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Sainsburys Christmas advert

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 deepsoup 13 Nov 2014
Trench coats for goalposts.
If you can watch this without a little sniffle you have a heart of stone.

youtube.com/watch?v=NWF2JBb1bvM&
In reply to deepsoup:

Should we read it as Saisnburys vs Aldi/Lidl? It seems like a curious event to use to promote a supermarket. I think they must have sat down and brainstormed the most emotive event they could think of and try and shoehorn an angle into it to relate to their brand. I guess JL set the benchmark for tearjerking Xmas ads, also they seem to be getting longer and longer.

If they were to ask me whats an effective ad campaign for a supermarket I would have looked at those M&S ones from a couple of years ago that just made you salivate at the deliciousness of the food being filmed.
In reply to deepsoup:

They left out the bit where Germany win the penalty shoot out
Wiley Coyote2 13 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:

> If you can watch this without a little sniffle you have a heart of stone.

And if you can watch a supermarket using a Disneyfied version of the trenches in the First World War, this year of all years, to flog mince pies and turkey without wanting to puke you have a stronger stomach than me.



OP deepsoup 13 Nov 2014
In reply to Bjartur i Sumarhus:
> Should we read it as Saisnburys vs Aldi/Lidl?

Because they're german? Er.. no, don't think so.

I read it as a very poignant little film about events that happened almost exactly a century ago. It was released the day after Armistice Day, so that's apt. And apparently they're selling the bar of chocolate featured with all profits going to the British Legion, so it'll be raising a few bob for a very worthy cause.

Really couldn't care less whether it's an effective ad or not.
OP deepsoup 13 Nov 2014
In reply to Punter S Thompson:
> They left out the bit where Germany win the penalty shoot out

I don't think they did win the shoot out that time around did they?
Post edited at 16:50
 planetmarshall 13 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:

> If you can watch this without a little sniffle you have a heart of stone.

If you see this is anything other than the cynical exploitation of a poignant moment in European history for commercial gain, you're an idiot.
OP deepsoup 13 Nov 2014
In reply to planetmarshall:
> If you see this is anything other than the cynical exploitation of a poignant moment in European history for commercial gain, you're an idiot.

I often tend to be something of a cynic about such things, but on this occasion I'm happy to be that idiot.
 DerwentDiluted 13 Nov 2014
In reply to Wiley Coyote:

Not sure how disneyfied those trenches were. OK I think that for 1914-15 trenches they were a bit too well established but quite (IMHO) credible recreations of later trenches. Admittedly the revetments looked a bit tidy and undamaged but the layout looked about right, not falling for the usual film error of being way too wide and having no traverses. The barbed wire was modern, but I've yet to see a modern production get that right. The original stuff is really nasty and makes modern wire look benign. The uniforms were pretty much on, the bandoliers were period and the cap badges (so I understand) actually are of regiments involved in the original truce. The Khaki chums were strongly involved in making this and I think that shows in a very high level of attention to detail.

Whatever the cynicism or otherwise of this, I don't think a charge of being disneyfied stands up.
Wiley Coyote2 13 Nov 2014
In reply to DerwentDiluted:

> Not sure how disneyfied those trenches were.

> Whatever the cynicism or otherwise of this, I don't think a charge of being disneyfied stands up.

You obviously know quite a bit about the technicalities and cap badges but I was going more on some of the recorded interviews with men who had been in the trenches that have been broadcast in the centenary documentaries. They did not talk so much about dimensions it was more about the absence of latrines so men were cr@pping in holes dug in the mud and then living with it squelching back, rats, lice, bodies buried in the same mud you were crapping into, body parts emerging from the mud, and one guy describing having to sit on corpses of comrades to eat his meal. I'd say that made the Sainsbury version pretty Disneyfied.
 Tall Clare 13 Nov 2014
Not that these things work that way, but I think a significant improvement would have been for the advert, flawed/not flawed as it is, to have run with just the British Legion logo at the end, no mention of Sainsbury's. Sure, people would find out, and it would be a viral thing, but it would have been a far more subtle/less crass move by Sainsbury's - and I bet if they'd done that, essentially not mentioned it was them, by some twist of how these things work, everyone would be trotting off to Sainsbury's this christmas, saying 'hey, wasn't it great what they did for the British Legion?'

But, alas, they didn't.

In reply to deepsoup:


> I read it as a very poignant little film about events that happened almost exactly a century ago. It was released the day after Armistice Day, so that's apt. And apparently they're selling the bar of chocolate featured with all profits going to the British Legion, so it'll be raising a few bob for a very worthy cause.

Maybe I'm just a great deal more cynical but I that's not how I see it.

Taken on it's own it's quite a nice little short film.

But I can't get away from the fact that's it's some shill working in advertising using anything and everything to sell more stuff.

They don't care what the use or cheapen as long as they sell more washing powder/mince pies/whatever.

I find that sort of sickening.

 DerwentDiluted 13 Nov 2014
In reply to Wiley Coyote:
The state of trenches in 1914-15 was a long way from the images of mud and horror that uncountably characterised the late 1916 and 1917 battlefields. Third Ypres or Passchendaele was the consequence of four years of battle in a small area, latterly fought with huge amounts of men and munitions. That was a charnel house and if those trenches had purported to show that I'd agree they were too sanitised by far.

At Christmas 1914 the lines had only recently stabilised and the artillery was direly starved of shells so the lunar landscape of later was not yet established. Peter Barton has written some excellent books showing many contemporary panoramic views of the battlefields and the surprising thing about almost all of the pre 1916 panoramas is how relatively undamaged the landscape looks. Particularly around the Armentieres area where most of the truce happened. Also pictures of trench life at this time show that the trenches (embrionic as they were) were actually quite tidy. Mass shelling had yet to destroy the drainage systems and the British army was a small professional one, well disciplined and orderly and still regarding trenches as a temporary phase before a war of mobility was restored. Many popular images of the war come from Frank Hurleys photographs from 1917 Ypres, but it was not like that from day one.

I take your point that there's not much horror in the advert, but it would not exist if it was going to be horrific - a Catch 22. But as a well researched and thought provoking piece of mini drama for a modern audience I think its not bad at all. It is also being generally well received by the Great War Forum who are usually quick to savage what they don't like.
OP deepsoup 13 Nov 2014
In reply to Punter S Thompson:

The whole business of advertising is sort of sickening, true enough. The business of quite a lot of business is sort of sickening come to think of it.

I don't think the purpose of this ad is to sell more stuff though. If it is, I don't doubt it'll prove to be absolutely useless, as many of the most memorable ads ever made have been. It may be meant to generate some warm and fuzzy feelings regarding the brand, though to be honest I suspect many folk having seen it won't even remember which supermarket's name appeared briefly at the end.

If I had to attribute a cynical motive to it's creation, and yes *of course* there will have been at least some cynical motivation behind it, I think the people who made it really intended it to do only one thing: upstage John Lewis. They've undoubtedly achieved that.

(Actually, that isn't true: I think the people who commissioned it intended that. I suspect the people who actually made it are creative types who rather wish they'd made Christian Camion's 'Joyeux Noel'.)

Like a small random act of kindness though, I think it's net effect will be to make people infinitesimally nicer for a short while. It's a little necessary good committed by 'Satan's little helpers and the ruiners of all things good' for the benefit of the greater evil.
 Blue Straggler 13 Nov 2014
In reply to Tall Clare:

> Not that these things work that way, but I think a significant improvement would have been for the advert, flawed/not flawed as it is, to have run with just the British Legion logo at the end, no mention of Sainsbury's. Sure, people would find out, and it would be a viral thing

I am not so sure. I am thinking back to the Tony Kaye "Magician" ad for tyres 9the one with Venus in Furs playing), from around 1994. Most people couldn't name the brand of tyre and in fact a lot thought it was an ad for a car. Even though it DID feature the brand name filling the screen for 3 seconds at the end.

I know things are different now, with the Internet and what not. But it would have been "that trenches ad for one of the supermarkets....probably M&S, they're good at that sort of thing", not "that Sainsbury's ad", IMHO
 Ridge 13 Nov 2014
In reply to Wiley Coyote:

> And if you can watch a supermarket using a Disneyfied version of the trenches in the First World War, this year of all years, to flog mince pies and turkey without wanting to puke you have a stronger stomach than me.

Yep, pretty f*cking cynical if you ask me.
 wintertree 13 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:
> Trench coats for goalposts.

I thought it was going to be Ron Manager from that... Which would have the twin benefits of being funny and of not epitomising to the crass commercialisation of Christmas in a new low.
Post edited at 19:23
OP deepsoup 13 Nov 2014
In reply to Blue Straggler:
Good example. I remembered that ad quite clearly, remembered that they were advertising tyres and was 99% sure it was for Pirelli. (They were good at that sort of thing.)
 The Potato 13 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:

heart of stone covered in a thin layer of ice, too thin for crampons sadly.

Anyway, it was amazing the first time I heard about this but then seeing it in film (albeit fake) makes me very sad, not because of the 'heartwarming meaning' but because they then went back to killing hundreds and thousands of each other for no good reason.
 Kimono 14 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:

> I don't think the purpose of this ad is to sell more stuff though.

That is the only purpose
 Philip 14 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:

> And apparently they're selling the bar of chocolate featured with all profits going to the British Legion, so it'll be raising a few bob for a very worthy cause.

That's good. Where can you purchase these chocolate bars? From all good confectioners? From Cubs and scouts collecting in the street for charity? From the legions of poppy sellers? Or is it just inside one store, losing a sales and failing to establish an identity in a market where it neither represents quality, integrity, or anything-goes-in-the-ready-meals pricing.

Call me old fashion but I'll stick to getting my shopping from small shops, my chocolate from good quality chocolatiers and giving my money directly to charities.

OP deepsoup 14 Nov 2014
In reply to Philip:
"Quality chocolatiers". Ha ha. Awesome.
1
 Tom Valentine 14 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:
Homage to the Coen Brothers.
(Musically, at least)
Post edited at 16:13
 Blue Straggler 14 Nov 2014
In reply to Tom Valentine:

> Homage to the Coen Brothers.

> (Musically, at least)

Do you think that was really the intention? To pay homage to the Coen Brothers?
 Blue Straggler 14 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:
I've seen it now. It is dreadful (not "beyond wretched" dreadful, but just plain old dreadful). Not because it's an advert, but because as "a short film", it is trite and cheesy.


DOGGEREL. That's the word I was after.
Post edited at 21:13
 Blue Straggler 14 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:

> creative types who rather wish they'd made Christian Camion's 'Joyeux Noel'.

Is that any good? When I saw this thread (the first I knew about the ad), that film sprang to mind not because I've seen it (I have not), but because when IT came out, I thought "oh Lord, that'll be trite and cheesy", as we were all taught the story of the Christmas Day football game in No Man's Land when we were about 12 or 13 at school (and it sounded a bit cheesy even THEN )
 Tom Valentine 15 Nov 2014
In reply to Blue Straggler:
I think the music gives them a nod, at the very least. The sparse piano chords of "Leaning" are very much inspired by the "True Grit" version, I think.
I suppose we could be grateful that it doesn't develop into Demented wailing, though.
Post edited at 00:57
 lowersharpnose 15 Nov 2014
In reply to DerwentDiluted:

Third Ypres or Passchendaele was the consequence of four years of battle in a small area,

Three. A minor subtraction quibble over the slaughter. My great.. uncle was killed on the first day of Passchendale.

'Twas a big day of death, and a fecking repeat of the year before. More meat into the mincer.
 Blue Straggler 15 Nov 2014
In reply to Tom Valentine:
> The sparse piano chords of "Leaning" are very much inspired by the "True Grit" version, I think.

That's not a "True Grit version" though, it is from Iris DeMent's "Lifeline" album from 2005 or so. They didn't commission it, they just picked it (or someone picked it for them).

Poor pun btw.
Post edited at 01:28
 Tom Valentine 15 Nov 2014
In reply to Blue Straggler:
The sparse piano chords I referred to are not really Iris's property. A large part of Carter Burwell's score is based on the song "Leaning" and Ms Dement's version is used at the end. The Sainsbury's ad has a lot more in common with the original score than it has with Iris's version.
Post edited at 07:14
 Trangia 15 Nov 2014
In reply to ow arm:

> they then went back to killing hundreds and thousands of each other for no good reason.


That statement is made with the benefit of hindsight.

In 1914 they felt that they had very good reasons for being at war. The reasons for going to war are often highly complex and as a war progresses it spawns further reasons for continuing, not least the feeling that if you stop the preceding deaths and wounds, seen as "sacrifice", have all been in vain. The feeling develops that you are letting down the dead by stopping before the origional war aims are obtained. The greater the losses the stronger this perception becomes.

This perception will persist so long as the opposing sides are roughly evenly matched, and only goes when one side or the other is resoundly defeated and the feelings give way to hopelessness and dispair.

That is what is so sad about war.
 The Potato 15 Nov 2014
In reply to Trangia:

hmm im sure the guys freezing in the trenches would have thought this many times over no hindsight needed
 Blue Straggler 15 Nov 2014
In reply to Tom Valentine:

You are a Coens fanboy and I claim my five pounds
OP deepsoup 15 Nov 2014
In reply to Blue Straggler:
> Is that any good? When I saw this thread (the first I knew about the ad), that film sprang to mind not because I've seen it (I have not), but because when IT came out, I thought "oh Lord, that'll be trite and cheesy", as we were all taught the story of the Christmas Day football game in No Man's Land when we were about 12 or 13 at school (and it sounded a bit cheesy even THEN )

Can't see my opinion being much use to you, I'm guessing you'd find it trite and cheesy.

I've just bought a second-hand dvd, going to watch it again when I'm in the mood some time over the next couple of weeks. PM me your address if you like and I'll bung it in the post to you afterwards. You can come back on here and tell me I'm an idiot for liking it.
 Blue Straggler 15 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:

> Can't see my opinion being much use to you, I'm guessing you'd find it trite and cheesy.

My question was poorly worded. I meant that when it came out, I was possibly being SLIGHTLY prejudiced and I never heard much about it. I was surprised to see it mentioned here and it got me thinking "hey maybe it's alright after all". I was trying to give it a second chance. But is it just a long version of the Sainsbury's ad?

I'll PM you !
Thanks
 Timmd 15 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:
It brought a tear to my eye, I wonder if it's a little bit cynical, too.

My grand dad used to say how nobody wanted the second world war after experiencing the first one.

What makes me sad is it'll touch people's emotions, and we'll probably still go to war in the future (which isn't something against the advert, of course).
Post edited at 21:53
 ThunderCat 15 Nov 2014
In reply to deepsoup:

> I don't think the purpose of this ad is to sell more stuff though. If it is, I don't doubt it'll prove to be absolutely useless, as many of the most memorable ads ever made have been. It may be meant to generate some warm and fuzzy feelings regarding the brand,

The only purpose of the advert is to sell more stuff. Even if the aim is to create a warm and fuzzy image around the brand, then the sole purpose of THAT is to sell more stuff.

To use an event so horrific in its barbarity to sell stuff is horrendous and I don't think the fact they donate a little bit of it to the British Legion in any way mitigates how loathsome it is - in fact the cynical bastard in me can picture the marketing men saying "Wow, this is actually pretty f*cking loathsome...maybe we should donate a small percentage to the British Legion to try and take the curse of it".

I wonder what next year's campaign will be? Josef Fritzl entering his dungeon in a Santa suit? Auzwitz guards handing out candy canes at the entrance to the showers?
 Mr Lopez 16 Nov 2014
In reply to ThunderCat:
> To use an event so horrific in its barbarity to sell stuff is horrendous

Do you consider the 1914 Christmas truce's barbaric and horrific?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christmas_truce#Christmas_1914

Just 'cause as far as that elusive "Christmas spirit" goes (and let's face it, Christmas ads are all about bandying about the ideal of the Christmas spirit) it is one of the finest examples in history.
Post edited at 02:24
1
 ThunderCat 16 Nov 2014
In reply to Mr Lopez:

Ok then, I guess that makes it all ok.

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