up an anchor, which I'm sure you'll be able to discuss with your instructor and build knowledge on. For the style of anchor you are suggesting (or any anchor for that matter), some of the things to think about are:

- Use screwgates throughout your anchor system.
- Consider the direction the anchor will be loaded in and arrange it accordingly.
- Make sure load from the climber is distributed evenly between the anchors (called 'equalising' - the set up described above might not allow for this, unless you are lucky with the bolts and sling lengths).
- C0nsider what will happen if one anchor fails. Will your set up remain safe? (it should do,if done properly).
- The slings in your example above will form a 'v' shape. You need to keep the angle of the 'v' as small as possible (less than about 60 degrees). As it starts to widen, loads on the anchors will increase significantly.
- Watch out for karabiners/slings/ropes being loaded over an edge. Generally a bad thing and may be difficult to avoid (this is why ropes are useful for building anchors!).

There's loads to be learned out there, so your session with an instructor sounds like a sensible plan and I'm sure they will run through some of the above points if you ask nicely.

Have fun!

Mike.
 climbwhenready 24 Aug 2014
In reply to WayneB:

What you describe sounds good. As long as you keep the angle between anchors down to less than 60 degrees, you're redundant and equalised.

Bowles is a really easy place to set up anchors. You'll find the anchors at the top of climbs are bombproof (going off memory, things like a ring suspended from 5 trees, or in quite a lot of cases a bolt that is itself backed up to another, higher bolt). In this case I would say it's OK to just extend the one anchor over the rock edge - but use your common sense.

Extending the anchor point over the rock edge is important in southern sandstone, as it minimises erosion (and wear on your rope!).

Have fun, and don't stress too much in advance about the anchor setup - especially since you've got an instructor to literally show you the ropes, you'll find it easy when you get there!
 Hyphin 24 Aug 2014
In reply to WayneB:

http://www.ukclimbing.com/videos/?category=10

lots of stuff here and on youtube think this guy is good

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCRFiSUqpmhB8E1Dgm3UPy-w

don't take anything as definitive but as you get to grips with the basics you can separate out the chancers

have fun be safe
Removed User 24 Aug 2014
In reply to WayneB:

Don't upload pics to this site, the way it handles photos is totally fubar. Chuck the pic on imgur or tinypic and then post the link here.
 Hyphin 24 Aug 2014
In reply to climbwhenready:

> What you describe sounds good. As long as you keep the angle between anchors down to less than 60 degrees, you're redundant and equalised.

may be being too pedantic, but the missing 'and' changes the sense a wee bit

could be interpreted that small angle automatically gives redundancy and equalisation, especially by someone not familiar with the concepts

less than 60 degrees,AND you're redundant and equalised
 climbwhenready 25 Aug 2014
In reply to Hyphin:

> may be being too pedantic, but the missing 'and' changes the sense a wee bit

> could be interpreted that small angle automatically gives redundancy and equalisation, especially by someone not familiar with the concepts

You're right.
 deacondeacon 25 Aug 2014
In reply to WayneB:

Bowles is a great place to learn how to build a basic anchor. It's very straightforward and after 5 minutes with the instructor it'll be second nature.
Obviously don't get too complacent
Many of the crags in the area have bolts already at the top of the climbs but from memory the smaller venues (and High Rocks) don't.
Also when you start travelling further afield to climb you'll rarely see these bolts.

Next time you go climbing without the instructor practice rigging at home so that you're nice and confident when you get to the crag. Nerves and doubts can do funny things.
Have a great time.
 jsmcfarland 25 Aug 2014
In reply to WayneB:

buy 10m of static rope from Rockrun, Bananfingers or other shops like V12 online etc.

This will let you set up anchors that will be easy to setup so your anchor point is hanging over the edge of the climb and the rope you are climbing on won't rub on any edges etc.
OP WayneB 25 Aug 2014
Thanks for all the tips. I'll buy that static rope for setting up the anchors.

Went climbing today. It was fun. The only dissapointing thing is a grade 4a seemed to be way beyong my capabilities, at the indoor wall a 4a is basically a ladder! What's up with that? I understand it's not an exact science but surely I'm missing something?
 GridNorth 25 Aug 2014
In reply to WayneB:

Yes you are missing the fact that the holds don't stand out from the surface and are not colour coded. I also suspect that the 4a is a UK trad grade and not a sports grade.
 climbwhenready 25 Aug 2014
In reply to WayneB:

Southern sandstone is graded using UK tech grades, indoor walls are graded using french grades. They don't match. Coupled with that, comparing inside with outside doesn't really work - Rockfax's table puts a VDiff at about french 2+, which - um - it's not.

FWIW, UK 4a is about Severe.
 climbwhenready 25 Aug 2014
In reply to WayneB:
FWIW, as someone who's also relatively new to climbing outside (this year only) - I can climb UK 4a/4b outside, and french 6a/6a+ inside.

There's also the additional factor that southern sandstone is ruddy hard compared with other rock types!
Post edited at 17:23
 Firestarter 25 Aug 2014
In reply to WayneB:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Rock-Climbing-Essential-Skills-Techniques/dp/095415...

This is a really good book if you're interested mate. Covers shedloads of stuff.
 CurlyStevo 25 Aug 2014
In reply to climbwhenready:

We'll protected VDiff is somewhere around F3. The problem is walls making F4+ like ladders when actually they should be around the HS / VS border. Outside you'll find sport grading is much more consistent in the lower grades!
 CurlyStevo 25 Aug 2014
In reply to climbwhenready:
Southern sandstone grades in the lower end of the spectrum are off. As far as I can tell they use a different scale to elsewhere. I've done moves in the ones and twos you'd expect to get on VDiffs or even severes! That and bellow 4c they only use a's and b's ie 1a 1b 2a 2b 3a 3b 4a 4b 4c etc !!!

Once you get to around 5a on southern sandstone the grades all start to make a lot more sense plus the climbs tend to be much more pleasant and less eroded / sandy!
Post edited at 17:48

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