UKC

A while ago there was a great deal on short lengths of twin rope on sport pursuit. I didn't buy them, but it got me thinking - would 30m or even 25m twins be a good idea for easy mountaineering routes such as the Cuillin ridge or the Pic du Midi d'Ossau (two routes I aspire to)?

My logic is that this kind of route often contains pitches of climbing, where I'd want to rope up, of no more than 30m but often these pitches, or similar ones, must be reversed. This would require 60m of rope for a retrievable ab and right now I only own a 60m single which weighs a ton or various shorter ropes which would be inadequate. Using either two 30m twins or one 60m twin doubled gives a substantial weight reduction whilst retaining the ability to climb 30m and ab 30m. Is there much advantage to one over the other - two ropes would mean they could be different colours but as I'd be using them as twins not doubles I'm not sure what advantage that would give. Obviously if I was abing on two ropes I'd want different colours to know which one to pull, but with one rope there is no knot so this is not as critical.

As you can tell, this is very much a thought experiment right now, but one that may result in me buying something next time I spot a good deal, so I'd appreciate some input from those more experienced.

In reply to Oujmik:

Good logic although a single 35m joker will do the lot with a short pitch out onto the face at start of naismiths.

In reply to Oujmik:
3mm pull down cord..............+whatever rope you have?

In reply to Oujmik:
These days I'd be fairly wary of spending much money on specific mountaineering ropes. As soon as you start doing things like direct belays, counterbalance abseils or even moving together you rapidly trash ropes.
I took a fairly new 30m single on Tower Ridge recently. In hindsight was a fairly poor decision as we were practicing short-roping and short-pitching during our ascent and it took a major hammering.
Using older lead ropes, single or half, cut down to 35-40m is going to be a cheaper option in many situations. Also, I can't think of that many situations where I would be so totally focused on cutting the weight of my rope to the stage of taking a shiny new sub-8mm rope on something like the Cuillin where I definitely planned to use it.

In reply to Oujmik:

there are a couple of folk selling ropes on here
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?n=604945
this is a fantastic type of rope, light, very tough and provided it has been looked after correctly by the seller might just suit you

In reply to Oujmik:

I'd been just about to say - why don't you get something like a 60m Beal Joker and chop it in half, as that way you can use it as a single or doubles, which is an awful lot more useful in a wider range of circumstances than a pair of twins. 30m doubles are really useful for the grit!

But MFB is right - grab that half rope in the ad, chop it, and the job's done for £65.

In reply to Jamie Wakeham:

Thanks all for the tips... one question. If I were to buy the Joker or the Phoenix, why do you suggest I chop it? Surely I could use it as doubles, twins or to ab off just by doubling it over? Obviously chopping it means I could take only one half in some situations but not sure this is a big gain.

In reply to top cat:

I've heard of this before, but how do you rig a retrievable ab with this setup?

In reply to Oujmik:

I think the logic works for what I remember of the pitches on the Cuillin and Ossau (though for the second I remember more about the thunderstorm I was trying to escape than the ab!).

But like others, I'd tend to use cast off old ropes (ones that have damage in one part that needs to be cut off, so end up short) than buy a new one. Depends on how good a deal Sports Pursuit are offering a sometimes they are spectacularly good - and if you have any old ropes to retire in the first place.

In reply to Oujmik:
Put the end of the rope through the anchor and tie a (locking!) krab onto the end of the rope using an appropriate knot. Clip this crab back onto the rope so you form a "loop" round the anchor. Attach your pulldown cord to this krab.

edit: like this http://www.climbing.com/skill/long-rappel-short-rope/

In reply to climbwhenready:

Thanks, that's a really nice trick - adds a bit of complication to an ab but definitely worth knowing.

In reply to Carolyn:

I don't have any cast-off ropes yet. I'm an occasional climber so hoping to get another few years out of mine before they need any chopping! Ropes for this kind of route seem to be something of a compromise as you definitely have to carry them (so you want light) but you're also far more likely to damage them (so you want durable). There are no deals on Sport Pursuit right now, but they were stupidly cheap hence why I was tempted (the ropes were Tendon I think, so a known brand albeit not a top-end one).

In reply to Oujmik:

I've never done it. I think one of the important considerations is that your knot is going to get pulled into the anchor, so it's important it doesn't get jammed.

In reply to climbwhenready:

never tried retrievable ab but i have had to tie back in to a stuck rope and launched my svelte 90kg frame off the nearest block on more than one occassion when ' being nice ' just wasn't working, less likely to do that on 3mm tag

when you can get a rope weighing 38g/m not sure tag lines make much sense unless you are going very high

another really great rope deal

http://www.outside.co.uk/shop/Photon+7.8mm

In reply to Oujmik:


That was my thinking - but the benefits of having a very light 60m might be worth more to you than the benefits of being able to grab just a 30m. Probably depends mostly on what other ropes you have.