This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
4 years of hard work by the editors and volunteers has finally come to fruition in the production of one of the best looking and easiest guides to use.
Ilkley, Widdop, Shipley, Earl, and the fantastic Barden Moor all included and well documented.
Profiles from Jerry Peel, John Dunne and big Ron amongst others.
In shops and climbing walls from today. Get yours and get out!! (When it dries!!!)
Jim
Ilkley, Widdop, Shipley, Earl, and the fantastic Barden Moor all included and well documented.
Profiles from Jerry Peel, John Dunne and big Ron amongst others.
In shops and climbing walls from today. Get yours and get out!! (When it dries!!!)
Jim
4
1
In reply to Wiley Coyote:
What about Whillan's Arete at HVS? If you're going to grade for exposure, I wish very route was exposed, usually a cleaner fall and a bigger tick.
Twin Cracks at Rocky Valley is up from HS (albeit in Rockfax) to HVS. Thought it was hard.
Gerty Berwick is never 7b!
What about Whillan's Arete at HVS? If you're going to grade for exposure, I wish very route was exposed, usually a cleaner fall and a bigger tick.
Twin Cracks at Rocky Valley is up from HS (albeit in Rockfax) to HVS. Thought it was hard.
Gerty Berwick is never 7b!
In reply to chalkyjim:
It's what guidebooks are for - though I'm told you can also use them to find routes
> Ha ha yeah nowt like a good grade debate!!
It's what guidebooks are for - though I'm told you can also use them to find routes
In reply to Wiley Coyote:
BS is Tufted E2! it's got fairly tricky moves for an E1, but it's about 3m long!
BS is Tufted E2! it's got fairly tricky moves for an E1, but it's about 3m long!
Post edited at 15:25
1
In reply to chalkyjim:
Grindleys Senile Bull.......'avoids the best bits of 3 routes' no number or named first ascencionist....you have your revenge Dave!
Grindleys Senile Bull.......'avoids the best bits of 3 routes' no number or named first ascencionist....you have your revenge Dave!
In reply to Ed Navigante:
And you never need to get above a runner. I'm pretty sure it was HVS when I first did it in the dim and distant
> BS is Tufted E2! it's got fairly tricky moves for an E1, but it's about 3m long!
And you never need to get above a runner. I'm pretty sure it was HVS when I first did it in the dim and distant
In reply to Ed Navigante:
Thin Red Line E2? generous but few will argue
Demerara E3? Good luck with that one!
Thin Red Line E2? generous but few will argue
Demerara E3? Good luck with that one!
1
In reply to Bulls Crack:
I always get Demerara and brown sugar mixed up. Which is the one on the right?
I always get Demerara and brown sugar mixed up. Which is the one on the right?
1
In reply to 1poundSOCKS:
About time too, it was nails at VS - and I was just seconding!
> What about Whillan's Arete at HVS?
About time too, it was nails at VS - and I was just seconding!
1
In reply to chalkyjim:
Can't wait to get my mitts on this one!
Great effort getting it all finished and published.
J
Can't wait to get my mitts on this one!
Great effort getting it all finished and published.
J
1
In reply to Simon Caldwell:
A lot of VS are nails at VS. I find the start of Old Crack @ Ilkley desperate, and that's 4b. Don't even mention some of the Almscliff ones.
A lot of VS are nails at VS. I find the start of Old Crack @ Ilkley desperate, and that's 4b. Don't even mention some of the Almscliff ones.
In reply to 1poundSOCKS:
Growing up near Almscliffe I thought I was doomed to be VS/HVS all my life then saved up enough pennies to go to the Peak and discovered I was already climbing E1/E2!
> A lot of VS are nails at VS. Don't even mention some of the Almscliff ones.
Growing up near Almscliffe I thought I was doomed to be VS/HVS all my life then saved up enough pennies to go to the Peak and discovered I was already climbing E1/E2!
2
In reply to 1poundSOCKS:
Grades relate 'hardness' to risk and other factors (including exposure) in the onsight and Simon is right that Whilans' Arete should always have been HVS compared to the Almscliffe VS classic cracks. The Peak already grades harder than most areas and any Yorkshire VS that is equivalent to a Peak E1 (or climbs getting easier with grade increases) is hardly anything to be proud about if you want to encourage trad for the future. Yorkshire grades being a bit harder (which they still are) is fine as long as things are more consistent than they were before. I remember 2 guides back when The Padder was the easiest E2 I'd seen and in the same area there were VS climbs I thought I'd never lead.
Back to the more important stuff the guide looks great and should continue to inspire and inform along with the best of its type.
Grades relate 'hardness' to risk and other factors (including exposure) in the onsight and Simon is right that Whilans' Arete should always have been HVS compared to the Almscliffe VS classic cracks. The Peak already grades harder than most areas and any Yorkshire VS that is equivalent to a Peak E1 (or climbs getting easier with grade increases) is hardly anything to be proud about if you want to encourage trad for the future. Yorkshire grades being a bit harder (which they still are) is fine as long as things are more consistent than they were before. I remember 2 guides back when The Padder was the easiest E2 I'd seen and in the same area there were VS climbs I thought I'd never lead.
Back to the more important stuff the guide looks great and should continue to inspire and inform along with the best of its type.
Post edited at 09:42
1
In reply to Offwidth:
With a runner in the middle of Peapod (if that's okay at HVS) you have to fall from the moves near top to hurt yourself, wouldn't you? The moves at the top are dead easy. I've done most of the VS's at the bank and Ilkley quarry, and I found this one of the easiest, and I didn't think it was that dangerous.
With a runner in the middle of Peapod (if that's okay at HVS) you have to fall from the moves near top to hurt yourself, wouldn't you? The moves at the top are dead easy. I've done most of the VS's at the bank and Ilkley quarry, and I found this one of the easiest, and I didn't think it was that dangerous.
In reply to 1poundSOCKS:
I found it the hardest adjectivally of the VS classics at The Bank and was very glad I bottled the onsight.
I found it the hardest adjectivally of the VS classics at The Bank and was very glad I bottled the onsight.
In reply to Offwidth:
Very subjective.
I've got a friend who onsighted it fairly easily. He's never onsighted HVS, and he wasn't climbing much when he did it, and has always avoided leading Joanna and Bramble Crack because they're a bit too hard.
EDIT: Looking at his logbook, he does log it as a flash, and comment "Butchered it.", whatever that means.
I wouldn't class either of us as very bold.
Skip the runner in Peapod, and I'd give it HVS.
EDIT: Found this comment also...
"VS? I've done easier E2s!"
If you're reading MeMeMe, let me know where they are???
Very subjective.
I've got a friend who onsighted it fairly easily. He's never onsighted HVS, and he wasn't climbing much when he did it, and has always avoided leading Joanna and Bramble Crack because they're a bit too hard.
EDIT: Looking at his logbook, he does log it as a flash, and comment "Butchered it.", whatever that means.
I wouldn't class either of us as very bold.
Skip the runner in Peapod, and I'd give it HVS.
EDIT: Found this comment also...
"VS? I've done easier E2s!"
If you're reading MeMeMe, let me know where they are???
Post edited at 11:52
In reply to 1poundSOCKS:
Is it still 4b in the new guide? I'd say solid 4c, though still VS.
> I find the start of Old Crack @ Ilkley desperate, and that's 4b
Is it still 4b in the new guide? I'd say solid 4c, though still VS.
In reply to Simon Caldwell:
Yes, still 4b. Comparing the start to another tricky start involving jamming, I find it harder than Joanna, which is 5a.
I will keep trying until I find the 4b method.
Yes, still 4b. Comparing the start to another tricky start involving jamming, I find it harder than Joanna, which is 5a.
I will keep trying until I find the 4b method.
1
In reply to chalkyjim:
Got my copy today and I'm looking forward to some Calder Valley esoterica. Household Scout here I come, thanks for the work, Simon
On the subject of grade controversies, Route 2 at Crookrise was my first VS lead last December, now it's HVS 5b. So I apparently led HVS before I ever managed a VS... Hmmmm... VS still scares me regularly so I've never attempted another HVS lead since, nor would I have if Route 2 had been so graded a year ago. I led it again a few weeks back and I still think it's just a VS with a big step up from the shrinking ground. There are two good wires in that thin crack above half height to take much of the tension away. Still, happy with the tick. Great route which gets a big thumbs up in the guide.
Got my copy today and I'm looking forward to some Calder Valley esoterica. Household Scout here I come, thanks for the work, Simon
On the subject of grade controversies, Route 2 at Crookrise was my first VS lead last December, now it's HVS 5b. So I apparently led HVS before I ever managed a VS... Hmmmm... VS still scares me regularly so I've never attempted another HVS lead since, nor would I have if Route 2 had been so graded a year ago. I led it again a few weeks back and I still think it's just a VS with a big step up from the shrinking ground. There are two good wires in that thin crack above half height to take much of the tension away. Still, happy with the tick. Great route which gets a big thumbs up in the guide.
1
In reply to BnB:
How tall are you? I struggle to get off the ground on those slab routes.
EDIT: And I've only just noticed The New Statesman is given E9. Not that it makes much difference to me.
How tall are you? I struggle to get off the ground on those slab routes.
EDIT: And I've only just noticed The New Statesman is given E9. Not that it makes much difference to me.
Post edited at 21:51
In reply to 1poundSOCKS:
Have to leave it until next winter then. Was hoping to have it beat by the springtime
I'm medium height and those End Slab routes offer ridiculously high step ups, don't they? I can't get off the ground on the other two HVSs (4 and 2.5).
Have to leave it until next winter then. Was hoping to have it beat by the springtime
I'm medium height and those End Slab routes offer ridiculously high step ups, don't they? I can't get off the ground on the other two HVSs (4 and 2.5).
In reply to BnB:
If Calderdale is your area, you might also be interested in checking out the Lancashire Bouldering guidebook, which covers all the newly developed Calderdale bouldering spots south of Todmorden. Just done a rough count and there are about 550 problems described in that area. Have a look at www.lancashirebouldering.com
Calderdale climbers are the only people in England to get two new guidebooks this year!
> Got my copy today and I'm looking forward to some Calder Valley esoterica. Household Scout here I come, thanks for the work, Simon
If Calderdale is your area, you might also be interested in checking out the Lancashire Bouldering guidebook, which covers all the newly developed Calderdale bouldering spots south of Todmorden. Just done a rough count and there are about 550 problems described in that area. Have a look at www.lancashirebouldering.com
Calderdale climbers are the only people in England to get two new guidebooks this year!
In reply to BnB:
A step ahead of me then, I haven't seen it yet!
A pleasure - if you can ignore the colour (and the approach) it's a great crag, certainly better in the low grades than Heptonstall.
Woo hoo, my first HVS lead by several years
> Got my copy today
A step ahead of me then, I haven't seen it yet!
> Household Scout here I come, thanks for the work, Simon
A pleasure - if you can ignore the colour (and the approach) it's a great crag, certainly better in the low grades than Heptonstall.
> Route 2 at Crookrise was my first VS lead last December, now it's HVS 5b
Woo hoo, my first HVS lead by several years
Post edited at 11:22
1
In reply to Simon Caldwell:
Of course Route 2 with its new grade is a 5b to start and HVS to finish.....one of those exceptional routes where reading the description is the key.
Of course Route 2 with its new grade is a 5b to start and HVS to finish.....one of those exceptional routes where reading the description is the key.
1
In reply to Simon Caldwell:
Heptonstall is much better in my opinion than Horsehold Scout in the lower grades. Fairy Steps is better than anything at Horsehold sub VS and there is a lot more to go at at Heppy and it is a genuine year round venue as it has sheltered bays with always clean lines, which get winter sun. Those familiar with Heppy from the old guide need to look especially at the improved coverage on the wings, including several newly starred lines, especially on the right-hand buttress (which amongst other things has the best set of mods in either volume of the new YMC guides). I think the new script does Horsehold more justice but it is often a bit grim as a venue in the winter half of the year and it remains to be seen if it gets all overgrown again away from the handful of better used lines; a sping clean in 2015 would benefit popularity....I'd help if anything was organised early March say. The best routes at Horsehold are clearly worth a visit or two and the main buttress is very impressive for a lower grade leader.
Heptonstall is much better in my opinion than Horsehold Scout in the lower grades. Fairy Steps is better than anything at Horsehold sub VS and there is a lot more to go at at Heppy and it is a genuine year round venue as it has sheltered bays with always clean lines, which get winter sun. Those familiar with Heppy from the old guide need to look especially at the improved coverage on the wings, including several newly starred lines, especially on the right-hand buttress (which amongst other things has the best set of mods in either volume of the new YMC guides). I think the new script does Horsehold more justice but it is often a bit grim as a venue in the winter half of the year and it remains to be seen if it gets all overgrown again away from the handful of better used lines; a sping clean in 2015 would benefit popularity....I'd help if anything was organised early March say. The best routes at Horsehold are clearly worth a visit or two and the main buttress is very impressive for a lower grade leader.
Post edited at 13:20
1
In reply to Offwidth:
I'm going up there this aft wi' t'wife to see what condition Horsehold is in... Only a visual inspection however... It's been pissing down!
I'm going up there this aft wi' t'wife to see what condition Horsehold is in... Only a visual inspection however... It's been pissing down!
In reply to Offwidth:
Calderdale Mountain Rescue tried to rescue me from Horsehold once - I'd been going slowly, cleaning as I went, when a concerned face pops over the top:
'You ok'
'Yes thanks!'
'Are you sure?'
'Yes!'
'Oh.......we've got a rope'.
'I've got two!'
Departs looking dissapointed....I appreciated the thought though
Calderdale Mountain Rescue tried to rescue me from Horsehold once - I'd been going slowly, cleaning as I went, when a concerned face pops over the top:
'You ok'
'Yes thanks!'
'Are you sure?'
'Yes!'
'Oh.......we've got a rope'.
'I've got two!'
Departs looking dissapointed....I appreciated the thought though
1
In reply to Bulls Crack:
I had a brief spell as a trainee with the Calderdale MR team. I gave up when after a year there hadn't been a single rescue, capped off by the infamous (and fruitless) Hardcastle Crags cafe stand-off with the Ambulance service: "Hands off he's our broken ankle" "No he's ours"
I had a brief spell as a trainee with the Calderdale MR team. I gave up when after a year there hadn't been a single rescue, capped off by the infamous (and fruitless) Hardcastle Crags cafe stand-off with the Ambulance service: "Hands off he's our broken ankle" "No he's ours"
In reply to Offwidth:
Have you been back to Horsehold and done The Sizzler? As good as anything of its grade at Heppy (imo of course), Only let down by its length, though it's still longer than the stuff on the wings at Hep.
It's also actually a year round venue, most of my visits have been between autumn and spring, and a lot of the first ascents were in February. It's certainly foreboding though and feels a bit grim, and most of the rock is green, though the rock's so grippy that even some of the slab routes go at the same grade in the rain. Its main downside for me is the difficulty of reaching the base of the crags.
Have you been back to Horsehold and done The Sizzler? As good as anything of its grade at Heppy (imo of course), Only let down by its length, though it's still longer than the stuff on the wings at Hep.
It's also actually a year round venue, most of my visits have been between autumn and spring, and a lot of the first ascents were in February. It's certainly foreboding though and feels a bit grim, and most of the rock is green, though the rock's so grippy that even some of the slab routes go at the same grade in the rain. Its main downside for me is the difficulty of reaching the base of the crags.
In reply to Simon Caldwell:
You're not kidding. It was lethal crawling round under The Sizzler today. Very green and wet on the rock and leaves piled high over steep mud on the floor... To be fair, just as you'd expect on a wet November day in the Valley.
> Have you been back to Horsehold and done The Sizzler? As good as anything of its grade at Heppy (imo of course), Only let down by its length, though it's still longer than the stuff on the wings at Hep.
> Its main downside for me is the difficulty of reaching the base of the crags.
You're not kidding. It was lethal crawling round under The Sizzler today. Very green and wet on the rock and leaves piled high over steep mud on the floor... To be fair, just as you'd expect on a wet November day in the Valley.
In reply to Simon Caldwell:
What you and I might regard as a 'good' winter venue is not the same as the average weekend lower grade climber. I too have experienced sliding down the approach slopes and would seriously consider an ab rope if there has been rain, dew or mist. Sizzler looked good but was damp when I went across to that bit.
Have you climbed all the newly listed stuff on the Heppy right-hand outcrop?
What you and I might regard as a 'good' winter venue is not the same as the average weekend lower grade climber. I too have experienced sliding down the approach slopes and would seriously consider an ab rope if there has been rain, dew or mist. Sizzler looked good but was damp when I went across to that bit.
Have you climbed all the newly listed stuff on the Heppy right-hand outcrop?
Post edited at 19:08
In reply to 1poundSOCKS:
Is placing gear in Peapod good style? Whillans did it without. And I can testify that a clean solo of Whillans Arete is scarier than many an 'E' grade route I've done. And feels dangerous!
I'll also be interested in what has been done with a similar route - Jacob's Ladder at Woodhouse Scar. At VS that really was a spacewalk with limited gear and serious hurt potential!
> With a runner in the middle of Peapod (if that's okay at HVS) you have to fall from the moves near top to hurt yourself, wouldn't you? The moves at the top are dead easy. I've done most of the VS's at the bank and Ilkley quarry, and I found this one of the easiest, and I didn't think it was that dangerous.
Is placing gear in Peapod good style? Whillans did it without. And I can testify that a clean solo of Whillans Arete is scarier than many an 'E' grade route I've done. And feels dangerous!
I'll also be interested in what has been done with a similar route - Jacob's Ladder at Woodhouse Scar. At VS that really was a spacewalk with limited gear and serious hurt potential!
In reply to andyathome:
Even without the runner in Peapod, the grade isn't for a solo ascent.
BTW, it does mention side runners is Peapod in the guide.
Even without the runner in Peapod, the grade isn't for a solo ascent.
BTW, it does mention side runners is Peapod in the guide.
In reply to andyathome:
Moff and I thought Jacobs Ladder was hard but safe with modern pro and gave it VS 5a as crag authors and we are peak softies. Monkey Business heading left from the same start we agreed with E1 5b.
Moff and I thought Jacobs Ladder was hard but safe with modern pro and gave it VS 5a as crag authors and we are peak softies. Monkey Business heading left from the same start we agreed with E1 5b.
In reply to Offwidth:
Fell running shoes are very useful, especially for the left hand buttress!
Haven't got my copy of the guide yet, so the answer's almost certainly no! We did do a couple of routes from the Leeds Wall site I think.
> I too have experienced sliding down the approach slopes and would seriously consider an ab rope if there has been rain, dew or mist. Sizzler looked good but was damp when I went across to that bit.
Fell running shoes are very useful, especially for the left hand buttress!
> Have you climbed all the newly listed stuff on the Heppy right-hand outcrop?
Haven't got my copy of the guide yet, so the answer's almost certainly no! We did do a couple of routes from the Leeds Wall site I think.
In reply to chalkyjim:
We were inspired by the new guide to shelter from the weather at Woodhouse Scar for a few hours spanning lunch today. I've only visited previously in the early months of my climbing life (ie last year!!) when Severe was my lead grade. This time, in addition to terrifying ourselves on the early, bold (and wet) moves of Eagles Nest Direct, we jumped on Ardus, Spread-eagle and Twin Cracks and what a trio of feisty little routes they are (especially in slightly moist conditions). I will be needing an early bedtime and taking with me memories of a great session.
We were inspired by the new guide to shelter from the weather at Woodhouse Scar for a few hours spanning lunch today. I've only visited previously in the early months of my climbing life (ie last year!!) when Severe was my lead grade. This time, in addition to terrifying ourselves on the early, bold (and wet) moves of Eagles Nest Direct, we jumped on Ardus, Spread-eagle and Twin Cracks and what a trio of feisty little routes they are (especially in slightly moist conditions). I will be needing an early bedtime and taking with me memories of a great session.
In reply to BnB:
Its a great crag for the VS leader. We also put a few previously unlisted quality variations for those who've done it all from the old guide. The bouldering there is also impressive for low to mid grade.
Its a great crag for the VS leader. We also put a few previously unlisted quality variations for those who've done it all from the old guide. The bouldering there is also impressive for low to mid grade.
In reply to Offwidth:
Its also a great pop-in winter months crag being roadside and fairly low altitude and west facing and one where you dont need fell running shoe or abseil approach. The Big 6 pub nearby is also a must (the boulder problem isnt bad either).
Its also a great pop-in winter months crag being roadside and fairly low altitude and west facing and one where you dont need fell running shoe or abseil approach. The Big 6 pub nearby is also a must (the boulder problem isnt bad either).
This topic has been archived, and won't accept reply postings.
Loading Notifications...