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Do we encourage a culture of victim hood?

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 Duncan Bourne 27 Sep 2014
Following on from the Emma Watson thread the concept of victim hood was mentioned and this is something that interests me.
In the past I would say that I have been guilty of putting myself in the role of a victim (in general terms) and now I don't, losing that view of myself was certainly life changing and now I am surprised that I ever thought that way at all.
But nevertheless there are undoubted victims in life and maybe sometimes their plight gets overshadowed because others (possibly with less obvious cause) cry victim louder.
As an example I know one person, doesn't read or write, poor up bringing, who has recently suffered a significant loss in wages due to his inability and yet he is one of the most positive people I know, works all the time making stuff, selling stuff, doing numerous odd jobs for folk . Another person I know earns significantly more for doing far less and constantly moans about how hard done by he is. His conversation revolves around what he should have had, what other people have done/might do to him, negativity fills his life and stops him enjoying what he has. While the first chap just gets on with life his conversation revolves around how lucky he is, who might be willing to buy/sell stuff from/to him, his catch phrase is it's just life no point in worrying. So who is the victim? The one with less money, and other disadvantages (his wife being disabled too) or the one with a materially better life style who nevertheless sees himself as a victim? Is being a victim a matter of circumstance or mental outlook? Granted someone who is shot by an attacker is a victim but what of the grey areas of life where the position of victim or not is dependant upon how we approach or view it? Could it not be said that we sometimes make ourselves into victims when there is no need?
 Ciro 27 Sep 2014
In reply to Duncan Bourne:

Everyone has privileges and everyone has disadvantages - it's a sense of inequality between these sets that creates an overall feeling of being victimised or not, and of course you can change your perspective.

If the people on this forum compared their lives with someone in Gaza who's had bombs and bulldozers disrupting daily life for years, watched three generations of their family wiped out by one, and now walks on crutches as they can't afford a prosthetic limb - I'd imagine most of us would feel pretty privileged in comparison.

Now on an individual level it is healthy to have a certain amount of willingness to make the best of the cards you've dealt and be happy, but being happy doesn't change the circumstances for the rest of the world, and none of this means that anyone more privileged than our Gazan has no right to complain about the disadvantages the society that they live in creates for them.

I believe in trying to create an equal society, and for that to happen I think that when someone talks about their disadvantages on a topic where we have privilege, we must shut up and listen, not try to enforce our view from our perspective of privilege. That doesn't mean we can't question their views, but they are the experts on what the disadvantages might be, so their position should be the starting point for discussion, not ours.

As an able-bodied white western heterosexual male, a lot of the cards were stacked in my favour, so when it comes to racial, sexual or sexual equality, I need to be ready to listen.

If a woman says to me "it sucks to get shouts and wolf-whistles from men all the time" I have to believe her. At first glance, the odd shout of "Oy, SEXY!" from a woman would flatter me, but I can't put myself in the position of having that as a daily part of life, sometimes threatening and intimidating, from the days of being a shy, self-conscious teenager onwards, so my instinctive feeling of "is it really that bad a thing?" is not to be trusted.

Having privileges should not prevent people from trying to right their disadvantages.
OP Duncan Bourne 27 Sep 2014
In reply to Ciro:

I agree that all things are relative. So if someone charges me a pound more for a pint of beer (not that they would) because they don't like the colour of my skin that may still be regarded as a problem even though in another country I might get shot for walking into a bar because of the colour of my skin.
I also appreciate that people will genuinely have problems in situations where I wouldn't and that does not necessarily mean that their problems are any less because of that.
For instance there are people I work with whom I insult on a daily basis and they insult me back, it's banter and both sides see no harm in it, there are other people whom I work with who I would never dream of treating in the same way because I perceive that they would find it distressing.
In some instances it is about stopping a problem ie bullying but also I think it is about educating people not to see themselves as powerless and to take control of their lives
 Indy 27 Sep 2014
In reply to Ciro:

Its hard not to see this as a 1st world 'problem' is being wolf whistled at really that bad? Or are people being conditioned to take offence?

Anyone seen the newish diet coke advert with the male gardener? If it had been a female coke would now be filing for bankruptcy.
 Timmd 27 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:
> Its hard not to see this as a 1st world 'problem' is being wolf whistled at really that bad? Or are people being conditioned to take offence?

I can remember an attractive girl in my class in secondary school talking about not liking 'being treated like a piece of meat' at times when she was out and about, to do with comments directed at her. First world or not, if women can find it unpleasant, and it makes them feel worse, it shouldn't happen.

> Anyone seen the newish diet coke advert with the male gardener? If it had been a female coke would now be filing for bankruptcy.

Write to them and point it out if it annoys you?
Post edited at 18:16
 nufkin 27 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:

> is being wolf whistled at really that bad?

Maybe once or twice isn't, but if it happens all the time it could be, especially if the whistlee isn't doing anything to provoke it, other than being present. The problem isn't so much the whistle itself, rather it's the thinking (or lack of) behind the whistle

> Anyone seen the newish diet coke advert with the male gardener? If it had been a female coke would now be filing for bankruptcy.

Wasn't the point that the usual dynamic was being inverted? And the reaction of the women was pretty subdued, if I remember rightly - girly giggling amongst each other, rather than bawdy and aggressive hectoring of the poor hot lawn mower.
Unimaginative rather than offensive, I'd say
 Indy 27 Sep 2014
In reply to Timmd:

> First world or not, if women can find it unpleasant, and it makes them feel worse, it shouldn't happen.

> Write to them and point it out if it annoys you?

Maybe your right maybe your not not but how do you suggest we 'correct' peoples behaviour?

What do you say to the kid teased because s/he gets free school meals or the one that has national health glasses or shoes from Lidl? Yes in an ideal world everyone would be politically correct and nice to everyone elsebut that's not going to happen so we need to man up/grow thicker skin and get things in perspective.

I don't care about the diet coke ad but if it had been a woman there would have been outrage which neatly shows the hypocrisy.
 Timmd 27 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:
> Maybe your right maybe your not not but how do you suggest we 'correct' peoples behaviour?

> What do you say to the kid teased because s/he gets free school meals or the one that has national health glasses or shoes from Lidl? Yes in an ideal world everyone would be politically correct and nice to everyone elsebut that's not going to happen so we need to man up/grow thicker skin and get things in perspective.

Like which has (generally) happened with racist attitudes you mean?

While the two issues are different, it shows societies can change, in different ways.

> I don't care about the diet coke ad but if it had been a woman there would have been outrage which neatly shows the hypocrisy.

So, because there's something which isn't good in one instance, something else which isn't good should be accepted as well?
Post edited at 20:00
 Indy 27 Sep 2014
In reply to Timmd:

> Like which has (generally) happened with racist attitudes you mean?

Now there's an interesting question! Are we less racist or has pressure from society just forced it underground?

Recently the UKIP leader said something along the lines of "I wouldn't want some Romanian Gypsies living next door" or something very similar. He got pillored as a racist yet from most of the people I spoke to (behind closed doors!) they too wouldn't want them as neighbors either.

Also look at the number of adverts telling us avout their "UK call centre's" ie NOT in India.
 Jim Fraser 28 Sep 2014
In reply to Duncan Bourne:

You have suggested that the disadvantaged person with the ever positive attitude is the more admirable one.

I meet plenty of people in similar positions and their ignorance is the most annoying thing in the world. They accept lack of opportunity and being treated like rubbish as though they are worthless and as though human progress is some intellectual fantasy in which they can never participate.

Recognising and pointing out the flaws and fighting to make the world a better place for everyone is the most admirable position.
 Timmd 28 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:
> Now there's an interesting question! Are we less racist or has pressure from society just forced it underground?

> Recently the UKIP leader said something along the lines of "I wouldn't want some Romanian Gypsies living next door" or something very similar. He got pillored as a racist yet from most of the people I spoke to (behind closed doors!) they too wouldn't want them as neighbors either.

> Also look at the number of adverts telling us avout their "UK call centre's" ie NOT in India.

''What do you say to the kid teased because s/he gets free school meals or the one that has national health glasses or shoes from Lidl? Yes in an ideal world everyone would be politically correct and nice to everyone elsebut that's not going to happen so we need to man up/grow thicker skin and get things in perspective.''

If it is forced under ground (I think it's a mixture), unwelcome comments being made to women walking down the street could be too then, and become less common.

I'm glad we've cleared that up...
Post edited at 00:38
Wiley Coyote2 28 Sep 2014
In reply to Duncan Bourne:

A lot of people actually seem to enjoy wallowing in victimhood and, worse still, try to force it onto others. I had a heart attack a few years ago and people occsionally say to me 'You're a heart attack victim, aren't you?' No I'm bloody not. If I must be anything I'm a heart attack survivor but actually I hardly ever think about it and I certainly don't define myself by it. It happened. I got over. Move on. But if you can be a 'victim' of something, no matter how trivial, it's your excuse for all your failings.
 Ciro 28 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:

> Its hard not to see this as a 1st world 'problem' is being wolf whistled at really that bad? Or are people being conditioned to take offence?

It's hard for us to understand the potential for trauma from a simple whistle from the outside but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist. There are many women who don't mind at all, and find it flattering - at the other end of the spectrum there are women who have experienced serious sexual traumas in their lives and find it absolutely terrifying. For most it's somewhere in-between - incidents which in isolation they probably wouldn't notice but day after day become quite degrading.

> Anyone seen the newish diet coke advert with the male gardener? If it had been a female coke would now be filing for bankruptcy.

I haven't seen this one although I do remember thinking in the past thinking that role reversal on the diet coke adds would result in outrage - but I think this highlights why as men it's difficult to understand the problem... we don't feel degraded by such an advert because it's not part of a message of objectification that society pushes at us day in, day out. The diet coke adds stand out because they are unusual - material and behaviour that is sexist towards women doesn't stand out.

It's much the same as the fact that I wouldn't be offended in the slightest by somebody calling me a honkey. My skin colour never adversely affected my life so it really doesn't matter. Call me a "wee fenian b@stard" on the other hand, and although I'll probably laugh it off, I will be offended because my parents religion did adversely affect me growing up in a slightly sectarian area of Scotland.

> Now there's an interesting question! Are we less racist or has pressure from society just forced it underground?

> Recently the UKIP leader said something along the lines of "I wouldn't want some Romanian Gypsies living next door" or something very similar. He got pillored as a racist yet from most of the people I spoke to (behind closed doors!) they too wouldn't want them as neighbors either.

We still have a way to go, but I think as a nation we are a lot less racist than we were when I was growing up.

> Also look at the number of adverts telling us avout their "UK call centre's" ie NOT in India.

I would hope that's more to do with the fact that it's usually easier to be understood when calling a UK call centre than it is calling a foreign one... as a Scotsman with a fairly anglicised accent after a decade in London, I still find Indian call centres can be hard work.
OP Duncan Bourne 28 Sep 2014
In reply to Jim Fraser:

I agree that make the world a better place for everyone is a worthy goal.

However you don't really know the person I mentioned. He is ever on the look out for opportunity and certainly does not regard himself as rubbish, he just doesn't beat himself up over what he can't do and accepts that things happen and then moves on.
OP Duncan Bourne 28 Sep 2014
In reply to Wiley Coyote:

I have come across that but feel that it is a mental problem all of its own. It is not that bad things don't happen but that people exaggerate the problem or even create problems where none exist, fearing future events that may never happen. It is a very natural and human thing to predict how the future might go and a very useful tool in anticipating events, however in some cases that can become stifling if one only focuses on the negative outcomes.
My own view is if I look at a future event that may be a problem I think to myself "Does this have to be dealt with now? what is the best way to deal with it? can it be avoided? Then once I feel I have done all I can I stop worrying about it because it will either get sorted or it won't" I go with the mantra "Melodrama never helps a situation". Granted it is not an easy thing to always do but it gets easier with practice
 Indy 28 Sep 2014
In reply to Ciro:

> It's hard for us to understand the potential for trauma from a simple whistle from the outside but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

You talk of trauma for a wolf whistle! Are you serious? All due respect the children in Syria and Iraq having to experience the daily obsenity of the war now that's trauma! People these days want to be offended.

"I would hope that's more to do with the fact that it's usually easier to be understood when calling a UK call centre than it is calling a foreign one"
That's a bit racist isn't it? Bit like I don't go down to the Indian shop on the corner because Mr Patel doesn't understand my English and his Indian accent is so thick I can hardly understand him but it doesn't matter as I go across the street to Mr Smith and his nice strong British accent and his proveable English heritage back to 1066.
llechwedd 28 Sep 2014
In reply to Duncan Bourne:

I think there are different aspects to this-
The personal 'mental/emotional resilience' thing is just part of being human. We're all different.

But when public services are involved in making a change to benefit the individual, expectations rise. Someone else is interceding on your behalf After all, you pay your taxes etc,, and sometimes self help isn't appropriate- You can't treat yourself with radiotherapy, or apprehend and jail a murderer.
Resources are finite though, and manpower relatively expensive compared to stuff. So when repeat interventions are required for, e.g. chronic back pain or longstanding harassment by neighbours, they may not be sufficiently resourced. Unless the 'victim' has emotional resilience and self reliance (as distinct from 'bottling it up'), in the short term at least, the sense of victimhood may have to be communicated more forcefully to the 'helping' agency. The saying 'it's the squeaky wheel that gets the oil' seems apt. Bump it up the scale by labelling it, e.g. religiously motivated harassment and something gets done.
Similarly, in the field of health, the incidence of 'whiplash' in the former USSR countries mirrors the development of litigation in that arena. What was once a self limiting condition becomes a case of 'every time I move my head, that I've held stiffly for weeks, it hurts so it must be something serious'.

I speak from ongoing personal experience regarding harassment by the family next door. I've gone a long way on the road from victimhood to accepting that I'm not responsible for the actions of others. Insight is one thing, but practicing it requires discipline and diligence on an ongoing basis.
llechwedd 28 Sep 2014
In reply to Duncan Bourne:


> My own view is if I look at a future event that may be a problem I think to myself "Does this have to be dealt with now? what is the best way to deal with it? can it be avoided? Then once I feel I have done all I can I stop worrying about it because it will either get sorted or it won't" I go with the mantra "Melodrama never helps a situation". Granted it is not an easy thing to always do but it gets easier with practice

+1
Good one Duncan.

OP Duncan Bourne 28 Sep 2014
In reply to llechwedd:

>


> Insight is one thing, but practicing it requires discipline and diligence on an ongoing basis.

Very true. Circumstances can make this easier or harder but it is still worth pursuing
 Ciro 28 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:

> You talk of trauma for a wolf whistle! Are you serious? All due respect the children in Syria and Iraq having to experience the daily obsenity of the war now that's trauma! People these days want to be offended.

Yes, I'm serious. Once the part of our brain which is supposed to watch out for danger and warn the conscious mind something is wrong has been wired to see mildly lecherous behaviour as a pre-cursor to something altogether more sinister, it's very difficult to unwire it.

> "I would hope that's more to do with the fact that it's usually easier to be understood when calling a UK call centre than it is calling a foreign one"

> That's a bit racist isn't it? Bit like I don't go down to the Indian shop on the corner because Mr Patel doesn't understand my English and his Indian accent is so thick I can hardly understand him but it doesn't matter as I go across the street to Mr Smith and his nice strong British accent and his proveable English heritage back to 1066.

Absolutely not - it has nothing to do with ethnicity. An asian person living in the UK and working in a call centre (or a shop) will probably understand me and I'll probably understand them - whether they are first generation immigrants with indian accent or third generation immigrants with scouse one - because they have had a higher level of exposure to spoken english than a lot of the staff in off-shore call centers.
OP Duncan Bourne 28 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:

> You talk of trauma for a wolf whistle! Are you serious? All due respect the children in Syria and Iraq having to experience the daily obsenity of the war now that's trauma! People these days want to be offended.

This is where it can be hard to judge without knowing all the facts. If it is a persistent thing then someone might have a reaction that seems out of proportion but might be very hard for them. Supposing you were a cricketer and fumbled a crucial catch in a significant game then every time you walked down the street someone called out hey "XXX catch the ball!" If this happened everytime it would get pretty bloody irritating and possibly traumatic but to anyone else who didn't know the story it would just appear as a weird joke.
Also knowing that worse things are happening elsewhere rarely makes people feel better about their own problems.
Having said that I have come across people who are prone to take offence at the slightest thing, where if you fail to notice them as you walk into a crowded room then you obviously hate them. In such cases the problem is an internal one, no less serious for that but no amount of external help will help unless the internal problem can be addressed
In reply to Indy:
> (In reply to Ciro)
>
> [...]
>
> You talk of trauma for a wolf whistle! Are you serious?

Of course it's serious. It should be banned. I got caught the other day checking out the pair of pert buttocks in tight jeans on a girl walking past me. That should be banned too, in case in traumatised her. In fact men looking at women in any way that any woman, any one at all, does not like, should be banned for all. Hang on, men looking at women should be banned. In fact men should not be allowed into the same environment as women.


We should institute the Burka for all women.
 Ridge 29 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:

> "I would hope that's more to do with the fact that it's usually easier to be understood when calling a UK call centre than it is calling a foreign one"

> That's a bit racist isn't it? Bit like I don't go down to the Indian shop on the corner because Mr Patel doesn't understand my English and his Indian accent is so thick I can hardly understand him but it doesn't matter as I go across the street to Mr Smith and his nice strong British accent and his proveable English heritage back to 1066.

No, it's a statement of fact. You seem to be creating the racism angle all by yourself.
OP Duncan Bourne 29 Sep 2014
In reply to Duncan Bourne:

We are more aware now of the problems that people encounter but I still think that we could go a long way to empowering people to cope with their own problems. I would hope that in the years to come we have a breakthrough in psychology that is comparable to the advances in other areas of medicine. If we reached the stage where depression was seen as a disease of the past, as we regard TB and polio (yes I know they still exist but they do not dominate Western society as they once did) would we be the better for it?
 Jim Fraser 29 Sep 2014
In reply to Duncan Bourne:

Does he vote?
 Indy 29 Sep 2014
In reply to Ridge:
> No, it's a statement of fact.

Shocking, never thought I'd read such a thing on UKC! Poor Mr Patel he's only trying to make his living and here are people discriminating against him soley because his first language isn't English. What next I wouldn't use his corner shop because it smells of curry?
Post edited at 21:03
 Indy 29 Sep 2014
In reply to stroppygob:

Had a horrible crappy day at work but that made me laugh out loud.... Cheers!
 Timmd 29 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:
> You talk of trauma for a wolf whistle! Are you serious? All due respect the children in Syria and Iraq having to experience the daily obsenity of the war now that's trauma! People these days want to be offended.

In what world does one thing being worse mean a bad thing should be tolerated?

Does that mean if I don't stamp on another person's toe I can flick your ear? Thought not.


Post edited at 21:14
 Indy 29 Sep 2014
In reply to Timmd:

If a woman says her feelings were hurt when she got wolf whistled then fair enough but using the word traumatized does nothing but devalue the word and belittles the people in the world who have genuinely been through traumatizing experiences ie war and torture etc

Explain your reasoning why its NOT racist
 Timmd 29 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:
I deleted that bit because I couldn't be fussed, to be honest.

It's not racist in the way that people from the same race who have strongly different accents can struggle to understand one another.

Like a broad Cornish accent being difficult for somebody from the North East to understand, as a Geordie I knew found while in Cornwall on a job down there.

Race doesn't need to factor in people with different accents struggling in communication. If two people with different mother tongues are of different races, it doesn't make it racist if one of them finds it more straight forward to talk to somebody who shares the same mother tongue.
Post edited at 21:23
 Jon Stewart 29 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:

> Now there's an interesting question! Are we less racist or has pressure from society just forced it underground?

Racism is now generally socially unacceptable, and against the law. This has a big effect on society, on what life is like for minorities: yes, there might still be racism out there, but it's the genuine racism of a small minority which is hard to address - people aren't just slightly racist (laugh at racist jokes, use racist language, make offensive assumptions, etc) by default because it's normal.

> Recently the UKIP leader said something along the lines of "I wouldn't want some Romanian Gypsies living next door" or something very similar. He got pillored as a racist yet from most of the people I spoke to (behind closed doors!) they too wouldn't want them as neighbors either.

Difficult subject. There are a lot of things that are said about groups of people (e.g. by class, race, gender, etc) that are generalisations with a grain of (statistical) truth behind them. Makes for touchy subjects. Wiser for politicians not to make these kind of generalisations...

> Also look at the number of adverts telling us avout their "UK call centre's" ie NOT in India.

There are loads of reasons why people are fed up with outsourced overseas call centres, and I would guess only a very tiny minority are racially motivated. Customer service is best done with exactly the appropriate tone of professionalism/friendliness/relaxedness - these is really hard to do in your second language, serving people from another culture. It just doesn't feel like good customer service, and it rubs people up the wrong way that the jobs are outsourced to another country.

If "racism" has been reduced to not liking outsourced call centres, then we're doing pretty well!
OP Duncan Bourne 29 Sep 2014
In reply to Jim Fraser:

Well he is eligible that's as much as I know
Pan Ron 29 Sep 2014
In reply to Duncan Bourne:
I can't speak for society as a whole, but I can certainly speak for the place I have spent 9-10 hours a day at, 5 days a week for the last 12 years - it absolutely encourages victimhood to the most obscene levels.

It is, outwardly at least, an uber-lefty, liberal academic institution and it prides itself on always having some form of protest going on. But where everyone is so wound up in how they are being (or fighting for the) maligned, victimised, and oppressed they have ended up becoming the victimizers and oppressors themselves. For an institution that prides itself on freedom of expression and speech it is utterly stifling, and working there you have to be constantly on your guard against offending someone's sensibilities, tiptoeing any time you demand aptitude or performance, lest or you find yourself dragged through a grievance procedure for causing hurt, distress and fear.

From where I sit, the line between needing to fight for your rights and realising that things are actually pretty good and you can put your weapons down, while fuzzy, is shining bright and has, in my employers case, been cross long ago. This is all the more ironic as, for the sector, we have one of the highest salary costs, with perks and holiday allowances to die for, yet combined with the laziest and most incompetent staff I have ever worked with (after being there 12 years I'm becoming just as bad), all while our student population are by and large wealthy. So clearly the grounds for complaint are non-existent in reality.

Salvation is coming thanks to the tory govt, who in cutting our funding and with us missing student targets, are likely to see us go under - I will be cheering when it happens. While this has been dragging on for years very few people in our institution realise that they themselves are the problem. Its all due to "neo-liberalism", the Tories, the rich, the corporate world. Anyone but ourselves. Essentially, our sense of victimhood is killing us.

Thankfully, I don't think my workplace is indicative of society at large. But it certainly wishes it was. And there is no doubt an element of this same mentality of entitlement and victimhood out there in the general population and encouraged in like-minded institutions.
Post edited at 23:12
 Jon Stewart 29 Sep 2014
In reply to David Martin:

> I can't speak for society as a whole, but I can certainly speak for the place I have spent 9-10 hours a day at, 5 days a week for the last 12 years - it absolutely encourages victimhood to the most obscene levels.

I worked in the civil service for 10 years and f^ck me can those guys piss and moan, while doing absolutely sweet FA and getting paid a decent wage on the sweetest terms and conditions. This was the the culture in the Sheffield offices, whereas down in Whitehall, everyone was posh, ambitious, clever and hardworking (of course they still just talked absolute bollocks all day and achieved nothing of any tangible value, but they at least were trying hard to climb the greasy pole).

So I don't think it was the institution or the corporate culture that created the sense of victimhood there, it was just that it was full of whinging, whining workshy wankers.

Pan Ron 29 Sep 2014
In reply to Jon Stewart:

Sounds very much like my office. I get the impression that most people with any real talent soon clock what our university is all about and run for the hills. So maybe the institution isn't the problem, just like woodlice, the ones who found themselves in the nice soggy environment they craved stopped moving while everyone else up sticks and left. Now we are just left with a rump of public sector workers with an overwhelming sense of entitlement and a complete lack of willingness to do anything.

What really gets me, is their righteous sense of entitlement views it as entirely proper that the general public through their taxes and 18 year old kids through crippling student debt should fund us poor victims to sit on our asses.
In reply to Indy:

No worries.
In reply to Duncan Bourne:

You want trauma and victimhood, we've got it in spades down here!!

> A Canberra public servant told her boss she needed longer breaks than her colleagues, saying she had to find a café that served organic coffee with soy milk. When the Australian Taxation Office bureaucrat was warned about her absences from her desk and told she had to adhere to time management requirements, she took her case to the Commonwealth government's workplace authority.

> After the appeal was dismissed, the Executive Level 1 public servant went on stress leave and claimed workers compensation, arguing that her ATO supervisor's approach left her with "adjustment disorder". The Administrative Appeals Tribunal has dismissed the worker's appeal against the decision to reject the claim, finding the Taxation Office was reasonable in its dealings with the public servant.
Pan Ron 30 Sep 2014
In reply to stroppygob:

Mate, that situation is exactly the kind of crap that I see on an ongoing basis where I work. You think you couldn't make it up, but it happens, seemingly all the time, the only difference in our case is I would have expect the case to be found in the worker's favour.
 Ridge 30 Sep 2014
In reply to Indy:

> Shocking, never thought I'd read such a thing on UKC! Poor Mr Patel he's only trying to make his living and here are people discriminating against him soley because his first language isn't English. What next I wouldn't use his corner shop because it smells of curry?

Since the original post has been deleted it's probably worth noting the post you're referring to was about call centres where the operators were unintelligible. Mr Patel is entirely your own invention.
OP Duncan Bourne 30 Sep 2014
In reply to stroppygob:

That would have been my take on it. Her request was the unreasonable one

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